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Good tactics-distract a robber, then shoot him

jet57 said:
I just people afraid to defend themselves.

My videos however prove that one does not need a gun to defeat and armed robber.
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You are making a stupid universal statement and applying it to all situations. That makes you indefensibly wrong jet. No jet, you do not "need" a firearm in every situation especially if you are willing to risk your life and physical well being. I don't believe anyone here has said otherwise. But it is not your place to make that decision for anyone but yourself. That is morally repugnant.
 
jet57 said:
I have an outstanding grasp of the realities, I just don't light candles and pray to my AR15.

And what was nonfactual about the videos I showed?

And just because someone uses a gun sometimes doesn't mean that IT always works either.
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Once again jet, did the passerby that saved that wounded police officer do the right thing by shooting the guy that shot and wounded said police officer? Perhaps he should have hugged him as the police officer bled out. Maybe he should have waited for the police. I would love to see your answer and try and save face.
 
Goshin said:
But Certain Silly Persons insist that carrying a gun is useless because you can't out-draw a criminal with a gun in hand.... :roll:
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Same silly person would have everyone automatically know Kung fu through osmosis and use ninja movie like tactics (seen on Rambo) to peacefully disable poor misguided attacker.
 
jet57 said:
I just people afraid to defend themselves.

My videos however prove that one does not need a gun to defeat and armed robber.
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The guy had a gun pointed to his head, do you think he would risk wrestling with the man & maybe getting shot ?
Look, I understand some shootings aren't justified. This one sure as hell is.

I understand you're firmly against all forms of guns. However, denying reality & refusing to accept that this particular instance was totally justified makes you, honestly, look a wee bit silly.
 
Cisero said:
The guy had a gun pointed to his head, do you think he would risk wrestling with the man & maybe getting shot ?
Look, I understand some shootings aren't justified. This one sure as hell is.

I understand you're firmly against all forms of guns. However, denying reality & refusing to accept that this particular instance was totally justified makes you, honestly, look a wee bit silly.
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I'm a gun owner and staunch supporter of the second amendment. I don't think guns are the end all however, thus I argue against the bastardization of the amendment by the right-wing as well as misrepresentations like you have just made.
 
BretJ said:
You are making a stupid universal statement and applying it to all situations. That makes you indefensibly wrong jet. No jet, you do not "need" a firearm in every situation especially if you are willing to risk your life and physical well being. I don't believe anyone here has said otherwise. But it is not your place to make that decision for anyone but yourself. That is morally repugnant.
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That would be your territory. I show examples where it is not necessary that you and your ilk keep denying.

Therefore, my points need no defense at all: they are proven fact. That is something that you gun guys are going to have to get over.

The right-wing bastardization of the 2nd amendment, which we have argued at length, wherein you gun guys have been wrong over and over again, is morally repugnant.


So, when have I ever said that I was against guns or the second amendment?

When have I ever said that I was against any CCW?

When have I ever said that a pistol in the home for assaultive intruders was not a good idea?

The answer to those three question is - not at any time, and you and the rest know that.

It's the right-wing gaslighting that I am against.
 
Rucker61 said:
Absolutely true. But when faced with an armed assailant, I'll pick a gun first over bear hugs every time.
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And there you go; that's all it takes for agreement.

So, what if you don't have your gun, or someone else doesn't have their gun? Will you be brave enough to take down the assailant by any means necessary?
 
BretJ said:
Once again jet, did the passerby that saved that wounded police officer do the right thing by shooting the guy that shot and wounded said police officer? Perhaps he should have hugged him as the police officer bled out. Maybe he should have waited for the police. I would love to see your answer and try and save face.
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That's not the OP story; refresh my memory please.
 
jet57 said:
(chuckle)

What - does this tell you?



MY views are skewed?
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Yes, they are. It is known as the Mozambique double tap and is a legit and legal tactic in a life or death situation.


Sorry no cigar.
 
jet57 said:
That would be your territory. I show examples where it is not necessary that you and your ilk keep denying.

Therefore, my points need no defense at all: they are proven fact. That is something that you gun guys are going to have to get over.

The right-wing bastardization of the 2nd amendment, which we have argued at length, wherein you gun guys have been wrong over and over again, is morally repugnant.


So, when have I ever said that I was against guns or the second amendment?

When have I ever said that I was against any CCW?

When have I ever said that a pistol in the home for assaultive intruders was not a good idea?

The answer to those three question is - not at any time, and you and the rest know that.

It's the right-wing gaslighting that I am against.
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No one here has ever claimed otherwise jet. I fully agree there are times when a firearm is not necessary. However, when you have been asked to clarify if your assertion is that it is never needed under other circumstances, you fail to explain yourself. Add to that you assertions that using a firearm is cowardice and you expect others to understand your point??

So are you finally agreeing that there are times when a firearm is the only or best option?

Jet, I can stop severe bleeding/traumatic injuries without a trauma kit in my car, but I have one anyway. I also have a couple fire extinguishers as well even though I could theoretically put out a car fire or help someone out of the vehicle without one. In both cases, as with having a firearm, my options are less limited and the possibility of success is greater.
 
Goshin said:
Yes, they are. It is known as the Mozambique double tap and is a legit and legal tactic in a life or death situation.


Sorry no cigar.
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So a description of how to shoot and kill a person on this forum is not a skewed view.
 
jet57 said:
So a description of how to shoot and kill a person on this forum is not a skewed view.
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Nope.


If you actually need to shoot someone, what do you THINK you're doing, trying to give him road rash?


Know where I learned this technique? The Police Academy. It is particularly a way to stop someone who is wearing body armor or so hopped up on drugs they don't feel pain.


Sure granted, you're "shooting to stop" not "to kill"... but killing someone stops them, and all gunfire is considered deadly force.


It isn't as if this is some secret technique... granted I don't go around telling random Internet people where to insert a knife to ensure someone bleeds out, but that's not as much common knowledge as headshots kill*.


Much ado about nothing.


*(NOT common knowledge, actually, that non-contact headshots with pistol-caliber weapons often deflect off the skull unless aimed at a certain area...)
 
TurtleDude said:
The place where I train teaches this.

Armed Citizen Who Threw Wallet to Distracted Suspect: 'That's When I Lit Him Up' - Breitbart

The suspect allegedly pointed his gun at Latanya’s face but was distracted by the wallets on the floor and looked away to pick them up. Dennis used the brief distraction as an opportunity to draw his own gun and shoot the suspect in the stomach.
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So you're cheering this vigilante who gunned down an American Citizen who was just looking to feed his kids? What about the man's rights? Where was the trial? So any old yahoo can be judge, jury and executioner? Your cheering the loss of a possible husband, someones father, brother, uncle or child? Cold hearted? Where is OSHA preventing this sort of dangerous work place for people just looking for money to feed their kids, why haven't they banned guns??


(Tongue is firmly in cheek on this btw, in case it's not clear)
 
Renae said:
So you're cheering this vigilante who gunned down an American Citizen who was just looking to feed his kids? What about the man's rights? Where was the trial? So any old yahoo can be judge, jury and executioner? Your cheering the loss of a possible husband, someones father, brother, uncle or child? Cold hearted? Where is OSHA preventing this sort of dangerous work place for people just looking for money to feed their kids, why haven't they banned guns??


(Tongue is firmly in cheek on this btw, in case it's not clear)
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sadly some actually believe that
 
BretJ said:
No one here has ever claimed otherwise jet. I fully agree there are times when a firearm is not necessary. However, when you have been asked to clarify if your assertion is that it is never needed under other circumstances, you fail to explain yourself. Add to that you assertions that using a firearm is cowardice and you expect others to understand your point??

So are you finally agreeing that there are times when a firearm is the only or best option?

Jet, I can stop severe bleeding/traumatic injuries without a trauma kit in my car, but I have one anyway. I also have a couple fire extinguishers as well even though I could theoretically put out a car fire or help someone out of the vehicle without one. In both cases, as with having a firearm, my options are less limited and the possibility of success is greater.
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Let's talk about dishonesty for a moment, because it's key:
Add to that you assertions that using a firearm is cowardice
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I never even intimated that. THAT is your dishonesty and the continued dishonesty of the gun group around here: misrepresentation; a from of manipulation of an opponent's argument in order to weaken that argument (strawman) and change the personality OF the opponent. It's a form of gaslighting, and you guys do it all - the - time.

Now, I am on record here as saying that there are times when I agree that uses of gun can be necessary. YOUR argument is - carry in gun.

I think that, and have said over and over again, THAT showing cause for CCW is a good thing, and I support those who can show cause. BUT- the average Joe carrying a gun around just because he wants to - is cowardly. THESE people are the ones who consistently cause death and injury to people who would still be alive if there had been no gun around and the incident could have been solved other ways. YOU and the gun ilk know that as well as I do, and I post videos and articles to prove that thesis. YOU GUY keep posting videos wherein people get shot, and by some figment of your imaginations, those videos are supposed to make me wrong.

THAT - is nonsense.

Joe 2nd amendment Average is no different than gangsters carrying guns around because they constantly feel threatened. And saying that Joe Average is "law abiding citizen" with a right to carry is even more BS because it wholly dismisses the reason for carrying it in the first place.

And I will never agree that gun is the best option or only option. THAT is yet another figment of the gun crowd imagination that has bastardized the second amendment.
 
Then may I suggest that when questioned to clarify one of your assertions, you actually clarify what you are attempting to say vice making people guess. You claim you want debate yet the crux of any debate is clarification of your position which is what you consistently, vehemently refuse to do. You could save your back and chest muscles some wear and tear by not puffing your chest out so much.��
 
jet57 said:
Let's talk about dishonesty for a moment, because it's key:

"Add to that your assertion that using a gun is cowardice..."

I never even intimated that. THAT is your dishonesty and the continued dishonesty of the gun group around here: misrepresentation; a from of manipulation of an opponent's argument in order to weaken that argument (strawman) and change the personality OF the opponent. It's a form of gaslighting, and you guys do it all - the - time.....
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You have absolutely used the word cowardice in context of carrying a gun. At least be honest about where you stand and what you say.
 
jet57 said:
My point is - that is is NOT necessary to carry a gun to defeat a robbery or assailant who uses any number of types of force. That's why I show the videos.

The gun crowd however is hypnotized into having to have a gun for any occasion and it's just ridiculous how they shut down any other suggestions or means of anything that doesn't include the use of a firearm by a law abiding citizen utilizing his right to bear arms under the second amendment.

You see it as well, I know you do.

So if a short gal who's first language is NOT English, and a guy who's brave enough to take action and simply bear- hug a guy and take'em down can do it, then anybody else unarmed at the time can stop an armed assailant as well.

It's a good point, and I like to take opportunities to make it again - just keep them reminded.
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American teacher shot and killed in Kenya after resisting robbers | Daily Mail Online
Customer shot and killed during W. Houston restaurant robbery - Houston Chronicle
Good Samaritan killed in Texas jewelry store robbery

I could go on, all these people attempted to resist, all these people died. While you bring up one lucky woman...
 
Now, I am on record here as saying that there are times when I agree that uses of gun can be necessary. YOUR argument is - carry in gun.
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Without a gun, a gun can't be an option. With a gun, every option is open.


I think that, and have said over and over again, THAT showing cause for CCW is a good thing, and I support those who can show cause.
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If an average person can't show cause, then who can? That's the problem with your argument, and it's very Californian.

BUT- the average Joe carrying a gun around just because he wants to - is cowardly. THESE people are the ones who consistently cause death and injury to people who would still be alive if there had been no gun around and the incident could have been solved other ways.
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You can't know that outcome of encounters with criminals. You're just guessing.

THAT - is nonsense.
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No that is hypocrisy. You show a video and claim that it represents the rule, not the exception. You still haven't explained why, if unarmed women can wrestle armed men in self defense, that almost 2k women are shot every year by men.

Joe 2nd amendment Average is no different than gangsters carrying guns around because they constantly feel threatened. And saying that Joe Average is "law abiding citizen" with a right to carry is even more BS because it wholly dismisses the reason for carrying it in the first place.
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The average Joe is a law abiding citizen. In fact, six sigma of the citizenry are law abiding. Concealed carry is to fight the small percentage who aren't law abiding.

And I will never agree that gun is the best option or only option. THAT is yet another figment of the gun crowd imagination that has bastardized the second amendment.
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Talk about your strawman. Nobody is claiming that its the only or always the best solution. Sometimes it is the best option, but you have to have a gun to have that option.
 
Goshin said:
You have absolutely used the word cowardice in context of carrying a gun. At least be honest about where you stand and what you say.
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Carrying, not using... Read what Bret said.
 
Renae said:
American teacher shot and killed in Kenya after resisting robbers | Daily Mail Online
Customer shot and killed during W. Houston restaurant robbery - Houston Chronicle
Good Samaritan killed in Texas jewelry store robbery

I could go on, all these people attempted to resist, all these people died. While you bring up one lucky woman...
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There has been no "luck" in any of the several videos that I have posted, just determination and bravery.

You wanna live in a shoot'em society, fine, I don't want to.
 
jet57 said:
There has been no "luck" in any of the several videos that I have posted, just determination and bravery.

You wanna live in a shoot'em society, fine, I don't want to.
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How do you know there was no luck?
 
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