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"We're Going To Borrow It"

Exquisitor

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"We're Going To Borrow It"

Data Lab - Federal Deficit Trends – U.S. Treasury | Data Lab

Sorry, I don't know how to past the image, you'll have to click the link.

If the Republicans had let Obama spend a little more in 2009 and 2010, he could have handed over a surplus.

Under Bush (quoted) the Republicans turned a surplus into a crisis and then obstructed sufficient stimulus, education spending, highways bill and minimum wage and then with Trump cut revenue and now with a crisis they put ten-trillion dollars on the credit card.
 
"We're Going To Borrow It"

Data Lab - Federal Deficit Trends – U.S. Treasury | Data Lab

Sorry, I don't know how to past the image, you'll have to click the link.

If the Republicans had let Obama spend a little more in 2009 and 2010, he could have handed over a surplus.

Under Bush (quoted) the Republicans turned a surplus into a crisis and then obstructed sufficient stimulus, education spending, highways bill and minimum wage and then with Trump cut revenue and now with a crisis they put ten-trillion dollars on the credit card.

When the Fed keeps writing checks to the Treasury and monetizing debt, there normally would be inflation and an increase in interest rates. You'd see an increase in prices with "too many dollars chasing too few goods." But with this sudden contraction in GDP and unemployment increase from the shutdown, it's all askew. We'll probably see a mixture of stagflation and severe recession with the gov printing money at dangerous levels.
 
What most fiscal conservatives don't realize is that a minimalist government always leads to a poorly managed economy.

Large government doesn't necessarily equate to a well managed economy, but a small government DOES equate to a poorly managed economy.
 
When the Fed keeps writing checks to the Treasury and monetizing debt, there normally would be inflation and an increase in interest rates. You'd see an increase in prices with "too many dollars chasing too few goods." But with this sudden contraction in GDP and unemployment increase from the shutdown, it's all askew. We'll probably see a mixture of stagflation and severe recession with the gov printing money at dangerous levels.

I don't know about you but I have seen prices going up already
and I think inflation isn't far behind
and a severe recession on the way
have a nice day
 
I don't know about you but I have seen prices going up already
and I think inflation isn't far behind
and a severe recession on the way
have a nice day

With workers unemployed and businesses closed, demand is going to be high. I see prices going up on food and retail goods. As people run out of money and credit, the recession will kick in.
 
"We're Going To Borrow It"

Data Lab - Federal Deficit Trends – U.S. Treasury | Data Lab

Sorry, I don't know how to past the image, you'll have to click the link.

If the Republicans had let Obama spend a little more in 2009 and 2010, he could have handed over a surplus.

Under Bush (quoted) the Republicans turned a surplus into a crisis and then obstructed sufficient stimulus, education spending, highways bill and minimum wage and then with Trump cut revenue and now with a crisis they put ten-trillion dollars on the credit card.
So you would prefer they do NO deficit spending right now...is that what you are saying?

And you DO know that it is the HOUSE that controls the spending...right?

But..lets get back to your original premise. You want NO deficit spending in a pandemic...right/ No stimulus spending, no extra unemployment payments, no additional benefits or food and housing checks...you want to balance that budget to the current level of income...right?
 
So you would prefer they do NO deficit spending right now...is that what you are saying?

And you DO know that it is the HOUSE that controls the spending...right?

But..lets get back to your original premise. You want NO deficit spending in a pandemic...right/ No stimulus spending, no extra unemployment payments, no additional benefits or food and housing checks...you want to balance that budget to the current level of income...right?

No, but here are my points.

1) they gave Obama $250 as stimulus and then said, "No more, no more borrowing, no raising revenue, crying, "Failed stimulus!" And extend Bush tax cuts, that Obama did as a fool and they took the legitimacy and energy it gave them, to defeat Obama in the midterms. Now we have $1200.

2) if we had balanced the budget under Obama and/or Trump failed to pas his tax cut, all this would be no sweat.

I can't imagine how I'd **** if I was all maxed out trying to push my patents.

Point # 3) Democrats have the track record of reducing deficits and handing over growing economies.

Therefor, Go with the Democrat, don't allow your Paradigm to broadcast the idea that Trump is doing good for America, or that we would be OK with him.

Don't accept dislike of the Democrat.

It is a Partizan thing and the vote is clearly Partizan for these reasons.
 
The coming Greater Recession and stagflation are the gifts from the Trump and the Republicans
 
So you would prefer they do NO deficit spending right now...is that what you are saying?

And you DO know that it is the HOUSE that controls the spending...right?

But..lets get back to your original premise. You want NO deficit spending in a pandemic...right/ No stimulus spending, no extra unemployment payments, no additional benefits or food and housing checks...you want to balance that budget to the current level of income...right?

Not that Trump is all bad.

Republican is all bad, just because of their tax cut and the way they treated Obama for which everyone is just as responsible.

Trump is trying to put America first.

But for his tax cut.

Really.
 
The coming Greater Recession and stagflation are the gifts from the Trump and the Republicans

Well, if it weren't for the coronavirus we'd think the economy was booming and forget it was only because of a Trillion dollars a year going to the rich.

What if instead of money going to those who deserved it it went to the biggest thieves?

Since both are true, both must be taken into your calculation and they are not.
 
The coming Greater Recession and stagflation are the gifts from the Trump and the Republicans

The economy would crash eventually and presently debt is growing faster than revenue.

Twice they did this, same thing, same philosophy, same error.
 
No, but here are my points.

1) they gave Obama $250 as stimulus and then said, "No more, no more borrowing, no raising revenue, crying, "Failed stimulus!" And extend Bush tax cuts, that Obama did as a fool and they took the legitimacy and energy it gave them, to defeat Obama in the midterms. Now we have $1200.

2) if we had balanced the budget under Obama and/or Trump failed to pas his tax cut, all this would be no sweat.

I can't imagine how I'd **** if I was all maxed out trying to push my patents.

Point # 3) Democrats have the track record of reducing deficits and handing over growing economies.

Therefor, Go with the Democrat, don't allow your Paradigm to broadcast the idea that Trump is doing good for America, or that we would be OK with him.

Don't accept dislike of the Democrat.

It is a Partizan thing and the vote is clearly Partizan for these reasons.
This isnt about Obama. You just **** yourself over the current spending. Stop playing stupid games. Do you think they should have spent the money or not? DO you agree the pandemic that we are currently experiencing is creating an extraordinary set of circumstances or not?

If your point is both political parties are hypocrites when it comes to policy...well...no ****. The bigger question is...what are YOU?
 
This isnt about Obama. You just **** yourself over the current spending. Stop playing stupid games. Do you think they should have spent the money or not? DO you agree the pandemic that we are currently experiencing is creating an extraordinary set of circumstances or not?

If your point is both political parties are hypocrites when it comes to policy...well...no ****. The bigger question is...what are YOU?

Reading comprehension is fundamental... but of course you have to be at least somewhat informed in the subject matter to be able to comprehend what's being said.

The fact of the matter is, government spending to combat the Great Recession and financial crisis was fought tooth and nail by Republicans, who consistently criticized spending to the point where they shut down the government and caused the credit ratings agencies to reduce their rating (which didn't impact the cost of debt). Suddenly, when the GOP takes control of the executive, HoR, and Senate... government spending growth and deficits are no longer a matter of concern. In fact, by 2019, the Federal government was going to see $1 trillion deficits as far as the eye can see. Suddenly, the GOP embrace of Keynesianism in the form of government transfer payments is acceptable, even though many of these same politicians labeled it socialism.

Exquisitor didn't engage in hypocrisy. You're just really confused when it comes to the economy and finance. Hope this post helped you out!!!:)
 
Well, if it weren't for the coronavirus we'd think the economy was booming and forget it was only because of a Trillion dollars a year going to the rich.

What if instead of money going to those who deserved it it went to the biggest thieves?

Since both are true, both must be taken into your calculation and they are not.
They were taken into my thinking, and they are minor.

The Greater Recession and stagflation are Trump and the GOP's gifts to the American people.
 
This isnt about Obama. You just **** yourself over the current spending. Stop playing stupid games. Do you think they should have spent the money or not? DO you agree the pandemic that we are currently experiencing is creating an extraordinary set of circumstances or not?

If your point is both political parties are hypocrites when it comes to policy...well...no ****. The bigger question is...what are YOU?

I'm pretty hypocritical.

Inflation hasn't risen five-hundred percent since Obama.

Democrats co-operate, while Repububnikcan'ts obstruct.

Where is your decision to vote?
 
I'm pretty hypocritical.

Inflation hasn't risen five-hundred percent since Obama.

Democrats co-operate, while Repububnikcan'ts obstruct.

Where is your decision to vote?
Democrats cooperate. This last 4 years has been cooperation. The 6 years during the Bush administration, that was 'cooperation'.

:lamo

So you DO want them to stop all spending caused by the pandemic then...right?

Your first line was pretty ****ing spot on.
 
"We're Going To Borrow It"

Data Lab - Federal Deficit Trends – U.S. Treasury | Data Lab

Sorry, I don't know how to past the image, you'll have to click the link.

If the Republicans had let Obama spend a little more in 2009 and 2010, he could have handed over a surplus.

Under Bush (quoted) the Republicans turned a surplus into a crisis and then obstructed sufficient stimulus, education spending, highways bill and minimum wage and then with Trump cut revenue and now with a crisis they put ten-trillion dollars on the credit card.


Other countries are in the same boat with us. Maybe Korea, Taiwan, Germany are doing alright, but the rest are as bad off or worse than America.
 
There is a lot of misplaced worry about the government replacing some of our lost income via deficit spending. (The only legit worry should be that they are not replacing nearly enough of it, and they are paying the wrong people.) Anyway, here is an account of WWII England, when the government pretty much took over the whole economy during the war. (I stripped out the names, but this was a correspondence between UK and Australian economists.)

************************

>>A recent phone-in comment by LBC Radio's economics correspondent set me thinking, as it led to the usual nonsense over equating Govt. spending with 'debt'. There were phrases like "UK Govt is paying the salaries of 60% of Brits- even another month will bankrupt us" etc. I thought of a useful parallel which went on immensely longer, and yet the promised bankruptcy never arose.

Shortly after the declaration of war in 1939, Britain ramped itself up into practically the most single-focused economy ever seen in the modern world. Within 2 years, 6 million Brits were paid directly by HMG in the armed forces alone. That is, at least 25% of the adult population. On top of which, a huge percentage of the UK economy was switched to exclusively war materials output. Domestic car, bus and truck manufacturing stopped completely. As did train manufacture. Dockyards concentrated on war vessels or freighters which often had a very short life.

This continued until early 1946: in other words the UK Govt closed huge swathes of private industry, and more or less directly employed over half the UK population for 5 years uninterrupted. Practically nothing of the 'traditional' industries worked for anything other than Government money, apart from farms, food industry, shops and a token amount of clothing and domestic items manufacture. For 5 whole years.

According to the 'household budget' idiots, this would have left us with a decimated economy, a crushing mountain of 'debt' equal to 5 years or more of GDP, and plunged us into a deep and savage depression.

Instead, the only visible debts were a combination of the real ones: the $6.5bn dollars owed to Canada and the USA for provision of food, oil and war materials, and the sum total of war bond redemption costs in £Sterling. The Dollar debts began repayment in 1950, and the total apparent visible debt was only about a third of what the 'household' model would have predicted, i.e. about 2-2.5x GDP

The whole 5-year complete takeover by Govt didn't lead to much inflation, due to rationing and price controls.

As troops were demobilised in a planned way, because the infrastructure of the economy was still in place, although rather battered, output simply started again. Not quite as simple as turning on a tap, but not far off. The promised depression never occurred, probably helped by the stimulus of having to rebuild lots of things, and re-supply our old markets which had been turned off by the almost 100% cessation of international trade.

So the answer to the pessimists is: we weathered a similar international hiatus which involved the Govt paying almost everyone, for a full 5 years once, and bounced back. That is (with this current lockdown scheduled to probably last 4 months) an almost exact parallel economic hit, but 15 times greater in magnitude. And with more deaths along the way (approx 400,000)

The figures and examples here are of course for Britain, but I'm sure fairly similar for Oz<<
 
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