Budget deficit smashes $1 trillion mark, the highest in seven years

Conservative said:

LOL, the debt down significantly? SO trillion dollar deficits are to be trumpeted because they were declining? You telling me that we should be celebrating that the 9.3 trillion Obama debt could have been worse?? Your liberal logic is typical. Declining deficits that still led to 9.3 trillion debt isn't anything to tout. I am so sorry that the federal taxpayers are now controlling more of their own money and taking that power away from your beloved federal bureaucrats

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You still haven’t suggested what you would have done differently than Obama faced with the deficits he had to deal with.

Kushinator said:

:laughat:



You didn't know Alan Krueger and Lawrense Katz walked back their study.

Let this be a lesson to those who seek data and/or information to fit their narrative, instead of allowing data and/or to shape their narrative. People who support Trump have a powerful tendency to behave in the former.

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Pay wall..no thx

Nickyjo said:

Deficit was down significantly in FY 2010 and 2011, before the GOP got to work. And of course, in his zeal to undo or outdo everything Obama did, Trump will surpass this by a significant margin, it seems. As I have said before, Democrats tend to tax and spend. Republicans tend to spend but don’t tax. Voodoo economics.

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Went down significantly after increasing it significantly. And would have stayed up except for sequestration. And Trump doesnt control the budget, just like Obama didnt. Congress is to blame, both parties, for many decades. Trump cant even undo or outdo. The problem is mandatory spending, which is on autopilot. Social spending and interest on the debt.

WCH said:

Pay wall..no thx

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Are you denying they had to retract their study?

WCH said:

Pay wall..no thx

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Wonder when they are going to walk back this data?

Labor Force Statistics from the Current Population Survey
Original Data Value

Series Id: LNS12032194
Seasonally Adjusted
Series title: (Seas) Employment Level - Part-Time for Economic Reasons, All Industries
Labor force status: Employed
Type of data: Number in thousands
Age: 16 years and over
Hours at work: 1 to 34 hours
Reasons work not as scheduled: Economic reasons
Worker status/schedules: At work part time
Years: 2008 to 2019

Year Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
2008 4846 4902 4904 5220 5286 5540 5930 5851 6148 6690 7311 8029
2009 8046 8796 9145 8908 9113 9024 8891 9029 8847 8979 9114 9098
2010 8530 8936 9233 9178 8845 8577 8500 8800 9246 8837 8873 8935
2011 8470 8464 8645 8652 8576 8427 8281 8788 9166 8657 8447 8171
2012 8305 8238 7775 7913 8101 8072 8082 7974 8671 8203 8166 7943
2013 8151 8178 7722 7964 7937 8103 8099 7816 7764 7936 7718 7827
2014 7296 7299 7435 7509 7254 7422 7402 7177 7020 7025 6898 6856
2015 6808 6671 6629 6608 6628 6383 6249 6423 6043 5811 6174 6084
2016 5941 5978 6066 6006 6467 5748 5926 5995 5918 5971 5738 5621
2017 5753 5603 5455 5279 5234 5266 5281 5237 5179 4912 4866 4986
2018 4982 5115 4969 4952 4920 4736 4588 4368 4656 4630 4781 4657
2019 5147 4310 4499 4654 4355 4347 3984 4381 4350 4438 4322

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Certainly looks like a lot of part time employees to most people but remember to a liberal it is the trend that matters not the fact that there remained more part time for economic reason employees when Obama left office vs what it was when the recession started with a Democratic Congress all at a cost of 9.3 trillion added to the debt. When Trump took over Obama left him with 5.7 MILLION that is now 4.3 MILLION, wonder who those 1.4 million are going to vote for??

Conservative said:

Wonder when they are going to walk back this data?

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That ugly block of numbers is of no value. The Trump economy is dependent on deficits. You take the spending away, and we go into recession.

Conservative said:

LOL, yep a trillion dollar GDP growth seems to be a problem for you. I am done with you, not worth getting an infraction over dealing with someone so bullheaded, arrogant and stubborn.

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If an ad hom like that doesn't get you an infraction, you're pretty safe.

Dittohead not! said:

If an ad hom like that doesn't get you an infraction, you're pretty safe.

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You are about to join others, thought you used to be reasonable, but not any more. You refuse to even look at the data to confirm accuracy and still focus on a topic you don't understand, the budget and the deficit. My so called ad hom's pale in comparison to what I have been called in this forum but I don't report people. I probably should but I prefer posting official data to make my case, results that you continue to ignore

Asked you what you wanted Trump to cut, no answer

Asked you how a 1.47 trillion dollar discretionary budget funded by taxes for those items generating revenue of over 2 trillion dollars causes deficits, No Answer

Asked you to provide the return on investment the American people got from the Obama Administration for the debt vs. Trump, no answer

Asked you where the state and local governments get most of their money, No Answer

You certainly refuse to answer direct questions as this is a debate forum and in debate your opinions don't win debates facts do

Nickyjo said:

You still haven’t suggested what you would have done differently than Obama faced with the deficits he had to deal with.

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Certainly have, I would have created shovel ready jobs that actually created jobs not see 4 million gone. I would have promoted the private sector not the public sector like Reagan and Trump have done. You are blinded by loyalty to a liberal ideology because you believe spending in the name of compassion is the answer and the Federal bureaucrats need your money more than you need it yourself. the Obama economy didn't generate the results necessary to grow the revenue, he created part time jobs for economic reasons, he supposedly saved jobs that didn't do anything to bring us out of recession, he didn't generate the economic growth or real job creation worthy of the debt generated. Compare that to Trump if you dare

Conservative said:

Certainly have, I would have created shovel ready jobs that actually created jobs not see 4 million gone. I would have promoted the private sector not the public sector like Reagan and Trump have done. You are blinded by loyalty to a liberal ideology because you believe spending in the name of compassion is the answer and the Federal bureaucrats need your money more than you need it yourself. the Obama economy didn't generate the results necessary to grow the revenue, he created part time jobs for economic reasons, he supposedly saved jobs that didn't do anything to bring us out of recession, he didn't generate the economic growth or real job creation worthy of the debt generated. Compare that to Trump if you dare

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How would you have created "shovel ready jobs?" Exactly how.

And how you would you have "promoted the private sector"...

Exactly how... Please give a detailed analysis of what you would have done.

thanks..

jaeger19 said:

How would you have created "shovel ready jobs?" Exactly how.

And how you would you have "promoted the private sector"...

Exactly how... Please give a detailed analysis of what you would have done.

thanks..

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Like Reagan and Trump have done, tax cuts and regulation reform for the private sector

saving union jobs isn't the role of the Federal Gov't PROMOTING Domestic Welfare is!!

Kushinator said:

You represent the lowest common denominator in terms of critical thinking and integrity.

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Conservative said:

I am done with you, not worth getting an infraction over dealing with someone so bullheaded, arrogant and stubborn.

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Moderator's Warning:

Comments like the above are going to get you 2 infractions if you make any more. This is your only warning.

Conservative said:

1 You are about to join others, thought you used to be reasonable, but not any more. You refuse to even look at the data to confirm accuracy and still focus on a topic you don't understand, the budget and the deficit. 2 My so called ad hom's pale in comparison to what I have been called in this forum but I don't report people. I probably should but I prefer posting official data to make my case, results that you continue to ignore

3 Asked you what you wanted Trump to cut, no answer

4 Asked you how a 1.47 trillion dollar discretionary budget funded by taxes for those items generating revenue of over 2 trillion dollars causes deficits, No Answer

5 Asked you to provide the return on investment the American people got from the Obama Administration for the debt vs. Trump, no answer

6 Asked you where the state and local governments get most of their money, No Answer

7 You certainly refuse to answer direct questions as this is a debate forum and in debate your opinions don't win debates facts do

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1 OMG! I'm about to join others? You mean others who disagree with you? Well, I'll have plenty of company.

2 Your ad homs are what they are. You aren't getting any from me, and you won't. Such things just show that the poster has no real arguments.

3 Trump does not make cuts. Congress does. I said that already.

4. I answered that one, too. If your figures are real, then that won't generate a deficit.

5. I answered that one, too. What we got from deficit spending then was an end to the recession. I followed that up with asking what we're getting from deficit spending during a time of economic growth.

6. Local governments generally get most of theirs from property taxes. State governments from a variety of sources, I suppose that depends on the state. Most of the red states get a lot of theirs from the federal government. Why do you ask?

7. LOL! Your "facts" include a jumble of numbers that others have organized into an easily readable graph showing steady economic growth starting in 2008 and continuing through today.

Hope that answers once again all your questions.

Dittohead not!;1071178346]1 OMG! I'm about to join others? You mean others who disagree with you? Well, I'll have plenty of company.

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Spent 35 years in the private sector and have never had a problem with people disagreeing but only problems with people who disagree without facts which is what you do all the time

2 Your ad homs are what they are. You aren't getting any from me, and you won't. Such things just show that the poster has no real arguments.

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No they are what you want to believe totally ignoring others including you doing the same thing. Suggest you re-read some of your past posts. Regardless again I have no problem with you disagreeing with me, but do so with facts, logic and common sense. Answer the direct verifiable data that I support my arguments with. Trump's budget deficits were generated by debt service which is now the fourth largest budget item and by entitlement spending and abuse of FICA revenue over the past 50 years

3 Trump does not make cuts. Congress does. I said that already.

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And yet I see no challenging of others who make the debt all about Trump totally ignoring the benefits we are getting from the current deficit. Do you believe that the Trump economy is built on deficit spending??

4. I answered that one, too. If your figures are real, then that won't generate a deficit.

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I have posted the link to the budget and yes they are real

5. I answered that one, too. What we got from deficit spending then was an end to the recession. I followed that up with asking what we're getting from deficit spending during a time of economic growth.

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No the 2009 deficit really had nothing to do with spending at least until the recession ended in June, that deficit came from major revenue losses due to the stimulus not creating the new taxpayers promised, 4 million lost in 2009. Obama spending didn't occur until after June although he did recycle TARP payments knowing that people would blame Bush. Bush loaned out 350 billion that was repaid, where did that repayment show up in the Obama Administration?

6. Local governments generally get most of theirs from property taxes. State governments from a variety of sources, I suppose that depends on the state. Most of the red states get a lot of theirs from the federal government. Why do you ask?

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Yes that is correct but Sales Taxes constitute a growing share of the state and local revenue. Property taxes funds schools, police, fire, and other public services in the community

7. LOL! Your "facts" include a jumble of numbers that others have organized into an easily readable graph showing steady economic growth starting in 2008 and continuing through today.

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I post the actual spreadsheets from both the Bureal of Labor Statistics and Bureau of Economic Analysis(Treasury data). If you want me to clarify the numbers for you, ask or better yet I may need some help formatting excell spreadsheets into this forum

Hope that answers once again all your questions.

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thank you for the civil response. Hopefully my response clarifies the answer to the questions for you

jonny5 said:

Went down significantly after increasing it significantly. And would have stayed up except for sequestration. And Trump doesnt control the budget, just like Obama didnt. Congress is to blame, both parties, for many decades. Trump cant even undo or outdo. The problem is mandatory spending, which is on autopilot. Social spending and interest on the debt.

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Why is social spending a problem? Cut benefits or increase taxes. Same with military spending.

Conservative said:

Like Reagan and Trump have done, tax cuts and regulation reform for the private sector

saving union jobs isn't the role of the Federal Gov't PROMOTING Domestic Welfare is!!

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Obama did that. Obama not only re authorized the Bush tax cuts.. but he also had a stimulus bill that was 1/3 tax cuts. In fact.. he cut taxes so much that the nations effective tax rate was lower than it was under Reagan.

Hmmm.. saving union jobs isn't the job of the federal government? So why did Trump vow to save coal workers jobs. (you know.. union jobs).

jaeger19 said:

Obama did that. Obama not only re authorized the Bush tax cuts.. but he also had a stimulus bill that was 1/3 tax cuts. In fact.. he cut taxes so much that the nations effective tax rate was lower than it was under Reagan.

Hmmm.. saving union jobs isn't the job of the federal government? So why did Trump vow to save coal workers jobs. (you know.. union jobs).

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What is it going to take to get you to understand that people keeping more of what they earn doesn't create deficits as the spending deficits have not come from discretionary spending which FIT pays for. The 2009 deficit prior to coming out of recession was due to Number 1: 350 billion in TARP loans that were repaid during 2009 but I cannot find where they were applied to the deficit so help me find that number 2: Four million jobs lost that the shovel ready job stimulus bill never created, Number 3: Part of the 842 billion Obama stimulus signed in February 2009

Bush tax cut extensions meant absolutely nothing to millions of job holders that lost their jobs and the stimulus program never recovered. Further expenses go up but the tax cuts from 2003 needed not simply renewing but rather replacing with more tax cuts

Saving Union jobs is the business responsibility first, then the local government, then the state. How did saving jobs create more tax revenue for the Federal bureaucrats? It simply kept that revenue flow going, nothing new here

Conservative said:

Certainly have, I would have created shovel ready jobs that actually created jobs not see 4 million gone. I would have promoted the private sector not the public sector like Reagan and Trump have done. You are blinded by loyalty to a liberal ideology because you believe spending in the name of compassion is the answer and the Federal bureaucrats need your money more than you need it yourself. the Obama economy didn't generate the results necessary to grow the revenue, he created part time jobs for economic reasons, he supposedly saved jobs that didn't do anything to bring us out of recession, he didn't generate the economic growth or real job creation worthy of the debt generated. Compare that to Trump if you dare

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Liberal ideology is what has dominated the last 90 or so years. We are healthier, better fed, work in safer conditions and have protected the enviornment. Two interesting but largely unnoticed Trump actions help define the opposite ideology in my view: 1- despite the views of scientists, he allowed use of a pesticide that causes significant harm that had been banned under Obama. Who cares about farmworkers (and apparently children) anyway? All they do is put food on our tables, and Trump doesn't seem to like fruits and vegetables. 2- He removed the requirement that awarding government contracts take into consideration the safety records of the contractors, and for other employers, freeing them from the terrible burden of keeping accurate, unfalsified records of workplace injuries and illnesses.

I like government bureaucrats. Was one myself, investigating race and sex discrimination. Got people jobs back with back pay. Got phoney claims dismissed.

Nickyjo said:

Liberal ideology is what has dominated the last 90 or so years. We are healthier, better fed, work in safer conditions and have protected the enviornment. Two interesting but largely unnoticed Trump actions help define the opposite ideology in my view: 1- despite the views of scientists, he allowed use of a pesticide that causes significant harm that had been banned under Obama. Who cares about farmworkers (and apparently children) anyway? All they do is put food on our tables, and Trump doesn't seem to like fruits and vegetables. 2- He removed the requirement that awarding government contracts take into consideration the safety records of the contractors, and for other employers, freeing them from the terrible burden of keeping accurate, unfalsified records of workplace injuries and illnesses.

I like government bureaucrats. Was one myself, investigating race and sex discrimination. Got people jobs back with back pay. Got phoney claims dismissed.

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I am sorry but liberalism as it always does has gone too far and eventually will run out of someone else's money to spend. This country was built on the foundation of a small central gov't with power resting at the state level closest to the people. Over the years politicians have learned out to create career jobs as they bought votes to make people dependent which is why spending in the name of compassion is such a failure.

What you do not seem to grasp is that your state has an EPA department and is control of the businesses in your state. There is nothing to prevent your state to control pesticides but what I would really like from you is to explain how the largest state in the union with the toughest EPA laws has 6 of the top 10 cities in the nation leading the pollution list

Stop buying what the left tells you and stop diverting from state and local responsibilities to a federal bureaucrat. You like Federal bureaucrats because you don't have to take responsibility for your own problems in your state and can then blame those bureaucrats.

So tell me do you think Farmers are going to support any of the Democrats running for the Presidency? You are blinded by an ideology that promises utopia yet never delivers on that promise as previous groups of liberals have tried what you continue to promote, massive central gov't to solve all personal social problems. That isn't the role of the federal bureaucrats that is your state and local government role. Base upon the record revenue collected by the states it is time to return all social programs to the state with the exception of those funded by FICA(SS and Medicare)

Kushinator said:

Are you denying they had to retract their study?

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Not going to pay to find out.

WCH said:

Not going to pay to find out.

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You don't have to pay to find out... it happened. You could look at the actual study... but that's why you chose that outdated article to begin with. You chose it because you thought it fit your narrative, and you were unaware of the retraction. You won't find Fox News reporting on this... but you did see Fox News pushing a narrative.

But if the only way you're capable of checking the validity of your sources is for me to spoon-feed you... i say why the hell not. : Krueger and Katz walk back study

What do you have to say for yourself to be citing a rebuked study? Furthermore, what do you have to say for yourself for not researching the validity of your source upon learning of this news?

Nickyjo said:

Why is social spending a problem? Cut benefits or increase taxes. Same with military spending.

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Social spending is expensive, unconstitutional, and inefficient and responsible for 70% of all spending. Military spending is only one of those, and while its already been cut, I have no problem with cutting it more.

MTAtech said:

[h=1]Budget deficit smashes $1 trillion mark, the highest in seven years[/h]
Are we great again yet?

Just like many of us said, the tax-cuts contributed to lower revenue that contributed to the higher deficit. Also, this puts to rest the myth that Democrats are the big spenders, as higher spending occurred when the Republicans were in full control.

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Wow.

How short sighted. It's called inflation.

Besides, aren't the democrats in control of the house, where bills... like spending bills, originate?

Please take a refresher course on the constitution.

jaeger19 said:

Obama did that. Obama not only re authorized the Bush tax cuts.. but he also had a stimulus bill that was 1/3 tax cuts. In fact.. he cut taxes so much that the nations effective tax rate was lower than it was under Reagan.

Hmmm.. saving union jobs isn't the job of the federal government? So why did Trump vow to save coal workers jobs. (you know.. union jobs).

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The stimulus bill had a tiny tax rebate (68 billion). It did not cut tax rates except a smaller cut in payroll for one year. Just the opposite Obamacare and the expiration of some of the Bush tax cuts increased tax rates and added a bunch of new taxes. And while revenue to GDP was lower under some of Obama than Reagan, that was due to the recession and stagnation after, not tax rates. By 2015, revenue to GDP was higher than under Reagan.

jaeger19 said:

Obama did that. Obama not only re authorized the Bush tax cuts.. but he also had a stimulus bill that was 1/3 tax cuts. In fact.. he cut taxes so much that the nations effective tax rate was lower than it was under Reagan.

Hmmm.. saving union jobs isn't the job of the federal government? So why did Trump vow to save coal workers jobs. (you know.. union jobs).

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Not to my recollection?

I've been paying taxes and filling out my own tax forms since the early 70's.

How did he make the nations tax rate less than under Reagan?

That most certainly doesn't seem right to me.