• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and that is a c

Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

Mycroft said:
Treasury wouldn't have to do this if Congress did their job.
Click to expand...

I think you mean the Senate, since they are the ones refusing to vote on House Bills.
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

Casper said:
I think you mean the Senate, since they are the ones refusing to vote on House Bills.
Click to expand...

When I say "Congress", I mean "Congress".

I've seen no real desire from either Reps or Dems to cut...or even reduce...deficit spending...ever.
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

Mycroft said:
When I say "Congress", I mean "Congress".

I've seen no real desire from either Reps or Dems to cut...or even reduce...deficit spending...ever.
Click to expand...

Well on that we agree, but it would help if the Senate did their job and hashed out some of the bills with the House. Sadly if we continue down the deficit spending path we are on everyone is going to pay, the future does not look bright.
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

Casper said:
Well on that we agree, but it would help if the Senate did their job and hashed out some of the bills with the House. Sadly if we continue down the deficit spending path we are on everyone is going to pay, the future does not look bright.
Click to expand...

It takes two to tango. In this case, neither is even at the dance.
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

Grand Mal said:
After eight years of Obama the deficit increased 57%. Trump has increased it 20% so far.

US Deficit by President: What Budgets Hide
Click to expand...
Obama ran up $5.5. trillion dollars in deficits for his first four years. Fortunately, the GOP controlled House managed to put the brakes on and finally reduce the deficits. Of course, Trump now has to deal with a desperate Dem controlled House that will do anything to cause him to fail.
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

Bullseye said:
Obama ran up $5.5. trillion dollars in deficits for his first four years. Fortunately, the GOP controlled House managed to put the brakes on and finally reduce the deficits. Of course, Trump now has to deal with a desperate Dem controlled House that will do anything to cause him to fail.
Click to expand...

The deficit in 2010 was 1.547 Trillion due to the stimulus package needed to climb out of the Bush recession and it went down year by year after that

FY 2017 - $666 billion. Although Trump requested additional spending, Congress did not approve it.
FY 2016 - $585 billion.
FY 2015 - $438 billion.
FY 2014 - $485 billion.
FY 2013 - $679 billion.
FY 2012 - $1.087 trillion.
FY 2011 - $1.300 trillion.
FY 2010 - $1.547 trillion. This is the sum of $1.294 trillion plus $253 billion from the Obama Stimulus Act that was attached to the FY 2009 budget.


President Barack Obama: Total = $6.785 trillion, a 57 percent increase.

Trump's deficits...

FY 2020 - $1.101 trillion.
FY 2019 - $1.092 trillion.
FY 2018 - $779 billion.

President Donald Trump: Total Actual plus Budgeted = $4.040 trillion, a 20 percent increase.
And that's in less than one term, and after inheriting a robust recovery economy. It's only going higher.


Just for comparison...

President George W. Bush: Total = $3.293 trillion, a 57 percent increase.
President Bill Clinton: Total = $63 billion surplus, a 1 percent decrease
President George H.W. Bush: Total = $1.036 trillion, a 36 percent increase
President Ronald Reagan: Total = $1.412 trillion, a 142 percent increase
President Jimmy Carter: Total = $253 billion, a 36 percent increase
President Gerald Ford: Total = $181 billion, a 38 percent increase
President Richard Nixon: Total = $70 billion, a 20 percent increase
President Lyndon B. Johnson: Total = $36 billion, an 11 percent increase
President John F. Kennedy: Total = $18 billion, a 6 percent increase
 
Last edited:
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

JohnfrmClevelan said:
That's not how it works. The deficit/surplus is the difference between what you spend and what you bring in via taxation. You can't change that by borrowing.

What you borrow to pay for the deficit spending adds to the debt. So if you have a $1 trillion deficit, you will add $1 trillion to your national debt.



There is no "bankruptcy" for nations. And we are able to pay any obligation in dollars, so there is no operational chance of default - just a political one if Moscow Mitch decides to default.
Click to expand...

Really, there is no "bankruptcy" for nations?

It was the biggest financial rescue of a bankrupt country in history. As of January 2019, Greece has only repaid 41.6 billion euros. It has scheduled debt payments beyond 2060.

Greek Debt Crisis: Summary, Causes, Timeline, Outlook
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

marke said:
The deficit was kept low under Obama because he borrowed trillions to keep it low, adding trillions to the US debt. Americans should be more concerned about the debt than the deficit. The US cannot default on the deficit but if it defaults on its debt it will be in big trouble.
Click to expand...

Nah.

The fed will just make up more money to loan us.

Or we could just make it up ourselves and cut out the middleman.
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

marke said:
How is the size of the US debt not a problem? Do you subscribe to the idea that the US will never have to pay its debt so never will pay the debt?
Click to expand...

The banks that make up the federal reserve don't have an army.

What're they gonna do? Stop creating money out of thin air to loan us?

We can make up money out of thin air too.

Never have understood why we do it the way we do.
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

RobertU said:
Really, there is no "bankruptcy" for nations?

It was the biggest financial rescue of a bankrupt country in history. As of January 2019, Greece has only repaid 41.6 billion euros. It has scheduled debt payments beyond 2060.

Greek Debt Crisis: Summary, Causes, Timeline, Outlook
Click to expand...

There is no legal designation of "bankrupt" for countries. The term was used improperly in your source. Probably decided it was a more dramatic description than "having a hard time meeting its bond obligations."

Countries can default on foreign-denominated debt, or they can default on debt by choice, but operationally, they can always meet their obligations in their own currency if they are monetarily sovereign. That isn't true of euro-using nations, because they stupidly ceded their monetary sovereignty to the ECB. Greece was not able to create their own euros, they have to borrow them.

That isn't true of monetarily sovereign countries like the U.S., U.K., Japan, Canada, Australia, etc. All of these countries will always be able to meet their domestic bond obligations, and none of them have any foreign debts to speak of.
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

Grand Mal said:
The deficit in 2010 was 1.547 Trillion due to the stimulus package needed to climb out of the Bush recession and it went down year by year after that

FY 2017 - $666 billion. Although Trump requested additional spending, Congress did not approve it.
FY 2016 - $585 billion.
FY 2015 - $438 billion.
FY 2014 - $485 billion.
FY 2013 - $679 billion.
FY 2012 - $1.087 trillion.
FY 2011 - $1.300 trillion.
FY 2010 - $1.547 trillion. This is the sum of $1.294 trillion plus $253 billion from the Obama Stimulus Act that was attached to the FY 2009 budget.


President Barack Obama: Total = $6.785 trillion, a 57 percent increase.

Trump's deficits...

FY 2020 - $1.101 trillion.
FY 2019 - $1.092 trillion.
FY 2018 - $779 billion.

President Donald Trump: Total Actual plus Budgeted = $4.040 trillion, a 20 percent increase.
And that's in less than one term, and after inheriting a robust recovery economy. It's only going higher.


Just for comparison...

President George W. Bush: Total = $3.293 trillion, a 57 percent increase.
President Bill Clinton: Total = $63 billion surplus, a 1 percent decrease
President George H.W. Bush: Total = $1.036 trillion, a 36 percent increase
President Ronald Reagan: Total = $1.412 trillion, a 142 percent increase
President Jimmy Carter: Total = $253 billion, a 36 percent increase
President Gerald Ford: Total = $181 billion, a 38 percent increase
President Richard Nixon: Total = $70 billion, a 20 percent increase
President Lyndon B. Johnson: Total = $36 billion, an 11 percent increase
President John F. Kennedy: Total = $18 billion, a 6 percent increase
Click to expand...
Obama was President for most of FY 2009 - I notice you ignore that. Oh, and "Bush's recession ended in 2009, about five months after Obama took office. Oh, and Trump didn't inherit a "robust recovery economy" He inherited an anemic, gasping economy struggling to reach 2% GDP grow. In fact the economy grew only 1.6% in 2016 - Obama's last year. And Trump managed to cut Obama's "full employment" 4.7% unemployment rate by a full point to 3.7% while adding millions to the labor force. Also, you conveniently over look that the GOP controlled the House during most of Obama's "deficit shrinking".
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

Bullseye said:
Obama was President for most of FY 2009 - I notice you ignore that. Oh, and "Bush's recession ended in 2009, about five months after Obama took office. Oh, and Trump didn't inherit a "robust recovery economy" He inherited an anemic, gasping economy struggling to reach 2% GDP grow. In fact the economy grew only 1.6% in 2016 - Obama's last year. And Trump managed to cut Obama's "full employment" 4.7% unemployment rate by a full point to 3.7% while adding millions to the labor force. Also, you conveniently over look that the GOP controlled the House during most of Obama's "deficit shrinking".
Click to expand...

C'mon. It's right there, look..."FY 2010 - $1.547 trillion. This is the sum of $1.294 trillion plus $253 billion from the Obama Stimulus Act that was attached to the FY 2009 budget."
And the year before '16 the growth was 2.9%, and 2.5% the year before that.
Why did you bring up the deficit and presidents if it's Congress that matters? Damn. In Trump's case you cite a Congress that wants him to fail, but I notice you ignore the blatant, proud even, obstructionism of the Republican Congress during Obama's administration.
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

Mycroft said:
It takes two to tango. In this case, neither is even at the dance.
Click to expand...

Correct, same was happening under Obama with the rolls reversed. This I find to be unacceptable and a very disturbing trend as an American. I don't care if both sides have their battles but much if this dead in the water is pure politics and is ignoring the work that needs to take place if this Nation is to function. Problem is the voting base on both sides seems to consider this normal, if this continues everyone is going learn a harsh lesson and wonder why someone did not do something, when all along we were part of the problem. Oh well, all one can really do is hope for the best and prepare for the worst.
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

marke said:
Deficit spending is spending more than you have in the bank. If you borrow money to add to your bank account then you have more money in the bank which lowers the ratio between what you spend compared to what you have in the bank.

It is impossible to default on the deficit. That is the point I was making. The deficit is not what is threatening the US with bankruptcy, the debt is.
Click to expand...

Does your bank have the ability to create money at will? Our government does which is why your analogy is wrong. You think the macro environment is an extension of the micro world. it is not which is why there are two schools of econ taught in college. Did you take econ in college?
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

Grand Mal said:
C'mon. It's right there, look..."FY 2010 - $1.547 trillion. This is the sum of $1.294 trillion plus $253 billion from the Obama Stimulus Act that was attached to the FY 2009 budget."
Click to expand...
So what? It's all money spent that we didn't have and had to borrow AKA a deficit.
Grand Mal said:
And the year before '16 the growth was 2.9%, and 2.5% the year before that.
Why did you bring up the deficit and presidents if it's Congress that matters? Damn. In Trump's case you cite a Congress that wants him to fail, but I notice you ignore the blatant, proud even, obstructionism of the Republican Congress during Obama's administration.
Click to expand...
But Trump didn't inherit that 2.9% year or the 2.5% year; he inherited the 1.6% year.
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

Mycroft said:
That tax cut brought in more revenue. Congress spent it...and then some.
Click to expand...

Um, how do tax cuts bring in more revenue to the government?
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

Drawdown said:
Well it is a little more than that. He borrowed on lower interest 10 year bonds instead of longer term higher interest 30 year bonds and now all those bonds are reaching maturity.
Click to expand...
The current real yield on 10 year Treasuries is 0.01%.
Daily Treasury Real Yield Curve Rates
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

MTAtech said:
The current real yield on 10 year Treasuries is 0.01%.
Daily Treasury Real Yield Curve Rates
Click to expand...

The demand for bonds may not be recessionary fears though. I don't rule out China's fingerprints ultimately being found on this.
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

99percenter said:
Opinion piece. Not fact.
Click to expand...
Not only that, but a review of the last 40 years of tax cutting finds that there is no evidence to suggest that cutting taxes when the rates are below confiscatory levels (70% or more according to economists).
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

Drawdown said:
The demand for bonds may not be recessionary fears though. I don't rule out China's fingerprints ultimately being found on this.
Click to expand...
I don’t see what benefit China gets from buying up U.S. debt, causing our government to enjoy super low borrowing costs.
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

99percenter said:
Opinion piece. Not fact.
Click to expand...

That article is full of facts. You are free to dispute them...or you can just ignore them

Your choice.
 
Re: Treasury is about to flood the market with debt to fund U.S.’s $1 trillion deficit — and tha

Mycroft said:
That article is full of facts. You are free to dispute them...or you can just ignore them

Your choice.
Click to expand...

Didn't see any. You will have to point them out. Assuming you actually read the article.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom