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Nationl Debt Tops $22 Trillion

Dittohead not! said:
The 20th. century is modern history. The issue is, just why was the latest economic downturn a recession, while the one that hit in '29 was a depression?



There are many reasons why this latest bit of bad financial news was not the worst recovery in history. There actually is history from before you were born, even from before Trump was born, believe it or not.
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Love the word smith that you leftists do
 
Conservative said:
No, sorry 2 trillion dollars in GDP growth in 2 years is the official data vs. 4.2 trillion in 8 years of Obama
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First and foremost, it's invalid to compare nominal GDP of different time frames on the basis of purchasing power alone. Why? Because $1 trillion in 2019 is worth much less than $1 trillion in 2009.

Furthermore, Trump inherited the longest economic expansion in the history of the United States.

Even with his inappropriate stimulus package, rGDP growth couldn't sustain 3% for the calendar year. That's a major blow to his credibility. It has absolutely zero impact on your standing here, because you can't get much lower.

If you want to start a thread about Obama, nobody is stopping you.
 
Conservative said:
Hope people are paying attention to this supposed book smart liberal who claims that quarterly annualized growth is the same as actual end of year numbers. This should dispel any claim of superior intelligence on the part of any supposed book smart liberal but it does display typical leftwing arrogance as leftwing radicals are used to bullying and getting their way. Just goes to show that supposed book smart people don't have a lot of credibility thus making their opinions worthless
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Why did you reply twice to the same post?

BTW, nobody gives a **** about your opinion of me, liberalism, the left, etc.... So you can shove it ombres.
 
Kushinator said:
First and foremost, it's invalid to compare nominal GDP of different time frames on the basis of purchasing power alone. Why? Because $1 trillion in 2019 is worth much less than $1 trillion in 2009.

Furthermore, Trump inherited the longest economic expansion in the history of the United States.

Even with his inappropriate stimulus package, rGDP growth couldn't sustain 3% for the calendar year. That's a major blow to his credibility. It has absolutely zero impact on your standing here, because you can't get much lower.

If you want to start a thread about Obama, nobody is stopping you.
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It is however to evaluate economic policies implemented during the Administration and the affect on the American people which I have done over and over again which you ignored. 3% Economic growth on a 20 trillion dollar economy vs 3% growth on the 14.7 trillion inherited are entirely different as it is actual dollars that matter but you are focused solely no on percentages again ignoring that the fiscal year 2018 was over 3% as will the calendar year 2018 when adjusted on March 28

Let's just admit you have no understanding of human nature or the private sector as you never post charts with context and you continue to try and prop up a failed presidency by continuing to make up what Obama inherited. I do feel sorry for people like you who believe they are much smarter than they are
 
Conservative said:
What a pretty chart, get someone to help you read it, what are the dates and date associated with those numbers. Looks like a steady decline from 2010 down, wonder if that has anything to do with the part time jobs for economic reasons Obama created?
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2010? Looks like a decline over the entire timespan.
 
phattonez said:
2010? Looks like a decline over the entire timespan.
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Yes I believe Obama was president during that span as well. The chart seems to go a little past 2015

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
 
Conservative said:
It is however to evaluate economic policies implemented during the Administration and the affect on the American people which I have done over and over again which you ignored.
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No it is not for reasons outlined above, and no you don't do anything but repeat the same tired and refuted garbage. Your posts are terrible and your ability to contruct coherent arguments does not exist.

3% Economic growth on a 20 trillion dollar economy vs 3% growth on the 14.7 trillion inherited are entirely different as it is actual dollars that matter
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The economy was in a lesser Depression. Your attempt to compare has failed.

but you are focused solely no on percentages again ignoring that the fiscal year 2018 was over 3% as will the calendar year 2018 when adjusted on March 28
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I am focused on objective economic analysis. That you've been wrong about everything is just a symptom of rabid partisanship.

Want to wager on the revision? :lol:

Let's just admit you have no understanding of human nature or the private sector as you never post charts with context and you continue to try and prop up a failed presidency by continuing to make up what Obama inherited. I do feel sorry for people like you who believe they are much smarter than they are
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Let's just say you are desperate, and nobody gives a **** about or respects your opinion.
 
Kushinator;1069760162]No it is not for reasons outlined above, and no you don't do anything but repeat the same tired and refuted garbage. Your posts are terrible and your ability to contruct coherent arguments does not exist.
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Your problem is you are used to bullying people and that isn't going to happen with me. If my posts are so bad, stop responding and use the ignore function


The economy was in a lesser Depression. Your attempt to compare has failed.
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That is your opinion, amazingly we came out of recession in June 2009 long before the Obama stimulus was spent according to recovery.org so keep ignoring what Obama did inherit, a Democratic Congress, TARP, No Budget, and had a stimulus passed almost day one for shovel ready jobs



I am focused on objective economic analysis. That you've been wrong about everything is just a symptom of rabid partisanship.

Want to wager on the revision? :lol:
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You are focused on your interpretation of data through your biased leftwing lens and totally ignoring context. The release stated that it was preliminary but that isn't even the issue, fiscal year 2018 ended Sept 30, 2018 and GDP growth was over 3%. Calendar year 2018 will see the same thing when revised to account for the gov't shutdown



Let's just say you are desperate, and nobody gives a **** about or respects your opinion.
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You think I give a damn? You obviously do because you keep responding with the same crap
 
Once again, you failed to properly format your response. Why do you struggle so much with everything?

Conservative said:
Your problem is you are used to bullying people and that isn't going to happen with me. If my posts are so bad, stop responding and use the ignore function
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I am simply owning you in any discussion pertaining to political economy. It is a pleasure to consistently highlight just how pathetic the rabid right has become. If you don't like it, too ****ing bad Conman.

That is your opinion
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It is the consensus opinion of the worlds economists.

amazingly we came out of recession in June 2009 long before the Obama stimulus was spent according to recovery.org so keep ignoring what Obama did inherit, a Democratic Congress, TARP, No Budget, and had a stimulus passed almost day one for shovel ready jobs
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We've been through this before, and you've been refuted ad nauseam. Your attempts to make an apples to apples comparison is an utter failure, for the reasons outlined prior.

You are focused on your interpretation of data through your biased leftwing lens and totally ignoring context.
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I am trained in data analysis. You are a rabid keyboard warrior.

The release stated that it was preliminary but that isn't even the issue, fiscal year 2018 ended Sept 30, 2018 and GDP growth was over 3%. Calendar year 2018 will see the same thing when revised to account for the gov't shutdown
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You want to wager? Not that i expect you to have enough courage to honor your bet.

You think I give a damn? You obviously do because you keep responding with the same crap
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I enjoy pointing out just how ignorant you are. The best part is the endless material for which to both expose and draw upon.
 
Kushinator said:
Once again, you failed to properly format your response. Why do you struggle so much with everything?



I am simply owning you in any discussion pertaining to political economy. It is a pleasure to consistently highlight just how pathetic the rabid right has become. If you don't like it, too ****ing bad Conman.



It is the consensus opinion of the worlds economists.



We've been through this before, and you've been refuted ad nauseam. Your attempts to make an apples to apples comparison is an utter failure, for the reasons outlined prior.



I am trained in data analysis. You are a rabid keyboard warrior.



You want to wager? Not that i expect you to have enough courage to honor your bet.



I enjoy pointing out just how ignorant you are. The best part is the endless material for which to both expose and draw upon.
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You just keep thinking that and I will keep laughing at you and what poor understanding you have of economics, civics, and the official gov't sites

World economists don't put food on the table of anyone but their own families, don't put a roof over the heads of anyone but their own families so keep spouting the opinions of economists you want to believe and ignore anything that refutes them including the official data

You can train a monkey to do just about anything including probably data analysis. Too bad logic, common sense and human nature aren't part of your training

Glad you feel good about yourself as I am embarrassed for you and the school that gave you whatever educational degree you have. You are a walking advertisement for school vouchers and school choice
 
Conservative said:
what poor understanding you have of economics, civics, and the official gov't sites
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Sorry, you have yet to establish this.

World economists don't put food on the table of anyone but their own families, don't put a roof over the heads of anyone but their own families so keep spouting the opinions of economists you want to believe and ignore anything that refutes them including the official data
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Economists are trained in data analysis. Sorry, they have far more credibility than any argument you've put forth, including the pathetic trash above.

You can train a monkey to do just about anything including probably data analysis. Too bad logic, common sense and human nature aren't part of your training
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You can't train a rabid partisan hack to be honest. I've tried. Even when your failed predictions come to light, you just shift the goalpost and keep on failing. It's like watching a building burn.
 
Kushinator said:
Sorry, you have yet to establish this.



Economists are trained in data analysis. Sorry, they have far more credibility than any argument you've put forth, including the pathetic trash above.



You can't train a rabid partisan hack to be honest. I've tried. Even when your failed predictions come to light, you just shift the goalpost and keep on failing. It's like watching a building burn.
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Your credibility is in your mind not in the minds of the American people who are benefiting from the Trump economy, over 5 million jobs created in 2 years most of them full time not part time jobs for economic reasons, rising wages, record S&P stock dividends, record charitable contributions, and record state and local tax revenue.. Sorry that you won't be able to deduct all your high state and local taxes from your federal returns thanks to Trump so now you will learn the true cost of what you support.

My partisanship? Bet I have voted for more Democrats in my life than you Republicans. that partisanship in me want away when I learned what you have failed to learn, liberalism is about spending in the name of compassion creating dependence thus solving no social problems which are state and local responsibilities anyway.

There is nothing intelligent about sending more money to bureaucrats in D.C. that have created the 22 trillion dollar debt. State and Local economies need it more and that comes from consumer spending

Oh, by the way I am partisan, partisan FOR the private sector, state and local responsibilities as well as people being held accountable for poor choices they make. I am partisan for individual wealth creation and the kind of gov't our Founders created, a small central gov;t with power at the state and local levels
 
Conservative said:
Your credibility is in your mind not in the minds of the American people who are benefiting from the Trump economy, over 5 million jobs created in 2 years most of them full time not part time jobs for economic reasons, rising wages, record S&P stock dividends, record charitable contributions, and record state and local tax revenue.. Sorry that you won't be able to deduct all your high state and local taxes from your federal returns thanks to Trump so now you will learn the true cost of what you support.

My partisanship? Bet I have voted for more Democrats in my life than you Republicans. that partisanship in me want away when I learned what you have failed to learn, liberalism is about spending in the name of compassion creating dependence thus solving no social problems which are state and local responsibilities anyway.

There is nothing intelligent about sending more money to bureaucrats in D.C. that have created the 22 trillion dollar debt. State and Local economies need it more and that comes from consumer spending

Oh, by the way I am partisan, partisan FOR the private sector, state and local responsibilities as well as people being held accountable for poor choices they make. I am partisan for individual wealth creation and the kind of gov't our Founders created, a small central gov;t with power at the state and local levels
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Nobody gives a **** about your opinions. I have exposed your ignorance, and will continue to do so. You may have the last word in this exchange, but if i catch any lies (and you are a known liar) i will call you on them and explain the error.
 
Visbek said:
US News: National debt tops $22 trillion for first time, after Trump tax cut

Treasury Department:
Debt to the Penny (Daily History Search Application)

$16,157,240,020,401 in Treasuries
$5,855,600,871,283 in Intragovernmental

Needless to say, the big drivers these days are the Trump tax cuts, and last year's spending bills.

The most likely short-term impact will be an increase in interest rates. In the medium term, it will probably make it harder to borrow in a recession.

Someone better hope that MMT is accurate....
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Can any of your liberals/progressives explain to us how federal tax revenue grew in 2018 with those tax cuts and how state and local revenue set records after those tax cuts were implemented? Do you people have any understanding as to the components of GDP and what the largest component is?

All I see from people like you is promotion of class envy, jealousy, and spreading liberal misery equally to everyone else. Suggest you all get out a little more and see what is going on in the country and rather than focus on 24/7 Trump bashing realize that the top issues facing the American people are economic and security not some so called collusion by Russia in the 2016 elections. If that is the number one issue facing you then all your problems are solved because that isn't an issue for me or most Americans as we celebrate the success of the Trump economy

Maybe it is time to focus on something more important like cutting the size of the federal gov't and doing what Trump did with the executive branch spending, CUT IT!! this thread has gotten a lot of posts none of which describe the major causes of the deficit which is interest and entitlement spending increases, not discretionary spending.
 
Kushinator said:
Nobody gives a **** about your opinions. I have exposed your ignorance, and will continue to do so. You may have the last word in this exchange, but if i catch any lies (and you are a known liar) i will call you on them and explain the error.
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Don't people ever get repulsed as i do when reading someone call their debating opponent a liar. Pick almost any issue we discuss here and there are two (at least) honest points of view. The world is a lot more gray than you would have us believe.

I have given up hope that the people who monitor this site would have cleaned up this aspect. They must feel it is good for business to allow folks to be "uncivil".
 
washunut said:
Don't people ever get repulsed as i do when reading someone call their debating opponent a liar. Pick almost any issue we discuss here and there are two (at least) honest points of view. The world is a lot more gray than you would have us believe.

I have given up hope that the people who monitor this site would have cleaned up this aspect. They must feel it is good for business to allow folks to be "uncivil".
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Thank your president.

Nothing gray about it, he is a liar and has taught his flock to do the same.
 
washunut said:
Don't people ever get repulsed as i do when reading someone call their debating opponent a liar.
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What do you call someone who continously lies?

Pick almost any issue we discuss here and there are two (at least) honest points of view. The world is a lot more gray than you would have us believe.
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Conman is the biggest hack on this site, and will say anything to push his position. There are no get areas with him.

Clearly you haven't read his posts in this thread, where he tells a lie, gets called on it for the tenth time in two months, and then back peddles with comments about his opinions of other people's education levels, intelligence, etc....

So I ask again... What do you call someone who repeatedly tells lies?
 
Conservative said:
Another topic you know nothing about fiscal year of the U.S. runs from October-September so apparently you don't know the difference between fiscal year and calendar year. It they gave you radicals a litmus test to vote you would never have a liberal in office because you couldn't vote
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I think I have said that the Fiscal runs from Oct 1 to the last day in Sept. many many times
way before you said anything like that
It has been you who has said the President takes over the debt on the day he takes office and now you are changing what you said?
have a nice day
 
Dittohead not! said:
The worst recovery in history?

Sorry, but that happened starting back in '29.

We could have had a repeat of that era, absent the governmental safeguards that were put into place afterward.
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and maybe if the Republicans would have put the welfare of the country first instead of trying to make Obama a one term President the recovery would have been more robust and we could have had a economy years before now
Have a nice day
 
Winston said:
All of that debt is because of Food Stamps and WIC, Ditto. Not the unfunded fiscal stimulus for the top 1%. It's all the free Cheetos! What the hell! This is an outrage. That poor guy is eating steak for free and I'm over here working my ass off for 14 dollars an hour eating rice and beans! Blame the poor!
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In his book, Toward a Democratic Majority, which was published in 1968 Michael Harrington predicted a nightmare scenario in which the white have littles struggle with the black have nots for the crumbs from the table where the rich dine on gourmet delicacies. Unfortunately, to a considerable extent it has happened.
 
Dittohead not! said:
Oh, no doubt that's it, but you'd think the self described "conservatives" would be all over giving away taxpayer dollars to people who just are wasting their time using food stamps to feed their kids. That money could be used to build more aircraft carriers, after all.

Or, pay down the deb... oh, right. The Republicans have their man in the White House. No need to talk about paying down the debt at least until after 2020.
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Trump told Bob Woodward that he could pay off the entire national debt in eight years.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...n-debt-in-eight-years/?utm_term=.e9ca18f92306

I do not think Trump is as dishonest as he is often accused of being. I think he is delusional enough to believe the preposterously false statements he makes. Unfortunately, the preposterously stupid and ignorant ditto heads who follow him blindly believe everything he and Rush Limbaugh tell them.
 
Individual said:
We have been perpetually complaining to Congress to start cutting some spending.
When times are bad, government increases spending. When times are good, government increases spending.
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When times are bad Republicans say we need to cut taxes to grow the economy. When times are good Republicans say that we can afford to cut taxes.
 
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