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Should the Wealthy Pay a Higher Percentage in Taxes?

American said:
Distribution%20of%20Federal%20Taxes%20in%202014.png


So this doesn't look fair to you?
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Your graph completely excludes the data that I presented. How do you defend the top 0.001% paying a lower rate than the top 10%?
 
phattonez said:
Your graph completely excludes the data that I presented. How do you defend the top 0.001% paying a lower rate than the top 10%?
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How do you keep bitching when the top 10% pay 66% of the income tax?
 
American said:
How do you keep bitching when the top 10% pay 66% of the income tax?
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That's a separate issue that we can have. Let's stick to the first topic that was presented. Why is it that when you start making more than about $2 million per year, your effective tax rate goes down? Why is that a good thing?
 
Taxes 2017 top tax rate = 39.6%

taxable income $1,000,000
tax ($1,000,000 x .396) - $54,796.20 = $341,203.80
tax rate = 34.12038%

taxable income $10,000,000
tax ($10,000,000 x .396) - $54,796.20 = $3,905,203.80
tax rate = 39.052038%

taxable income $100,000,000
tax ($100,000,000 x .396) - $54,796.20 = $39,545,203.80
tax rate = 39.5452038

taxable income $1,000,000,000
tax ($1,000,000,000 x .396) - $54,796.20 = $395,945,203.80
tax rate = 39.59452038%

As ones taxable income increases, their tax rate grows approaching the maximum tax rate.
 
Media_Truth said:
Note the historical tax chart. In US History, the Top Tier Tax rate was typically much higher than it is today. Since the 1980s, with a few yearly exceptions the Top Tier Tax Rate has been dropping sharply. This is about the same time that the deficit started rising sharply.

View attachment 67243170

Most would not dispute these facts. Some will argue that it's not fair to the wealthy. I believe it is. I believe that the wealthy are more reliant on Government than others. They have much more at stake. As an example - when the Nazis took over countries in Europe, they seized mansions, artwork, and other valuables from the wealthy. They took over their businesses. The poor and the middle class also lose out, but what's the expression - "You can't squeeze blood from a turnip". Besides military security, the wealthy also benefit more from economic governmental entities. In other words - they rely on government more.

Robert Reich analyzes the taxes paid by wealthy in the US, versus other countries.

https://www.newsweek.com/robert-reich-why-rich-and-corporations-should-pay-more-tax-670465

The rich aren’t overtaxed. The wealthiest 1 percent in the U.S. pay the lowest taxes as a percent of their income and total wealth of the top 1 percent in any major country – and far lower than they paid in the U.S. during the first three decades after World War II, when the American economy grew faster than it’s been growing since the Reagan tax cuts.
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Republicans argue that they Rich pay more taxes than poor but they pay less in terms of percentage of income and pain felt. I agree, the answer is they should pay more and Bernie wanted it around 50% I think it should be higher than that because they'll deduct stuff and wind up paying 45 50% anyway which was which was the case in the 50s
 
American said:
Distribution%20of%20Federal%20Taxes%20in%202014.png


So this doesn't look fair to you?
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I get your "infatuation" with the rich. You have your charts, and I have mine.

Income_1percenters_poor_etc.JPG

When the CEOs of the US reduce their income by a factor of 10, their taxes can be cut. They've been gouging Americans for the last 40 years. They get paid hundreds of thousands of dollars just to sit on each other's Boards, and attend a meeting once a year.

CEO's don't work thousands of times harder than doctors, engineers, or factoryline workers, so they don't deserve 1000x their pay. They vote themselves and their buddy-corps huge salary increases and bonuses. There are no checks and balances on CEOs. Tax 'em, and tax 'em big.

And what are they doing with the billionaire tax-cuts that they were gifted two years ago. Now they're reinvesting in Company stock. That's the definition of "Make America Great Again".
 
Media_Truth said:
I get your "infatuation" with the rich. You have your charts, and I have mine.

View attachment 67245966

When the CEOs of the US reduce their income by a factor of 10, their taxes can be cut. They've been gouging Americans for the last 40 years. They get paid hundreds of thousands of dollars just to sit on each other's Boards, and attend a meeting once a year.

CEO's don't work thousands of times harder than doctors, engineers, or factoryline workers, so they don't deserve 1000x their pay. They vote themselves and their buddy-corps huge salary increases and bonuses. There are no checks and balances on CEOs. Tax 'em, and tax 'em big.

And what are they doing with the billionaire tax-cuts that they were gifted two years ago. Now they're reinvesting in Company stock. That's the definition of "Make America Great Again".
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You seem very dark, angry and jealous of others. You're a typical liberal Democrat.
 
Yes.

Why?

1. Rich folks own companies.
2. Companies used to use things like profit shares or ownership stakes for employees.
3. Rich folks have now ended these practices of fair compensation for employees, on an almost universal scale.

Since the rich, that own the companies, have decided they alone have the authority to dictate market rates for employees, it is the perogative of the country to tax them higher. They have ended things that have enabled a strong middle class. It is directly their fault.

They owe a massive debt to society for enabling their literally sickening wealth.
 
American said:
You seem very dark, angry and jealous of others. You're a typical liberal Democrat.
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That's your reply?

Sounds like a typical right wing soundbyte. Presented with facts, you can't debate, you spew bull****.

Typical.
 
Media_Truth said:
I get your "infatuation" with the rich. You have your charts, and I have mine.

When the CEOs of the US reduce their income by a factor of 10, their taxes can be cut. They've been gouging Americans for the last 40 years. They get paid hundreds of thousands of dollars just to sit on each other's Boards, and attend a meeting once a year.

CEO's don't work thousands of times harder than doctors, engineers, or factoryline workers, so they don't deserve 1000x their pay. They vote themselves and their buddy-corps huge salary increases and bonuses. There are no checks and balances on CEOs. Tax 'em, and tax 'em big.
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Stock buybacks are as corrupt as they get, and these people say nothing about it. They think that people work for the economy, rather than the economy working for the nation.
 
American said:
You seem very dark, angry and jealous of others. You're a typical liberal Democrat.
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This isn't an argument. He made a good point and you refused to respond. I similarly showed that once you crack the top 1% your tax rate actually starts going down as your income climbs. Why should we be okay with that? Why are you defending a regressive tax system?
 
Obscurity said:
Yes.

Why?

1. Rich folks own companies.
2. Companies used to use things like profit shares or ownership stakes for employees.
3. Rich folks have now ended these practices of fair compensation for employees, on an almost universal scale.

Since the rich, that own the companies, have decided they alone have the authority to dictate market rates for employees, it is the perogative of the country to tax them higher. They have ended things that have enabled a strong middle class. It is directly their fault.

They owe a massive debt to society for enabling their literally sickening wealth.
Click to expand...

Things like strong labor unions and tariffs. Instead, these free traders want us to celebrate foreign workers getting exploited and paid less than $1 per hour while our own workers lose their jobs and all of the gains go toward shareholders. This system stinks, and they love the smell.
 
phattonez said:
This isn't an argument. He made a good point and you refused to respond. I similarly showed that once you crack the top 1% your tax rate actually starts going down as your income climbs. Why should we be okay with that? Why are you defending a regressive tax system?
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Did you fight the tax cut, because the Dems did. The data you showed was from 2015, so there were no attempts at cutting taxes then. The Dems don't seem to mind people paying lots of taxes.
 
American said:
Did you fight the tax cut, because the Dems did. The data you showed was from 2015, so there were no attempts at cutting taxes then. The Dems don't seem to mind people paying lots of taxes.
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I'm all in favor of cutting taxes for workers.
 
American said:
Did you fight the tax cut, because the Dems did. The data you showed was from 2015, so there were no attempts at cutting taxes then. The Dems don't seem to mind people paying lots of taxes.
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Look who is making out on the tax cuts.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-poli...ax-bill-congress-conference-tax-policy-center

The rich and ultrarich, by contrast, would continue to see massive tax breaks due to the corporate provisions. The top 1 percent would claim 82.8 percent of the benefit of the bill, and receive an average cut of $20,660. The top 0.1 percent, the richest of the rich earning $5.1 million or more a year, would get $148,260 back on average.


There's something wrong with a bill that gifts the top 0.1% more per year than most Americans make in a year.
 
Media_Truth said:
Look who is making out on the tax cuts.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-poli...ax-bill-congress-conference-tax-policy-center

The rich and ultrarich, by contrast, would continue to see massive tax breaks due to the corporate provisions. The top 1 percent would claim 82.8 percent of the benefit of the bill, and receive an average cut of $20,660. The top 0.1 percent, the richest of the rich earning $5.1 million or more a year, would get $148,260 back on average.


There's something wrong with a bill that gifts the top 0.1% more per year than most Americans make in a year.
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OMG, people keeping more of what THEY EARN, HOW UNAMERICAN!! Amazing how people like you are so concerned about the federal bureaucrats not getting fed and totally ignoring the reality that tax revenue is UP in 2018 vs. 2017 WITH THOSE TAX CUTS.

What is wrong with people today and why won't anyone answer the question as to how people(rich) keeping more of what they earn hurts them, their family, or the country? The concept of people keeping more of what they earn needing less of that liberal help seems to be a concept you don't understand

Seems if you worked harder, took more risk, stopped whining and complaining about others you just might be able to take advantage of the U.S. economy and join them in their tax cuts instead of relying on bureaucrats to take care of you
 
Conservative said:
OMG, people keeping more of what THEY EARN, HOW UNAMERICAN!! Amazing how people like you are so concerned about the federal bureaucrats not getting fed and totally ignoring the reality that tax revenue is UP in 2018 vs. 2017 WITH THOSE TAX CUTS.

What is wrong with people today and why won't anyone answer the question as to how people(rich) keeping more of what they earn hurts them, their family, or the country? The concept of people keeping more of what they earn needing less of that liberal help seems to be a concept you don't understand

Seems if you worked harder, took more risk, stopped whining and complaining about others you just might be able to take advantage of the U.S. economy and join them in their tax cuts instead of relying on bureaucrats to take care of you
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I oppose the Republican tax cuts or the following reasons.
1. The economy was doing fine, but the Republonuts decided to start skyrocketing the deficit, by cutting income.
2. Most of the tax cut savings went to the very wealthy.
3. Tax cuts should only be implemented if we have a Positive deficit, and the debt is being reduced sharply.
4. Many businesses are investing their tax cuts into stock buybacks - more benefits for the wealthy.
 
Conservative said:
OMG, people keeping more of what THEY EARN, HOW UNAMERICAN!! Amazing how people like you are so concerned about the federal bureaucrats not getting fed and totally ignoring the reality that tax revenue is UP in 2018 vs. 2017 WITH THOSE TAX CUTS.

What is wrong with people today and why won't anyone answer the question as to how people(rich) keeping more of what they earn hurts them, their family, or the country? The concept of people keeping more of what they earn needing less of that liberal help seems to be a concept you don't understand

Seems if you worked harder, took more risk, stopped whining and complaining about others you just might be able to take advantage of the U.S. economy and join them in their tax cuts instead of relying on bureaucrats to take care of you
Click to expand...

Warren Buffett, for example, was worth about $65 billion in 2017, is paid a $100,000 salary and is worth over $84 billion in 2018. How many of the top 0.1% income earners see that kind of wealth increase in a year? Government taxes income, NOT wealth and government, by redistribution of tax revenue collected from the much lesser wealthy but higher income earners produces the means by which the wealthiest grow their wealth even if they have no FICA taxable income at all.
Think about that, someone who is taxed only on non FICA taxed income avoids paying Social Security and Medicare taxes. Perhaps FICA taxes should be applied to capital gains before thinking about raising the rates or ceiling again?
But just WHO is it we are talking about that represent the 0.1% income earners? A billionaire living and paying taxes on say, $200,000 of stock dividends each year?
Or maybe athletes, celebrities, entertainers, etc. who may not accumulate massive wealth, but may earn enormous incomes?
 
Media_Truth said:
I oppose the Republican tax cuts or the following reasons.
1. The economy was doing fine, but the Republonuts decided to start skyrocketing the deficit, by cutting income.
2. Most of the tax cut savings went to the very wealthy.
3. Tax cuts should only be implemented if we have a Positive deficit, and the debt is being reduced sharply.
4. Many businesses are investing their tax cuts into stock buybacks - more benefits for the wealthy.
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1. When the economy is doing well, perhaps we should see some Federal government spending reductions.
2. You can't cut someones taxes unless they're paying taxes.
3. That would be NEVER.
4. Not to mention people like me who are middle class retirees living on investment income (3/4) and Social Security (1/4).
 
Media_Truth said:
I oppose the Republican tax cuts or the following reasons.
1. The economy was doing fine, but the Republonuts decided to start skyrocketing the deficit, by cutting income.
2. Most of the tax cut savings went to the very wealthy.
3. Tax cuts should only be implemented if we have a Positive deficit, and the debt is being reduced sharply.
4. Many businesses are investing their tax cuts into stock buybacks - more benefits for the wealthy.
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Interesting, still just an opinion not boosted by facts.

What is your definition of an economy doing fine?? What was the GDP Growth during the Obama term?

So people keeping more of what they earn hurts you, your family, or the country how? Is the concept of people that have more spendable income needing less govt. foreign to you

How do you give a tax cut to people who don't pay FIT?

Are you ever going to post data showing that tax cuts reduced the federal revenue and even if it did, so what? Isn't it time for the bureaucrats to go on a diet?

You think stock buybacks don't benefit the shareholders many of whom are elderly and supplementing SS?

So much wrong with your statements that show nothing but partisan ignorance of reality
 
Individual said:
1. When the economy is doing well, perhaps we should see some Federal government spending reductions.
2. You can't cut someones taxes unless they're paying taxes.
3. That would be NEVER.
4. Not to mention people like me who are middle class retirees living on investment income (3/4) and Social Security (1/4).
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Skyrocketing deficits by Republicans are the norm. You're being manipulated by billionaire Oligarchs.
 
Media_Truth said:
Skyrocketing deficits by Republicans are the norm. You're being manipulated by billionaire Oligarchs.
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We need to cut spending and the deficit will decrease.
 
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