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Trillion Doallr Deficit

I do think that Trump is culpable for the upcoming deficit, but not due to tax cuts.

According to the US Treasury Department's Monthly Treasury Statement, the Federal Government received $26.626 Billion MORE in revenue during the time period of January 2018 to May 2018 (the last month data is available) than the same period in 2017. So, revenue is NOT the reason that we are about to have a dreadful annual deficit...it's spending.

The Federal Government spent $110.899 Billion more in January-May 2018 than it did during the same period the previous year.

We don't have a revenue problem in this country. We have a spending problem. Trump should have vetoed the previous budget and forced spending cuts.
 

So what is your state EPA doing about this? Your state has the most stringent environmental laws in the nation along with the highest pollutions in the nation long before Trump came into office. You should be solving your own problems before trying to force your ideology on everyone else
 
About half don't pay any federal income tax. Under my system they would pay at least some. Everybody has a stake; everybody has a say.

and the wealthiest among us pay at the 15% capital gains rate. long term capital gains. assets held over one year. how about we move that to 5 years. while we are at it why don't we make all income subject to social security and Medicare taxes.
 
About half don't pay any federal income tax. Under my system they would pay at least some. Everybody has a stake; everybody has a say.

and the wealthiest among us pay at the 15% capital gains rate. long term capital gains. assets held over one year. how about we move that to 5 years. while we are at it why don't we make all income subject to social security and Medicare taxes.
 
and the wealthiest among us pay at the 15% capital gains rate. long term capital gains. assets held over one year. how about we move that to 5 years. while we are at it why don't we make all income subject to social security and Medicare taxes.

Why don't we raise it back to 30% and start balancing budgets again?

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and the wealthiest among us pay at the 15% capital gains rate. long term capital gains. assets held over one year. how about we move that to 5 years. while we are at it why don't we make all income subject to social security and Medicare taxes.

Why don't we raise it back to 30% and start balancing budgets again?

download (3).png
 
and the wealthiest among us pay at the 15% capital gains rate. long term capital gains. assets held over one year. how about we move that to 5 years. while we are at it why don't we make all income subject to social security and Medicare taxes.

and the wealthiest among us pay at the 15% capital gains rate. long term capital gains. assets held over one year. how about we move that to 5 years. while we are at it why don't we make all income subject to social security and Medicare taxes.

Why don't we raise it back to 30% and start balancing budgets again?
 
Exactly how was the 2008 Crisis exclusively President Bush or the Republicans' fault?

Don't get me wrong, the Bush Administration has blame, but the Financial Crisis Inquiry Commission found blame on all sides.

You can always find blame on all sides, but as Calamity said, the Moron-in-chief, was primarily responsible. And now we have Chump, building huge deficits with tax cuts for billionaires.
 
Waddy said:
About half don't pay any federal income tax. Under my system they would pay at least some. Everybody has a stake; everybody has a say.
Willie Sutton famously was asked "why do you rob banks?" He replied, "because that's were the money is." As a corollary, there is little money at the bottom to middle of the income scale.

In addition, while the federal income tax is indeed mainly paid by people with high incomes, it’s far from being the only tax. So, the DO have a stake already. At the federal level, most people pay more in payroll taxes than in income taxes, and the payroll tax is actually regressive. And state, local taxes and sales taxes are also a big deal, and they’re definitely regressive. Efforts to estimate the overall distribution of taxes find that the system isn’t especially progressive: the wealthy pay a lot in taxes, but they also receive a lot of income, and the shares aren’t much out of line:

102917krugman1-blog480.png
 
You are absolutely correct...to a point. When A Republican is in office, the Democrats get all twisted up over the debt. When a Democrat is in office the Republicans get all twisted up over the debt. Yet neither side is willing to rollback and programs near and dear to them. Both sides are hypocrites.

As the party that reduces the deficit when in power, it would be logical for Democrats to bitch over the deficit and debt. Republicans have no leg to stand on as they increase the deficit when in power.

So no, they are not both hypocrites.
 
I do think that Trump is culpable for the upcoming deficit, but not due to tax cuts.

According to the US Treasury Department's Monthly Treasury Statement, the Federal Government received $26.626 Billion MORE in revenue during the time period of January 2018 to May 2018 (the last month data is available) than the same period in 2017. So, revenue is NOT the reason that we are about to have a dreadful annual deficit...it's spending.

The Federal Government spent $110.899 Billion more in January-May 2018 than it did during the same period the previous year.

We don't have a revenue problem in this country. We have a spending problem. Trump should have vetoed the previous budget and forced spending cuts.

Why does this drivel continue to survive despite basic arithmetic. If you reduce the money coming in, you have less money to cover expenditures... thus, deficits increase. So what you're saying may be true, but it's immaterial to the discussion, especially when the Republicans increase spending on the military and do nothing but suggest minor cuts to public programs.
 
You can always find blame on all sides, but as Calamity said, the Moron-in-chief, was primarily responsible. And now we have Chump, building huge deficits with tax cuts for billionaires.

I understand Calamity's assertion. But the Commission on Financial Responsibility didn't see it that way.

Certainly, the Bush Administration has culpability in the inefficient manner in how the SEC failed to monitor and enforce lending laws and the derivative market. But as Michael Lewis' book points out, the issue quite frankly was that the SEC could not keep qualified, knowledgeable investigators as they left for more profitable positions in the private sector.

However, much of the oversight lapses and scorn by the Commission was reserved for the Federal Reserve. And while their transgressions certainly occurred during the Bush Administration, the Federal Reserve is an independent entity. Outside of appointing the Fed's Chairman and Board of Governors, the administration has little power over the Federal Reserve.

The Commission also zeroed in on the abuses in GSE's such as Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac. Here the story is interesting as President Bush and his administration saw danger coming as early as 2001. In his FY02 budget proposal, President Bush stated called these entities "a potential problem," because "financial trouble of a large GSE could cause strong repercussions in financial markets, affecting Federally insured entities and economic activity."

In 2003, his then-Treasury Secretary's congressional testimony called for Congress to enact "legislation to create a new Federal agency to regulate and supervise the financial activities of our housing-related government sponsored enterprises."

In 2004, the Bush Administration once again warned that "the Administration has determined that the safety and soundness regulators of the housing GSEs lack sufficient power and stature to meet their responsibilities, and therefore … should be replaced with a new strengthened regulator."

In fact, the Bush Administration called for the tools for tighter regulation 17 times. The Democrat response?

Representative Barney Frank (D) responds in 2003 to calls for more regulation by saying that "these two entities – Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac – are not facing any kind of financial crisis … The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing" and Senator Thomas Carper (D) adds that "if it ain't broke, don't fix it." In fact, in 2005 nearly every Republican supported and nearly every Democrat opposed legislation in 2005 which would have would have prohibited the GSEs from speculating on the mortgage-based securities they packaged.

At least Democrat Rep. Artur Davis gets credit for finally admitting:

"Like a lot of my Democratic colleagues I was too slow to appreciate the recklessness of Fannie and Freddie. I defended their efforts to encourage affordable home ownership when in retrospect I should have heeded the concerns raised by their regulator in 2004. Frankly, I wish my Democratic colleagues would admit when it comes to Fannie and Freddie, we were wrong."

So, I'm not sure if you were aware of these facts when you wrote your post. If not, no worries. We all have jobs and other responsibilities that preclude us from always digging out the details of an issue. We just should be wary of putting out "bumper sticker" comments and confusing them with fact.
 
Why does this drivel continue to survive despite basic arithmetic. If you reduce the money coming in, you have less money to cover expenditures... thus, deficits increase. So what you're saying may be true, but it's immaterial to the discussion, especially when the Republicans increase spending on the military and do nothing but suggest minor cuts to public programs.

Mostly because it is "basic arithmetic."

Since the tax cuts went into effect, we have earned MORE money while spending has increased by over $110 Billion. The basic arithmetic shows that spending is the biggest problem, not tax relief.
 
Why don't we raise it back to 30% and start balancing budgets again?

This story is appropriate to explain why simply raising some taxes may not be a good idea.

Suppose that every day, ten men go out for beer and the bill for all ten comes to $100. If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this...

The first four men (the poorest) would pay nothing. The fifth would pay $1. The sixth would pay $3. The seventh would pay $7. The eighth would pay $12. The ninth would pay $18. The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59.

So, that's what they decided to do.

The ten men drank in the bar every day and seemed quite happy with the arrangement, until one day, the owner threw them a curve ball. “Since you are all such good customers,” he said, “I'm going to reduce the cost of your daily beer by $20”. Drinks for the ten men would now cost just $80.

The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes. So the first four men were unaffected. They would still drink for free. But what about the other six men ? How could they divide the $20 windfall so that everyone would get his fair share?

They realized that $20 divided by six is $3.33. But if they subtracted that from everybody's share, then the fifth man and the sixth man would each end up being paid to drink his beer.

So, the bar owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man's bill by a higher percentage the poorer he was, to follow the principle of the tax system they had been using, and he proceeded to work out the amounts he suggested that each should now pay.

And so the fifth man, like the first four, now paid nothing (100% saving). The sixth now paid $2 instead of $3 (33% saving). The seventh now paid $5 instead of $7 (28% saving). The eighth now paid $9 instead of $12 (25% saving). The ninth now paid $14 instead of $18 (22% saving). The tenth now paid $49 instead of $59 (16% saving).

Each of the six was better off than before. And the first four continued to drink for free. But, once outside the bar, the men began to compare their savings.

“I only got a dollar out of the $20 saving,” declared the sixth man. He pointed to the tenth man,“but he got $10!”

“Yeah, that's right,” exclaimed the fifth man. “I only saved a dollar too. It's unfair that he got ten times more benefit than me!” “That's true!” shouted the seventh man. “Why should he get $10 back, when I got only $2? The wealthy get all the breaks!”

“Wait a minute,” yelled the first four men in unison, “we didn't get anything at all. This new tax system exploits the poor!”

The nine men surrounded the tenth and beat him up.

The next night the tenth man didn't show up for drinks so the nine sat down and had their beers without him. But when it came time to pay the bill, they discovered something important. They didn't have enough money between all of them for even half of the bill!

And that, boys and girls, journalists and government ministers, is how our tax system works. The people who already pay the highest taxes will naturally get the most benefit from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy, and they just may not show up anymore. In fact, they might start drinking overseas, where the atmosphere is somewhat friendlier.
 
This story is appropriate to explain why simply raising some taxes may not be a good idea.

I notice you did not have a link to where your post came from. So, where did it originate.
Economic history will show that in almost all cases large tax cuts increase the national debt. And tax cuts typically decrease spending. And therefor tax cuts typically increase unemployment.

decrease taxes>cut programs>increase unemployment>decrease gov revenue>increase national debt
And the beat goes on.
 
I understand Calamity's assertion. But the Commission on Financial Responsibility didn't see it that way.

Certainly, the Bush Administration has culpability in the inefficient manner in how the SEC failed to monitor and enforce lending laws and the derivative market. But as Michael Lewis' book points out, the issue quite frankly was that the SEC could not keep qualified, knowledgeable investigators as they left for more profitable positions in the private sector.

However, much of the oversight lapses and scorn by the Commission was reserved for the Federal Reserve. And while their transgressions certainly occurred during the Bush Administration, the Federal Reserve is an independent entity. Outside of appointing the Fed's Chairman and Board of Governors, the administration has little power over the Federal Reserve.

The Commission also zeroed in on the abuses in GSE's such as Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac. Here the story is interesting as President Bush and his administration saw danger coming as early as 2001. In his FY02 budget proposal, President Bush stated called these entities "a potential problem," because "financial trouble of a large GSE could cause strong repercussions in financial markets, affecting Federally insured entities and economic activity."

In 2003, his then-Treasury Secretary's congressional testimony called for Congress to enact "legislation to create a new Federal agency to regulate and supervise the financial activities of our housing-related government sponsored enterprises."

In 2004, the Bush Administration once again warned that "the Administration has determined that the safety and soundness regulators of the housing GSEs lack sufficient power and stature to meet their responsibilities, and therefore … should be replaced with a new strengthened regulator."

In fact, the Bush Administration called for the tools for tighter regulation 17 times. The Democrat response?

Representative Barney Frank (D) responds in 2003 to calls for more regulation by saying that "these two entities – Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac – are not facing any kind of financial crisis … The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing" and Senator Thomas Carper (D) adds that "if it ain't broke, don't fix it." In fact, in 2005 nearly every Republican supported and nearly every Democrat opposed legislation in 2005 which would have would have prohibited the GSEs from speculating on the mortgage-based securities they packaged.

At least Democrat Rep. Artur Davis gets credit for finally admitting:



So, I'm not sure if you were aware of these facts when you wrote your post. If not, no worries. We all have jobs and other responsibilities that preclude us from always digging out the details of an issue. We just should be wary of putting out "bumper sticker" comments and confusing them with fact.

You give GW Bush way too much credit. He was in so far over his head, he didn't know if he was coming or going. The billionaire bankers and CEOs ate his lunch, and the American people picked up the tab. It's that simple. You can overcomplicate it all you want, by listening to the rhetoric of the billionaires. The Republican Party, no matter who is at the helm, is nothing but a puppet party for billionaires.
 
If cutting taxes produce greater wealth for the treasury, then the most wealthy person is a slave.
 
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