Paychecks Lag as Profits Soar, and Prices Erode Wage Gains

Vox said:

Just read "The Grapes of Wrath."

You may start to understand.

Education is essential to being a good citizen.

That's why America is in trouble now.

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You are still wrongly applying a definition, view of poverty that completely fails to take into consideration context. It does not matter what level of hardship others in the past faced when it comes to poverty when talking about poverty now. Poverty now is very much real. If someone is living on the street or close to it every single month (since most rent is due every month), then that means they are living in poverty. There are many more indications. Claiming that because someone may own a phone/cell phone (which are pretty much required now to even just have a job) means someone is not living in poverty because of a book from 80 years ago describing poverty during the Great Depression as so much worse is nothing more than your personal belief and does not match even the accepted definition of poverty or what reality is like today for many people.

There is a huge difference in how people lived then and how they live and work now.

MTAtech said:

Paychecks Lag as Profits Soar, and Prices Erode Wage Gains
Wait. But some will tell you that the GOP tax-cut put more money in worker's pockets.

What we have here is what happens when we elect a plutocrat masquerading as a populist -- he tells you he'll pass policies that help workers, then, when elected, passes policies that help millionaires and billionaires.
His tariffs are hurting Americans and will hurt more in the coming months and years.
His attack on the ACA is driving prices up. Even Tom Price, Trump's former top health official said the Republican tax law would raise the cost of health insurance for some Americans because it repealed a core provision of the Affordable Care Act.

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Paychecks lagged under barry for 8 years even after he printed TRILLIONS of dollars and raised taxes on "the rich".

8 YEARS!

Now, wages are rising...slowly, but much more than happened under barry.

it's called, 'Making the Rich Richer Again' ................ thank you Donny .........

itsforthekids said:

Paychecks lagged under barry for 8 years even after he printed TRILLIONS of dollars and raised taxes on "the rich".

8 YEARS!

Now, wages are rising...slowly, but much more than happened under barry.

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8 YEARS, huh? I warn people that before they make statements about numbers, they actually look at the numbers. Under Obama, wages dipped during the recession. After the recession they grew. I have no idea why they dipped during 2017.

Oh, presidents don't 'print dollars.' Control of the money supply is only in the jurisdiction of the Federal Reserve.

Vox said:

Free college? When? Where?

I know that in the 1960s people were going to California to get free TUITION for the first two years.

Your statement sounds like EVERYBODY in the U.S. was getting free college.

Wrong.

I paid for ALL.......ALL of my college. Yes, I went on the G.I. Bill.......but that choice was open to anybody with the courage to go to a war......and it was another of my smart choices that paid off.

Quit making excuses.......it just makes you look bad.

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BWAAAHHH.. that's funny. So now you are "what free college".. "people were going to California for free tuition for two years"

THATS AN EXAMPLE OF FREE COLLEGE. It happened all over the country that public universities and colleges had free or nearly free tuition..

And yep.. the GI bill paid for that college. in part.. because the GI bill went farther when colleges were already free or cheaper!.because they were subsidized so heavily by the government.

You also benefited from all the infrastructure, and good economy where one person could work a job and support a family. and so on.

No excuses.. just facts. .

b

jaeger19 said:

THATS AN EXAMPLE OF FREE COLLEGE. It happened all over the country that public universities and colleges had free or nearly free tuition..

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If that were true I would have gotten in on it.

As I said, I paid for every penny of my four years of college costs.......nothing was free.......your statement is simply untrue.

MTAtech said:

8 YEARS, huh? I warn people that before they make statements about numbers, they actually look at the numbers. Under Obama, wages dipped during the recession. After the recession they grew. I have no idea why they dipped during 2017.

Oh, presidents don't 'print dollars.' Control of the money supply is only in the jurisdiction of the Federal Reserve.

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Anyone can make a chart.

MTAtech said:

Your post represents the false narrative that YOU sitting in front of the Fox News propaganda channel all day. Generally, those receiving gov't help are seniors, disabled, and the working poor -- who just happen to work but earn very little.

The idea of the Welfare Queen driving a Cadillac is a lie.

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Right! Now she drives a Lexus.

roguenuke said:

You are still wrongly applying a definition, view of poverty that completely fails to take into consideration context. It does not matter what level of hardship others in the past faced when it comes to poverty when talking about poverty now. Poverty now is very much real. If someone is living on the street or close to it every single month (since most rent is due every month), then that means they are living in poverty. There are many more indications. Claiming that because someone may own a phone/cell phone (which are pretty much required now to even just have a job) means someone is not living in poverty because of a book from 80 years ago describing poverty during the Great Depression as so much worse is nothing more than your personal belief and does not match even the accepted definition of poverty or what reality is like today for many people.

There is a huge difference in how people lived then and how they live and work now.

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My mother was alive then. Kids went hungry in school and even passed out during class from hunger. People froze to death in their homes in the Winter. Kids went without shoes or shoes so worn out as to functionally useless. People who's bodies had been weakened were susceptible to Tuberculosis (sometimes referred to as consumption) for which there was no cure at the time.

MTAtech said:

Your post represents the false narrative that YOU sitting in front of the Fox News propaganda channel all day. Generally, those receiving gov't help are seniors, disabled, and the working poor -- who just happen to work but earn very little.

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LOL!

If they worked they wouldn't be so fat.

Vox said:

LOL!

If they worked they wouldn't be so fat.

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Most trump supporters I see are wider than a refrigerator. Go to Wal-Mart

itsforthekids said:

Anyone can make a chart.

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Are you competing for the most inane post of the week?

MTAtech said:

Are you competing for the most inane post of the week?

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I stand by my statement. For years I've been seeing charts which "prove" that the economy was just peachy under barry (although, real evidence) such as worker participation rates being the lowest in history, more people being on welfare than ever before and the overall feel of depression. The charts and the chart makers are liars. Now, with a booming economy, (it now takes about 3 days to get a dumpster delivered to a jobsite, when it was always a guarantee that it would be there next morning!), I'm being shown charts "proving" that it's just not that good. It's bull****. Am I going to believe some liars chart, or my own eyes?

itsforthekids said:

I stand by my statement. For years I've been seeing charts which "prove" that the economy was just peachy under barry (although, real evidence) such as worker participation rates being the lowest in history, more people being on welfare than ever before and the overall feel of depression. The charts and the chart makers are liars. Now, with a booming economy, (it now takes about 3 days to get a dumpster delivered to a jobsite, when it was always a guarantee that it would be there next morning!), I'm being shown charts "proving" that it's just not that good. It's bull****. Am I going to believe some liars chart, or my own eyes?

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Well, numbers speak for themselves. It is interesting that when numbers disagree with what you think you "know," just know, you choose to dismiss the numbers in favor of your preconceived view. There are numbers for every economic measure and they each tell a different story.

You focus on worker participation as "real evidence." Real evidence of what? Worker participation isn't a proxy for the economy. It has been falling for many years mainly because the population is aging and retiring. Moreover, more young people over 16 are staying in school longer -- as well as parents staying at home to raise children. None of those factors point to a worse economy. But if your objective is to "prove" that the economy is worse, you will find measures that confirm your biases.

MTAtech said:

Paychecks Lag as Profits Soar, and Prices Erode Wage Gains
Wait. But some will tell you that the GOP tax-cut put more money in worker's pockets.

What we have here is what happens when we elect a plutocrat masquerading as a populist -- he tells you he'll pass policies that help workers, then, when elected, passes policies that help millionaires and billionaires.
His tariffs are hurting Americans and will hurt more in the coming months and years.
His attack on the ACA is driving prices up. Even Tom Price, Trump's former top health official said the Republican tax law would raise the cost of health insurance for some Americans because it repealed a core provision of the Affordable Care Act.

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Two points on this: 1) Wage increases always lag profits because wage increases come from profit increases. 2) Price increases always follow wage increases.

Minimum wage regulations put wage increases before profit which effects a business stability, but it can't fix #2 above.

jmotivator said:

Two points on this: 1) Wage increases always lag profits because wage increases come from profit increases. 2) Price increases always follow wage increases.

Minimum wage regulations put wage increases before profit which effects a business stability, but it can't fix #2 above.

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Somehow corporations resist increases in the minimum wage on the grounds that it hurts profits but giving the CEO a huge bonus never seems to factor into the equation. WSJ: Poor Year Doesn't Stop CEO Bonuses

Moreover, wage increases are disconnected from past profits because regardless of profits, companies award wage increases to retain employees. There is no evidence that price increases follow wage increases. If a firm could have raised the price when then wage rates were lower, they would have.

Vox said:

If that were true I would have gotten in on it.

As I said, I paid for every penny of my four years of college costs.......nothing was free.......your statement is simply untrue.

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You did get in on it. Your GI billed went farther because the cost of college was so less.

And you just admitted that you knew California was providing free tuition for two years. Dude.. that;s your own statement.

jmotivator said:

Two points on this: 1) Wage increases always lag profits because wage increases come from profit increases. 2) Price increases always follow wage increases.

Minimum wage regulations put wage increases before profit which effects a business stability, but it can't fix #2 above.

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No.. that's doesn;t make sense. Profits come after wages are paid. Wages increase before profits increase. The very reason a business increases wages, is to increase or maintain profits.

not the other way around.

Price increases have pretty much nothing to do with wage increases. Prices go up due to demand and supply.

jaeger19 said:

No.. that's doesn;t make sense. Profits come after wages are paid. Wages increase before profits increase. The very reason a business increases wages, is to increase or maintain profits.

not the other way around.

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No, they don't. Wages are increased when the business realizes the revenue that will fund a wage increase.

Price increases have pretty much nothing to do with wage increases. Prices go up due to demand and supply.

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Increased wages increase demand.

jaeger19 said:

You did get in on it. Your GI billed went farther because the cost of college was so less.

And you just admitted that you knew California was providing free tuition for two years. Dude.. that;s your own statement.

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Dude, that statement was to refute your false implication that every state was providing "free college." That's a lie. You are dishonest.

The cost of college was "so less" (as you put it) because EVERYTHING was far less expensive then--you could get a brand new car for $2500.........today it's $30,000.

You simply have no idea what you're talking about......like most people of your generation--but that doesn't stop you from babbling your nonsense.

I lived through that era......you're just guessing about it.

Stop taking selfies and read some history.........and read "Grapes of Wrath." It will begin your education.

jmotivator said:

No, they don't. Wages are increased when the business realizes the revenue that will fund a wage increase.



Increased wages increase demand.

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BWWWWAAAHHHH... you are kidding right?

You think wages increase because a company makes profits and say.. "hey lets be magnanimous.. and raise wages"...

that's funny!?!?!

No.. businesses increase wages when the need to do so because they need to be competitive so that they can increase profits or maintain profits. Not the other way around.

Increased wages increase demand

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Awesome.. All I need to do is increase my wages and more people will become sicker and use my services.. awesome.

Sorry.. it does not work that way. Increase wages CAN increase demand.. but not necessarily. Wages can increase and demand may not change one bit.

Vox said:

Dude, that statement was to refute your false implication that every state was providing "free college." That's a lie. You are dishonest.

.

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Dude.. you just pointed out that California offered two years tuition free. And now you are arguing that free college wasn;t around.

and what do you think happens to the price of college.. when people can get free or cheap college at public universities? okay.. you think your public university is going to say "so what.. we don't care what our competitors are doing.. we will jack up tuition and people will flock to us"?

Listen.. I get it.. you don't want to realize the truth.. even when YOU YOURSELF.. mentioned California and free tuition. You made your money during a different time. and a different economy.. that in large part was due to the infrastructure and sacrifices that the generation before you made.

You simply have no idea what you're talking about......like most people of your generation--but that doesn't stop you from babbling your nonsense.

I lived through that era......you're just guessing about it.

Stop taking selfies and read some history.........and read "Grapes of Wrath." It will begin your education.

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Yeah.. here is the irony. First.. you realize that Grapes of Wrath isn;t a historical document. its a fictional story right?

Second.. I know history quite well. Its because of this.. I knew that when you said " we have paid high taxes and continue to pay".. I knew that was wrong.. and was able to provide a link to documents that showed that income tax rates paid fell, since the late 80's early 1990'a and have continued to decline.

I knew history well enough to know that colleges and public universities were much more heavily funded by the government and that tuition was low because of it. I knew that yes.. things cost less.. AND wages were commensurate with those costs. In other words.. it took less work to go to college. (because I knew real wages in this country have been stagnant for almost two decades).

See the problem here..is that you don't understand history. The economy is NOT like it was when you "went through it". It was rare that a family had mom and dad both working full time. Even for the poor and especially the middle class. If it happened it was because of the women's choice usually. Now its a necessity for a middle class family.

The economy is much more global now than when you "made your money". Now.. a worker is competing with a Chinese worker making a dollar an hour. Or a Mexican worker,, or an indian computer tech.

These are facts. You sir are stuck in a view of history that doesn't exist.

jaeger19 said:

BWWWWAAAHHHH... you are kidding right?

You think wages increase because a company makes profits and say.. "hey lets be magnanimous.. and raise wages"...

that's funny!?!?!

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er. . . um, maybe you missed the millions of workers who got raises, bonuses and improved benefits IMMEDIATELY FOLLOWING the passage of the tax bill. Sounds like magnanimity to me.

jaeger19 said:

No.. businesses increase wages when the need to do so because they need to be competitive so that they can increase profits or maintain profits. Not the other way around.

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Yep, those raises will come also.

jaeger19 said:

Awesome.. All I need to do is increase my wages and more people will become sicker and use my services.. awesome.

Sorry.. it does not work that way. Increase wages CAN increase demand.. but not necessarily. Wages can increase and demand may not change one bit.

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Well it seems that those increased wages ARE increasing demand, retail sales are growing rapidly as is consumer confidence.

jaeger19 said:

BWWWWAAAHHHH... you are kidding right?

You think wages increase because a company makes profits and say.. "hey lets be magnanimous.. and raise wages"...

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As a matter of act they do. I got a nice 40% boost in my compensation package at the end of this year due to the company having a terrific year.

that's funny!?!?!

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Are you asking a question?

No.. businesses increase wages when the need to do so because they need to be competitive so that they can increase profits or maintain profits. Not the other way around.

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Gee, and how would they know what they are trying to maintain, or keep up with? Most successful businesses regularly increase wages to reward successful and productive employees, which is a decision based on past profitability not future profitability. All you need to do is look at what a company does when they have a bad year to see whether payroll is driven by past or future performance.

Awesome.. All I need to do is increase my wages and more people will become sicker and use my services.. awesome.

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That appears to be the argument that YOU are making, that is certainly not the argument I am making. But if you are self employed as you seem to be, then you arguments seem even more puzzling.

So do you never give raises to your employees? If your profits are based on whether people get sicker in the coming year then how on Earth do you do a payroll budget for your company? :roll:

Sorry.. it does not work that way. Increase wages CAN increase demand.. but not necessarily. Wages can increase and demand may not change one bit.

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Wrong. Increased wages DOES increase demand. People spend more when they have more to spend... how is this a foreign concept to you? Some people funnel all the extra wages to old debts, which doesn't increase demand, but the vast majority of people translate increase pay to increased spending.

Vox said:

Dude, that statement was to refute your false implication that every state was providing "free college." That's a lie. You are dishonest.

The cost of college was "so less" (as you put it) because EVERYTHING was far less expensive then--you could get a brand new car for $2500.........today it's $30,000.

You simply have no idea what you're talking about......like most people of your generation--but that doesn't stop you from babbling your nonsense.

I lived through that era......you're just guessing about it.

Stop taking selfies and read some history.........and read "Grapes of Wrath." It will begin your education.

Click to expand...

If you were an adult in the 50s and 60s , you lived through a uniquely prosperous period of time for the working class. It will never happen again.
The U.S. was dominant in manufacturing while most of the rest of the world was struggling to rebuild. Anyone with even a H.S. education could find a job. And Jaeger is correct that State Universities ,if not free, were incredibly inexpensive. By the time I went to college in the late 70s, I could earn enough to pay a semester's tuition to go to U.Mass. in a couple of weeks of work. Now State universities cost what? $12- $14,000 a semester? I see jobs advertised that require a Bachelor's degree and that offer only $12. an hour. Young people are loaded w student debt and struggling to find decent paying jobs.