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Snopes agrees that Trump reduced debt

iguanaman said:
Funny you should mention that because i just read an article that said the TPP is going ahead without us. I'm pretty certain that is not a good thing for the US. Putting up trade barriers has never worked for anyone....ever.





https://www.ft.com/content/7a10d70a-0031-11e8-9650-9c0ad2d7c5b5
Click to expand...

You make the false assumption that because we are not in the TPP that may go along without us that we have trade barriers. That is not necessarily the case. We can still negotiate bilateral, or even multilateral, trade deals while not abiding by the terms of the TPP. The TPP is yet another way that Trump has majorly impacted the economy, not that Trump-haters will give him credit because of course Trump isn't technically 100% fully responsible for that, as no one person is fully responsible for anything.
 
vash1012 said:
They had 1 person on their payroll who had run for office before and they WOULD get more complaints about liberal bias because conservatives have been whining about bias for decades and seeing it everywhere.
Click to expand...

That's because most media is actually on the left.
 
Checkerboard Strangler said:
Here is one thing Trump did that I CAN honestly thank him for, and I DO NOT think that a Democratic administration would have EVER done it.
He got us OUT of the Trans-Pacific Partnership. And that, of course, effectively SANK the stupid thing for all practical purposes.
Do we need such a thing? Sure, we could use some kind of an agreement. Could we BENEFIT from such an agreement?
MAYBE.
But the way it was structured, it was going to us harm, and it doesn't take Donald Trump to see that, a lot of people saw it.
So Trump killed the TPP and I thank him for it.
Click to expand...



The TPP is going ahead.

In 2017, the United States withdrew from the agreement.[5][7] The other 11 TPP countries agreed in May 2017 to revive it[8][9] and reached agreement in January 2018.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans-Pacific_Partnership

Japan and New Zealand have already ratified and Canada and New Zealand are expected to do so this year.

Canada is assuming Trump will scrap NAFTA anyway....so goodbye old friends, hello new
 
Fearandloathing said:
The TPP is going ahead.

In 2017, the United States withdrew from the agreement.[5][7] The other 11 TPP countries agreed in May 2017 to revive it[8][9] and reached agreement in January 2018.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans-Pacific_Partnership

Japan and New Zealand have already ratified and Canada and New Zealand are expected to do so this year.

Canada is assuming Trump will scrap NAFTA anyway....so goodbye old friends, hello new
Click to expand...

OUCH...uninformed Ch.S....BAD Checkers!! Bad bad...(rolled up newspaper - kabong!)
Well, this will be interesting.
 
atheist4thecaus said:
Haha...you strawman me in order to tell me that my understanding is lacking. Talk about being dishonest.
Click to expand...

You DON'T understand how the national debt works.
Sorry but you don't, you've demonstrated that you don't.
You don't even have an understanding of how and why we accumulated what we accumulated.
 
azgreg said:
Anybody who thinks Snopes is far leftist is a far rightist.

Hey! just pulling crap out of thin air is fun.
Click to expand...

There's a job for you in politics!
 
Checkerboard Strangler said:
You DON'T understand how the national debt works.
Sorry but you don't, you've demonstrated that you don't.
You don't even have an understanding of how and why we accumulated what we accumulated.
Click to expand...

Lol...so informative. "You don't. Sorry, you don't. I've determined that you demonstrated you don't." lol gtfo
 
Checkerboard Strangler said:
OUCH...uninformed Ch.S....BAD Checkers!! Bad bad...(rolled up newspaper - kabong!)
Well, this will be interesting.
Click to expand...

:lamo:lamo

Interestinger and interestinger.

Canada is now part of the EU agreement, will retain NAFTA with Mexico and is a founding member of the TPP. That kind of puts us at the center of a huge trading block. My economics are not that good that I can explain what that means, but it surprises me.
I was just reading that once the current group: Australia, Brunei, Canada, Chile, Japan, Malaysia, Mexico, New Zealand, Peru, Singapore and Vietnam, ratifies, new members will have to apply. The US seems to be going in the opposite direction of the world...

Meanwhile, Boeing has lost it's 300% tariff against Canada's Bombardier "C" series by a unanimous decision by the US trade commission. My bet is that Boeing misread the mood for protectionism....but the commission ruled Boeing is not impacted at all by the "C" since Boeing does not have the technology for the jet engine STOL.
 
atheist4thecaus said:
That's because most media is actually on the left.
Click to expand...

Uhhhhhhhh yeahNO..
Television news in the USA is a consumer product.
Has been since the mid to late 80's.
TV news organizations these days are tasked with creating a "product" which APPEALS to a targeted consumer base.
If you like Chevy's, they're not about to sell you a Ford. If you like Fords, they're not going to try to sell you a donkey.
If you like chocolate, they're not going to try to sell you escargot.
If you like wolves, they're not out to sell you tangerines.

And that's an EXCELLENT way to pursue the consumer base, get ratings, and make a nice profit.
Unfortunately it is very detrimental to piddling little things like objectivity, impartiality, accuracy, ethical standards and journalistic integrity.
Since Fox News Channel is by far the #1 cable news outlet in the country, it's pretty obvious that NO, the media is NOT mostly on the LEFT, it's mostly on the side of Fox News Channel, and Sinclair Broadcast Group, which is about four steps to the RIGHT of Fox.
Sinclair may eventually take the #1 spot FROM Fox, by the way, if they ever decide to start a cable news channel.
Since they already own 73% LOCAL market penetration on individual stations, putting a signal up on a bird is a matter of writing a check and flipping a switch and BLAMMO, Dish, Direct and all the cable companies would be carrying SBG.
The takeover for #1 would probably be almost overnight.

That leaves the REST of TV news media, which occupy #3, 4, 5, 6, 7, etc etc, to go after the remaining consumer base which is looking for something else. And THOSE outlets ALSO "create product" which they know is proven to appeal to a base.

That is NOT the right way to do hard news at all, as it turns out, but it IS the PROFITABLE way to sell "news product", which is sometimes referred to derisively as "infotainment".

And, also...as it turns out, one of the news "PRODUCTS" which sells THE MOST ON the NUMBER ONE TV news outlet in the country (Fox News) is the meme about how "most media is on the Left".

Exact same process also works on AM talk radio - see Alex Jones, Rush Limbaugh, etc etc.

https://www.debatepolitics.com/bias-in-the-media/307762-tv-news-consumer-product-not-public-service.html
 
And by the way, guess what would happen over at Fox IF SBG ever decides to DO that?
 
atheist4thecaus said:
You make the false assumption that because we are not in the TPP that may go along without us that we have trade barriers. That is not necessarily the case. We can still negotiate bilateral, or even multilateral, trade deals while not abiding by the terms of the TPP. The TPP is yet another way that Trump has majorly impacted the economy, not that Trump-haters will give him credit because of course Trump isn't technically 100% fully responsible for that, as no one person is fully responsible for anything.
Click to expand...



Nope.

Any agreement with a TPP member will have to conform to the model of the partners.

In the case of fruit and fresh vegetables it means America's ready-made cash cow of Canada and Mexico now has stiff competition.

Two, Trump is going to scrap NAFTA regardless of how the talks turn out, which is why Canada has been the impetus of TPP

And please "Trump haters"?

Can you guys grow some ****ing skin and quit whining. Hillary is likely the worst woman on the planet, but at least she had the fortitude to face inquiry after inquiry for 20 years without complaint....and all you Trumpies can do is whine and snivel.

Grow up, join the debate and lose the personal insults, they don't work and only reveal great ignorance on the part of the insulter.
 
Fearandloathing said:
:lamo:lamo

Interestinger and interestinger.

Canada is now part of the EU agreement, will retain NAFTA with Mexico and is a founding member of the TPP. That kind of puts us at the center of a huge trading block. My economics are not that good that I can explain what that means, but it surprises me.
I was just reading that once the current group: Australia, Brunei, Canada, Chile, Japan, Malaysia, Mexico, New Zealand, Peru, Singapore and Vietnam, ratifies, new members will have to apply. The US seems to be going in the opposite direction of the world...

Meanwhile, Boeing has lost it's 300% tariff against Canada's Bombardier "C" series by a unanimous decision by the US trade commission. My bet is that Boeing misread the mood for protectionism....but the commission ruled Boeing is not impacted at all by the "C" since Boeing does not have the technology for the jet engine STOL.
Click to expand...

OMG....a lot of folks in Seattle are checking their shorts for brown racing stripes right now, yes?
 
atheist4thecaus said:
Lol...so informative. "You don't. Sorry, you don't. I've determined that you demonstrated you don't." lol gtfo
Click to expand...

Did you address even ONE of the points I made about how it works?
Ummmm, let's see:

NOPE.

Not AGREE with, just address them at all, in any way?

NOPE.

I didn't determine anything, the facts determined that you don't understand.
If you knew anything about what I talked about, you'd have a response of some kind, beyond whining like a nine year old.
Don't take this personally. I don't know the first thing about a LOT of stuff. The point is, I am willing to learn.
You should try it.
 
Checkerboard Strangler said:
Uhhhhhhhh yeahNO..
Television news in the USA is a consumer product.
Has been since the mid to late 80's.
TV news organizations these days are tasked with creating a "product" which APPEALS to a targeted consumer base.
If you like Chevy's, they're not about to sell you a Ford. If you like Fords, they're not going to try to sell you a donkey.
If you like chocolate, they're not going to try to sell you escargot.
If you like wolves, they're not out to sell you tangerines.

And that's an EXCELLENT way to pursue the consumer base, get ratings, and make a nice profit.
Unfortunately it is very detrimental to piddling little things like objectivity, impartiality, accuracy, ethical standards and journalistic integrity.
Since Fox News Channel is by far the #1 cable news outlet in the country, it's pretty obvious that NO, the media is NOT mostly on the LEFT, it's mostly on the side of Fox News Channel, and Sinclair Broadcast Group, which is about four steps to the RIGHT of Fox.
Sinclair may eventually take the #1 spot FROM Fox, by the way, if they ever decide to start a cable news channel.
Since they already own 73% LOCAL market penetration on individual stations, putting a signal up on a bird is a matter of writing a check and flipping a switch and BLAMMO, Dish, Direct and all the cable companies would be carrying SBG.
The takeover for #1 would probably be almost overnight.

That leaves the REST of TV news media, which occupy #3, 4, 5, 6, 7, etc etc, to go after the remaining consumer base which is looking for something else. And THOSE outlets ALSO "create product" which they know is proven to appeal to a base.

That is NOT the right way to do hard news at all, as it turns out, but it IS the PROFITABLE way to sell "news product", which is sometimes referred to derisively as "infotainment".

And, also...as it turns out, one of the news "PRODUCTS" which sells THE MOST ON the NUMBER ONE TV news outlet in the country (Fox News) is the meme about how "most media is on the Left".

Exact same process also works on AM talk radio - see Alex Jones, Rush Limbaugh, etc etc.

https://www.debatepolitics.com/bias-in-the-media/307762-tv-news-consumer-product-not-public-service.html
Click to expand...

You actually help make my point. The country is split pretty close to 50/50 and yet Fox News has the #1 Cable News channel as a channel obviously on the Right. That's because there are more outlets on the Left, meaning they are splitting the Left base more times. CNN, MSNBC, CBS, and even ABC are all on the Left, some more than others. ABC is probably the most neutral of the group. I'd also add that channels like BBC, Newsmax, and others are on the Left. OAN is on the Right. It's pretty obvious IMO that most news channels are Left, and that's why news outlets like Fox News and even outlets like Breitbart and InfoWars can do so well with fewer competition.
 
Fearandloathing said:
Nope.

Any agreement with a TPP member will have to conform to the model of the partners.

In the case of fruit and fresh vegetables it means America's ready-made cash cow of Canada and Mexico now has stiff competition.

Two, Trump is going to scrap NAFTA regardless of how the talks turn out, which is why Canada has been the impetus of TPP

And please "Trump haters"?

Can you guys grow some ****ing skin and quit whining. Hillary is likely the worst woman on the planet, but at least she had the fortitude to face inquiry after inquiry for 20 years without complaint....and all you Trumpies can do is whine and snivel.

Grow up, join the debate and lose the personal insults, they don't work and only reveal great ignorance on the part of the insulter.
Click to expand...

You are jumping to conclusions and can't say this yet, because the TPP didn't actually move forward and NAFTA hasn't actually been scrapped. Even if we do have to conform within TPP rules, that doesn't mean we can't make bilateral deals that fit within the framework btw.

Calling someone a "Trump Hater" is not a personal insult, btw. It's their anti-Trump stance. I find it humorous that you whine to me about your perception that I'm whining. If you care so much about whining, stop doing it.
 
atheist4thecaus said:
You actually help make my point. The country is split pretty close to 50/50 and yet Fox News has the #1 Cable News channel as a channel obviously on the Right. That's because there are more outlets on the Left, meaning they are splitting the Left base more times. CNN, MSNBC, CBS, and even ABC are all on the Left, some more than others. ABC is probably the most neutral of the group. I'd also add that channels like BBC, Newsmax, and others are on the Left. OAN is on the Right. It's pretty obvious IMO that most news channels are Left, and that's why news outlets like Fox News and even outlets like Breitbart and InfoWars can do so well with fewer competition.
Click to expand...

You just described cutting off a piece of a blanket at the top and sewing it to the bottom and thinking you just made the blanket longer. :lamo

Oh and, about Newsmax:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Ruddy

BBC is not a US news network, even if they have a US bureau.
They're a UK network.
 
Checkerboard Strangler said:
Did you address even ONE of the points I made about how it works?
Ummmm, let's see:

NOPE.

Not AGREE with, just address them at all, in any way?

NOPE.

I didn't determine anything, the facts determined that you don't understand.
If you knew anything about what I talked about, you'd have a response of some kind, beyond whining like a nine year old.
Don't take this personally. I don't know the first thing about a LOT of stuff. The point is, I am willing to learn.
You should try it.
Click to expand...

Stop pretending you are making points when you are not. Here's the quote I was responding to when I sarcastically said you were being so informative:
You DON'T understand how the national debt works.
Sorry but you don't, you've demonstrated that you don't.
You don't even have an understanding of how and why we accumulated what we accumulated.
Click to expand...

Now you quote me knowing people won't see your original quote and you are trying to tell me I didn't respond to the point you were making. You didn't make a point here, but the question is, why are you now using dishonest tactics to confuse others?
 
atheist4thecaus said:
Stop pretending you are making points when you are not. Here's the quote I was responding to when I sarcastically said you were being so informative:


Now you quote me knowing people won't see your original quote and you are trying to tell me I didn't respond to the point you were making. You didn't make a point here, but the question is, why are you now using dishonest tactics to confuse others?
Click to expand...

This is really getting tiresome.

https://www.debatepolitics.com/government-spending-and-debt/307775-snopes-agrees-trump-reduced-debt-post1068102936.html#post1068102936

People saw it when I posted it and now they're seeing it a second time, and from your answers I infer that you either haven't read it, can't read it or can't comprehend it.
 
Checkerboard Strangler said:
You just described cutting off a piece of a blanket at the top and sewing it to the bottom and thinking you just made the blanket longer. :lamo

Oh and, about Newsmax:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Ruddy

BBC is not a US news network, even if they have a US bureau.
They're a UK network.
Click to expand...

Sorry, Newsmax is on the Right. I meant Newsweek, which is on the Left. And it doesn't matter that BBC is UK news, it's a pretty major network on cable TV and it's about on par with CNN in terms of Left-leaning bias. There are foreign channels like RT that fall on the Right, but that's a much smaller network because of it's connection to Russia. Fox dominates cable news for a reason, and it's because it's the only major player on cable that leans Right while CNN, MSNBC, BBC, and others all split the Left up.
 
Checkerboard Strangler said:
This is really getting tiresome.

https://www.debatepolitics.com/government-spending-and-debt/307775-snopes-agrees-trump-reduced-debt-post1068102936.html#post1068102936

People saw it when I posted it and now they're seeing it a second time, and from your answers I infer that you either haven't read it, can't read it or can't comprehend it.
Click to expand...

So you quoted me quoting you, but now you are answering my quote as if I was quoting a different comment. Pretty interesting. Stop being dishonest.
 
atheist4thecaus said:
Sorry, Newsmax is on the Right. I meant Newsweek, which is on the Left. And it doesn't matter that BBC is UK news, it's a pretty major network on cable TV and it's about on par with CNN in terms of Left-leaning bias. There are foreign channels like RT that fall on the Right, but that's a much smaller network because of it's connection to Russia. Fox dominates cable news for a reason, and it's because it's the only major player on cable that leans Right while CNN, MSNBC, BBC, and others all split the Left up.
Click to expand...

You still haven't addressed your mass logical failure with the Indian Blanket problem, and BBC does not follow US broadcast TV news boilerplate, as they are for the most part, a public service of BBC, therefore they stand in a group all by themselves.
And again, we are talking about how TV news is done HERE in the USA BY US TV networks and stations.

Try to keep up!
 
Checkerboard Strangler said:
You still haven't addressed your mass logical failure with the Indian Blanket problem, and BBC does not follow US broadcast TV news boilerplate, as they are for the most part, a public service of BBC, therefore they stand in a group all by themselves.
And again, we are talking about how TV news is done HERE in the USA BY US TV networks and stations.

Try to keep up!
Click to expand...

NPR is another one that is Left-leaning. Being funded by the state doesn't make the immune from bias. By that logic, RT is not Right-leaning. Al Jazeera was not Left-leaning. Except that BBC is obviously Left-leaning, Al Jazeera was obviously Left-leaning, and RT is obviously Right-leaning. NPR is also Left-leaning. All of these are state-funded.

EDIT: It doesn't matter if they are UK-based, Russia-based, Qatar-based, or American-based, all that matters is if Americans can and do watch them.
 
atheist4thecaus said:
NPR is another one that is Left-leaning. Being funded by the state doesn't make the immune from bias. By that logic, RT is not Right-leaning. Al Jazeera was not Left-leaning. Except that BBC is obviously Left-leaning, Al Jazeera was obviously Left-leaning, and RT is obviously Right-leaning. NPR is also Left-leaning. All of these are state-funded.

EDIT: It doesn't matter if they are UK-based, Russia-based, Qatar-based, or American-based, all that matters is if Americans can and do watch them.
Click to expand...

I don't think you're getting the point that we do not have the ability to set standards for foreign based networks aside from whether we choose to allow them or not.

The FCC cannot regulate the way content is created on a network not located in the United States.
Like I said, this is getting tiresome.
 
Checkerboard Strangler said:
I don't think you're getting the point that we do not have the ability to set standards for foreign based networks aside from whether we choose to allow them or not.

The FCC cannot regulate the way content is created on a network not located in the United States.
Like I said, this is getting tiresome.
Click to expand...

You are seriously moving the goalposts. Who said anything about setting standards? Also, if they operate within the USA they do have to follow our laws and standards, so not only is the comment irrelevant, it's completely wrong. The BBC airs in the USA, therefore, it is subject to American TV regulations.
 
atheist4thecaus said:
You make the false assumption that because we are not in the TPP that may go along without us that we have trade barriers. That is not necessarily the case. We can still negotiate bilateral, or even multilateral, trade deals while not abiding by the terms of the TPP. The TPP is yet another way that Trump has majorly impacted the economy, not that Trump-haters will give him credit because of course Trump isn't technically 100% fully responsible for that, as no one person is fully responsible for anything.
Click to expand...

I think Trump is just leading us backwards and his chances of negotiating any trade agreements are slim to none. He's a terrible negotiator except in bankruptcy court. The NAFTA negotiations are going nowhere and if he leaves NAFTA the country will certainly go into recession. Knowing Trump he will time it for the 2018 midterms and it will be a rout for the Dems and game over for him.
 
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