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30,417,609 Paid $0 Income Taxes, Got $89.6 Billion Back

KLATTU

KLATTU

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Not sure but this might apply..

Here in my state, there were 6 Latino workers from a meat processing plant who lived together and claimed something like 65 minor children as dependents. This allowed them to get cash back, a large sum, with out ever proving these children even exist, much less live in this country.

It this the type of goings on your post is talking about?
 
Blkdirt Farmer said:
Not sure but this might apply..

Here in my state, there were 6 Latino workers from a meat processing plant who lived together and claimed something like 65 minor children as dependents. This allowed them to get cash back, a large sum, with out ever proving these children even exist, much less live in this country.

It this the type of goings on your post is talking about?
Click to expand...

If you read it, you would have seen nothing about the child tax credit.

Now can you provide something to back up your claim about those 6 latino workers?
 
KLATTU said:
something to consider as you try to wade through all the left wing demagoguery on the tax bill.

https://townhall.com/columnists/ter...-0-income-taxes-got-896-billion-back-n2424825

"The other 51,452,534 -- or about 34.2 percent of all filers -- did not pay a penny. Their average income tax payment was $0."

A few years ago, that number was ~47 %. Wonder what changed? Anybody?
Click to expand...

jesus ... could they shift the shells around a little faster while they're weaving that tale?

OF COURSE married couple filing jointly paid the most tax ... they earned the most money.
OF COURSE single people paid the least tax ... they earned the least money.
(generally speaking)

"... 27,978,931 -- or about 91.2 percent -- of the 30,417,609 tax-return filers who did get a "refundable portion" from the IRS had an adjusted gross income of less than $40,000."

More than 60% of filers (139,000,000) earn less $40k https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_income_in_the_United_States
Income range ......... % at or below
$37,500 to $39,999 ....... 61.35

So 30 million out of the 139 million people earning less than $40k per year got a refund that averaged about $2,900. Big whoop.

Also ... could an article have been written that was more of a rally against poor people than this article?

You have to compare the AMOUNT OF MONEY EARNED (in dollars, for a particular group of people) with the AMOUNT OF TAXES PAID (in dollars, for a particular group of people). You don't compare the PERCENTAGE OF THAT GROUP OF PEOPLE FILING TAXES (in persons) with the PERCENTAGE OF THE TOTAL TAX (in dollars) that they pay.

Compare dollars to dollars of different subsets of people, not a particular subset of people to the dollars that they pay.
 
Blkdirt Farmer said:
Not sure but this might apply..

Here in my state, there were 6 Latino workers from a meat processing plant who lived together and claimed something like 65 minor children as dependents. This allowed them to get cash back, a large sum, with out ever proving these children even exist, much less live in this country.

It this the type of goings on your post is talking about?
Click to expand...

True, you don't have to supply SS numbers on your W2, only when you file. They are also entitled to the earned income child credit, even if the children are in Mexico. I'm not sure that has changed.
 
Critter7r said:
jesus ... could they shift the shells around a little faster while they're weaving that tale?

OF COURSE married couple filing jointly paid the most tax ... they earned the most money.
ay.
Click to expand...

I see his pont there went over your head. He's a pro marriage guy.
 
KLATTU said:
I see his pont there went over your head. He's a pro marriage guy.
Click to expand...

Of course he is, he's lamenting that higher-earning married couples have to pay more taxes than poor people. Well, no **** Sherlock, and boo hoo.
 
KLATTU said:
something to consider as you try to wade through all the left wing demagoguery on the tax bill.

https://townhall.com/columnists/ter...-0-income-taxes-got-896-billion-back-n2424825

"The other 51,452,534 -- or about 34.2 percent of all filers -- did not pay a penny. Their average income tax payment was $0."

A few years ago, that number was ~47 %. Wonder what changed? Anybody?
Click to expand...

I find this llike so many cons posts to br laughable. Yes, people do pay little or no Fed income taxes, but what about all of the other taxes they pay. FICA and Medicare taxes. State and local sales taxes. Property taxes either where they own the property or rent. State taxes. Licenses and fees of all kinds which are just taxes. As a percentage of their incomes those people who pay little or no fed income taxes pay more of their income in "TAXES" than do the wealthy. So, let us begin there instead of the same old they pay no taxes crap.
 
independentusa said:
I find this llike so many cons posts to br laughable. Yes, people do pay little or no Fed income taxes, but what about all of the other taxes they pay. FICA and Medicare taxes. State and local sales taxes. Property taxes either where they own the property or rent. State taxes. Licenses and fees of all kinds which are just taxes. As a percentage of their incomes those people who pay little or no fed income taxes pay more of their income in "TAXES" than do the wealthy. So, let us begin there instead of the same old they pay no taxes crap.
Click to expand...

Does that matter?

Everyone needs a dog in the fight. If they pay nothing, then they have no desire to control spending or taxes. My biggest fear for this nation is when enough of them destroy this nation by electing people who give them more and more, making the rest of us pay more and more in taxes.

When will enough be enough, and the marginal people contributing to the rst decide it's easier to live off of tax dollars, and effectively strike from work?
 
The 2018 tax information is in. Exemption from the $4,050 per person in 2017 no longer exists. Instead, the standard deduction goes from $6,350 for a single filer to $12,000. It goes from $12,700 to $24,000 for a married filing joint, and from $9,350 to $18,000 for head of household.

I am 100% in favor of this change, as I do not believe in rewarding families to have children. You have more children at your desire and ability to pay, rather than having others pay.

I wonder what the changes to earned income are? I haven't looked yet. Sorry if posted already, I am new to this topic.
 
Lord of Planar said:
Does that matter?

Everyone needs a dog in the fight. If they pay nothing, then they have no desire to control spending or taxes. My biggest fear for this nation is when enough of them destroy this nation by electing people who give them more and more, making the rest of us pay more and more in taxes.

When will enough be enough, and the marginal people contributing to the rst decide it's easier to live off of tax dollars, and effectively strike from work?
Click to expand...

I find this offensive. My husband is a 100% service-connected disabled vet. He spent 25 years serving his country, only to come out damaged and broken beyond repair.

For this? He has tax free disability payments from the VA and SSI. Don't you think he deserves to live tax free? For what he sacrificed?

I certainly do. I'd much rather pay income taxes, and have my husband whole, and healthy.

Don't just assume that because someone pays no taxes, that they should have no right in how taxes are spent.

People pay their dues in more ways than just financially.
 
Lord of Planar said:
The 2018 tax information is in. Exemption from the $4,050 per person in 2017 no longer exists. Instead, the standard deduction goes from $6,350 for a single filer to $12,000. It goes from $12,700 to $24,000 for a married filing joint, and from $9,350 to $18,000 for head of household.

I am 100% in favor of this change, as I do not believe in rewarding families to have children. You have more children at your desire and ability to pay, rather than having others pay.

I wonder what the changes to earned income are? I haven't looked yet. Sorry if posted already, I am new to this topic.
Click to expand...

You do realize they expanded the child tax credit with the new law?
 
Superfly said:
I find this offensive. My husband is a 100% service-connected disabled vet. He spent 25 years serving his country, only to come out damaged and broken beyond repair.

For this? He has tax free disability payments from the VA and SSI. Don't you think he deserves to live tax free? For what he sacrificed?

I certainly do. I'd much rather pay income taxes, and have my husband whole, and healthy.

Don't just assume that because someone pays no taxes, that they should have no right in how taxes are spent.

People pay their dues in more ways than just financially.
Click to expand...

Let me change that to all income earners, and meaning those with taxable income. VA Disability is not taxed already.

I have seen abuses with the disables statuses, and wrong decisions also keeping deserving vets from getting the right compensation. I will not pretend to know your situation, but I didn't mean it to be on all money received.

Keep in mind, I was responding to the complaint of poor people still paying FICA. You don't pay FICA on VA disability either.
 
Winchester said:
You do realize they expanded the child tax credit with the new law?
Click to expand...

No, I didn't. I will search for the specifics some time later, but if you have a link, that would be appreciated. I am currently trying to look forward for my 2018 tax return next year, and mostly interested with single status.
 
americanwoman said:
If you read it, you would have seen nothing about the child tax credit.

Now can you provide something to back up your claim about those 6 latino workers?
Click to expand...

If the article didn't include the child tax credit then the numbers are going to be skewed just by that alone since its talking about tax returns that people got.

As for your question. I don't know about those particular workers but....

 
Lord of Planar said:
Let me change that to all income earners, and meaning those with taxable income. VA Disability is not taxed already.

I have seen abuses with the disables statuses, and wrong decisions also keeping deserving vets from getting the right compensation. I will not pretend to know your situation, but I didn't mean it to be on all money received.

Keep in mind, I was responding to the complaint of poor people still paying FICA. You don't pay FICA on VA disability either.
Click to expand...

Gotcha. And we have been on the receiving end of both wrong decisions, as well as not getting compensation. My husband tried to get 100% compensation for 20 years and had no luck. They kept telling him no. Then I got involved and started doing research (one of my favorite things to do). I first listed his illnesses, then his duty stations. Then I researched whether or not they had issues with toxic waste (several were Superfund sites). I then looked at the chemicals he came in contact with, and looked into what types of illnesses they caused. It all fit together like a well-worn puzzle. I turned in reams of data to the VA, and within a few months, they had approved him.

A friend told me if you want the VA to approve you, don't wait for them to do the right thing. You do it, and show them your work, and usually they'll approve you. But you have to be prepared to put in some work. It took me about 2 years to do all my research, and I have about 10 large 3" binders full of data, all cross-referenced to each other. It was work, but it was worth it.
 
chuckiechan said:
True, you don't have to supply SS numbers on your W2, only when you file. They are also entitled to the earned income child credit, even if the children are in Mexico. I'm not sure that has changed.
Click to expand...

Only if those children are their dependents. Pretty sure that those 6 people, assuming the story by Blkdirt Farmer is true, are not responsible for 65 children.
 
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Superfly said:
Gotcha. And we have been on the receiving end of both wrong decisions, as well as not getting compensation. My husband tried to get 100% compensation for 20 years and had no luck. They kept telling him no. Then I got involved and started doing research (one of my favorite things to do). I first listed his illnesses, then his duty stations. Then I researched whether or not they had issues with toxic waste (several were Superfund sites). I then looked at the chemicals he came in contact with, and looked into what types of illnesses they caused. It all fit together like a well-worn puzzle. I turned in reams of data to the VA, and within a few months, they had approved him.

A friend told me if you want the VA to approve you, don't wait for them to do the right thing. You do it, and show them your work, and usually they'll approve you. But you have to be prepared to put in some work. It took me about 2 years to do all my research, and I have about 10 large 3" binders full of data, all cross-referenced to each other. It was work, but it was worth it.
Click to expand...

Yes, I know it is a difficult task. Several people I work with receive partial disability. It does need top be made more easy.
 
Kal'Stang said:
Only if those children are their dependents. Pretty sure that those 6 people, assuming the story by Blkdirt Farmer is true, are not responsible for 65 children.
Click to expand...

There are documented cases of examples like that though they are few.
 
Lord of Planar said:
There are documented cases of examples like that though they are few.
Click to expand...

You might want to watch the video I presented in post 17. It shows a very different picture of a "few". Though I guess "few" is a subjective word..... At the time the video came out this was costing US taxpayers over 4 billion. Takes more than a "few"...at least imo...cases to reach that high a number.
 
Kal'Stang said:
You might want to watch the video I presented in post 17. It shows a very different picture of a "few". Though I guess "few" is a subjective word..... At the time the video came out this was costing US taxpayers over 4 billion. Takes more than a "few"...at least imo...cases to reach that high a number.
Click to expand...

I remember discussion this on this or another forum some years back. I haven't revisited it, but part of the problem was allowing illegals to file and not requiring proof of children claimed.

Yes, few is a subjective word. In my opinion the abuse was excessive to be allowed, actually non should be allowed, but 100% audits are not possible, or desired. A few percentage of all tax filers can still be a very large number.

Just started the video. It is the same one I say those years back.
 
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