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Thread: A Democratic Republic or Athoritarianism?

  1. #91
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    Re: A Democratic Republic or Athoritarianism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nickyjo View Post
    Yeah, “A Traitor for the Ages.” With that title, it has to be a fair and balanced look at the former president. The American Thinker, aka The Paranoid Digest.
    If you are referring to my moniker, it is not personal...it's my own personal protest about of piece of **** legislation.
    Democrats were for the border wall before they were against it!

  2. #92
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    Re: A Democratic Republic or Athoritarianism?

    Jmotivator is not in charge of anything other than his poor form posting.

    You know what the problems are, so, no, you don’t get “just once more.” Read moree carefully.

    I know your dislike accepting that economic and progress is all based on Obama’s actions. Tell you what: what are the ‘bad parts’ of what Obama did. You cannot.

    We were not talking about the Mexico, Canada, and US trade agreements. Read carefully.

    The tax cuts have ballooned the deficit to the richies’ benefits not the workers’.

    Show us which deregulation and tax cuts specifically have promoted growth. Trump is saying 2.4% GDP while the fact will be 1.1 to 1.3%

    Yes, your ‘Begging the Question Fallacy” is obvious above.
    Russian trolls and their supporters go on Ignore, automatically: no second chance.

    Dr. Fauci suggests strongly that drinking alcohol helps to surviveTrump's briefings on the Coronavirus.

  3. #93
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    Re: A Democratic Republic or Athoritarianism?

    Quote Originally Posted by uptower View Post
    That’s better, some meat at least. How about less whining about imaginary TDS and more like this one please?

    Now to address the point: this Trump/Obama dichotomy doesn’t really exist in my paradigm. It is not my job to defend ‘our’ Obama over ‘your’ Trump. I don’t see the Rosen case as a ‘comparison’ so much as a dangerous precedent. Alarm bells were rightly raised over their treatment of leakers, which is what they got onto Rosen about.

    Now he also happened to be a reporter, but give the Trumpies time on that: they’ve already started punishing leakers and testifiers, as well as attempting to shut the unfriendly ‘lugenpresse’ out of press conferences and so on. More insidious, Trump has stepped up attacks on the very idea of the press.

    The Trump/sessions DOJ did indeed investigate Ali Watkins of the NYT over leaks, probably using the Obama precedent. So while no charges have been brought against journalists yet, Trump is already moving in that direction.
    Imaginary TDS?

    Democrats were for the border wall before they were against it!

  4. #94
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    Re: A Democratic Republic or Athoritarianism?

    Ok, will do my best, for convenience in response to the earlier exchange.

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    Re: A Democratic Republic or Athoritarianism?

    Quote Originally Posted by ObamacareFail View Post
    If you are referring to my moniker, it is not personal...it's my own personal protest about of piece of **** legislation.
    No I wasn’t referring to your moniker. If Obamacare is a failure, amend it or replace it. Isn’t that what the plan was before Sen McCain’s vote? My feeling is that the main thing the right dislikes about Obamacare - which was reportedly based on conservatives’ plans — is its first three syllables. Or, you could wait a few decades, and the GOP will find the ACA as dangerous to touch as Medicare, and will trumpet their support.

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    Re: A Democratic Republic or Athoritarianism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nickyjo View Post
    The only thing not accurate is the “severe economic and social regimentation.” All the other stuff you can find in Trump’s approach to governing.
    Exalts the nation and race above the individual

    - calls Mexican illegals “rapists”, offers no stats
    - refers to all immigrants, presumably my father and grandparents, as poisonous snakes — on more than one occasion, no stats presented, even tho immigrant crime rates are lower
    - proposes banning all Muslims and monitoring mosques

    Stands for a centralized and autocratic government
    - “I alone” can solve certain problems — Mussolini couldn’t have said it better
    - no need to get more specific than to point out that his admin. has proposed tougher sentences for crimes committed by the peasantry, and pardons those committed by the aristocrats, he has spread hugely false info on black on white homicide, told cops to be rough on suspects, suggested torture worse than waterboarding, and suggested our military commit war crimes (“take out their families” — including pregnant women? President ProLife) for actions similar to what Nazi’s were hanged for, and of course, referred to those golden days when protesters were taken out on stretchers.

    Forcible suppression of the opposition
    - “forcible” is a stretch, but “I can do anything” comes close to defining his approach

    Admittedly, Trump’s fascism is more style than substance. His preening

  7. #97
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    Re: A Democratic Republic or Athoritarianism?

    [QUOTE=Nickyjo;1071388325]Exalts the nation and race above the individual

    - calls Mexican illegals “rapists”, offers no stats
    - refers to all immigrants, presumably my father and grandparents, as poisonous snakes — on more than one occasion, no stats presented, even tho immigrant crime rates are lower
    - proposes banning all Muslims and monitoring mosques

    Stands for a centralized and autocratic government
    - “I alone” can solve certain problems — Mussolini couldn’t have said it better
    - no need to get more specific than to point out that his admin. has proposed tougher sentences for crimes committed by the peasantry, and pardons those committed by the aristocrats, he has spread hugely false info on black on white homicide, told cops to be rough on suspects, suggested torture worse than waterboarding, and suggested our military commit war crimes (“take out their families” — including pregnant women? President ProLife) for actions similar to what Nazi’s were hanged for, and of course, referred to those golden days when protesters were taken out on stretchers.

    Forcible suppression of the opposition
    - “forcible” is a stretch, but “I can do anything” comes close to defining his approach

    Admittedly, Trump’s fascism is more style than substance. His preening resembles that of Benito. His MAGA slogan longs for some bygone period of the past much as Mussolini referred to theRoman Empire. The is also a famous painting of Hitler in armor as some sort of Teutonic knight. By the way, has anyone asked Trump when America was great and when and how it lost its greatness?

  8. #98
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    Re: A Democratic Republic or Athoritarianism?

    [QUOTE=Nickyjo;1071388325]Exalts the nation and race above the individual

    - calls Mexican illegals “rapists”, offers no stats
    - refers to all immigrants, presumably my father and grandparents, as poisonous snakes — on more than one occasion, no stats presented, even tho immigrant crime rates are lower
    - proposes banning all Muslims and monitoring mosques

    Stands for a centralized and autocratic government
    - “I alone” can solve certain problems — Mussolini couldn’t have said it better
    - no need to get more specific than to point out that his admin. has proposed tougher sentences for crimes committed by the peasantry, and pardons those committed by the aristocrats, he has spread hugely false info on black on white homicide, told cops to be rough on suspects, suggested torture worse than waterboarding, and suggested our military commit war crimes (“take out their families” — including pregnant women? President ProLife) for actions similar to what Nazi’s were hanged for, and of course, referred to those golden days when protesters were taken out on stretchers.

    Forcible suppression of the opposition
    - “forcible” is a stretch, but “I can do anything” comes close to defining his approach

    Admittedly, Trump’s fascism is more style than substance. His preening resembles that of Benito. His MAGA slogan longs for some bygone period of the past much as Mussolini referred to theRoman Empire. The is also a famous painting of Hitler in armor as some sort of Teutonic knight. By the way, has anyone asked Trump when America was great and when and how it lost its greatness?

  9. #99
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    Re: A Democratic Republic or Athoritarianism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nickyjo View Post
    No I wasn’t referring to your moniker. If Obamacare is a failure, amend it or replace it. Isn’t that what the plan was before Sen McCain’s vote? My feeling is that the main thing the right dislikes about Obamacare - which was reportedly based on conservatives’ plans — is its first three syllables.
    You are wrong on both counts. Conservatives do not like the ACA because it makes health insurance too damned expensive. Healthcare reform was needed, however the ACA was not reform. It government mandated control of private healthcare. And your claim that the ACA was based on conservative plans is utter nonsense and likely based on a conservative think tank at one time proposing something remotely similar to it. Conservatives do not take marching orders from conservative think tanks. No conservative in the White House or Congress has ever proposed anything remotely similar to the ACA. And before you respond with Romneycare, Romney is not and never was a real conservative. He is a RINO.

    Or, you could wait a few decades, and the GOP will find the ACA as dangerous to touch as Medicare, and will trumpet their support.
    I doubt it. The ACA will continue to crumble under it's own weight. Long term, it cannot survive the repeal of the individual mandate. As for repealing and replacing the entire ACA in one fell swoop, that will only happen when both parties are willing to work together on an alternative plan that both sides can live with. That is what should have been done to begin with. Instead the democrats decided they had the votes and could pass anything they wanted to. Unfortunately for them, no republicans joined them and they ended up with no political cover for a largely unpopular piece of **** legislation. That resulted in a wave of republican victories in the 2010 midterms as well as republican victories in the majority of state legislatures. My own state legislature went republican for the first time since Ulysess S Grant was president. The ACA has been a disaster for the democrat party.
    Democrats were for the border wall before they were against it!

  10. #100
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    Re: A Democratic Republic or Athoritarianism?

    Quote Originally Posted by ObamacareFail View Post
    You are wrong on both counts. Conservatives do not like the ACA because it makes health insurance too damned expensive. Healthcare reform was needed, however the ACA was not reform. It government mandated control of private healthcare.

    ++ my cynical theory on the ACA was democrats: the foot-in-the-door notion. Let’s pass something to get started on this project. Republicans cynicism: let’s not have another large government program liberals can take credit for, like SS and Medicare. Some actually said that.

    And your claim that the ACA was based on conservative plans is utter nonsense and likely based on a conservative think tank at one time proposing something remotely similar to it. Conservatives do not take marching orders from conservative think tanks. No conservative in the White House or Congress has ever proposed anything remotely similar to the ACA. And before you respond with Romneycare, Romney is not and never was a real conservative. He is a RINO.

    ++ Romney represents what used to be the republicans role in such things, moderating or putting the brakes on liberal legislation for defensible reasons. As I remember it, however, the GOP solution back then was proclaiming that “America has the best healthcare system in the world, and let’s try special savings accounts”. It apparently was the Heritage Foundation that came up with a plan resembling the ACA.



    I doubt it. The ACA will continue to crumble under it's own weight. Long term, it cannot survive the repeal of the individual mandate. As for repealing and replacing the entire ACA in one fell swoop, that will only happen when both parties are willing to work together on an alternative plan that both sides can live with. That is what should have been done to begin with. Instead the democrats decided they had the votes and could pass anything they wanted to. Unfortunately for them, no republicans joined them and they ended up with no political cover for a largely unpopular piece of **** legislation. That resulted in a wave of republican victories in the 2010 midterms as well as republican victories in the majority of state legislatures. My own state legislature went republican for the first time since Ulysess S Grant was president. The ACA has been a disaster for the democrat party.
    ++ Correct. A lousy roll out and it’s demonization made it unpopular. As noted, the GOP in general tends to oppose government programs that don’t involve jailing people at home or blowing them up overseas, admittedly an oversimplification. For a version of that notion, however look up what Reagan has to say about Medicare (in 1960, I believe).

    ++ And approval of the ACA has grown in recent years, so the prospects of both parties agreeing on something similar but presumably better are increased. Look, the bottom line is that Obama’s quote (was it originally MLK?) about the “arc of history” bending towards more justice (I might have said “zig-zags” rather than bend).

    ++ As noted just above, the last one hundred plus years have seen progressive legislation take hold in the US, moderated by conservative changes, suggestion and rollbacks, from anti-trust to the New Deal to LBJ to Nixon signing EPA legislation to the ACA. (The same has happened in other developed and some lesser developed countries.) The great conservative Willian F Buckley humorously suggested that his role was to stand athwart the path of history yelling “Stop!”
    Last edited by Nickyjo; 02-21-20 at 06:26 PM.

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