• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

"Is the Presidency Driving Us Nuts?"

This president and congress don't suck any more than any of the last several.

They have been bad for a very long time.
 
The only people I've seen that are being driven nuts, are a majority of the minions on the alt-left. Those of us with our sanity are just busy pointing and laughing.
 
This president and congress don't suck any more than any of the last several.

They have been bad for a very long time.

Nonsense

Let's see the last guy bailed out the banks and the car industry fixed wall st. Saved the housing market.
Provide health insurance for millions. Did not start a new war ended one war.
You might not like it but the last guy fixed things.
He pretty much handed the new guy a nation better off then it was when he 1st took office in 2009. GOP haters might not like it but it's the truth.

The guy before him let's see came in with a balance budget and surplus had no domesitc agenda what's so ever... Was sleep on the job allowed 9/11 to happen on his watch.
Made government more bigger homeland Security and fema...
Embarrassing foreign policy. Declared mission accomplished on an air craft carrier...
Forgot about Iraq invaded Afghanistan oh yeah we still there.

SMH GOP presidents are horrible the last two have stole elections to gain power then don't get crap done.

Now here's trump in his 1st year in office he has passed a tax cut for the rich.

My god I hope nothing serious like a 9/11 happens under this administration.

You will have trump pointing blame at everybody but himself.

What a crappy Show.
 
Last edited:
This president and his administration suck gen. Kelly just came out on fake I mean fox News and said Mexico is not paying for no wall... So who is the American tax payers. That's who so of his many lies you brain washed GOP voters go ahead with even more excuses for this lair. And thank goodness we do have checks and balances in our system of government just image if trump did have his way with the ban. And all of the other crap he has tried to do that the courts throw out.

Unfortunately....

False promises and outright lies by politicians are "protected speech".

Yet we have mega millions of voter who are gullible enough to buy the bull**** and then turn around says that it's up to the voters to hold the 3 branches of government responsible and accountable. :roll: It we the people can't build a government that has a much higher level of integrity and allegiance to the citizens, then we'll continue to live in nation ran by corrupt authoritarians. Trump is not America's answer. And if the majority of Americans really and truly believe that he is, then may the powers of the universe have mercy on the little planet called Earth. Maybe a huge comet will take care of the problem.
 
Jay Cost at National Review argues that in fewer than 70 years, we have developed a “pervasive sense of presidential omnipotence and omniscience,” the notion that a President is all-powerful and everywhere, and that this may be driving us all crazy. In a republic, centering government power around one person and making that person a celebrity superstar is not very republican, he says, and adds:

The fact that any president could rile up the nation as Trump has is an illustration of how overgrown the executive power has become. The notion of “coequal branches” is a 20th-century invention. For most of the nation’s history prior to the Great Depression, the president played second fiddle to Congress. This was by constitutional design. The Framers envisioned the legislature, not the president, as the fount of republican authority, and they designed a government accordingly.

Cost observes that when Teddy Roosevelt reinvigorated the Presidency, his opponents mocked him for it, and he blames “Progressive Democrats” assuming power under Wilson and certainly under FDR for “giving the president a leadership role that he had only occasionally possessed before.”

He also notes that FDR’s admin was the first to exploit mass-communications technology. With successive admins, “Presidential exposure has scaled up accordingly.” His opinion:

I think one reason for these bipartisan manifestations of presidential derangement syndrome is the mythological foundation of the modern presidency. A core operating assumption of the office is that one human being can possibly speak for the national interest generally understood. That is fanciful. At most, the president will always express a particular view of the national interest, thereby creating the potential for cognitive dissonance in a sizable minority of the country. Because he is now able to speak to us so often, this mental discomfort can be nearly constant for his opponents. And because he is now so powerful, he also makes it seem to them that he is ruining the country. Trump & Obama Derangement Syndrome Rooted in Myth of President as King | National Review

I’m with the author: I too hope that the “lemonade” here is that perhaps the Trump administration is exposing institutional flaws that will lead to the scaling back of the Executive and the reformation and restoration of the Congress.



Most interesting article, thank you.

Irony, Teddy Roosevelt was he first "presidential super star".

I have always found Americans' outsized interest in the royals interesting if not amusing. It is not a simple, amusement, more like a passion. I mean Americans rejected the crown with the most violent means possible at the time and celebrated "The birth of a new where all men are created equal...

Then turned around three years later and, using slave labor, built a castle as official residence.

But then there is the irony that the President of the United States is only democratic leader who is "hailed" into a room with an "official anthem" just like Caesars of old where hailed into the forums.


One thing that has always bothered me is that everywhere, every federal office, classroom, military building and all the ships at sea have an "official" portrait staring down at you from the wall like Big Brother.

The only other places I have seen that, pictures of the leader, has been in 1950's Canada, China, North Korea, Cuba and Russia.
 
In every Episcopalian church I ever attended, somewhere there was always a large and expensively framed picture of the diocese's bishop. I guess I just always assumed official portraiture was a thing.

BTW, on the TV show "Blue Bloods," the camera pans pretty frequently to a portrait of Teddy Roosevelt, and Tom Selleck's character, the NYC Police Commissioner, often quotes him.
 
Nonsense

Let's see the last guy bailed out the banks and the car industry fixed wall st. Saved the housing market.
Provide health insurance for millions. Did not start a new war ended one war.
You might not like it but the last guy fixed things.
He pretty much handed the new guy a nation better off then it was when he 1st took office in 2009. GOP haters might not like it but it's the truth.

The guy before him let's see came in with a balance budget and surplus had no domesitc agenda what's so ever... Was sleep on the job allowed 9/11 to happen on his watch.
Made government more bigger homeland Security and fema...
Embarrassing foreign policy. Declared mission accomplished on an air craft carrier...
Forgot about Iraq invaded Afghanistan oh yeah we still there.

SMH GOP presidents are horrible the last two have stole elections to gain power then don't get crap done.

Now here's trump in his 1st year in office he has passed a tax cut for the rich.

My god I hope nothing serious like a 9/11 happens under this administration.

You will have trump pointing blame at everybody but himself.

What a crappy Show.

Out of curiosity, what do you believe qualifies as starting or ending a war? I ask because I am willing to bet there are many countries out there that will disagree with your assessment that Obama didn't start any wars or end one.
 
Out of curiosity, what do you believe qualifies as starting or ending a war? I ask because I am willing to bet there are many countries out there that will disagree with your assessment that Obama didn't start any wars or end one.

Obama started the war in Libya. He didn't end any.
 
In every Episcopalian church I ever attended, somewhere there was always a large and expensively framed picture of the diocese's bishop. I guess I just always assumed official portraiture was a thing.

BTW, on the TV show "Blue Bloods," the camera pans pretty frequently to a portrait of Teddy Roosevelt, and Tom Selleck's character, the NYC Police Commissioner, often quotes him.

I agree. It's ridiculous to think the president's official portraits in offices are signs of dictatorship. The difference between those portraits and those of, say, Hosni Mubarak or Mao, is that 1) the portraits change regularly (every 4-8 years) and 2) they're not the size of movie posters or billboards. A very facile argument to point out his "royalty" due to having official portraits everywhere. I've seen portraits of the Governor at the DMV, and he's practically a figurehead in a blue state.

The person who pointed out his official portraits, who is from Vancouver, BC: Justin Trudeau has a crap-ton more power in his little finger than any US president has in his whole hand. Prime ministers are typically way more powerful than presidents (in actual presidential democracies). No term limits. The whole idea of "responsible government" is, I've come to realize, a joke (and I mean no offense to Canadians, but if we had your government the problem would be ten times worse and W would still be prime minister...or maybe Nixon. He'd be dead, but he'd still be in power.)
 
Last edited:
Jay Cost at National Review argues that in fewer than 70 years, we have developed a “pervasive sense of presidential omnipotence and omniscience,” the notion that a President is all-powerful and everywhere, and that this may be driving us all crazy. In a republic, centering government power around one person and making that person a celebrity superstar is not very republican, he says, and adds:

The fact that any president could rile up the nation as Trump has is an illustration of how overgrown the executive power has become. The notion of “coequal branches” is a 20th-century invention. For most of the nation’s history prior to the Great Depression, the president played second fiddle to Congress. This was by constitutional design. The Framers envisioned the legislature, not the president, as the fount of republican authority, and they designed a government accordingly.

Cost observes that when Teddy Roosevelt reinvigorated the Presidency, his opponents mocked him for it, and he blames “Progressive Democrats” assuming power under Wilson and certainly under FDR for “giving the president a leadership role that he had only occasionally possessed before.”

He also notes that FDR’s admin was the first to exploit mass-communications technology. With successive admins, “Presidential exposure has scaled up accordingly.” His opinion:

I think one reason for these bipartisan manifestations of presidential derangement syndrome is the mythological foundation of the modern presidency. A core operating assumption of the office is that one human being can possibly speak for the national interest generally understood. That is fanciful. At most, the president will always express a particular view of the national interest, thereby creating the potential for cognitive dissonance in a sizable minority of the country. Because he is now able to speak to us so often, this mental discomfort can be nearly constant for his opponents. And because he is now so powerful, he also makes it seem to them that he is ruining the country. Trump & Obama Derangement Syndrome Rooted in Myth of President as King | National Review

I’m with the author: I too hope that the “lemonade” here is that perhaps the Trump administration is exposing institutional flaws that will lead to the scaling back of the Executive and the reformation and restoration of the Congress.
the only power the current pres. or any potus has is the veto.
 
BTW, on the TV show "Blue Bloods," the camera pans pretty frequently to a portrait of Teddy Roosevelt, and Tom Selleck's character, the NYC Police Commissioner, often quotes him.

I think that's a character choice. Teddy Roosevelt was a former NYC police commissioner, and Selleck's character keeps the portrait in his office as someone he looks up to.
 
In every Episcopalian church I ever attended, somewhere there was always a large and expensively framed picture of the diocese's bishop. I guess I just always assumed official portraiture was a thing.

BTW, on the TV show "Blue Bloods," the camera pans pretty frequently to a portrait of Teddy Roosevelt, and Tom Selleck's character, the NYC Police Commissioner, often quotes him.

Roosevelt has deep history with New York and NYC, his last act as Governor of NY was to establish a single Police Commissioner in place of a Police Board and a police chief. Roosevelt served as President of the Police Board and saw the need for a single office for responsibility and authority. Roosevelt made a Police Commissioner possible.
 
Great post Nota Bene, but too many people have rejected the constitutional process intellectually, emotionally, philosophically. They want a king. A king who will make things right. A king who will establish a government that creates utopia as they envision it. A king who will punish or vanquish the people they hate and embrace themselves as the privileged class. And that makes the executive larger than life and far more important than anything the founders intended.

Those of us who still respect and revere constitutional principles want:

--The executive to perform the responsibilities assigned to that office by the Constitution. He should have no power to alter, change, dismiss, or refuse to enforce the laws passed by the people's representatives. He certainly is given no constitutional authority to make executive orders that have the force of law.

--All laws, rules, regulations of all kinds--those that have the force of law--at the federal level should be considered, debated, and voted by the people's elected representatives according to the process specified in the Constitution. No law, rule, or regulation should ever be passed and signed into law by the President without citing the specific constitutional authority that justifies it. A congressperson's or senator's vote should be clear that the person voting has read the legislation in its entirety and he/she is approving it.

--Those appointed or hired as government employees or aides should implement the laws passed by the people's elected representatives, period. Unelected faceless bureaucrats have no constitutional authority to make rules and regulations that have the force of law, and yet we have allowed such people to make thousands upon thousands of such rules and regulations constituting hundreds of thousands of pages in the national register that have the force of law. There are so many with so many overlaps and contradictions that it is probable that every U.S. corporation is committing at least one felony every single day and perhaps each and every one of us too. That gives government power that it was never intended to have.

--The purpose of the courts is to settle disputes or questions of the intent and application of the law. The Constitution gives the courts no authority of any kind to change the law or make their own rulings that then have the force of law.

But all that is out the window when you have a king. A king that is either revered or worshiped as the people's savior, or is reviled and hated because he is not of the proper 'royal' (political) blood. And depending on the role the people assign to him, he gets all the credit for anything good and any who oppose him get all the blame for anything bad. Or if he is from the wrong 'royal line' he will be blamed for anything bad and any who oppose or thwart him will be praised as virtuous and honorable. (And their posts are liked a lot on message boards.)

With an education system and MSM who mostly promote the king concept and no longer teach Constitution as it was intended if they teach it at all, I don't know that we can reverse this. I have long believed that we are the last generation who will be able to turn it around, and I fear we may have already passed the tipping point.

There is a way to turn it completely around in three years exactly. A one and done trick shot. Just need around $210,000,000,000 dollars for the first election and then 310,000,000,000 for the second two years later. You buy everyone's full ballot that is willing to sell before or on election day. The purchase price first time around $1000.00 the second $1500.00 a full ballot your way I bet you could purchase at minimum 70% of the registerable populations vote or about 200,000,000 million people give or take, twice. A half a trillion dollars will buy the United States lock, stock, and barrel with the ability to change things as one sees fit without serious opposition in position to do anything about it. That includes in the purchase pretty much every elected position that can be had to secure a minimum of a two thirds majority in every legislative or other elective body. Theoretically speaking. Oh and a ruling that your franchise is your to do with as you please, including sell it.

If one had a cohesive plan and people ready to play their roll, one could buy revolutionary change without the revolution. Just need a lot of money. Done right it would probabley be the most fair, free, open and transparent election in history.
 
Last edited:
And who was it that consolidated so much power into the executive branch? Meet Mr. Cheney the author of the consolidation. Just don't go hunting with him.
 
There is a way to turn it completely around in three years exactly. A one and done trick shot. Just need around $210,000,000,000 dollars for the first election and then 310,000,000,000 for the second two years later. You buy everyone's full ballot that is willing to sell before or on election day. The purchase price first time around $1000.00 the second $1500.00 a full ballot your way I bet you could purchase at minimum 70% of the registerable populations vote or about 200,000,000 million people give or take, twice. A half a trillion dollars will buy the United States lock, stock, and barrel with the ability to change things as one sees fit without serious opposition in position to do anything about it. That includes in the purchase pretty much every elected position that can be had to secure a minimum of a two thirds majority in every legislative or other elective body. Theoretically speaking. Oh and a ruling that your franchise is your to do with as you please, including sell it.

If one had a cohesive plan and people ready to play their roll, one could buy revolutionary change without the revolution. Just need a lot of money. Done right it would probabley be the most fair, free, open and transparent election in history.

The left sell their votes to democrats already. One subsidy at a time.
 
I think that's a character choice. Teddy Roosevelt was a former NYC police commissioner, and Selleck's character keeps the portrait in his office as someone he looks up to.

Yes, he does. Quotes him too and in one episode explains to a group of little kids including his grandson at a museum Teddy's conservation efforts and the creation of the United States Forest Service.
 
Jay Cost at National Review argues that in fewer than 70 years, we have developed a “pervasive sense of presidential omnipotence and omniscience,” the notion that a President is all-powerful and everywhere, and that this may be driving us all crazy. In a republic, centering government power around one person and making that person a celebrity superstar is not very republican, he says, and adds:

The fact that any president could rile up the nation as Trump has is an illustration of how overgrown the executive power has become. The notion of “coequal branches” is a 20th-century invention. For most of the nation’s history prior to the Great Depression, the president played second fiddle to Congress. This was by constitutional design. The Framers envisioned the legislature, not the president, as the fount of republican authority, and they designed a government accordingly.

Cost observes that when Teddy Roosevelt reinvigorated the Presidency, his opponents mocked him for it, and he blames “Progressive Democrats” assuming power under Wilson and certainly under FDR for “giving the president a leadership role that he had only occasionally possessed before.”

He also notes that FDR’s admin was the first to exploit mass-communications technology. With successive admins, “Presidential exposure has scaled up accordingly.” His opinion:

I think one reason for these bipartisan manifestations of presidential derangement syndrome is the mythological foundation of the modern presidency. A core operating assumption of the office is that one human being can possibly speak for the national interest generally understood. That is fanciful. At most, the president will always express a particular view of the national interest, thereby creating the potential for cognitive dissonance in a sizable minority of the country. Because he is now able to speak to us so often, this mental discomfort can be nearly constant for his opponents. And because he is now so powerful, he also makes it seem to them that he is ruining the country. Trump & Obama Derangement Syndrome Rooted in Myth of President as King | National Review

I’m with the author: I too hope that the “lemonade” here is that perhaps the Trump administration is exposing institutional flaws that will lead to the scaling back of the Executive and the reformation and restoration of the Congress.

You know what drives me crazy? People who drive slowly in the passing lane when there's plenty of opportunity for them to pull into the slow lane! I mean who do these ****ing losers think they are, that they're the only ones in the world that matters?

The above was a little off topic. Let me just say this: Right-wing politicians were much more respectful of Obama than Democratic politicians have been of trump. Tell me which democrat screamed "You lie" at trump during any of his SOTU. Tell me any democratic politician has waved their finger in trumps face on camera like that idiot "governor" of AZ?

The two don't compare and I don't recommend the right wing try to equate the two. You won't be fooling anyone but yourselves.
 
I am all for cutting the power of the Presidency by a LOT. The War Powers Act needs more teeth and the scope of Executive Orders needs to be reigned in.



When you study even a little bit about the Parliamentary system you understand the gaping chasms in the American system. Here, were a Prime Minister to comment on a judges ruling, of any kind, would lead to his resignation. Were a prime minister to engage in the kind of twitter war does Trump, he would be forced to resign likely from pressure from his own party or losing a "non confidence motion".

If questions where raised about his taxes and a prime minister did not comply, he would be forced to resign and likely a criminal investigation would occur. (Unlike America we investigate to discover IF a crime has been committed while you people seem to want that when there is already proof of a crime, like Trump.) The same if he were refer to anyone as "Pocahantes", name call or insult. Instant resignation and likely an end to his political career.

Here, questions get raised about ANY politician they usually resign pending the outcome.

The difference is when a prime minister gets the boot, government continues as the party in power simply elects a new leader who becomes prime minister and who would have to face the electorate within a year or so.

There is far far less concentration of power here. At one point Prime Minister Jean Chretien moved RCMP oversight to his own office. It was the last straw, he resigned soon after.

There are fewer and fewer checks and balances on the White House and since 911 it seems he is omnipotent.

I have long held that the United States is not a democracy at all, but an unstructured Oligarchy with all power concentrated within a very narrow social strata who call themselves Democrats or Republicans, but once in office both hold that keeping power is the only objective.
 
The left sell their votes to democrats already. One subsidy at a time.

But its not cold hard cash. Seriously. Think about how many people who say that voting is waste of time and how many dont vote. Now offer a not insignificant cash more than half of America makes in a week. Those people would show for the money. What about every single person on a limited fixed income or just social security? Think about it. I am surprised nobody has tried yet.
 
Yes, he does. Quotes him too and in one episode explains to a group of little kids including his grandson at a museum Teddy's conservation efforts and the creation of the United States Forest Service.

And Gary Sinise's character kept a photo of Reagan in his office in CSI:NY.
 
From the NYT: Opinion: Fix America’s National Emergencies Law. And Not Just Because of Trump.
- excerpt:
The 1976 statute had flaws before President Trump took office. But his recent emergency declaration gives Congress an incentive to fix it.

Congress is on the verge of formally repudiating a president’s national emergency declaration, a historic first.

Last month, after losing a funding battle with Congress over his desire for a border wall, President Trump made his declaration, insisting that a “national security crisis on our southern border” precipitated his action. The Senate has mustered enough support to pass a joint resolution, introduced and approved in the House last month, calling for the immediate termination of a national emergency that represented an unprecedented end run around Congress’s power of the purse.

Mr. Trump has threatened to veto the resolution if it passes. Nonetheless, such a rejection from Congress would be healthy for the nation’s constitutional order. Among other things, it’d demonstrate that the separation of powers still matters and that some Republican lawmakers — after two years of looking the other way — are willing to stand up to a president with no respect for constitutional boundaries.

At the same time, the need for this legislative reprimand lays bare flaws in the National Emergencies Act, which Congress passed in 1976 to restrain executive power. Before the law, a president could declare a national emergency and unlock formidable powers under an array of statutes, giving him authority, according to a legislative analysis, “to seize property and commodities, organize and control the means of production, call to active duty 2.5 million reservists, assign military forces abroad, seize and control all means of transportation and communication, restrict travel, and institute martial law, and, in many other ways, manage every aspect of the lives of all American citizens.”

the government had used as late as 1972 to justify actions in Vietnam.

Senator Charles McC. Mathias, a Republican from Maryland who was a chief sponsor of the legislation, called President Gerald Ford’s signing of the bill “a historic act of relinquishing powers of the presidency” and envisioned it would be a tool for “restoring constitutional democracy.”

But in the more than 40 years that the National Emergencies Act has been in effect, it’s been subject to few checks and balances. That Congress has never invoked its own authority under the act to rebuke a president until now is a sign of the statute’s weaknesses.

The resolution now before Congress serves mainly to nullify Mr. Trump’s border emergency declaration. But further reforms are called for to protect the nation from future excesses.

For one thing, the National Emergencies Act doesn’t define what an emergency is — a loophole that Mr. Trump took advantage of by declaring that there’s a crisis at the border, contrary to all evidence. Congress could set clearer parameters, allowing a president to declare emergencies only when threats to the national interest are imminent and based on observable facts.

The current law also lets the president extend emergencies for years on end, simply by notifying Congress.

One year and eight months more years of this jerk ... !?!
 
I am all for cutting the power of the Presidency by a LOT. The War Powers Act needs more teeth and the scope of Executive Orders needs to be reigned in.

And while you are at it cut all that First Lady nonsense.
 
But its not cold hard cash. Seriously. Think about how many people who say that voting is waste of time and how many dont vote. Now offer a not insignificant cash more than half of America makes in a week. Those people would show for the money. What about every single person on a limited fixed income or just social security? Think about it. I am surprised nobody has tried yet.

Or the opposite, make people pay to vote - say $10 and $5 for seniors. People do not value anything they get for free.
 
Or the opposite, make people pay to vote - say $10 and $5 for seniors. People do not value anything they get for free.

Not a bad idea.
 
Back
Top Bottom