VP pick Kamala Harris

ultmd · Aug 3, 2020

Jay59 said:
If you think violence by Antifa is a far right thing, I have no help to offer. That's you projecting your delusion.

The delusions are all yours, of course. Given that we KNOW...for a FACT...that nearly every identified act of arson..and nearly every incited riot thus far...has been traced directly back to WHITE NATIONALIST types, it's clear to me that you have been deluded by your fakenews sources.

And how do with KNOW that WHITE NATIONALIST are behind most of the violence and rioting thus far...because TRUMP'S own FBI says so. Trump's FBI has, so far, not identified ANY Antifa violence at a recognized #BLM rally.

So if you wish to cling to your delusions about "antifa" violence, your argument is with the FBI, not just me.

It's too bad you recanted your statement:

Once again....two ways to win swing states:
--win the moderates
--turnout the base

That much made sense.

Yes, it made sense. No I didn't recant it. It's all true.

The VP pick will turnout the base. And the Lincoln Project campaign will turn out the republican-leaning moderates. If both are done effectively, Trump loses in an electoral blowout.

Not sure why you are having such a difficult time understanding this. It's not rocket science.

Jay59 · Aug 3, 2020

ultmd said:
The delusions are all yours, of course. Given that we KNOW...for a FACT...that nearly every identified act of arson..and nearly every incited riot thus far...has been traced directly back to WHITE NATIONALIST types, it's clear to me that you have been deluded by your fakenews sources. And how do with KNOW that WHITE NATIONALIST are behind most of the violence and rioting thus far...because TRUMP'S own FBI says so. Trump's FBI has, so far, not identified ANY Antifa violence at a recognized #BLM rally. So if you wish to cling to your delusions about "antifa" violence, your argument is with the FBI, not just me.

So, only approved sources can have the facts. Should we start calling the Pravda? These are not facts. They are wishful thinking on your part.

Yes, it made sense. No I didn't recant it.

I agree with you, but you said we did not agree. That's recanting. You also have a problem with voter turnout, because the Republicans have much better enthusisasm.
It’s Biden, Not Trump, Who Has an Enthusiasm Problem | RealClearPolitics

It's all true.

I said I agreed. you were the one claiming otherwise.

The VP pick will turnout the base. And the Lincoln Project campaign will turn out the republican-leaning moderates. If both are done effectively, Trump loses in an electoral blowout. Not sure why you are having such a difficult time understanding this. It's not rocket science.

You are correct that it is not difficult. You simply have a problem with denial.

Luckyone · Aug 3, 2020

john patriot said:
Biden notes lets cat out of the bag! he had Kamala Harris as his #1 pick for VP! Willie Browns girl friend Kamala Harris for VP! Biden so senile he left his notes visable! Q 2024

The pick has not been made but the favorite (according to Vegas odds) is Harris:

Here are the odds as of 2 days ago.

jaeger19 · Aug 3, 2020

Re: VP pick Kamala Harri

ultmd said:
What a moronic Strawman argument from you, Jaeger.

The remarks you quotes were clear and well-chosen. I specifically stated that Democrats need no worry about the views or advice of "right wing Trump acolytes", not the swing voters who are leaving Trump for the 2020 election. I am in agreement with Lincoln Project founders like Steve Schmidt and Rick Wilson. They understand that, for conservatives like them, 2020 is all about one thing: Defeating Trump. Their participation, and their votes, are not in doubt...because they are REAL conservatives, not right-wing fascist ideologues.

The Democratic Party will do the right thing, and cater this campaign toward the Democratic base. What you, and people like you, think...really doesn't matter. You will watch, and you will learn.

.

Yeah.. you apparent have reading comprehension problems. I am a NeverTrumper. I financially support the Lincoln Project. I AM the guy you need to listen to. WE ARE TRYING TO GET TRUMP OUT OF OFFICE.

And we are telling you.. stop trying to fire up your base.. stop leaning toward your base BECAUSE IT WILL PUT TRUMP IN THE WHITE HOUSE.

The Democratic Party will do the right thing, and cater this campaign toward the Democratic base.

Which will give Trump the WhiteHouse.

Holy crap batman.. lets hope to hell that the democratic party DOES NOT LISTEN TO YOU. You want the democrats to cater to the votes they already have in hand..and alienate the moderates and people that will swing away from trump.. the folks you need to win the electoral college... and you think thats a winning strategy???? :doh

You're "severely anti-Trump", huh? I think you're more likely just "mildly anti-Trump". If you voted for Trump, or have defended Trump policies and/or positions over the last 4 years...you're not "severely anti-Trump".

Yeah.. never voted for Trump.. and never defended Trumps policies. Other than way back when he bombed syria for using chemical weapons on its people. Thats all I can think of. I have been against trump from when he ran in the republican primary.

After all, let's not forget that you're also the OTHER guy ("moi621" being the 2nd one, just recently) who got caught LYING about being a doctor (when, in reality, you sell medical supplies), a few years back, o

Bwwaaahhh.. thats funny because I am a doctor.. and I don;t sell medical supplies.. how you ever got that.. well I don;t know.. but judging by the responses you have made regarding what you think it takes to win the presidency... .. Yeah.. you have some serious issue with comprehension.

You're confused. First, Clinton lost because the Democratic base didn't turn out (for a host of reasons, including voter suppression efforts by gopers in swing states), NOT because "republican voters held their noses and voted for Trump". That's just silly. Clinton didn't need "republican voters" to win states like Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania.

No.. she lost because she couldn't get moderates and swing voters to come out for here.. You simply cannot win with your base. Your base did show up.. its why she won the popular vote.. but your base does not live in the areas you need to win the electoral college.

On the other hand, it is the "moderates" (i.e. the Lincoln Project Gopers...at least, the TRUE Lincoln Project Gopers) are already committed to voting against Trump and for Biden.

WRong. Number one.. the Lincoln project folks are not the majority moderates.. .. Number two.. I ask you to go read the books that the Lincoln Project folks have put out on how to beat trump.

I strongly recommend and you and other liberal read this book: Running Against the Devil: A Plot to Save America from Trump--and Democrats from Themselves Hardcover – January 14, 2020

And you will see I am right.

...

Democrats will not ever again make the mistake of pairing a moderate with another moderate on their Presidential tickets.

Yeah.. that wasn;t your mistake. But you are destined to make another...

God I hope that you don;t have any power in the democratic party... otherwise its a good chance that we will have to deal with another four years of trump.

ultmd · Aug 3, 2020

Jay59 said:
So, only approved sources can have the facts. Should we start calling the Pravda? These are not facts. They are wishful thinking on your part.

Is the FBI the same as "Pravda" in the alt-right world, these days?

That's interesting. Not too shocking, but certainly interesting.

Unless you have "facts" to rebut the FBI, your point here just seems silly. I guess that's what come conservatives will do when their fakenews narratives are challenged and debunked.

That said...what "approved sources" are you talking about? The FBI?

The FBI Finds ‘No Intel Indicating Antifa Involvement’

And there are many, many more sources for this information, including one from the National Counter Terrorism Center of the DNI (another Trump government institution):
LEAKED DOCUMENTS SHOW POLICE KNEW FAR-RIGHT EXTREMISTS WERE THE REAL THREAT AT PROTESTS, NOT “ANTIFA”

FACT CHECK: Who caused the violence at protests? It wasn’t antifa.

An 'ANTIFA' Twitter accounts that called for looting...actually run by white nationalist group Identity Evropa

A fake antifa Twitter account that called for violence was actually run by a white nationalist group, according to a Twitter spokesperson.
The account, "@ANTIFA_US," pretended to align with the Black Lives Matter movement and ongoing nationwide protests, and called for protesters to "move into residential areas... the white hoods.... and we take what's ours."

3 more with ties to white extremism charged with plotting mayhem at protests

Three men with ties to the U.S. military and alleged to be members of an extreme white supremacist group face multiple terrorism conspiracy charges of planning to wreak havoc at protests in Las Vegas over George Floyd’s death. Federal prosecutors say the men belong to the far-right “Boogaloo” movement and not the American militant anti-fascist movement Antifa, which President Donald Trump continues to blame most for stoking violence around the country.

I agree with you, but you said we did not agree. That's recanting.

Pointing out that you are confused, or have misunderstood, or misrepresented my previous remarks isn't recanting. My previous remarks stand. Your apparent misunderstanding of them reflects upon you, not me.

You also have a problem with voter turnout, because the Republicans have much better enthusisasm.
It’s Biden, Not Trump, Who Has an Enthusiasm Problem | RealClearPolitics

Great for them. Enthusiasm within a shrinking minority means little If I was a fascist and a racist, I'd hold unwavering enthusiasm for Trump, too. But the problem with your assessment is that there are many, many fewer people like you, than people like me. When you're running 10-15 points behind in the polls...and 2-10 points behind in every swing state...all the enthusiasm in the world doesn't make a bit of difference. The numbers are just overwhelming against Trump right now. The only major demographic groups of voters still supporting him are uneducated white males and older evangelicals. Biden is headed for a huge victory at this point.

I said I agreed. you were the one claiming otherwise.

Not at all. Not even remotely. You were confused. Hopefully you understand now.

You are correct that it is not difficult. You simply have a problem with denial.

You are correct. My analysis is correct. Biden doesn't need Trump voters to win. He only needs to turn out his own base again. The number of Obama voters who stayed home in 2016 literally dwarfs Trump's margins of victory in states like Pa, Michigan, Wisc, N.C....and even Florida and Georgia. Former Trump voters are simply the key to a landslide. They are not needed for a clear electoral victory on Nov 3 for Biden. It's not that difficult.

jnug · Aug 3, 2020

Re: VP pick Kamala Harri

Getting tired of hearing media talking heads commenting that Harris has been tested on the national stage. I would add something to that incomplete line. Harris has been tested on the National Stage and found wanting.

Nobody but nobody rose and fell in this primary campaign faster than Kamila Harris. She even rose and fell faster than Beto did and that is saying something. In fact, both have the same problem. As soon as a truly national flashlight fell on them, they began to underperform. Neither has presence on the national stage and while there is much that goes into a national contender, if you don't have presence, you are kidding yourself.

Beto for his part cannot help looking like a little boy that needs to visit the little boy's room, constantly bouncing up and down on the stage with his legs often held together like he is about to pee. Yea that says Presidential. Harris for her part giggles incessantly and without conviction at the start of every one of her campaign appearances and press conferences (transparent phony). Yea that says Presidential. What the frig are you laughing about Kamila? You haven't even said anything yet and you are not letting us in on some joke somebody just told you off stage.

Then both Beto and Kamila made policy platform decisions that put them at odds with too much of the Electorate. Beto for his part didn't back away from those positions though they really did put him in a bad spot as a national candidate. Kamila backtracked several times over policy platform decisions and at the end just looked like she really did not hold any position with conviction.

You can easily make the case that Beto is Kamila and Kamila is Beto and neither is ready for the national stage, even as a second banana.

jaeger19 · Aug 3, 2020

Re: VP pick Kamala Harri

jnug said:
Getting tired of hearing media talking heads commenting that Harris has been tested on the national stage. I would add something to that incomplete line. Harris has been tested on the National Stage and found wanting.

Nobody but nobody rose and fell in this primary campaign faster than Kamila Harris. She even rose and fell faster than Beto did and that is saying something. In fact, both have the same problem. As soon as a truly national flashlight fell on them, they began to underperform. Neither has presence on the national stage and while there is much that goes into a national contender, if you don't have presence, you are kidding yourself.

Beto for his part cannot help looking like a little boy that needs to visit the little boy's room, constantly bouncing up and down on the stage with his legs often held together like he is about to pee. Yea that says Presidential. Harris for her part giggles incessantly and without conviction at the start of every one of her campaign appearances and press conferences (transparent phony). Yea that says Presidential. What the frig are you laughing about Kamila? You haven't even said anything yet and you are not letting us in on some joke somebody just told you off stage.

Then both Beto and Kamila made policy platform decisions that put them at odds with too much of the Electorate. Beto for his part didn't back away from those positions though they really did put him in a bad spot as a national candidate. Kamila backtracked several times over policy platform decisions and at the end just looked like she really did not hold any position with conviction.

You can easily make the case that Beto is Kamila and Kamila is Beto and neither is ready for the national stage, even as a second banana.

And both of them give the Trump campaign fodder to scare moderates and independents.

Jay59 · Aug 3, 2020

ultmd said:
Is the FBI the same as "Pravda" in the alt-right world, these days?

That's interesting. Not too shocking, but certainly interesting.

Unless you have "facts" to rebut the FBI, your point here just seems silly. I guess that's what come conservatives will do when their fakenews narratives are challenged and debunked.

That said...what "approved sources" are you talking about? The FBI?

The FBI Finds ‘No Intel Indicating Antifa Involvement’

And there are many, many more sources for this information, including one from the National Counter Terrorism Center of the DNI (another Trump government institution):
LEAKED DOCUMENTS SHOW POLICE KNEW FAR-RIGHT EXTREMISTS WERE THE REAL THREAT AT PROTESTS, NOT “ANTIFA”

FACT CHECK: Who caused the violence at protests? It wasn’t antifa.

An 'ANTIFA' Twitter accounts that called for looting...actually run by white nationalist group Identity Evropa

3 more with ties to white extremism charged with plotting mayhem at protests

Pointing out that you are confused, or have misunderstood, or misrepresented my previous remarks isn't recanting. My previous remarks stand. Your apparent misunderstanding of them reflects upon you, not me.

Great for them. Enthusiasm within a shrinking minority means little If I was a fascist and a racist, I'd hold unwavering enthusiasm for Trump, too. But the problem with your assessment is that there are many, many fewer people like you, than people like me. When you're running 10-15 points behind in the polls...and 2-10 points behind in every swing state...all the enthusiasm in the world doesn't make a bit of difference. The numbers are just overwhelming against Trump right now. The only major demographic groups of voters still supporting him are uneducated white males and older evangelicals. Biden is headed for a huge victory at this point.

Not at all. Not even remotely. You were confused. Hopefully you understand now.

You are correct. My analysis is correct. Biden doesn't need Trump voters to win. He only needs to turn out his own base again. The number of Obama voters who stayed home in 2016 literally dwarfs Trump's margins of victory in states like Pa, Michigan, Wisc, N.C....and even Florida and Georgia. Former Trump voters are simply the key to a landslide. They are not needed for a clear electoral victory on Nov 3 for Biden. It's not that difficult.

One aluminum bat. :lamo

The Antifa mob in Portland was using incendiaries and explosives, in addition the rocks, bricks and knives. Violence begets answering violence, so only 90% of this is from the left wing.

You are bending every detail to support your preconceptions. Indeed, you may need professional help and extensive counseling.

ultmd · Aug 3, 2020

Re: VP pick Kamala Harri

jaeger19 said:
Yeah.. you apparent have reading comprehension problems. I am a NeverTrumper. I financially support the Lincoln Project. I AM the guy you need to listen to. WE ARE TRYING TO GET TRUMP OUT OF OFFICE. And we are telling you.. stop trying to fire up your base.. stop leaning toward your base BECAUSE IT WILL PUT TRUMP IN THE WHITE HOUSE

:lamo
It's amusing that you think you speak for the Lincoln Project. I'm very familiar with the group. You are in conflict with people like Steve Schmidt, who believe that base turnout is key to Biden's success. He's right. If he wasn't, I'd be quick to say so. Sorry, I'm with Steve Schmidt, a real Lincoln Project member, not you.

Which will give Trump the WhiteHouse. You want the democrats to cater to the votes they already have in hand..and alienate the moderates and people that will swing away from trump.. the folks you need to win the electoral college... and you think thats a winning strategy?

Already explained to you. Moderates are not "alienated" by a black female on the ticket. Bigots and racists (pretending to be moderates) are. People like you are neither needed, nor wanted. Feel free to secretly vote for Trump again.

Yeah.. never voted for Trump.. and never defended Trumps policies.

Stop lying. You have defended every moronic, lying 2nd Amendment, anti-gun control argument...and every single lying anti-Obamacare argument that Trump has ever allowed to stumble out of his ignorant, orange mouth. And those are just 2 of the most obvious examples of your Trump devotion.

I am a doctor.. and I don;t sell medical supplies.. how you ever got that.. well I don;t know.

:roll:
OOO-kay, buddy. I won't put you through that again. But we both know you admitted you sold medical equipment a long time ago.

I don't understand why some people try to be more than what they are on boards like this. It's silly. It's needless.

No.. she lost because she couldn't get moderates and swing voters to come out for here.. You simply cannot win with your base. Your base did show up.

Again, this is just ignorant. You're clinging to discredited, FauxNews propoganda. The FACTS are not up for debate. The FACTS show that base voters did NOT turn out in 2016. I've already posted a few of them. This is simply not arguable. Your feelings don't matter.

WRong. Number one.. the Lincoln project folks are not the majority moderates.. ..

That's good, because I never said they were. Go back and re-read what I said. Lincoln Project types (i.e. republican-leaning "moderates") are already in the bag for Biden. That's their commitment. That's ALL the Lincoln Project is about. If you aren't a republican committed to voting for Biden...you CANNOT be a Lincoln Project person. They are not the key to winning. They can only be a key to winning in a landslide. As such, you'll need to understand your in the Biden coalition. They (you?) will not ever be influential in policy-making in the Biden administration. Their job is to contribute to Trump's defeat, and then begin work to reclaim the once-Grand Old Party from the fascist Trumpists who have hijacked it.

I strongly recommend and you and other liberal read this book: Running Against the Devil: A Plot to Save America from Trump--and Democrats from Themselves Hardcover – January 14, 2020 And you will see I am right.

Haven't read that one. But I like Rick Wilson. I suspect there is nothing in this book that I have't already heard from Wilson, many times now. He and the Lincoln Project are already doing everything he might have said in the book, I'm sure. Their ads are excellent. I know, for a fact, that they are working in coordinated fashion with the Biden team. But the bottom line is that NeverTrumpers are a small group. Your votes can't win or lose the election for Trump. They couldn't in 2016, and they still can't in 2020.

Biden's road to victory is the base, not the NT'ers. Sorry. Numbers don't lie. And the Biden team knows this, too.

Yeah.. that wasn;t your mistake. But you are destined to make another...

God I hope that you don;t have any power in the democratic party

:lamo
Love the self-importance you feel. Better offer up a different prayer, next time. That one won't be answered, at least, not to your satisfaction.

... otherwise its a good chance that we will have to deal with another four years of trump.

Trump won't win, and your votes won't be a factor...except for margin of victory.

ultmd · Aug 3, 2020

Jay59 said:
One aluminum bat. :lamo

The Antifa mob in Portland was using incendiaries and explosives, in addition the rocks, bricks and knives. Violence begets answering violence, so only 90% of this is from the left wing.

You are bending every detail to support your preconceptions. Indeed, you may need professional help and extensive counseling.

So at least you've made it clear that you are another one of those rightwing ideologues who are believe facts that destroy their opinions are "fake news".

Glad we cleared that up.

But again, the FACTS (as I've detailed) show that virtually EVERY major incident thus far, for which a culprit has been identified, has been incited by WHITE NATIONALIST types.

I guess I shouldn't be surprised to see you defending and deflecting in support of White Nationalist violence, huh?

Eriech · Aug 3, 2020

Thoreau72 said:
Hot Damn, we get another corrupt prosecutor for POTUS.

At least she's not an old white guy. :mrgreen:

Is there anything more racist and sexist to exclude all but minority women candidates? Has there ever a more important VP selection given Biden's age and acuity? (Even as unlikely a Biden win is)
The Democrats are all in on defunding the police and law enforcement that is going to exclude several. Not sure 1/1000 Cherokee will cut it. If I was picking, I'd go for the mayor of Atlanta. California, Illinois and Massachusetts will all go Blue anyway. Of the contenders she comes off as more competent than Biden, low bar I know but he is but a placeholder. The VP pick is said to be a candidate's first consequential decision. How's he doing?

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

Jay59 · Aug 3, 2020

ultmd said:
So at least you've made it clear that you are another one of those rightwing ideologues who are believe facts that destroy their opinions are "fake news".

As I said, you bend everything to fit your preconceptions, facts be damned.

Glad we cleared that up.

I doubt that.

But again, the FACTS (as I've detailed) show that virtually EVERY major incident thus far, for which a culprit has been identified, has been incited by WHITE NATIONALIST types.

Except that what you call facts are only conspiracy theories.

I guess I shouldn't be surprised to see you defending and deflecting in support of White Nationalist violence, huh?

I defend the innocent when they are attacked. You are attacking and they are at least innocent of this, whatever they may be guilty.

I am totally serious. You should seek professional help.

john patriot · Aug 4, 2020

Harris make get the chance to work under Biden! Q 2024

john patriot · Aug 4, 2020

Thoreau72 said:
Hot Damn, we get another corrupt prosecutor for POTUS.

At least she's not an old white guy. :mrgreen:

but she is a socialist

ultmd · Aug 4, 2020

Jay59 said:
Except that what you call facts are only conspiracy theories.

Those reports (links posted) directly from the offices of the FBI and the Office of the DNI...are "conspiracy theories" to conservatives like you?

All of those independently reported news reports, each documenting incidents, and prevalence of WHITE NATIONALISTS infiltrating #BLM protests and inciting violence and arson, etc.....are "conspiracy theories" to you people, as well?

So let's sum things up, shall we?

So far, I've posted at least a half dozen links, including records from the FBI and the DNI, which prove without question, that most of the violence is coming from WHITE NATIONALIST sources. And you? You're STILL offering NOTHING but your own uninformed/fakenews derived personal opinions as rebuttal. You WANT to believe that "Antifa" is responsible for the violence, because you need to re-affirm your ideology of right-wing ignorance.

You're deflecting, because you have no sources. You have no facts. And you know it.

:lamo
I must say, this is funny. We've reached Orwellian times when rightwing conpsiracy theory types (like you) are actually accusing EVERYONE else of being conspiracy theorists.

I defend the innocent when they are attacked. You are attacking and they are at least innocent of this, whatever they may be guilty.

:lamo you think you "defend the innocent"? Is that your best excuse for defending White Nationalists?

This is just breathtakingly ignorant. I just posted multiple links, including links to DOCUMENTS from the FBI and the DNI which detail and confirm that WHITE NATIONALISTS are behind most of the violence at the protests.

If the FBI and the DNI both agree that WHITE NATIONALISTS are the primary threat...what makes you believe you are "defending the innocent" by defending WHITE NATIONALISTS, huh?

Defending White Nationalist terrorists...in the face of mounds of credible allegations....and in the complete absence of any factual rebuttal...is what white nationalists do. And pretty much, no one else.

I am totally serious. You should seek professional help.

I won't lose sleep over your medical recommendations.

That said, I am totally serious when I say that you might be a white nationalist. At the very least, you're clearly sympathetic to white nationalist behavior.

jaeger19 · Aug 4, 2020

Re: VP pick Kamala Harri

ultmd said:
:lamo
It's amusing that you think you speak for the Lincoln Project.
y.

Yeah.. lets think about that for a second. What is your base? Its the folks THAT WILL VOTE FOR YOU NO MATTER WHAT!. Its the folks that ARE THE MOST RELIABLE.

The folks that decided not to vote for Hillary Clinton and instead stay home? AREN"T BY DEFINITION YOUR BASE. Duh..

Do you see your intellectual disconnect here.? By the way.. if the Lincoln project REALLY Thought that... then there would be NO NEED FOR THE LINCOLN PROJECT.. because you would just need to fire up your liberal base and all would be good.

Already explained to you. Moderates are not "alienated" by a black female on the ticket

Yes they are.. and thats because moderates want.. wait for it... MODERATE views.. and black females in politics.. are not seen as being MODERATE. Particularly from places like California.

People like you are neither needed, nor wanted. Feel free to secretly vote for Trump again.

Yeah..never voted for trump.. and its hard to be a bigot and racist when you have an interracial marriage as I do. But being white.. I get to hear what moderates and independents say. And if you think that their view isn't that that black politicians seen on TV generally represent the left wing of the democrat party.. well then you are fooling yourself.

By the way.. you absolutely need guys like me to vote for Biden.

. You have defended every moronic, lying 2nd Amendment, anti-gun control argument.

Ha..nice try. first.. I have never defended Trump on his gun stance.. because he is anti gun.. he doesn;t care about the second amendment any more than he cares about the constitution as a whole. He banned bump stocks for no good reason.. and he didnt; even have a political reason to do so. He has stated publicly that he would take guns away from people without due process and mocked politicians that have respect for the NRA.

So need to stop being so full of what you obviously don;t know. BUT.. if you think that going hard left on gun issues.. and calling for gun control.. is going to help you win the presidency..? You better buckle up buttercup for another 4 years of trump. Moderates and independents.. make up a lot of gun owners..especially in the rural areas and states where you need electoral votes.. and the more Biden is anti gun.. the less his chance of winning.

lying anti-Obamacare argument that Trump has ever allowed to stumble out of his ignorant, orange mouth

p. As one poster stated.. you need some help.. because I have NOT supported anti obamacare.. in fact.. I have been a supporter of much of obamacare.. and I actually have read obamacare..and have pointed out that what trump has done..is to try and rescind some of the best things about obamacare.. like stopping insurance from having pre existing conditions.

OOO-kay, buddy. I won't put you through that again. But we both know you admitted you sold medical equipment a long time ago.

Ummm no... I never admitted "I sold medical equpment.".. I have no idea where you even got that..

I don't understand why some people try to be more than what they are on boards like this. It's silly. It's needless.

Bwwahhh.. you mean the guy who calls himself "ULTMD".. as if ultimate MD? You are too funny.

Again, this is just ignorant. You're clinging to discredited, FauxNews propoganda. The FACTS are not up for debate. The FACTS show that base voters did NOT turn out in 2016. I've already posted a few of them.

Thats funny. Look.. the facts are.. they aren;t your BASE.. YOUR BASE IS WHO YOU CAN ALWAY RELY ON TO SHOW UP!!! That by definition is your base.

They weren;t your base if they didn;t show up. They might be obama voters.. those who voted for obama..but instead they were swing voters, independents, maybe moderate republicans...who either voted for TRUMP.. because they didn't like Hillary.. or they voted third party.. or they decided simply not to vote.

IF they WERE hard core.. BASE DEMOCRATS.. they would have come out to vote. Thats why they are called the BASE!!!

Lincoln Project types (i.e. republican-leaning "moderates") are already in the bag for Biden.

No they aren't. IF they were.. there would be no NEED for the lincoln project and their ads.. Why would anyone need to spend money.. if they are already in the bag? The fact is that moderates and independents and republicans that would switch.. are NOT in the bag. Thats why the lincoln project is there trying to get them to vote against Trump.

I suspect there is nothing in this book that I have't already heard from Wilson, many times no

Really.. then why are you arguing with me. I am stating the same things that are in the book.. because they make sense. He is saying exactly what I am saying.

jaeger19 · Aug 4, 2020

OOO-kay, buddy. I won't put you through that again. But we both know you admitted you sold medical equipment a long time ago.

Ummm no... I never admitted "I sold medical equpment.".. I have no idea where you even got that..

I don't understand why some people try to be more than what they are on boards like this. It's silly. It's needless.

Bwwahhh.. you mean the guy who calls himself "ULTMD".. as if ultimate MD? You are too funny.

Again, this is just ignorant. You're clinging to discredited, FauxNews propoganda. The FACTS are not up for debate. The FACTS show that base voters did NOT turn out in 2016. I've already posted a few of them.

Thats funny. Look.. the facts are.. they aren;t your BASE.. YOUR BASE IS WHO YOU CAN ALWAY RELY ON TO SHOW UP!!! That by definition is your base.

They weren;t your base if they didn;t show up. They might be obama voters.. those who voted for obama..but instead they were swing voters, independents, maybe moderate republicans...who either voted for TRUMP.. because they didn't like Hillary.. or they voted third party.. or they decided simply not to vote.

IF they WERE hard core.. BASE DEMOCRATS.. they would have come out to vote. Thats why they are called the BASE!!!

Lincoln Project types (i.e. republican-leaning "moderates") are already in the bag for Biden.

No they aren't. IF they were.. there would be no NEED for the lincoln project and their ads.. Why would anyone need to spend money.. if they are already in the bag? The fact is that moderates and independents and republicans that would switch.. are NOT in the bag. Thats why the lincoln project is there trying to get them to vote against Trump.

I suspect there is nothing in this book that I have't already heard from Wilson, many times no

Really.. then why are you arguing with me. I am stating the same things that are in the book.. because they make sense. He is saying exactly what I am saying.

But the bottom line is that NeverTrumpers are a small group. Your votes can't win or lose the election for Trump. They couldn't in 2016, and they still can't in 2020.

Thats right.. you need to get those moderates and independents those swing voters.. to swing from Trump. or from staying home..to Biden. We know who these people are. We know exactly why they didn;t vote for Clinton and voted Trump.. or why they voted their party orr why they stayed home. and it sure as heck wasn;t because they were "part of your base".

These folks 1. Are scared when your radical left talks about Medicare for all. They are already on medicare..many of them.. and they are afraid that medicare for all will affect them negatively.
2. They comprise a large number of gun owners.. who are going to be put off by an anti gun stance.
3. They are folks who believe in global warming. and are concerned about the environment.. but they worry about the radical left hurting their jobs with crazy GREEN NEW DEALS.

At the end of the day.. these are people who are NOT being negatively effected by Trump. They might not like his manners, his incompetence, his racism but at the end of the day.. he did give them a tax cut.. and he isn't perceived as doing anything that has directly hurt them.
They can be persuaded to vote for Biden.. as long as its a safe choice.

Love the self-importance you feel. Better offer up a different prayer, next time. That one won't be answered, at least, not to your satisfaction.

The irony is that you are displaying the same self important arrogance you had when you thought Hillary Clinton was going to win... why numbers. her polling didn;t lie...remember?

Lets hope that the Democrats running the campaign.. don't listen to you.

Jay59 · Aug 4, 2020

ultmd said:
Those reports (links posted) directly from the offices of the FBI and the Office of the DNI...are "conspiracy theories" to conservatives like you?

All of those independently reported news reports, each documenting incidents, and prevalence of WHITE NATIONALISTS infiltrating #BLM protests and inciting violence and arson, etc.....are "conspiracy theories" to you people, as well?

So let's sum things up, shall we?

So far, I've posted at least a half dozen links, including records from the FBI and the DNI, which prove without question, that most of the violence is coming from WHITE NATIONALIST sources. And you? You're STILL offering NOTHING but your own uninformed/fakenews derived personal opinions as rebuttal. You WANT to believe that "Antifa" is responsible for the violence, because you need to re-affirm your ideology of right-wing ignorance. You're deflecting, because you have no sources. You have no facts. And you know it.lamo
I must say, this is funny. We've reached Orwellian times when rightwing conpsiracy theory types (like you) are actually accusing EVERYONE else of being conspiracy theorists.
lamo you think you "defend the innocent"? Is that your best excuse for defending White Nationalists?

This is just breathtakingly ignorant. I just posted multiple links, including links to DOCUMENTS from the FBI and the DNI which detail and confirm that WHITE NATIONALISTS are behind most of the violence at the protests. If the FBI and the DNI both agree that WHITE NATIONALISTS are the primary threat...what makes you believe you are "defending the innocent" by defending WHITE NATIONALISTS, huh?

Defending White Nationalist terrorists...in the face of mounds of credible allegations....and in the complete absence of any factual rebuttal...is what white nationalists do. And pretty much, no one else. I won't lose sleep over your medical recommendations.

That said, I am totally serious when I say that you might be a white nationalist. At the very least, you're clearly sympathetic to white nationalist behavior.

As I said before, seek help.

ultmd · Aug 5, 2020

Re: VP pick Kamala Harri

jaeger19 said:
Yeah.. lets think about that for a second. What is your base? Its the folks THAT WILL VOTE FOR YOU NO MATTER WHAT!. Its the folks that ARE THE MOST RELIABLE.The folks that decided not to vote for Hillary Clinton and instead stay home? AREN"T BY DEFINITION YOUR BASE. Duh..Do you see your intellectual disconnect here.?

I see your confusion. You're conflating your thoughts with the facts.

I've posted the FACTS...like the FACT that black turnout in swing states in 2016 was:

-down by more than 90K in Milwaukee... Trump won Wisconsin by 44K votes
-down by more than 270K in Michigan, where Trump won by 11K votes
-down by more than 230K in Philly alone...Trump won Pa by 44K votes

That's the entire election for Trump in 2016. Those voters are the base, but they consistently said they were not motivated by the Clinton/Kaine ticket (and justifiably so). Again, FACTS matter.

You STILL have not...and will not...post objective FACTS, because there are none to support your point of view. That's pretty much the ball game for you, here.

By the way.. if the Lincoln project REALLY Thought that... then there would be NO NEED FOR THE LINCOLN PROJECT.. because you would just need to fire up your liberal base and all would be good.

You clearly don't really know much about the Lincoln Project. It's goal is not just to defeat Trump, but to serve as the device that either reforms the GOP, or destroys it so that a true conservative (as opposed to white nationalist) party can replace it. You should pay more attention to guys like Steve Schmidt, Rick Wilson, George Conway and Stuart Stevens.

Yes they are.and thats because moderates want..wait for it..MODERATE views..and black females in politics.. are not seen as being MODERATE. Particularly from places like California.

:lamo Why do seemingly all conservative white guys just reflexively see themselves as the norm/standard in every situation? It's so simple-minded. You're not talking about moderates. You're talking about white male republicans who don't see themselves as bigots...but truly are. The ignorance of assuming that YOU represent the average "moderate" voter...is truly hilarious. Moderate/swing voters are actually more likely to be female, than male...and they are more likely to be center-left, than center-right in ideology. So...NO...most "moderates" do NOT see all black females as "radical left", as you do. Only white male conservatives who pretend to be "moderates" are that racist and stupid.

its hard to be a bigot and racist when you have an interracial marriage as I do.

:lamo...words that could only come from a privileged white guy who doesn't understand what racism looks like, or how it works. Geez, man...being in an inter-racial marriage doesn't mean you're not a bigot toward other races (nor even others of your wife's race).

By the way.. you absolutely need guys like me to vote for Biden.

You're not a moderate. You're a conservative Republican who now claims to dislike Trump (after defending most of his policies for 3.5 years). You're absolutely welcome to vote for Biden. But you vote is not needed to win. If Biden gets votes from guys like you, he secures a landslide. But you're not needed to win. As ALL of the data clearly shows, 6.9 MILLION Obama voters sat out the 2016 election. If they vote in 2020, Biden wins states like Pa, Wisc, Michigan and N.C. easily.

Ummm no... I never admitted "I sold medical equpment.".. I have no idea where you even got that..

Yes you did. Something to that effect. You sell something. That much I remember. Your claim was that you work in a "healthcare business", or something to that effect.

Bwwah.. you mean the guy who calls himself "ULTMD".. as if ultimate MD? You are too funny.

:lamo...those would be initials, not a self-declaration of "ultimate" MD. You should charge me rent, because I'm clearly taking up precious space in your head. Too funny!:lamo

Thats funny. Look.. the facts are.. they aren;t your BASE.. YOUR BASE IS WHO YOU CAN ALWAY RELY ON TO SHOW UP!!! That by definition is your base.

Again, your feelings don't count. The FACTS are EXACTLY as I've posted in this thread. If you could rebut them, you'd have done so by now. You have not...and you will not...because you CANNOT. You personal feelings only hold sway in your personal home, Jaeger. Here, we require verifiable FACTS. And you can't provide any, because none exist which back up the notion that "all moderates view black females as radical left". That was a baseless personal opinion that you KNOW you can't back up, yet won't retract. In other words, it's a lie. But, again, if you wish to continue arguing your case, you'll NEED to post some FACTS and some DATA to back it up.

ultmd · Aug 5, 2020

jaeger19 said:
They weren;t your base if they didn;t show up. They might be obama voters.. those who voted for obama..but instead they were swing voters, independents, maybe moderate republicans...who either voted for TRUMP.. because they didn't like Hillary.. or they voted third party.. or they decided simply not to vote. IF they WERE hard core.. BASE DEMOCRATS.. they would have come out to vote. Thats why they are called the BASE!!!

Again, your personal confusion about the nature of a "base" voter, is not my problem. The FACT that 6.9 Obama voters sat out the 2020 election, remains un-rebutted by you, and speaks for itself. Nothing else you say matters, until you respond (with verifiable FACTS) to this.

No they aren't. IF they were.. there would be no NEED for the lincoln project and their ads.. Why would anyone need to spend money.. if they are already in the bag? The fact is that moderates and independents and republicans that would switch.. are NOT in the bag. Thats why the lincoln project is there trying to get them to vote against Trump.

Again, you don't know much about the Lincoln Project. They are, indeed, "already in the bag" for Biden. They advertise in order to recruit others, like them. And their ads have been tremendously successful, thus far.

Time for you to post some actual FACTS to rebut all of the objective sources and data I've posted thus far, Jaeger. Either that, or we can just agree that your opinions are not relevant to this discussion. You've just about worn out the "my feelings are the same as facts" angle. I think we can all agree on that, can't we?