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Democrats ... are you still fighting for $15 minimum wage?

Chuck9788 said:
What are your thoughts on minimum wage with the current pandemic and its obvious negative effect on the economy?

Have you all completely given up on that issue?
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Two competing schools of thought on this issue:

A) Today's economy consists largely of McJobs, the kind of employment that usually includes a nametag or a hairnet of some kind.
They are "McJobs" because the majority of these new jobs are in fact, minimum wage.
If the bulk of the economy IS McJobs, then that minimum wage MUST be livable, otherwise such a burden damages the economy in the long run.

B) We COULD HAVE an economy with a MUCH MUCH larger variety of higher paying stable decent jobs with a real future, real career tracks, real opportunity for advancement and upward mobility, benefits, etc.
If the BULK of all these new jobs were that kind instead, then minimum wage would quickly cease being an issue of contention because those McJobs would go BACK to being what they used to be when I was growing up - namely for kids just starting out, for seniors looking to pad their pensions and for persons of limited skills, training or intellect to handle more.
Most people would have those better paying jobs, so few would care all that much about what the minimum wage is.

Frankly I am actually much more in favor of option B but in order for option B to be a reality, we must be willing as a society to invest in the kind of advanced training needed to have that kind of a workforce.
We can't all be entrepreneurs, or CEO's, or day traders and we can't all sell insurance to each other.
Some people have to have jobs where they MAKE STUFF or DO STUFF, stuff which requires a lot of education, skill or training.

So yeah, Option B is highly preferable but if we are not willing to invest in our future that way, then the only remaining choice is Option A and if the majority of this country is stuck with that, they will not be able to buy the cars, buy their homes, buy the consumer goods or use the services that an economy produces.
So that means that in the long run, we would be cutting our own throats, so that minimum wage HAS to be a livable one.

(There is NO real choice in an Option C, because Option C is a society doomed to generational ignorance and destitution.)
Yeah, in reality there IS an Option C, to be honest.
Option B WITHOUT a livable minimum wage LEADS TO Option C.
 
Chuck9788 said:
What are your thoughts on minimum wage with the current pandemic and its obvious negative effect on the economy?

Have you all completely given up on that issue?
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I only contend with my seventy five dollar an hour min. wage when I do a job.
 
KLATTU said:
not a complete lie as long as you qualify it with the undefined 'moderate'. Other wise there is plenty of data pointing to a negative correlation. Then of course there is common sense.
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Links or it is just right wing fantasy.

The right wing has no common sense only fantasy.
 
Court Jester said:
Who pays for wage increase? How does say a small business like a burger stand pay for a minimum wage increase other than one or more of the following:

Raise prices and pass that onto customers---- many who are not exactly rich.
Change the size or value of the product / offer less for the same price or eliminate other items or services
Cut operating expenses by lessening hours of operation
Cut employee shifts to save salary expenses
Lay off some employees and hope everyone just works harder
Owner takes a pay cut, accepts to make less profits even despite his personal investment.

None of these are great options to most small businesses which make up larger portion of the minimum wage work force. Raising prices or cutting value is a huge risk because at the point the consumer feels they aren't getting the value anymore causing you to lose a customer--- making the losses even deeper.

About the only way to overcome the additional cost in labor with all other factors remaining is to exponentially increase your sales thus mitigating the rise in labor expenses over a larger market share. Something very difficult to do for a small business already operating on a razor thin margin against a lot of other competition in the specific category of business they are in.

Minimum wage jobs were never meant to sustain someone without other income sources. Generally low skilled entry level jobs for young people while living it home, second household wage earners, or older retired people earning a little extra income. If anything minimum wage needs to be lowered and people taught to have better expectations and/or strive for higher goals in life. $2-3 more dollars to most of these willfully unskilled and uneducated people is like for a drug addict just adding a couple of more specks of drug to their addiction of choice. It won't help them in the long run, but it will keep them addicted to more help from the government.
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Higher paid labor pays more in taxes and creates more in demand.
 
countryboy said:
Artificially inflated wages kill income and jobs every time.

Lol, this stupid liberal **** has been going on long before Trump, with the same result every time. Enough with the leftist loonery lying crap.
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There is no unemployment under Capitalism only underpayment.
 
jimjeff said:
The taxpayers are sick and tired of corporations and businesses not paying a living wage to their workers...why because those underpaid workers need help to live
and the taxpayer has to pay for it...business needs to bankroll the programs to help these underpaid people...
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I am always amused at the fun little phrases liberals like to invent to make themselves "feel" good like 'underpaid and living wage'. If you feel you are underpaid, then quit, look for a job that pays more. Nobody has a gun held to their head to take a job, and it IS THE RESPONSIBILITY of a business to make their best deal---- SAME as it is for the worker. Don't think you can live on the wage, then get an education, learn some skills, and then go out and negotiate for a better job in the job MARKET..... the FREE MARKET. Supply and demand baby.... works the same way in employment.

Would you buy a hamburger that costs $35? You might, if it is worth $35, but is it really worth that? Although at some point it would cost that if you were forced to pay hamburger makers more than they are worth based on their skill sets. Why are liberals incapable of passing a class in

jimjeff said:
The rich control every part of your life from birth to death...they need to step up and create a system that has a minimum quality of life rather than taking everything out and putting nothing back in...
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Nobody controls you unless you let them. Take responsibility for yourself, be accountable, strive to do better. Heck, you might even discover that in that process you end up rich yourself. And then if that makes you feel guilty you can give all your money away to the poor and be poor again yourself. America is about FREEDOM. Freedom to win, or freedom to lose.
 
Chuck9788 said:
What are your thoughts on minimum wage with the current pandemic and its obvious negative effect on the economy?

Have you all completely given up on that issue?
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No. Why should I
 
noonereal said:
Demand for the product not the wage paid the employee determines what kills job. Eco 101

Enough with the greedy heartless Trump lying crap.
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Economics 101 b: Workers are part of supply and demand. Therefore if you were employed making wagon wheels for horse drawn wagons in 1910 then YOU should have been responsible for changing or adapting your skill sets in order to find work where the changing demand for a different product would keep you employed and/or increased the demand for your labor and how much you are paid.

Supply AND Demand works the same way for labor and skill sets.

In the near future a whole lot of these $15 burger flippers are going to end up out on the skids after employers reach the tipping point where investing in burger flipping robot machines will lower their costs and eventually increase their profits. In fact this is already happening anyway. So best to learn how to build and repair burger flipping robot machines. Maybe even get paid $40 per hour or more after learning some new skills in that---- which would be a real "living wage".

The world is full of winners and losers... Way I see it, more like winners and whiners.
 
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noonereal said:
you folks don't know the differance between fiscally conservative and stingy, greedy, selfish pig.
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It is the role of business to have a profit motive, otherwise why be in business in the first place? Why invest capital if not to increase your wealth? Some people will whine about corporations making huge profits, but behind most of those publicly traded stocks are lots of little investors with their retirement funds helping to pay for their "living wage" and not shaking down taxpayers to bail them out. Lots of normal people taking a risk creating wealth for themselves.

When I come across people who would call rich people or successful people "greedy and selfish pigs", what that usually indicates to me is just someone who is jealous. THAT is NOT a conservative principle.
 
Court Jester said:
It is the role of business to have a profit motive, otherwise why be in business in the first place? Why invest capital if not to increase your wealth? Some people will whine about corporations making huge profits, but behind most of those publicly traded stocks are lots of little investors with their retirement funds helping to pay for their "living wage" and not shaking down taxpayers to bail them out. Lots of normal people taking a risk creating wealth for themselves.

When I come across people who would call rich people or successful people "greedy and selfish pigs", what that usually indicates to me is just someone who is jealous. THAT is NOT a conservative principle.
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they took you hook line and sinker
 
Court Jester said:
Economics 101 b: Workers are part of supply and demand. Therefore if you were employed making wagon wheels for horse drawn wagons in 1910 then YOU should have been responsible for changing or adapting your skill sets in order to find work where the changing demand for a different product would keep you employed and/or increased the demand for your labor and how much you are paid.

Supply AND Demand works the same way for labor and skill sets.

In the near future a whole lot of these $15 burger flippers are going to end up out on the skids after employers reach the tipping point where investing in burger flipping robot machines will lower their costs and eventually increase their profits. In fact this is already happening anyway. So best to learn how to build and repair burger flipping robot machines. Maybe even get paid $40 per hour or more after learning some new skills in that---- which would be a real "living wage".

The world is full of winners and losers... Way I see it, more like winners and whiners.
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There is a simple solution. Equal protection of at-will employment laws for unemployment compensation.

These are the jobs we want Labor to fill: Labor shortage: The US doesn’t have enough workers to fill open jobs - Vox
 
Court Jester said:
Democrats don't care about economics.... well, other than raising taxes.
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Why do you guys keep telling each other this historically incorrect 'fact?' The right is one big never ending complaint about taxes. Reagan told republicans years ago, the government is not the solution to your problems, the government is the problem and then he went on to tell republicans taxes are bad and democrats are worse because they want to tax and spend. Several decades have passed, we had a market crash under reagan while spending billions on star wars. His iran-contra scandal and the increased debt he left behind when he left office. Another market crash under W but this time much worse than reagan's crash. Billions on a war he lied us into and an economy that was shattered so badly we had to bail out the free markets. And now we have trump. Forty million or so out of work, an explosion of new covid cases and yet all we hear from this administration is how good the economy is and the curve is going down. Both lies. We have yet to see the worst from this administration.
 
Razoo said:
The economy can never regain strength paying workers low wages it's simple matter of fact. Therefore I put forward a minimum wage of $17.50 per hour = only $33,000 per year.

Some economic growth can happen.

As for the COVID activity:

Thank the anti-American GOP for COVID 19 plus 100,000 deaths. The GOP did nothing for more than 3 years ....... they are murderers ........

It did not need to be this way!!!

===The Trump administration is ill-prepared for a global pandemic
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...605bc6-1a49-11e7-9887-1a5314b56a08_story.html
Apr 08, 2017 · April 8, 2017 The Trump administration has failed to fill crucial public health positions across the government, leaving the nation ill-prepared to face one of its greatest potential threats:

=== Dr. Fauci Warned In 2017 Of ‘Surprise Outbreak’ During Trump ...
Dr. Fauci Warned In 2017 Of ‘Surprise Outbreak’ During Trump Administration | HuffPost
Dr. Anthony Fauci, the U.S. government’s top infectious disease specialist, warned in early 2017 that a “surprise outbreak” would occur during the Trump administration, and he said that more needed to be done to prepare for a pandemic.

=== Did Dr. Fauci Predict a Serious Pandemic During Trump’s Presidency — in 2017?
Fact Checks, Viral Content / By Kim LaCapria / April 1, 2020
Claim
In January 2017, Dr. Anthony Fauci predicted a serious pandemic during U.S. President Donald Trump's tenure in office.
Rating
True
Dr. Fauci Warned In 2017 Of ‘Surprise Outbreak’ During Trump Administration | HuffPost

Trump admin did nothing for 3 years despite being advised multiple times of a potential pandemic. That is lame and stupid.
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again ..... thanks
 
countryboy said:
Wait, you think libs have a cogent thought about economic issues? Ha! Good one.
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Repugs still believe in bull**** trickle down economics, which has been proven totally ineffective over and over again. So you have no room to talk.
 
Chuck9788 said:
What are your thoughts on minimum wage with the current pandemic and its obvious negative effect on the economy?

Have you all completely given up on that issue?
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No, we haven't given up. The Democrats passed it in the House a couple of years ago. Moscow Mitch and the other Repug traitors in the Senate continue to sit on it.

It will pass the Senate when Trump loses in November and the Repug Party ceases to exist after their pathetic, sycophantic support of this ****ing idiot.
 
danielpalos said:
There is a simple solution. Equal protection of at-will employment laws for unemployment compensation.
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Nope, not necessary. People don't think they make enough money then ask for a raise, organize a union, or quit and look for another job. Government has no business getting into price fixing labor.
 
bongsaway said:
Why do you guys keep telling each other this historically incorrect 'fact?' The right is one big never ending complaint about taxes. Reagan told republicans years ago, the government is not the solution to your problems, the government is the problem and then he went on to tell republicans taxes are bad and democrats are worse because they want to tax and spend. Several decades have passed, we had a market crash under reagan while spending billions on star wars.
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WHO was writing the checks when Reagan was president? Wasn't him, it was congress---- a Democratic controlled congress.

Reagan didn't run up the debt, the democrats did by spending on more social welfare programs. Reagan's build up of the military was actually the free part. Free because of the expanding economy that grew about the size of West Germany's GDP at that time. Military IS a role of the federal government, not head start, section 8, and food stamps. All of that crap is on the democrats.
 
danielpalos said:
Higher paid labor pays more in taxes and creates more in demand.
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Sure it does, but not with minimum wage workers. Those folks pay no Federal or state taxes generally. In fact they may get earned income credit back which is basically another form of handout. In addition they are usually living in households which are getting welfare, section 8, free childcare, food stamps, and all kinds of stuff.

I will repeat, minimum wage jobs were never meant be for the main income earner in the home. Most people's first minimum wage job after they graduated from delivering news papers or babysitting was a part time minimum wage job flipping burgers or bagging groceries while they were in high school.

We need to abolish the minimum wage, control our borders, stop building fast food places on every corner, get high school kids educated enough to take some vocational training and earn a skill.
 
Chuck9788 said:
What are your thoughts on minimum wage with the current pandemic and its obvious negative effect on the economy?

Have you all completely given up on that issue?
Click to expand...

More money for illegal aliens and Non citizens to send back to their country of origin therefore leaving or economy

Great job guys!
 
Kerry Won Ohio said:
Repugs still believe in bull**** trickle down economics, which has been proven totally ineffective over and over again. So you have no room to talk.
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Grow up. There's no economic system known as "trickle down". Libs have an idiotic penchant for making stupid **** up. What exactly have Dems done for the poor? Why is poverty and homelessness most rampant in Democrat cities?
 
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