• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Police violence solutions

S

Slavister

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 8, 2018
Messages
13,963
Reaction score
11,568
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Some ideas on solving police violence.

(Solution A) Use tech

1. Cameras are cheap - put 2 on each officer uniform and 2-3 on each police car pointing in different directions.
2. Storage is cheap - keep all recordings of all shifts for at least 1 year. Anyone can file a request for videos from certain day / incident / officers to be stored for 10 years.
3. Anyone can use these videos for prosecuting both officers AND their commanding officers for any injury. Such cases are fast tracked and necessary videos are pulled.
4. Any clearly malicious prosecutions of such kind are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
5. If cameras were NOT working for an incident or a complaint - commanding officer gets penalized in some way.

(Solution B) Review of officers with multiple complaints on their records.

1. Anyone with 4 or more complains within last 2-3 years is investigated by an independent agency - their prior cases are looked at and interviewed to see if there are more.
2. Going forward, any officer hitting 4th complaint within 2-3 years is investigated the same way.
3. Any clearly malicious complaints are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
4. Officers found to abuse their power are either warned or removed or jailed depending on severity of abuse.
 
Obviously if we get rid of all minorities, those racist pigs would just retire.
 
Step One needs to come first. There needs to be a legitimate evaluation of how big a problem it is. A 10 ton "solution" for a 5 pound problem only creates more problems.

The problem with implementing such an evaluation, however, is that there is no political will to do so. Having told the population that cops are dangerous for the past several decades there is no political benefit in having a study that may well come back and show that they really aren't the problem they have been made out to be. Votes in poor, ethnically homogeneous communities are a big part of the whole "identity politics" campaign strategy used by BOTH major parties. Because those votes are so important the LAST thing that politicians (and community leaders who capitalize on their political relationships) want to hear is that they don't really need as much government "help" as they are getting.
 
WCH said:
Obviously if we get rid of all minorities, those racist pigs would just retire.
Click to expand...

It's more like, "It we get rid of all the cops then the crime rate will go down". That's actually kind of true because if nobody is ever held to account for a crime then, on paper at least, that crime never happened.
 
Slavister said:
Some ideas on solving police violence.

(Solution A) Use tech

1. Cameras are cheap - put 2 on each officer uniform and 2-3 on each police car pointing in different directions.
2. Storage is cheap - keep all recordings of all shifts for at least 1 year. Anyone can file a request for videos from certain day / incident / officers to be stored for 10 years.
3. Anyone can use these videos for prosecuting both officers AND their commanding officers for any injury. Such cases are fast tracked and necessary videos are pulled.
4. Any clearly malicious prosecutions of such kind are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
5. If cameras were NOT working for an incident or a complaint - commanding officer gets penalized in some way.

(Solution B) Review of officers with multiple complaints on their records.

1. Anyone with 4 or more complains within last 2-3 years is investigated by an independent agency - their prior cases are looked at and interviewed to see if there are more.
2. Going forward, any officer hitting 4th complaint within 2-3 years is investigated the same way.
3. Any clearly malicious complaints are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
4. Officers found to abuse their power are either warned or removed or jailed depending on severity of abuse.
Click to expand...

Revise #5 solution A to read as follows: If cameras were NOT working and or recordings are lost for an incident or a complaint - commanding officer and involved officers are presumed guilty of the offense they are accused of committing and subject to the maximum possible penalties.
 
Slavister said:
Some ideas on solving police violence.

(Solution A) Use tech

1. Cameras are cheap - put 2 on each officer uniform and 2-3 on each police car pointing in different directions.
2. Storage is cheap - keep all recordings of all shifts for at least 1 year. Anyone can file a request for videos from certain day / incident / officers to be stored for 10 years.
3. Anyone can use these videos for prosecuting both officers AND their commanding officers for any injury. Such cases are fast tracked and necessary videos are pulled.
4. Any clearly malicious prosecutions of such kind are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
5. If cameras were NOT working for an incident or a complaint - commanding officer gets penalized in some way.

(Solution B) Review of officers with multiple complaints on their records.

1. Anyone with 4 or more complains within last 2-3 years is investigated by an independent agency - their prior cases are looked at and interviewed to see if there are more.
2. Going forward, any officer hitting 4th complaint within 2-3 years is investigated the same way.
3. Any clearly malicious complaints are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
4. Officers found to abuse their power are either warned or removed or jailed depending on severity of abuse.
Click to expand...

Let's just hang the officer in public. IF you would ask everyday Americans, they would probably like that.
 
Lutherf said:
It's more like, "It we get rid of all the cops then the crime rate will go down". That's actually kind of true because if nobody is ever held to account for a crime then, on paper at least, that crime never happened.
Click to expand...

Mine was snarkier. ;)
 
It can only be dealt with by training. Anything else doesn't address the problem. The OP's positions are all about detection not prevention. They are useless "solutions".
 
Bucky said:
Let's just hang the officer in public. IF you would ask everyday Americans, they would probably like that.
Click to expand...

Now they're hanging the public because of an officer.
 
Slavister said:
Some ideas on solving police violence.

(Solution A) Use tech

1. Cameras are cheap - put 2 on each officer uniform and 2-3 on each police car pointing in different directions.
2. Storage is cheap - keep all recordings of all shifts for at least 1 year. Anyone can file a request for videos from certain day / incident / officers to be stored for 10 years.
3. Anyone can use these videos for prosecuting both officers AND their commanding officers for any injury. Such cases are fast tracked and necessary videos are pulled.
4. Any clearly malicious prosecutions of such kind are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
5. If cameras were NOT working for an incident or a complaint - commanding officer gets penalized in some way.

(Solution B) Review of officers with multiple complaints on their records.

1. Anyone with 4 or more complains within last 2-3 years is investigated by an independent agency - their prior cases are looked at and interviewed to see if there are more.
2. Going forward, any officer hitting 4th complaint within 2-3 years is investigated the same way.
3. Any clearly malicious complaints are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
4. Officers found to abuse their power are either warned or removed or jailed depending on severity of abuse.
Click to expand...

Obviously, you are punishment heavy here, so basically, you will not have a police department. At least not an effective one.

It's as asinine as blaming the police for the looting and arson. The people who are looting and starting the fires are at fault. It's a "riot of opportunity".
 
Slavister said:
Some ideas on solving police violence.

(Solution A) Use tech

1. Cameras are cheap - put 2 on each officer uniform and 2-3 on each police car pointing in different directions.
2. Storage is cheap - keep all recordings of all shifts for at least 1 year. Anyone can file a request for videos from certain day / incident / officers to be stored for 10 years.
3. Anyone can use these videos for prosecuting both officers AND their commanding officers for any injury. Such cases are fast tracked and necessary videos are pulled.
4. Any clearly malicious prosecutions of such kind are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
5. If cameras were NOT working for an incident or a complaint - commanding officer gets penalized in some way.

(Solution B) Review of officers with multiple complaints on their records.

1. Anyone with 4 or more complains within last 2-3 years is investigated by an independent agency - their prior cases are looked at and interviewed to see if there are more.
2. Going forward, any officer hitting 4th complaint within 2-3 years is investigated the same way.
3. Any clearly malicious complaints are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
4. Officers found to abuse their power are either warned or removed or jailed depending on severity of abuse.
Click to expand...

These are very reasonable things to do.
 
Slavister said:
Some ideas on solving police violence.

(Solution A) Use tech

1. Cameras are cheap - put 2 on each officer uniform and 2-3 on each police car pointing in different directions.
2. Storage is cheap - keep all recordings of all shifts for at least 1 year. Anyone can file a request for videos from certain day / incident / officers to be stored for 10 years.
3. Anyone can use these videos for prosecuting both officers AND their commanding officers for any injury. Such cases are fast tracked and necessary videos are pulled.
4. Any clearly malicious prosecutions of such kind are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
5. If cameras were NOT working for an incident or a complaint - commanding officer gets penalized in some way.

(Solution B) Review of officers with multiple complaints on their records.

1. Anyone with 4 or more complains within last 2-3 years is investigated by an independent agency - their prior cases are looked at and interviewed to see if there are more.
2. Going forward, any officer hitting 4th complaint within 2-3 years is investigated the same way.
3. Any clearly malicious complaints are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
4. Officers found to abuse their power are either warned or removed or jailed depending on severity of abuse.
Click to expand...

I have few buddies in law enforcement who implemented body cams. After two years, the general public wants them removed. They say these are unfair disadvantages to their pleadings in court.

Who'd a thunk.
 
Slavister said:
Some ideas on solving police violence.

(Solution A) Use tech

1. Cameras are cheap - put 2 on each officer uniform and 2-3 on each police car pointing in different directions.
2. Storage is cheap - keep all recordings of all shifts for at least 1 year. Anyone can file a request for videos from certain day / incident / officers to be stored for 10 years.
3. Anyone can use these videos for prosecuting both officers AND their commanding officers for any injury. Such cases are fast tracked and necessary videos are pulled.
4. Any clearly malicious prosecutions of such kind are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
5. If cameras were NOT working for an incident or a complaint - commanding officer gets penalized in some way.

(Solution B) Review of officers with multiple complaints on their records.

1. Anyone with 4 or more complains within last 2-3 years is investigated by an independent agency - their prior cases are looked at and interviewed to see if there are more.
2. Going forward, any officer hitting 4th complaint within 2-3 years is investigated the same way.
3. Any clearly malicious complaints are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
4. Officers found to abuse their power are either warned or removed or jailed depending on severity of abuse.
Click to expand...

None of above can happen without the approval of the very politically powerful police unions, and I can assure you they won't like any of it.

Anyone with 4 or more complains within last 2-3 years is investigated by an independent agency
Click to expand...

Name an existing independent agency that is a model for what you want for police.
 
chuckiechan said:
Obviously, you are punishment heavy here, so basically, you will not have a police department. At least not an effective one.

It's as asinine as blaming the police for the looting and arson. The people who are looting and starting the fires are at fault. It's a "riot of opportunity".
Click to expand...

"Punishment heavy"? Only for abuse of power, not for reasonable actions. I each suggestion, I also have punishment for those filing ludicrous complaints.

Nothing that I said would prevent jailing those starting fires or looting.


Paradoxical said:
These are very reasonable things to do.
Click to expand...

Thanks. I did not know we could agree on something. Good to know that we can.

aociswundumho said:
None of above can happen without the approval of the very politically powerful police unions, and I can assure you they won't like any of it.

Name an existing independent agency that is a model for what you want for police.
Click to expand...

Can start with (beefed up as needed) internal affairs?
 
Slavister said:
"Punishment heavy"? Only for abuse of power, not for reasonable actions. I each suggestion, I also have punishment for those filing ludicrous complaints.

Nothing that I said would prevent jailing those starting fires or looting.




Thanks. I did not know we could agree on something. Good to know that we can.



Can start with (beefed up as needed) internal affairs?
Click to expand...

I try to disagree just to be disagreeable and your proposals were reasonable. What that cop did to kneel on a guys neck is inexcusable. It showed that some cops are really bad people. What I think society needs to get over is to always yell "racist" and contend that because one cop did this, that the entire police departments all over the United States are. Unfortunately, too many cops do this too often and they do it to WHITE people also. Far more white people were killed by cops than were black people. But, when a black person is killed, it is automatically racism, instead of it being a cop who is a sadist or just may be a racist who needs to be removed from the force.
 
Drawdown said:
It can only be dealt with by training. Anything else doesn't address the problem. The OP's positions are all about detection not prevention. They are useless "solutions".
Click to expand...
Wow you actually posted something that I agree with for the most part. Had to happen sooner or later

Training is the key, with a better vetting system, they would keep some that are unfit to serve out.
As for the OP, I agree with more cameras, hard to hide the facts of an incident when it is caught on film, it protects the public and the officer.
Reviews, well I would say some need to done but I think this maybe needs to be left to individual police departments to decide what the criteria should be, far too many complaints are bogus, those should be removed from the officers record at the time.
 
Slavister said:
Some ideas on solving police violence.

(Solution A) Use tech

1. Cameras are cheap - put 2 on each officer uniform and 2-3 on each police car pointing in different directions.
2. Storage is cheap - keep all recordings of all shifts for at least 1 year. Anyone can file a request for videos from certain day / incident / officers to be stored for 10 years.
3. Anyone can use these videos for prosecuting both officers AND their commanding officers for any injury. Such cases are fast tracked and necessary videos are pulled.
4. Any clearly malicious prosecutions of such kind are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
5. If cameras were NOT working for an incident or a complaint - commanding officer gets penalized in some way.

(Solution B) Review of officers with multiple complaints on their records.

1. Anyone with 4 or more complains within last 2-3 years is investigated by an independent agency - their prior cases are looked at and interviewed to see if there are more.
2. Going forward, any officer hitting 4th complaint within 2-3 years is investigated the same way.
3. Any clearly malicious complaints are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
4. Officers found to abuse their power are either warned or removed or jailed depending on severity of abuse.
Click to expand...

I don't agree 100% with your suggestions, but at least you are suggesting something, too bad more here aren't think along the same lines.
 
Slavister said:
Some ideas on solving police violence.

(Solution A) Use tech

1. Cameras are cheap - put 2 on each officer uniform and 2-3 on each police car pointing in different directions.
2. Storage is cheap - keep all recordings of all shifts for at least 1 year. Anyone can file a request for videos from certain day / incident / officers to be stored for 10 years.
3. Anyone can use these videos for prosecuting both officers AND their commanding officers for any injury. Such cases are fast tracked and necessary videos are pulled.
4. Any clearly malicious prosecutions of such kind are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
5. If cameras were NOT working for an incident or a complaint - commanding officer gets penalized in some way.

(Solution B) Review of officers with multiple complaints on their records.

1. Anyone with 4 or more complains within last 2-3 years is investigated by an independent agency - their prior cases are looked at and interviewed to see if there are more.
2. Going forward, any officer hitting 4th complaint within 2-3 years is investigated the same way.
3. Any clearly malicious complaints are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
4. Officers found to abuse their power are either warned or removed or jailed depending on severity of abuse.
Click to expand...

I would add that police departments have a citizen review board for incidents, including those from the community who have a history of advocating for fair policing as well. This would review incidents from top to bottom, including the behavior of management staff, the district attorney behavior in police abuse cases, as well as the conduct of the medical examiner, etc, as well.

These abuses can be hidden on multiple level and everything needs sunlight.
 
Slavister said:
Some ideas on solving police violence.

(Solution A) Use tech

1. Cameras are cheap - put 2 on each officer uniform and 2-3 on each police car pointing in different directions.
2. Storage is cheap - keep all recordings of all shifts for at least 1 year. Anyone can file a request for videos from certain day / incident / officers to be stored for 10 years.
3. Anyone can use these videos for prosecuting both officers AND their commanding officers for any injury. Such cases are fast tracked and necessary videos are pulled.
4. Any clearly malicious prosecutions of such kind are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
5. If cameras were NOT working for an incident or a complaint - commanding officer gets penalized in some way.

(Solution B) Review of officers with multiple complaints on their records.

1. Anyone with 4 or more complains within last 2-3 years is investigated by an independent agency - their prior cases are looked at and interviewed to see if there are more.
2. Going forward, any officer hitting 4th complaint within 2-3 years is investigated the same way.
3. Any clearly malicious complaints are penalized by fines and/or jail time.
4. Officers found to abuse their power are either warned or removed or jailed depending on severity of abuse.
Click to expand...

Solution (A) 2 poses a major problem - it allows an alleged perp to get a good look at potential prosecution witnesses and thus the ability to "convince" such witnesses (snitches get stitches?) not to testify (or to back their story instead).
 
Casper said:
Wow you actually posted something that I agree with for the most part. Had to happen sooner or later

Training is the key, with a better vetting system, they would keep some that are unfit to serve out.
As for the OP, I agree with more cameras, hard to hide the facts of an incident when it is caught on film, it protects the public and the officer.
Reviews, well I would say some need to done but I think this maybe needs to be left to individual police departments to decide what the criteria should be, far too many complaints are bogus, those should be removed from the officers record at the time.
Click to expand...

The unions will likely oppose always on cameras tooth and nail because they would also record when cops are goofing off or pulled up together in some out of the way corner for an hour talking **** to each other about their bosses.
 
1. A federal requirement for dash and body cameras on every officer ALL THE TIME.
2. Body cam and dash cam footage are submitted to independent review board instantly and in real time and BEFORE submission to the prosecutors.
3. Independent review board publishes findings online, identifying any violations of protocol and the individual officer who committed them in a searchable format.

I also think that police have far too much discretion. In the absence of a violent felony, police should not need to place their hands on people. The exception would be after a judge signs a warrant authorizing the use of force to detain/arrest. During COVID, police have been identifying suspects, letting them go and seeking a warrant for arrest at a later date. Why not make this the norm for non-violent offenses? Once warrants have been signed, specially trained units can then effectuate the arrest.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom