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Thread: Sanders vent

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    Sanders vent

    If Bernie Sanders still leads after Super-Tuesday, I think Democrats are screwed. I think he's way too far left to win over moderate and independent voters.

    Why Dem moderates such as Buttigieg, Klobuchar, etc. give Bernie a pass on the debate stage is beyond me. They have to more forcefully separate from Bernie and explain why.

    Look, the US Senate is in all likelihood going to remain majority GOP 2020-2024. How would Bernie Sanders get any of his legislation through?

    Medicare for all? Tax reforms on corporations and the wealthy? New Green Deal? Collage for all? Student loan forgiveness?

    C'mon. None of that is going to get past Moscow Mitch. An emasculated/hamstrung Sanders as president sets the Dems up for an electoral fall in 2024.

    I want Trump gone as badly as anyone. Trump is so damned bad this election should be EASY! But the Dems are screwing this up IMO.


    ē In the middle of an unprecedented public health crisis, late on a Friday night, Trump fires one of his own appointees for having the temerity to do his job. ē

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    Re: Sanders vent

    Klobuchar or Bloomberg are centrists enough so that they'd grab even some republicans who are tired of Trump.

    Maybe even Buttigieg or Biden.

    Biden seems like he's on his way out though.

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    Re: Sanders vent

    More anti-Bernie nonsense.

    If conservative Democrats pick trump over Bernie, they deserve trump.

    The American people deserve to have power, not plutocracy, and that is Bernie, not the conservative Democrats.

    If he loses some of them, he'll gain a lot of young and working class voters that the conservative Democrats would lose, and lose the election.

    You're right this should be simple, and the biggest risk is Democrats screwing it up - by making the mistake you do about Bernie. He's both the best candidate and the most electable.

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    Re: Sanders vent

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue Valley View Post
    If Bernie Sanders still leads after Super-Tuesday, I think Democrats are screwed. I think he's way too far left to win over moderate and independent voters.

    Why Dem moderates such as Buttigieg, Klobuchar, etc. give Bernie a pass on the debate stage is beyond me. They have to more forcefully separate from Bernie and explain why.

    Look, the US Senate is in all likelihood going to remain majority GOP 2020-2024. How would Bernie Sanders get any of his legislation through?

    Medicare for all? Tax reforms on corporations and the wealthy? New Green Deal? Collage for all? Student loan forgiveness?

    C'mon. None of that is going to get past Moscow Mitch. An emasculated/hamstrung Sanders as president sets the Dems up for an electoral fall in 2024.

    I want Trump gone as badly as anyone. Trump is so damned bad this election should be EASY! But the Dems are screwing this up IMO.
    He gets a pass because when the DNC shanks him...they need his supporters to play nice and vote the way they are told which is for the candidate who will do as told. Same as in 2016.

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    Re: Sanders vent

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue Valley View Post
    If Bernie Sanders still leads after Super-Tuesday, I think Democrats are screwed. I think he's way too far left to win over moderate and independent voters.
    Bernie polls better than all other candidates from independent voters by as much as 18 points.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue Valley View Post
    Why Dem moderates such as Buttigieg, Klobuchar, etc. give Bernie a pass on the debate stage is beyond me. They have to more forcefully separate from Bernie and explain why.
    Too bad they can't. The only candidates that built any sort of platform that is based on policy were Bernie, and Warren. The rest have billed themselves as "hey I can beat Trump in an election." So now, the likes of Klobs, Biden, and Buttigieg have to pander to the right to have any chance. Which if we're being honest, Republicans are never going to vote for a Democrat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue Valley View Post
    Look, the US Senate is in all likelihood going to remain majority GOP 2020-2024. How would Bernie Sanders get any of his legislation through?
    The GOP is defending 23 seats in 2020 compared to Democrats defending 13. All the Democrats need are to just win an additional three seats in order to take a majority. Thanks to Bernie Sanders building a national collation, the Democrats have a serious advantage in 2020 to win back the Senate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue Valley View Post
    Medicare for all? Tax reforms on corporations and the wealthy? New Green Deal? Collage for all? Student loan forgiveness?
    Yes, those are all fantastic policies that people are heavily in favor of. What policies are the Moderates running on aside from "hey, Trump sure is bad, huh?"

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue Valley View Post
    C'mon. None of that is going to get past Moscow Mitch. An emasculated/hamstrung Sanders as president sets the Dems up for an electoral fall in 2024.
    Which is why Bernie built a national platform that aimed towards galvanizing disenfranchised, or disinterested voters nationwide. Even when the Democrats have majority control, all we got passed were fat war bills, big business bailouts, and a wildly unpopular healthcare bill.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue Valley View Post
    I want Trump gone as badly as anyone. Trump is so damned bad this election should be EASY! But the Dems are screwing this up IMO.
    If you're main concern is seeing Donald Trump out of office, vote and support Bernie Sanders as he is the only candidate that can beat him.
    Democrats need to realize that "Bernie or Bust" is already a compromise position.

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    Re: Sanders vent

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue Valley View Post
    If Bernie Sanders still leads after Super-Tuesday, I think Democrats are screwed. I think he's way too far left to win over moderate and independent voters.

    Why Dem moderates such as Buttigieg, Klobuchar, etc. give Bernie a pass on the debate stage is beyond me. They have to more forcefully separate from Bernie and explain why.

    Look, the US Senate is in all likelihood going to remain majority GOP 2020-2024. How would Bernie Sanders get any of his legislation through?

    Medicare for all? Tax reforms on corporations and the wealthy? New Green Deal? Collage for all? Student loan forgiveness?

    C'mon. None of that is going to get past Moscow Mitch. An emasculated/hamstrung Sanders as president sets the Dems up for an electoral fall in 2024.

    I want Trump gone as badly as anyone. Trump is so damned bad this election should be EASY! But the Dems are screwing this up IMO.
    I couldn't disagree more; to save myself some effort:

    Quote Originally Posted by Surrealistik View Post
    As stated earlier, Sanders is more likely to win in my estimation than any other candidate in the field:

    Bloomberg is unelectable for reasons that should have just been made abundantly clear.

    Buttigieg is a small time mayor who is utterly unqualified and is despised by both the progressive wing and minorities.

    Warren has the intellect and largely has the policy but sorely lacks charisma, and is essentially bereft of good political instincts; she would make a killer cabinet member though, like Yang.

    Biden... has dementia, and a notably more exploitable past.

    Klobuchar has the least charisma of any of the serious Democratic candidates by far, and also struggles with the progressive and minority vote.

    Meanwhile, besides consistently winning head to heads by substantial margins against Trump, including in pivotal states and the Rust Belt, Sanders is most trusted nationwide on the question of healthcare which is _the_ #1 issue according to Americans, surpassing the economy, and this to a backdrop of Trump cutting Medicare, Medicaid and the CDC to give himself and his rich friends permanent tax breaks, even as we look upon one of the worst outbreaks in modern history.
    If I have anything further to add, of the field, Sanders consistently polls among the best nationally vs Trump, and his core ideas have durable majoritarian support amongst both Democrats and the general population.

    By the way, if we don't take the Senate, nothing substantive will be accomplished by the Dem president, no matter who it is, that doesn't involve some kind of horrible Faustian bargain with the Republicans outside of executive orders.
    "The amount of energy necessary to refute bull**** is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it." -Alberto Brandolini

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    Re: Sanders vent

    Quote Originally Posted by Craig234 View Post
    More anti-Bernie nonsense.

    If conservative Democrats pick trump over Bernie, they deserve trump.

    The American people deserve to have power, not plutocracy, and that is Bernie, not the conservative Democrats.

    If he loses some of them, he'll gain a lot of young and working class voters that the conservative Democrats would lose, and lose the election.

    You're right this should be simple, and the biggest risk is Democrats screwing it up - by making the mistake you do about Bernie. He's both the best candidate and the most electable.
    Wrong again. Bernie Sanders brings nothing to the table that Democrats donít already have locked up. We need a moderate candidate who can win a national election not a socialist who can only deliver what we already have - urban areas.

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    Re: Sanders vent

    Quote Originally Posted by Craig234 View Post
    More anti-Bernie nonsense.

    If conservative Democrats pick trump over Bernie, they deserve trump.

    The American people deserve to have power, not plutocracy, and that is Bernie, not the conservative Democrats.

    If he loses some of them, he'll gain a lot of young and working class voters that the conservative Democrats would lose, and lose the election.

    You're right this should be simple, and the biggest risk is Democrats screwing it up - by making the mistake you do about Bernie. He's both the best candidate and the most electable.
    Wrong again. Bernie Sanders brings nothing to the table that Democrats donít already have locked up. We need a moderate candidate who can win a national election not a socialist who can only deliver what we already have - urban areas. Besides, the Kremlin is helping Bernieís campaign again. Thatís reason enough to deny him the nomination.

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    Re: Sanders vent

    Economic populism is a winner. It was a winner for Trump in 2016 even though his claims were based on lies he had no intention of ever really pursuing. Now, imagine an economic populist who isn't burdened by being an unrepentant scumbag and has decades of actually trying to improve the lives of average Americans?

    Is Sanders going to appeal to Never Trump Republicans? No. Is he going to appeal to moderate Democrats who are essentially Republicans with better manners? No. Is he going to appeal to the billionaire donor class? No.

    But there are a lot of people out there looking for someone to fight for them and Sanders has a long track record of demonstrating why he is that guy.

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    Re: Sanders vent

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue Valley View Post
    If Bernie Sanders still leads after Super-Tuesday, I think Democrats are screwed. I think he's way too far left to win over moderate and independent voters.

    Why Dem moderates such as Buttigieg, Klobuchar, etc. give Bernie a pass on the debate stage is beyond me. They have to more forcefully separate from Bernie and explain why.

    Look, the US Senate is in all likelihood going to remain majority GOP 2020-2024. How would Bernie Sanders get any of his legislation through?

    Medicare for all? Tax reforms on corporations and the wealthy? New Green Deal? Collage for all? Student loan forgiveness?

    C'mon. None of that is going to get past Moscow Mitch. An emasculated/hamstrung Sanders as president sets the Dems up for an electoral fall in 2024.

    I want Trump gone as badly as anyone. Trump is so damned bad this election should be EASY! But the Dems are screwing this up IMO.
    Legislation is backlogged now thanks to Bitch McConnell how is Trumps inability to get vital legislation going to be and worse than Bernie's?
    To live is to suffer~Fritz Lang

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