• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Interesting fact about Flynn's request to withdraw his plea?

independentusa

DP Veteran
Joined
Nov 10, 2016
Messages
14,607
Reaction score
9,303
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Even if the judge allows Flynn to withdraw his plea the law allows prosecutors to use what he has said in his present plea against him in a trial. IN fact, if he says something different in his future trial than what he swore to before a judge, he could be indicted for perjury. Flynn's real hope is for a pardon and I do not think trump will pardon anyone until after his reelection as he does not want the pardon's to be used against him in said election. So I see Flynn trying to keep out of jail by legal mens until after the election.
 
Even if the judge allows Flynn to withdraw his plea the law allows prosecutors to use what he has said in his present plea against him in a trial. IN fact, if he says something different in his future trial than what he swore to before a judge, he could be indicted for perjury. Flynn's real hope is for a pardon and I do not think trump will pardon anyone until after his reelection as he does not want the pardon's to be used against him in said election. So I see Flynn trying to keep out of jail by legal mens until after the election.
To the bolded: "Possibly".

But I surely wouldn't put my money on it!
 
To the bolded: "Possibly".

But I surely wouldn't put my money on it!

Agreed. At this point he wouldn't suffer political harm from his own side if he pardoned Charles Manson.

I predicted (obviously wrongly) that he'd pardon Stone and Flynn before the end of this week. Frankly, I'm a little puzzled what he's waiting for.
 
Even if the judge allows Flynn to withdraw his plea the law allows prosecutors to use what he has said in his present plea against him in a trial. IN fact, if he says something different in his future trial than what he swore to before a judge, he could be indicted for perjury. Flynn's real hope is for a pardon and I do not think trump will pardon anyone until after his reelection as he does not want the pardon's to be used against him in said election. So I see Flynn trying to keep out of jail by legal mens until after the election.

What other person could get away with lyhing to a grand jury, then plead guilty to that crime then reverse their guilty plea? Flynn "willfully and knowingly" acknowledged making "false, fictitious and fraudulent statements" to the FBI. But let's not forget what Michael Flynn was accused of doing. He was accused of working closely with Russia's top spy Sergey Kisylak, to get the U.S. sanctions imposed by the Obama administration for interfering with our election, removed from Russia. Essentially he was fired for this and he was only fired because of the storm caused by the testimony of Deputy Attorney General Sally Yates.

But there's a lot more. Michael Flynn admitted that he was working as an unregistered foreign agent in cooperation with Erdogan of Turkey. He was paid more than a half million dollars by Erdogan to kidnap a U.S. resident, the cleric Fethullah Gülen . Gulen is living in Pennsylvania and has been there since the false 'coup' attempt happened in Turkey. Erdogan blames Gulen and wanted Flynn to get him back to Turkey for what? To be murdered of course, nothing more than that. And Flynn was the major U.S. player in that whole conspiracy.

Michael Flynn was the U.S. National Security Director!! What the **** is wrong with people? They will defend Trump's interference with the justice department in order to get scum like Michael Flynn off the hook and support Trump in destroying the lives of innocent public service career professionals.
 
Trump and his corrupt accomplices are simply trying to muddy the waters, so that when the pardons do occur, his base has something to cling to and rationalize the outrageously corrupt behavior, as they have to-date.
There is no good reason that I'm aware of, to pardon anyone until the election is over, and every good reason to wait until the election is decided.

How many ways was this one corrupt act bad?
- A sitting president interfering in legal matters for political/personal gain
- A sitting president attacking the justice system in a public way, during an ongoing investigation, trial, and now sentencing of an obviously guilty, convicted felon.
- A sitting president publicly defending a felon awaiting sentencing who was convicted in efforts to help that president avoid legal/political damage, and to interfere in the ongoing investigation that included POTUS.
- A sitting president attacking the prosecutors, judge, etc., involved in this ongoing legal process.
- A sitting president trying to lie/spin the fact that after Trump had the DOJ get involved, all four federal prosecutors immediately quit in protest.

I mean, any one of those is deplorable and he should be held to account by honest voters for. But all together....
 
Michael Flynn was the U.S. National Security Director!! What the **** is wrong with people?
Fox, Rush, right wing propaganda. The root cause.

People don't really change in thousands of years.
But with the advent in the U.S. of 24/7 fake news (the actual fake news, not what the fake-news people successfully projected to defend themselves), the right wing can manufacture consent for any action, no matter how corrupt, criminal, abusive, dangerous, or damaging.

Long-term, education may help, but realistically propaganda is powerful, it should simply be limited because it's dangerous.
 
What other person could get away with lyhing to a grand jury, then plead guilty to that crime then reverse their guilty plea? Flynn "willfully and knowingly" acknowledged making "false, fictitious and fraudulent statements" to the FBI. But let's not forget what Michael Flynn was accused of doing. He was accused of working closely with Russia's top spy Sergey Kisylak, to get the U.S. sanctions imposed by the Obama administration for interfering with our election, removed from Russia. Essentially he was fired for this and he was only fired because of the storm caused by the testimony of Deputy Attorney General Sally Yates.

But there's a lot more. Michael Flynn admitted that he was working as an unregistered foreign agent in cooperation with Erdogan of Turkey. He was paid more than a half million dollars by Erdogan to kidnap a U.S. resident, the cleric Fethullah Gülen . Gulen is living in Pennsylvania and has been there since the false 'coup' attempt happened in Turkey. Erdogan blames Gulen and wanted Flynn to get him back to Turkey for what? To be murdered of course, nothing more than that. And Flynn was the major U.S. player in that whole conspiracy.

Michael Flynn was the U.S. National Security Director!! What the **** is wrong with people? They will defend Trump's interference with the justice department in order to get scum like Michael Flynn off the hook and support Trump in destroying the lives of innocent public service career professionals.

Flynn didn't get charged for lying to a grand jury.
 
Flynn didn't get charged for lying to a grand jury.

He lied to the FBI and the grand jury acknowledged that as a fact. It was well established that he lied by proof such as documents, emails, witness testimonies.
 
He lied to the FBI and the grand jury acknowledged that as a fact. It was well established that he lied by proof such as documents, emails, witness testimonies.

You said he lied to a grand jury. You're wrong. You demand justice, but you don't even know the basic facts. You make **** up as you go.
 
[
QUOTE=HumblePi;1071355169]What other person could get away with lyhing to a grand jury, then plead guilty to that crime then reverse their guilty plea?

It can happen.

Flynn "willfully and knowingly" acknowledged making "false, fictitious and fraudulent statements"

I guess he and McCabe can hang out together.

to the FBI. But let's not forget what Michael Flynn was accused of doing. He was accused of working closely with Russia's top spy Sergey Kisylak, to get the U.S. sanctions imposed by the Obama administration for interfering with our election, removed from Russia.

Yep-- the incoming administration was thinking about changing policies. What a surprise.
"Accused" of wanting to change foreign policy? Talk about weaponizing the DOJ.

Essentially he was fired for this and he was only fired because of the storm caused by the testimony of Deputy Attorney General Sally Yates.

He apparently had lied to Mr. Pence about it.

But there's a lot more. Michael Flynn admitted that he was working as an unregistered foreign agent in cooperation with Erdogan of Turkey

A NATO ally.


Michael Flynn was the U.S. National Security Director!! What the **** is wrong with people? They will defend Trump's interference with the justice department in order to get scum like Michael Flynn off the hook and support Trump in destroying the lives of innocent public service career professionals.

What is this off the hook stuff? Hasn't Mr. Flynn been prosecuted?
 
You said he lied to a grand jury. You're wrong. You demand justice, but you don't even know the basic facts. You make **** up as you go.

There's a lot of that going around in these forums...making **** up as they go.
 
Agreed. At this point he wouldn't suffer political harm from his own side if he pardoned Charles Manson.

I predicted (obviously wrongly) that he'd pardon Stone and Flynn before the end of this week. Frankly, I'm a little puzzled what he's waiting for.
I disagree. Trump’s support comes from somewhere around 40% of the public, give or take a few points, but his core base, those who are absolutely committed to him, is only around 30% (again, give or take a few points) and not expanding.

Trump may think he’s invincible, but I’d be willing to wager that folks in his campaign who recognize the actual fragility of his support are working overtime trying convince him of the danger of losing that significant/important portion of his base that never did think much of him to begin with, but just wanted to shake up D.C..

Just my .02
 
I disagree. Trump’s support comes from somewhere around 40% of the public, give or take a few points, but his core base, those who are absolutely committed to him, is only around 30% (again, give or take a few points) and not expanding.

Trump may think he’s invincible, but I’d be willing to wager that folks in his campaign who recognize the actual fragility of his support are working overtime trying convince him of the danger of losing that significant/important portion of his base that never did think much of him to begin with, but just wanted to shake up D.C..

Just my .02

Yes, but you're applying rational judgment to a person who obviously doesn't wield his power rationally (let alone democratically or Constitutionally).
 
Even if the judge allows Flynn to withdraw his plea the law allows prosecutors to use what he has said in his present plea against him in a trial. IN fact, if he says something different in his future trial than what he swore to before a judge, he could be indicted for perjury. Flynn's real hope is for a pardon and I do not think trump will pardon anyone until after his reelection as he does not want the pardon's to be used against him in said election. So I see Flynn trying to keep out of jail by legal mens until after the election.

This is why Barr is involved - to try and extract Trump's friend from this Gordian knot.
 
You said he lied to a grand jury. You're wrong. You demand justice, but you don't even know the basic facts. You make **** up as you go.

Indeed. If Flynn is accused of lying to the wrong group, clearly he's innocent.
 
Yes, but you're applying rational judgment to a person who obviously doesn't wield his power rationally (let alone democratically or Constitutionally).
Ergo, my comment regarding his campaign staff.
 
True. I wonder who/how many people have any sway with him anymore.

My guess is "none." The only people left in the White House are bootlickers.
 
My guess is "none." The only people left in the White House are bootlickers.
If true, Trump will continue to escalate his attacks on the Constitution and the institutions of democracy it created.

My hope/belief is that Americans will get fed up and pissed off enough to carry their asses to the voting booths in November to remedy it.
 
Back
Top Bottom