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Bernie Sanders nearly doubles support in New Hampshire; from 17% to 29%.

trouble13 said:
Imo, bernie bros are the democrats version of the teaparty. Voters from both sides are rejecting the status quo establishment policies. People are not stupid they are waking up to the fact that the game is rigged against us. They make empty promises to get your vote and they try to convince people that even though you know they are feeding you empty promises they are the only game in town because the other side is just plain evil while they are just a little greedy.
The only way this gets fixed is to stop buying inyo the propaganda and stop worrying about beating the other party at all costs. Start fixing your own party by primarying out all the establishment powerbrokers.

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Yep, I agree.
 
poweRob said:
Bernie Sanders Tied With Joe Biden in Democratic Race Nationally and Among African American Community, Polls Say

And Bernie leads Biden by much larger percentages with other minorities.
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Damn, Bernie has come a long way! Tied nationally, tied among African-Americans, and up +10 pts over Biden with Hispanics?

I may come back to Bernie, who was my first choice in '16 even if I thought that ship had sailed for '20. I have to see how Bernie does with Indies and perhaps anti-Trump Republicans, but I just may be jumping-on the Bernie bandwagon again. That goes in spades if he picks Kolbuchar to bring-in the Midwest.

Thanks for bringing this to my attention, PowerRob! :thumbs:
 
Airyaman said:
My prediction: Bernie wins a few states, Warren drops out, Bernie picks up the progressive votes and then wins the nomination.

He is then pummeled by Trump in November.
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I don't like how the movie ends, but I must admit I hope you're right with everything else.
 
trouble13 said:
To be clear you only agree with what you bolded or you bolded that part for emphasis?

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I agreed with everything, but I especially like the bolded - which I've been proclaiming myself.
 
Chomsky said:
Damn, Bernie has come a long way! Tied nationally, tied among African-Americans, and up +10 pts over Biden with Hispanics?

I may come back to Bernie, who was my first choice in '16 even if I thought that ship had sailed for '20. I have to see how Bernie does with Indies and perhaps anti-Trump Republicans, but I just may be jumping-on the Bernie bandwagon again. That goes in spades if he picks Kolbuchar to bring-in the Midwest.

Thanks for bringing this to my attention, PowerRob! :thumbs:
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Sanders outperforms Biden against Trump among voters ages 18-29, those who are not interested in politics and self-described independents.

Why Bernie Sanders Is Electable, Too
 
Airyaman said:
My prediction: Bernie wins a few states, Warren drops out, Bernie picks up the progressive votes and then wins the nomination.

He is then pummeled by Trump in November.
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I believe that, though the pummeling will very much be in the opposite direction.

It seems like nothing can stop him thus far, and the more people seem to disparage Sanders, the stronger he gets; though Teflon Don's ability to avoid lasting consequences from attacks may be impressive, it is nothing compared to a candidate who is like some kind of political Hulk in that he is not only impervious to attacks and smears, but just becomes more powerful for them.

If Bernie takes Iowa and NH, the powers that be better start preparing to either Epstein the man or rob him at a probable brokered DNC convention, as that's probably the only way he can be stopped; Bernie will eat Trump's lunch at the rust belt, which is where this election will be won or lost.
 
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Chomsky said:
Damn, Bernie has come a long way! Tied nationally, tied among African-Americans, and up +10 pts over Biden with Hispanics?

I may come back to Bernie, who was my first choice in '16 even if I thought that ship had sailed for '20. I have to see how Bernie does with Indies and perhaps anti-Trump Republicans, but I just may be jumping-on the Bernie bandwagon again. That goes in spades if he picks Kolbuchar to bring-in the Midwest.

Thanks for bringing this to my attention, PowerRob! :thumbs:
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I kept telling you he is stronger and better than ever.

Will Iowa and NH make a believer of you?
 
Surrealistik said:
I kept telling you he is stronger and better than ever.

Will Iowa and NH make a believer of you?
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Yes! Now that I see him polling well with African-Americans & Hispanics, I'm open to becoming a believer.

So, can I sell you on Veep Klobuchar to bring-in the Midwest? Become the Yin, to his Yang?
 
Chomsky said:
Yes! Now that I see him polling well with African-Americans & Hispanics, I'm open to becoming a believer.

So, can I sell you on Veep Klobuchar to bring-in the Midwest? Become the Yin, to his Yang?
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At least left leaning media has started to point out Bernie having self avowed as a Democratic Socialist. However the GOP has not turned its guns on Bernie yet because Bernie is the guy they want to run against. I am not sure Bernie survives the kind of effort the GOP will throw at him if he becomes the nominee.

The polls within the Dem primary effort are whipsawing all over the place. I don't think we will really know what is happening till people actually go to the polls. It is clear that Warren is at the moment falling back a bit and Bernie is prospering from that.

Mayer Pete is falling back a bit and Biden is prospering from that.
 
Chomsky said:
Yes! Now that I see him polling well with African-Americans & Hispanics, I'm open to becoming a believer.

So, can I sell you on Veep Klobuchar to bring-in the Midwest? Become the Yin, to his Yang?
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I'm afraid you cannot with all due respect.

Bernie's VP choice matters far too much, and there's no way Klobuchar could be relied upon to provide any kind of continuity or carry his torch; it would have to be another ardent progressive.

What would be the point of Bernie winning if it meant a conservadem took up the reins and then immediately proceeded to neglect his goals and priorities should he die in office?
 
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Surrealistik said:
I believe that, though the pummeling will very much be in the opposite direction.

It seems like nothing can stop him thus far, and the more people seem to disparage Sanders, the stronger he gets; though Teflon Don's ability to avoid lasting consequences from attacks may be impressive, it is nothing compared to a candidate who is like some kind of political Hulk in that he is not only impervious to attacks and smears, but just becomes more powerful for them.

If Bernie takes Iowa and NH, the powers that be better start preparing to either Epstein the man or rob him at a probable brokered DNC convention, as that's probably the only way he can be stopped; Bernie will eat Trump's lunch at the rust belt, which is where this election will be won or lost.
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Bernie has been around a long time, but he's never been vetted on the national level.

Trump's billion dollar war chest will see to that. Plus, get used to hearing "socialist" and "socialism" on an everyday basis because Trump will use it to scare people. It will be very effective.
 
Airyaman said:
Bernie has been around a long time, but he's never been vetted on the national level.

Trump's billion dollar war chest will see to that. Plus, get used to hearing "socialist" and "socialism" on an everyday basis because Trump will use it to scare people. It will be very effective.
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I doubt it; every disingenuous attack on Sanders thus far has served to either make him stronger, make its source weaker, or a combination thereof. We'll see, but I don't think this is going to turn out at all like you imagine should he get the nomination.
 
Surrealistik said:
I'm afraid you cannot with all due respect.

Bernie's VP choice matters far too much, and there's no way Klobuchar could be relied upon to provide any kind of continuity or carry his torch; it would have to be another ardent progressive.
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No offense, but the Americans have rejected progressivism. People are leaving the most "progressive" states in droves. California, NY, Vermont, are all losing population, because people don't want the sky-high taxes and regulation that progressives impose on people.
 
Surrealistik said:
I doubt it; every disingenuous attack on Sanders thus far has served to either make him stronger, make its source weaker, or a combination thereof. We'll see, but I don't think this is going to turn out at all like you imagine should he get the nomination.
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I've not seen the bolded take place, care to provide some links? The only thing I am aware of is the Warren thing about women being elected president.
 
aociswundumho said:
No offense, but the Americans have rejected progressivism. People are leaving the most "progressive" states in droves. California, NY, Vermont, are all losing population, because people don't want the sky-high taxes and regulation that progressives impose on people.
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Sources please.

I can see cost of living being a problem in California and a primary motivator of exodus, but all that generally means is either a lot of people are flocking there, or a smaller but still considerable amount of wealthy people are flocking there.

If it were truly a hellhole that nobody wanted to live in, the price of everything in that state wouldn't be so exorbitant.
 
Airyaman said:
I've not seen the bolded take place, care to provide some links? The only thing I am aware of is the Warren thing about women being elected president.
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CNN's egregiously biased moderating and question framing would be another contemporary example: all it seemed to do was increase Sanders' support, undermine confidence in CNN, and allow him to raise an absolute asston of money.

Also Clinton's recent attacks on Sanders would be another; epic backfire.
 
aociswundumho said:
No offense, but the Americans have rejected progressivism. People are leaving the most "progressive" states in droves. California, NY, Vermont, are all losing population, because people don't want the sky-high taxes and regulation that progressives impose on people.
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And may the screen door not hit them where the good lord split them on the way out.

See, I can he civil!
 
I'd rather not have Sanders, but better him than Trump.

I would like to hear an explanation of what he could realistically achieve in congress, not what he could achieve in an ideal world with the congress he wants. Pretty much none of his ideas have a real chance without Dem supermajority, and even then the party is not as far left as he because America isn't as far left.

This is why I am so sick of these 'debates', ads, whatever. It's all fluffy noises and pie-in-the sky ideas; wishlists. Sure, I'd like to know what a person wants to do, but I also want to hear a reasonable case for what they have a chance of accomplishing.
 
Mr Person said:
I'd rather not have Sanders, but better him than Trump.

I would like to hear an explanation of what he could realistically achieve in congress, not what he could achieve in an ideal world with the congress he wants. Pretty much none of his ideas have a real chance without Dem supermajority, and even then the party is not as far left as he because America isn't as far left.

This is why I am so sick of these 'debates', ads, whatever. It's all fluffy noises and pie-in-the sky ideas; wishlists. Sure, I'd like to know what a person wants to do, but I also want to hear a reasonable case for what they have a chance of accomplishing.
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Move here to New Mexico. No ads or any of that. Because no one gives a **** about our measly amount of delegates or EC electors. Many might not even know we are in the USA.
 
Mr Person said:
I'd rather not have Sanders, but better him than Trump.

I would like to hear an explanation of what he could realistically achieve in congress, not what he could achieve in an ideal world with the congress he wants. Pretty much none of his ideas have a real chance without Dem supermajority, and even then the party is not as far left as he because America isn't as far left.

This is why I am so sick of these 'debates', ads, whatever. It's all fluffy noises and pie-in-the sky ideas; wishlists. Sure, I'd like to know what a person wants to do, but I also want to hear a reasonable case for what they have a chance of accomplishing.
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How do you eat an elephant? Answer: a piece at a time. The agenda has to be set before it can be achieved. Moderate Dems kneecap themselves by moving to the center before the debate even begins. Bernie may not be able to achieve everything, but he’ll fight to achieve it and in the doing create a movement that will succeed him after he’s gone. That’s how its done.
 
Dans La Lune said:
How do you eat an elephant? Answer: a piece at a time. The agenda has to be set before it can be achieved. Moderate Dems kneecap themselves by moving to the center before the debate even begins. Bernie may not be able to achieve everything, but he’ll fight to achieve it and in the doing create a movement that will succeed him after he’s gone. That’s how its done.
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Which is why I want both: what are the ultimate goals, what realistically do you think you can get? But these debates are basically slogan and barb contests.



I don't blame the media. I blame people. If candidates gave 10 minute answers it'd be "tl;dr...I'm too busy looking at cat pictures on my phone while farting into the couch". We've been getting what we deserve, collectively.
 
jnug said:
At least left leaning media has started to point out Bernie having self avowed as a Democratic Socialist. However the GOP has not turned its guns on Bernie yet because Bernie is the guy they want to run against. I am not sure Bernie survives the kind of effort the GOP will throw at him if he becomes the nominee.

The polls within the Dem primary effort are whipsawing all over the place. I don't think we will really know what is happening till people actually go to the polls. It is clear that Warren is at the moment falling back a bit and Bernie is prospering from that.

Mayer Pete is falling back a bit and Biden is prospering from that.
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Who knows? The country is so deadlocked, unmovable, with so many against Trump. Bernie may surprise us against Trump. The Dems as a group want out, and Bernie will do I'm sure.
 
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