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Thread: Study finds that single-payer saves money

  1. #101
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    Re: Study finds that single-payer saves money

    Quote Originally Posted by Dans La Lune View Post
    Yawn.

    Remember The 47 Percent Who Pay No Income Taxes? They Are Not Who You Think.



    Statistically the speaking, Trumpers are less likely to pay their taxes while receiving government hand-outs. Way to sabotage your own point. Wheeee!

    And also:


    Only 11 percent of those age 25-55 do not pay federal income tax
    A little lesson for ya

    This group does more than not pay a fed income tax. They receive someones else's redistributed wealth in the EITC(Billions)

    The Earned Income Tax Credit and the Child Tax Credit: History, Purpose, Goals, and Effectiveness | Economic Policy Institute



    Yep

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    Re: Study finds that single-payer saves money

    We don’t need single payer to reap the benefits that this study found.

    The two largest and almost complete net result of the savings was from administrative cost reduction (billing) and drug cost reduction.

    Both of those can happen under the system we have now but it requires the removal of government interference from the health care system, ie the ACA.

    Basic regulation should be in place that the ACA provides like
    Pre existing condition protection
    No lifetime maximum
    Etc

    Get the quota system out of medicine, docs having to “see” X number of patients. Let folks buy insurance across state lines, IOW increase competition.

    I worked for a small company that offered BCBS and it was high deductible plan. The company paid my deductible into my HSA. That has been by far the best health insurance plan I have ever had.

    The government should be there to encourage good behavior not force compliance.

    Don’t tax the bad, incentive the good. Tax benefits for HSA contribution by both the employer and employee. Allow as much as one wants to save into HSA. There are all kinds of ideas that do t burden the many taxpayers to support the few AND reduce costs through completion and efficiency.


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    Re: Study finds that single-payer saves money

    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    You are talking about total costs. MFA would bankrupt the government because even though the overall costs would be less, the government would basically be paying 100% of the costs while right now individuals pay a good share of the cost. And, with the government in control, the horrors of a single payer system would soon take root.

    I've been on both sides, the private and the public, and I can assure you there are more horrors on the private side than on the public side.


    Once upon a time, ever heard of the "claims department"? Wanna know what their mission was?


    Answer: To deny claims as much as possible.

    YouTube

    YouTube

    This is what it was like before the ACA. And repubs want to kill it.

    See, the whole principle of health insurance, is that the more they can get away with denying claims, the more money they make.

    Does that sound like a good model that serves the public interest? Medicare has NO such incentive. Why? Because IT IS NOT FOR PROFIT, THAT'S WHY.

    I'm on medicare, and i've had NO PROBLEMS with it, no waiting, no denials, no nothing, It works beautifully.

    Those on the right need to STFU.


    Moreover, M4A will not prevent anyone for paying for medical care directly, should they so choose.


    Additionally, what you are failing to grasp regarding costs, is that health care dollars are already being spent, but M4A, all it does is redirect those dollars being channeled to insurers away from them and into a more efficient system. It's more efficient because the insurance cost layer is removed. This is precisely why in 50 developed nations that have some form of UHC, their costs per capita is roughly half of what it is in the USA.
    Last edited by OscarLevant; 01-18-20 at 10:36 AM.
    “He’s [Chinese President Xi Jinping] now president for life. President for life. And he’s great,” Trump said. “I think it’s great. Maybe we’ll give that a shot someday.” ---Donald J. Trump

  4. #104
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    Re: Study finds that single-payer saves money

    Quote Originally Posted by Dans La Lune View Post
    Yawn.

    Remember The 47 Percent Who Pay No Income Taxes? They Are Not Who You Think.



    Statistically the speaking, Trumpers are less likely to pay their taxes while receiving government hand-outs. Way to sabotage your own point. Wheeee!

    And also:
    Derp. Few over 75 pay taxes, and they are overwhelmingly Trump supporters. Not exactly the unemployed rural rubes you pretend.

    Question of the Day: Why are leftwingers so dishonest in everything they do and say?

  5. #105
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    Re: Study finds that single-payer saves money

    Quote Originally Posted by Luther View Post
    This group does more than not pay a fed income tax. They receive someones else's redistributed wealth in the EITC(Billions)
    Oh no billions! I think you should address the fact that the VAST majority of people who don’t pay income tax are statistically Trump supporters who receive he most benefit from socialized medicine. Would you advocate for taking Medicare away from Trumpers? I’m not actually sure what you’re trying to say, much less advocate for.
    “I believe that If we're successful in this election, when we're successful in this election, that the fever may break [for Republicans]” - Obama, 2012

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    Re: Study finds that single-payer saves money

    Quote Originally Posted by Mashmont View Post
    Derp. Few over 75 pay taxes, and they are overwhelmingly Trump supporters. Not exactly the unemployed rural rubes you pretend.

    Question of the Day: Why are leftwingers so dishonest in everything they do and say?
    This from a guy who calls Obamacare “Chimpycare”.
    “I believe that If we're successful in this election, when we're successful in this election, that the fever may break [for Republicans]” - Obama, 2012

    ”Republicans ‘know better’, ‘will change after Trump’...” - Joe Biden, 2019

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    Re: Study finds that single-payer saves money

    Quote Originally Posted by Integrityrespec View Post
    the other countries using similar systems aren't working out as Democratic Socialist Bernie Sanders is claiming. Gaps in coverage and long waiting lines exist. The promise of the democrat Leftist is that in America we will do it better and fix all the mistakes and problems that occur elsewhere. Yeah, government runs things so well.

    No, the Rest of the World Doesn't Use "Single Payer" - Foundation for Economic Education


    I've had the opportunity to put this question to some 100 persons from Canada, France, Finland, Norway, Holland, Sweden, etc


    "Would you trade your country's health care system for that of America's? "


    Thus far, 99 of those said "no". not just "no", but "HELL NO".

    The Naval Hospital, a government run institution, is par none. If there is proof that government can run a hospital, and do it well, there it is.

    See, it's not gov versus private, it's good admin versus bad admin.


    Moreover, M4A is NOT a "gov run hospital". It's a consortium of private clinics who opt in for medicare paying the bill.

    See, these clinics still compete in a market place for business. Viola, the best of both worlds, the perfect balance of socialism/capitalism.

    I ask: Where does the pendulum rest?


    Answer: It rests only upon arrival at dead center.


    Moreover, using other countries as examples is not that good, considering that most countries are far more stingier with their health care dollars than America is, on the whole.
    “He’s [Chinese President Xi Jinping] now president for life. President for life. And he’s great,” Trump said. “I think it’s great. Maybe we’ll give that a shot someday.” ---Donald J. Trump

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    Re: Study finds that single-payer saves money

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarLevant View Post
    I've had the opportunity to put this question to some 100 persons from Canada, France, Finland, Norway, Holland, Sweden, etc


    "Would you trade your country's health care system for that of America's? "


    Thus far, 99 of those said "no". not just "no", but "HELL NO".

    The Naval Hospital, a government run institution, is par none. If there is proof that government can run a hospital, and do it well, there it is.

    See, it's not gov versus private, it's good admin versus bad admin.


    Moreover, M4A is NOT a "gov run hospital". It's a consortium of private clinics who opt in for medicare paying the bill.

    See, these clinics still compete in a market place for business. Viola, the best of both worlds, the perfect balance of socialism/capitalism.

    I ask: Where does the pendulum rest?


    Answer: It rests only upon arrival at dead center.


    Moreover, using other countries as examples is not that good, considering that most countries are far more stingier with their health care dollars than America is, on the whole.


    "most countries are far more stingier with their health care dollars than America is, on the whole"

    That's because to get the same or better health outcomes at nearly half the cost, those countries not only pay much less for admin and drugs, they also pay less in doctors and mgr salaries. BTW, the claim that the UHC countries wait-time is much longer than in the US is a farce and has never been proven.

  9. #109
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    Re: Study finds that single-payer saves money

    Quote Originally Posted by cabse5 View Post
    In universal health care, all have access to health care but not all have access to quality health care or health care when they want or need it.
    That's how universal health care is cheaper. People are regularly denied health care.
    That's kind of like how our **** works, but we pay more. Many folk can't afford the higher quality care and just die after some time. Medical expenses are the number one cause of bankruptcy in America. That seems a bit messed up.
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    Re: Study finds that single-payer saves money

    Quote Originally Posted by ikari View Post
    that's kind of like how our **** works, but we pay more. Many folk can't afford the higher quality care and just die after some time. Medical expenses are the number one cause of bankruptcy in america. That seems a bit messed up.
    nm...
    Last edited by cabse5; 01-18-20 at 02:46 PM.
    "I'm getting pretty nervous about the coronavirus. There is no cure and L.A., for example, is just an epidemic away." cabse5 02/09/20

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