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Giuliani just confessed to the crime. He also revealed something bigger.


Any chance you can give us a brief description of the opinion in the article? Sites with a paywall are rather difficult to access for those of us that don't really feel like subscribing to that site, and without context it's a bit of a challenge to properly discuss whatever issue it is you have in mind.
 
Any chance you can give us a brief description of the opinion in the article? Sites with a paywall are rather difficult to access for those of us that don't really feel like subscribing to that site, and without context it's a bit of a challenge to properly discuss whatever issue it is you have in mind.

Giuliani tweeted that U.S. assistance to Ukraine on anti-corruption reforms could face a “major obstacle” until the “conversation about corruption in Ukraine” is resolved. Giuliani alleged “compelling” evidence of criminal misdeeds by Biden, but gave no specifics.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/ukraine-lawmaker-seeking-biden-probe-meets-with-giuliani-in-kyiv/2019/12/05/ead06eae-175b-11ea-80d6-d0ca7007273f_story.html

Trump is blackmailing Ukraine while being impeached for blackmailing Ukraine and his lawyer is telling the world.
 
Very good explanation of the Russian/trump disinformation campaign, and completely explains some of the posters on this very site...
 
Any chance you can give us a brief description of the opinion in the article? Sites with a paywall are rather difficult to access for those of us that don't really feel like subscribing to that site, and without context it's a bit of a challenge to properly discuss whatever issue it is you have in mind.

Sure thing. I don't think I should post the entire piece but I think it's safe to pull out a few of the highlights:

Two new developments attest to this [disinformation campaign]: a remarkable pair of revelatory tweets* from Giuliani, and a tour de force of reporting in The Post, which reveals that Trump routinely communicated throughout the whole saga with Giuliani on unsecured devices, which may have been vulnerable to monitoring by Russia.
Rudy Giuliani
@RudyGiuliani
Schiffs impeachment is a FARCE because

1. There was no military aid withheld.

2. The conversation about corruption in Ukraine was based on compelling evidence of criminal conduct by then VP Biden, in 2016, that has not been resolved and until it is will be a major obstacle...
1:42 PM · Dec 5, 2019·Twitter for iPad.

.....Rudy Giuliani
@RudyGiuliani
·
21h
Replying to
@RudyGiuliani
...to the US assisting Ukraine with its anti-corruption reforms.

The American people will learn that Biden & other Obama administration officials, contributed to the increased level of corruption in Ukraine between 2014 to 2016.

This evidence will all be released very soon.

“The conversation about corruption in Ukraine was based on compelling evidence of criminal conduct by then VP Biden,” Giuliani tweeted, referring to Joe Biden, the intended target of “investigations” Trump and Giuliani pressured Ukraine to announce.

To empirically grounded observers, this will blow up a key Trump defense: that in conditioning official acts on getting Ukraine to announce the investigations he wanted, he was correctly concerned with cleaning up corruption there.

After all, Giuliani just confirmed that in pressuring Ukraine, “investigate corruption” actually meant, “smear Trump’s political rival.”
We already knew this — Giuliani and Trump have said it publicly for months — but that’s an unusually stark way to admit it.

Simply put, Dirtbag and Giuliani didn't give a **** about general corruption within the Ukraine government. They just wanted dirt on Biden.
 
Sure thing. I don't think I should post the entire piece but I think it's safe to pull out a few of the highlights:






Simply put, Dirtbag and Giuliani didn't give a **** about general corruption within the Ukraine government. They just wanted dirt on Biden.

I guess I'm missing the significance. If there is evidence that Biden was involved with corrupt acts in Ukraine then that should be investigated. I mean, presumed corrupt acts by Trump are being investigated and might impact the 2020 election, right?
 
Sure thing. I don't think I should post the entire piece but I think it's safe to pull out a few of the highlights:

Simply put, Dirtbag and Giuliani didn't give a **** about general corruption within the Ukraine government. They just wanted dirt on Biden.

Using unsecure devices was just Trump's way of CC'ing Vlad on the progress of their plans to blame Ukraine.
 
I guess I'm missing the significance. If there is evidence that Biden was involved with corrupt acts in Ukraine then that should be investigated. I mean, presumed corrupt acts by Trump are being investigated and might impact the 2020 election, right?

If Rudy has that evidence he should be turning it over to the DoJ sooner rather than later.
 
Using unsecure devices was just Trump's way of CC'ing Vlad on the progress of their plans to blame Ukraine.

I would not be surprised to learn that was the idea of using unsecured channels of communication.
 
I guess I'm missing the significance. If there is evidence that Biden was involved with corrupt acts in Ukraine then that should be investigated. I mean, presumed corrupt acts by Trump are being investigated and might impact the 2020 election, right?

I guess you missed the argument (i.e., lie) that Dirtbag and his congressional rodents have been pushing about that "perfect phone call" which is that Dirtbag was only speaking to concerns about general government corruption in Ukraine. Of course, that call read-out itself told us that was a lie since Dirtbag specifically cited the Bidens in it so really this article is just showing how the disinformation campaign is going to keep on working as long as possible, or ad infinitum as long as Dirtbag remains in office.
 
If Rudy has that evidence he should be turning it over to the DoJ sooner rather than later.

Yeah, I'm not holding my breath. Even if he did, Barr would likely do everything he could to deep-six it.
 
I guess you missed the argument (i.e., lie) that Dirtbag and his congressional rodents have been pushing about that "perfect phone call" which is that Dirtbag was only speaking to concerns about general government corruption in Ukraine. Of course, that call read-out itself told us that was a lie since Dirtbag specifically cited the Bidens in it so really this article is just showing how the disinformation campaign is going to keep on working as long as possible, or ad infinitum as long as Dirtbag remains in office.

Am I mistaken or did "Dirtbag" not mention Biden in the phone call that prompted all this? I'm too dumb and lazy to go back and check but the way I remember things is that Trump Dirtbag asked about Crowdstrike and the Bidens. I also seem to remember some guy on one of the committees paraphrasing explaining in detail what the context of that conversation was and my recollection is that it involved Biden. Now if my recollection is anything close to right and if Biden was involved in some "pay to play" scheme with Ukrainian businesses then it seems to me, in my feeble and warped brain, that an investigation into that activity would, in fact, be part of an investigation into general corruption in Ukraine.
 
I guess I'm missing the significance. If there is evidence that Biden was involved with corrupt acts in Ukraine then that should be investigated. I mean, presumed corrupt acts by Trump are being investigated and might impact the 2020 election, right?


See that is where your theory falls apart.

There is and never has been any evidence of wrongdoing by the Bidens...

Now the trumps on the other hand...
 
See that is where your theory falls apart.

There is and never has been any evidence of wrongdoing by the Bidens...

Now the trumps on the other hand...

Well, without regard to anything Giuliani may have come up with, the situation with the Bidens was concerning enough to the Obama State Department that they EXPRESSLY prepped Yovanovitch for discussions of the matter. That would be an indication that SOMETHING was going on.
 
Well, without regard to anything Giuliani may have come up with, the situation with the Bidens was concerning enough to the Obama State Department that they EXPRESSLY prepped Yovanovitch for discussions of the matter. That would be an indication that SOMETHING was going on.

Yeah, big news! Hunter Biden was on the board of a Ukranian company, and yeah, chances are they wanted his last name to show off. That's what was going on. So, among 100s of questions printed out for Yovanovitch for her confirmation hearing to be U.S. ambassador to Ukraine, they said if someone asks about that one, refer them to VP office.

You pretending like this is something important while ignoring what Trump is doing and his kids having positions in the White House is laughable.
 
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Am I mistaken or did "Dirtbag" not mention Biden in the phone call that prompted all this? I'm too dumb and lazy to go back and check but the way I remember things is that Trump Dirtbag asked about Crowdstrike and the Bidens. I also seem to remember some guy on one of the committees paraphrasing explaining in detail what the context of that conversation was and my recollection is that it involved Biden. Now if my recollection is anything close to right and if Biden was involved in some "pay to play" scheme with Ukrainian businesses then it seems to me, in my feeble and warped brain, that an investigation into that activity would, in fact, be part of an investigation into general corruption in Ukraine.

Well in the context of trump believing that the DNC servers are at the crowdstrike home office in Ukraine that is owned by one of their rich guys, then anything else he believes must be considered stupid and implausible as well.
 
Well, without regard to anything Giuliani may have come up with, the situation with the Bidens was concerning enough to the Obama State Department that they EXPRESSLY prepped Yovanovitch for discussions of the matter. That would be an indication that SOMETHING was going on.

Or just that oppo research could latch onto it to spin nothing into nonsense.

And they would have been correct.
 
Am I mistaken or did "Dirtbag" not mention Biden in the phone call that prompted all this? I'm too dumb and lazy to go back and check but the way I remember things is that Trump Dirtbag asked about Crowdstrike and the Bidens. I also seem to remember some guy on one of the committees paraphrasing explaining in detail what the context of that conversation was and my recollection is that it involved Biden. Now if my recollection is anything close to right and if Biden was involved in some "pay to play" scheme with Ukrainian businesses then it seems to me, in my feeble and warped brain, that an investigation into that activity would, in fact, be part of an investigation into general corruption in Ukraine.

Except no physical crowdstrike server exists, it was cloud-based.

Trump'''s Ukraine Server Delusion Is Spreading | WIRED
 
Or just that oppo research could latch onto it to spin nothing into nonsense.

And they would have been correct.

I love you guys. Trump needs to be investigated for anything that he might have so much as thought of doing but Biden is to get a free pass even when his own people have expressed concern over a given situation. "I'll have a standard. In fact, make it a double!"
 
I guess I'm missing the significance. If there is evidence that Biden was involved with corrupt acts in Ukraine then that should be investigated. I mean, presumed corrupt acts by Trump are being investigated and might impact the 2020 election, right?
Not all that significant, we already know what happened, and Trump may be impeached for it. It's simply Rudy confirming what has already been confirmed.
Rudy is stating what we already know...that "corruption" is simply code for "declaring an investigation into Burisma/Biden", and into "Ukraine meddling in the 2016". Both personal political ploys, that have no basis in fact.

But we already know that's all it was, it was not a wider interest in "corruption", because various departments including the department of defense already certified that Ukraine had the green light on that funding.
The anti-corruption ambassador was removed by Rudy/Trump (for no reason, but they smeared her with fake stories first).
Political appointees replaced her efforts and all worked in opposition to the *other* state department officials (NSC and Bill Taylor), etc., in pushing the quid pro quo.
They have hidden and stonewalled all efforts to inquire about it.
They failed to provide otehr significant examples of this "corruption" they claimed they were so concerned about, other than just those two.

You know Lutherf, if you are not just gaslighting, that they were trying to use code to discuss that, in a weak attempt at obfuscating what they were doing. You know this.

*EDIT* Also it appears to include admissions of regularly using unsecured communications (and cannot be recorded by U.S. or monitored, etc.) with POTUS, including in discussion about their Ukraine scheme.
This should also disturb you for at least three good reasons:
- This adds another example of consciousness of guilt, with respect to the alleged abuses of power Trump is being accused of. Attempts to hide that on non-secure phones is obviously that.
- Trump was repeatedly told how to conduct communications as POTUS, he either doesn't understand, or is willful for reasons (Obviously to conduct illicit behavior)
- Wanton use of unsecured wireless communication allows foreign adversaries to listen in, which is problematic for two reasons.
1. If they hear anything that could compromise Trump, they can then use that against Trump to leverage their own agenda...kompromat. Of course, Trump has supported any/all Russian agenda items, and opposed any/all holding of Russia to account..so he's already compromised I suppose...low risk that "more compromise" would hurt more.
2. It can be a back channel communication. If they describe what they want to happen...and Russia picks it up, and runs with it, it can be conspiracy without the ability to prosecute it.

Worrisome no?
 
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If there is evidence that Biden was involved with corrupt acts in Ukraine then that should be investigated.
The Senate will begin an investigation just any minute now, yes?
Or will Trump_DoJ beat them to it?
 
The Senate will begin an investigation just any minute now, yes?
Or will Trump_DoJ beat them to it?

Trump, through the DoJ, has already initiated an investigation into whether Operation Crossfire Hurricane was properly predicated or not. If information tangential to that investigation, but not directly related, comes up it might be investigated as well. That is pretty much the same way that Manafort and Cohen got dragged down during the investigation into whether Trump and/or his campaign conspired with Russia to manipulate the 2016 election.
 
Trump needs to be investigated for anything that he might have so much as thought of doing but Biden is to get a free pass even when his own people have expressed concern over a given situation.
Apparently, the GOP doesn't think it needs investigating either.

The GOP controls the Senate.
It only takes a majority of a single committee to open a congressional investigation.

If the GOP actually wanted this investigated, there would be an investigation already.

Just food for thought, fwiw.
 
Trump, through the DoJ, has already initiated an investigation into whether Operation Crossfire Hurricane was properly predicated or not. If information tangential to that investigation, but not directly related, comes up it might be investigated as well. That is pretty much the same way that Manafort and Cohen got dragged down during the investigation into whether Trump and/or his campaign conspired with Russia to manipulate the 2016 election.
...
...any minute now...
...
...just you wait...
...
...you'll see...
...
...any second now...
...
 
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