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Search warrants 'n stuff.

Torus34

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A police patrolman pulls a car off to the side of the road, perhaps for a defective tail light. The driver arouses suspicion for any number of reasons -- perhaps spent pistol cartridges on the floor -- and the policeman asks the driver to open the trunk of the car. The driver refuses. If there is sufficient reason to do so, the patrolman can get a court order and have the trunk opened. The motorist has no right to refuse the court order.

Replace the patrolman, the motorist and the court order with the House of Representatives, the president and a subpoena. There's a certain degree of similarity, nu?
 
A police patrolman pulls a car off to the side of the road, perhaps for a defective tail light. The driver arouses suspicion for any number of reasons -- perhaps spent pistol cartridges on the floor -- and the policeman asks the driver to open the trunk of the car. The driver refuses. If there is sufficient reason to do so, the patrolman can get a court order and have the trunk opened. The motorist has no right to refuse the court order.

Replace the patrolman, the motorist and the court order with the House of Representatives, the president and a subpoena. There's a certain degree of similarity, nu?

Yes, if the judge is the driver’s best friend and the driver is the mayor. Then the judge would refuse to sign the court order and the patrolman would be **** out of luck.
 
Trump was never pulled over by the DC police. Your argument is invalid.
 
A police patrolman pulls a car off to the side of the road, perhaps for a defective tail light. The driver arouses suspicion for any number of reasons -- perhaps spent pistol cartridges on the floor -- and the policeman asks the driver to open the trunk of the car. The driver refuses. If there is sufficient reason to do so, the patrolman can get a court order and have the trunk opened. The motorist has no right to refuse the court order.

Replace the patrolman, the motorist and the court order with the House of Representatives, the president and a subpoena. There's a certain degree of similarity, nu?

Not the President (was President subpoenaed to testify?) but all those others who refused to testify because they pretend the President is the "court", the judge, the jury and the executioner and his directions have more weight the the House subpoena.
 
Trump was never pulled over by the DC police. Your argument is invalid.

Awwwww, shucks! Come to think of it, the driver didn't have orange hair, either. And so it goes.

Thanks for replying, though.

Regards.
 
A police patrolman pulls a car off to the side of the road, perhaps for a defective tail light. The driver arouses suspicion for any number of reasons -- perhaps spent pistol cartridges on the floor -- and the policeman asks the driver to open the trunk of the car. The driver refuses. If there is sufficient reason to do so, the patrolman can get a court order and have the trunk opened. The motorist has no right to refuse the court order.

Replace the patrolman, the motorist and the court order with the House of Representatives, the president and a subpoena. There's a certain degree of similarity, nu?

No...

You are equating a court order with a subpoena that was issued by the House...that is, by the "patrolman". In real life, a patrolman cannot issue a court order.

You are cutting the court out of the House/Trump/subpoena scenario...much like the House Dems are attempting to ram their impeachment nonsense through BEFORE the court can issue their rulings.
 
No...

You are equating a court order with a subpoena that was issued by the House...that is, by the "patrolman". In real life, a patrolman cannot issue a court order.

You are cutting the court out of the House/Trump/subpoena scenario...much like the House Dems are attempting to ram their impeachment nonsense through BEFORE the court can issue their rulings.

Curses! Foiled again! I forgot that almost any comparison, even if qualified by phrases such as 'a certain degree of similarity', would draw comments starting with 'No' and 'You're wrong'.

Best of the holiday season to you and yours.
 
A police patrolman pulls a car off to the side of the road, perhaps for a defective tail light. The driver arouses suspicion for any number of reasons -- perhaps spent pistol cartridges on the floor -- and the policeman asks the driver to open the trunk of the car. The driver refuses. If there is sufficient reason to do so, the patrolman can get a court order and have the trunk opened. The motorist has no right to refuse the court order.

Replace the patrolman, the motorist and the court order with the House of Representatives, the president and a subpoena. There's a certain degree of similarity, nu?

Unfortunately the patrolman can seize the car for no reason, and then search it then use the evidence against the driver.

I know you were trying to make a political point, but you need to use a scenario that does not have a go around like this one does.
 
Unfortunately the patrolman can seize the car for no reason, and then search it then use the evidence against the driver.

I know you were trying to make a political point, but you need to use a scenario that does not have a go around like this one does.

The point, such as it was, was more procedural than political. It centered upon the concept of obstruction.

Season's best to you.
 
A police patrolman pulls a car off to the side of the road, perhaps for a defective tail light. The driver arouses suspicion for any number of reasons -- perhaps spent pistol cartridges on the floor -- and the policeman asks the driver to open the trunk of the car. The driver refuses. If there is sufficient reason to do so, the patrolman can get a court order and have the trunk opened. The motorist has no right to refuse the court order.
Police don't need a warrant to search your car. They only need probable cause.

If they don't have probable cause, they can also ask you to allow the search. You don't have to agree, but you have the option.


Replace the patrolman, the motorist and the court order with the House of Representatives, the president and a subpoena. There's a certain degree of similarity, nu?
No.

Impeachment is not a criminal process. It's a political process to determine if an official has engaged in conduct that justifies removal from office.

The Constitution is very open-ended about impeachment. It does not stipulate any sort of due process rights, certainly not during the investigative phase. While it is a good idea to give the impeached official the ability to respond to charges during the Senate trial, there is no requirement to do so under the Constitution. The House could impeach on Monday, and the Senate could convict on Tuesday, if they chose to do so.

The federal government is not a private citizen, and is not protected by the 4th Amendment. Everything the federal government does, with the exception of anything classified or specifically shielded by executive privilege, is supposed to be tracked, recorded, archived and available to the public.

If there is an individual working for the federal government who believes that their statements to Congress may be incriminating, then they can invoke their 5th Amendment rights. However, federal agencies don't have 5th Amendment rights, only individual staffers.

Congress has the power to issue subpoenas for its investigations. The only real objection the White House has right now is to claim executive privilege, which is not a blanket excuse to avoid accountability. Some things will reasonably be shielded, but most of it won't.

The Executive Branch has the option to fight Congress' requests in court. So far, they haven't convinced many courts that their arguments are sound.

The Executive Branch has also ordered multiple officials not to comply. Several officials have declined, and so far Congress has not chosen to take their refusal into court -- instead, it's likely going to be treated as evidence of obstruction. Despite that demand, numerous individuals have voluntarily appeared.

In other words: Congress is acting 100% in accordance with the law.
 
@ Visbek.

Hi! Yup, there are all sorts of 'no's' possible. You did, though, touch on the central aspect of the OP. That was the effect of obstruction. If not opposed, it can lead, if we accept the assertion of presidential invincibility, to essentially un-punishable crimes.

Regards, and season's best to you.
 
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