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Scholars Call Trump’s Actions on Ukraine an Impeachable Abuse of Power

Rogue Valley said:
Scholars Call Trump’s Actions on Ukraine an Impeachable Abuse of Power | New York Times

Democrats and Republicans clashed over the Constitution and President Trump’s conduct as the House Judiciary Committee formally began its impeachment proceedings.

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Constitutional scholars testify before the House Judiciary Committee.



If Donald Trump's abuse of presidential power is not checked, future presidents could strong-arm foreign governments to assist them in winning US elections. This is precisely what the principle authors of the Constitution (Jefferson and Madison) most feared - foreign government (at the time British) interference in American elections. Donald Trump's Obstruction of Congress also needs to be addressed. The Supreme Court has previously ruled that subpoena's issued in the course of the impeachment process are legal and valid subpoena's. Trump has ordered subpoenaed witnesses not to testify before the House impeachment Intelligence/Judiciary Committee's, and subpoenaed documents to not be provided to the House.

Republicans need to carefully think about the above. If Trump can employ such illicit tactics without consequence, then another president, perhaps a Democrat president, can follow suit and also employ such Trumpian lawlessness while in office.

A standard will be established here. Will it be a Constitutional standard, or a Trumpian standard?
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Scholars, my ass. Try partisan hacks.
 
Moderate Right said:
Before this even began it was known that there were three liberal scholars and one conservative scholar. So they voted 3-1. Democrats had it set up like that on purpose. They refused to have a fair panel of scholars. What would you have said if Democrats had actually made it fair and the vote was 2-2?
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Well realistically the house is 3/4 rs Democrat so it seems fair.

Do you think I will be any fairer when it moves to the Senate???
 
Paradoxical said:
Talk about far left "scholars" who despise Trump. OMG. I thought this was an inquisition in the Middle Ages.
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Anyone with at least a double digit IQ hates trump, that is why cultists hate intelligent people...
 
GDViking said:
Well realistically the house is 3/4 rs Democrat so it seems fair.
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LOL. Well, at least you admit it is nothing but partisan nonsense. Democrats have control of the House so they rig this so that it mirrors the partisan makeup of the House and you, of course, put your partisan stamp on that claiming that it is fair. When it goes to the Senate you will see not only the partisan makeup of the Senate but a few Democratic Senators defecting and zero Republican Senators defecting. The whole thing is nothing but a partisan sham.
 
Lutherf said:
Quite right. And that is the precedent that the Democrats have chosen to set.
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Seeing how Trump represents the biggest threat to the political classes power, ever; they feel they have nothing to lose.

They can't allow people to think that in The United States, anyone can become the president.
 
GDViking said:
Interesting attempt at muddying the waters, however this was never about an investigation.

No investigation existed when Obama orders Biden to send the news that they would not get the aid until they dealt with their corruption.

And that being said trump didn't give a dinglberry about an investigation, all he wanted was a public announcement of an investigation that he could use against Biden.

An obvious illegal abuse of power.

Who would have thunk that a life long narcissist would abuse the power of the presidency???
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So impeach him and we will have a national debate that will be settled next November

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
 
Cardinal said:
And the fourth argued in 1998 that Bill Clinton should have been impeached. I wonder what 1998 Jonathan Turley would make of 2019 Jonathan Turley.
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:lol:

Jonathan Turley 2019:

That is why this is wrong. It's not wrong because President Trump is right. His call was anything but perfect. It's not wrong because the House has no legitimate reason to investigate Ukrainian controversy. Point's not wrong because we're in an election year. There is no good time for an impeachment. No, it's wrong because this is not how you impeach an American president. This case is not a case of the unknowable. It's a case of the peripheral. We have a record of conflicts, defenses that have not been fully considered, unsubpoenaed witness with material evidence. To impeach a president on this record would expose every future president to the same time of inchoate impeachment.​

Jonathan Turley 1998:

In a government of laws, existence of the government will be imperiled if it fails to observe the law scrupulously. Our Government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the Government becomes a lawbreaker; it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. The allegations against President Clinton go to the very heart of the legitimacy of his office and the integrity of the political system. As an individual, a president may seek spiritual redemption in the company of friends and family. Constitutional redemption, however, is found only in the company of representatives of all three branches in the well of the Senate. It is there that legitimacy, once recklessly lost, can be regained by a president.​

Linkypoo...

Republicans are never at a loss for finding liars for hire it seems.
 
GDViking said:
Well this didn't quite rise to the high crimes and misdemeanors level of getting a blowjob, having a four year investigation to uncover the blow job than put him under the spot in front of a wife and an entire nation.
All trump did was about 289 counts of obstruction of justice and blackmail a foreign country into helping him get elected.
Obviously not up to the legal bar Republicans set which the blowjob crime of the century...
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Don't try to make light of Bill Clinton's crimes. Blowjob, suborning perjury to cover up the blow job, lying to federal investigators, use of office to obstruct a federal investigation. Like Watergate, the act was nothing much. The coverup is damning. The false statement under oath was in the Paula Jones sexual assault case, mostly unrelated to the blow job.
 
GDViking said:
Anyone with at least a double digit IQ hates trump, that is why cultists hate intelligent people...
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um.double digit would be 30, 40,....80. That explains why Democrats hate Trump then. Thanks for giving me your opinion of why low IQ people hate Trump. I have always wondered why.
 
Moderate Right said:
LOL. Well, at least you admit it is nothing but partisan nonsense. Democrats have control of the House so they rig this so that it mirrors the partisan makeup of the House and you, of course, put your partisan stamp on that claiming that it is fair. When it goes to the Senate you will see not only the partisan makeup of the Senate but a few Democratic Senators defecting and zero Republican Senators defecting. The whole thing is nothing but a partisan sham.
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I am actually nonpartisan, I am however anti corruption, and so far in my lifetime the corrupt administrations have all been Republican starting with Nixon.

When Republicans return to caring about our environment and stop coordinating with hostile foreign governments to get elected i may start voting Republican again...
 
Paradoxical said:
um.double digit would be 30, 40,....80. That explains why Democrats hate Trump then. Thanks for giving me your opinion of why low IQ people hate Trump. I have always wondered why.
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I guess you missed the part where trump supporters would have single digit IQ s.

You prove my point...
 
GDViking said:
I guess you missed the part where trump supporters would have single digit IQ s.

You prove my point...
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I guess you proved mine then because you didn't know a double digit IQ was borderline imbecile.
 
Jay59 said:
Don't try to make light of Bill Clinton's crimes. Blowjob, suborning perjury to cover up the blow job, lying to federal investigators, use of office to obstruct a federal investigation. Like Watergate, the act was nothing much. The coverup is damning. The false statement under oath was in the Paula Jones sexual assault case, mostly unrelated to the blow job.
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Obstruction???

He gave a blood sample, trump has not turned over a single document.

Trump has solicited foreign governments to go assist him in his election.

Bill gat a blowjob, that was between him and his wife, trump is committing international crimes, and cult actually do not see the difference...
 
Jay59 said:
Don't try to make light of Bill Clinton's crimes. Blowjob, suborning perjury to cover up the blow job, lying to federal investigators, use of office to obstruct a federal investigation. Like Watergate, the act was nothing much. The coverup is damning. The false statement under oath was in the Paula Jones sexual assault case, mostly unrelated to the blow job.
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Glad to see you support impeaching Trump for an entire platoon of coverups that dwarf the combined sum total of ALL coverups ever committed by every administration in history.
 
GDViking said:
Obstruction??? He gave a blood sample, trump has not turned over a single document. Trump has solicited foreign governments to go assist him in his election. Bill gat a blowjob, that was between him and his wife, trump is committing international crimes, and cult actually do not see the difference...
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Trump turned over 1,500,000 documents. It's enough.

It's not between Clinton and his wife, because Clinton committed multiple crimes to cover his various indiscretions, including obstruction. The evidence was so compelling, there were Democrats voting to impeach.
 
Checkerboard Strangler said:
Glad to see you support impeaching Trump for an entire platoon of coverups that dwarf the combined sum total of ALL coverups ever committed by every administration in history.
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So, if and when Trump actually commits a crime, we can have that discussion. Until then, too much said already.
 
Cardinal said:
And the fourth argued in 1998 that Bill Clinton should have been impeached. I wonder what 1998 Jonathan Turley would make of 2019 Jonathan Turley.
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In 1998, Congress said flat out that which Clinton ought be impeached over.
In 2019, Congress hasn't figured out what polls better.
1998 Turley would probably agree with 2019 Turley-- Congress hasn't made a case.
 
Cardinal said:
If Trump prevails, he's going to use the full powers of his office to openly cheat in the 2020 election in ways you and I never even knew existed. 2020 isn't going to be a free and fair election.
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Nice-- when Trump said during the last election that he wouldn't accept the results if lost, he was slammed for it. Now such comments for 2020 are a badge of honor.
 
ultmd said:
Yours is a rather typical FoxNews-styled argument.

Sorry, but if you people were honestly interested in "new information" and the "facts", you'd join the rest of the public in calling for direct and PUBLIC testimonies from the primary sources (i.e. Donald Trump, Mike Pence, Sec. Pompeo, Chief of Staff Mick Mulveney, former WH Counsel Don McGahn, etc. etc.).

Republicans whine and complain about "hearsay" and "2nd hand or 3rd hand testimonry", etc....yet they fully support the Trump WH's obstructive efforts (i.e. like ignoring Congressional subpoenas, etc.).

You people don't want the facts. You and your ilk only want to complain about the process, and promote your fakenews lies and conspiracy theoriesj about the Bidens.
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Congress is free to go to court to challenge the presidents claim of executive privilige regarding the testimony of the above.
 
less right said:
If there is a credible reason to think Hunter Biden has done something illegal then our DoJ should investigate. We shouldn't be asking foreign countries. That should be a clue.
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Trump said he would have Barr coordinate with Ukraine. That would fit the standard requested.
Moreover, the DOJ can't just march into foreign countries and start intvestigating.
 
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