A Summary that Even Trump supporters can grasp.

I'm sorry, but this is just too hilariously ironic to not talk more specifically about....

So now what Trump supporters are trying to argue is that Trump was doing his job by insuring that corruption in Ukraine was being investigated before giving them foreign aid. That's something that is standard practice for the United States to do before giving aid. So Trump did the right thing and that's not criminal.

One problem....THAT'S WHAT JOE BIDEN WAS DOING!!!!!!!

So in Summary... What Trump supporters are claiming Trump did is exactly what Joe Biden did. Conversely, what Trump supporters are trying to say Biden did is verbatim what Trump did.

The accusation their making towards Joe Biden is literally the exact thing Trump did. The defense their making of Trump is literally the exact same thing Joe Biden did. So by claiming Biden is guilty and Trump is innocent they have successfully proven that Trump is guilty and Biden is innocent.

Bravo Trump Supporters!!!! Absolutely Brilliant!

MrWonka said:

I'm sorry, but this is just too hilariously ironic to not talk more specifically about....

So now what Trump supporters are trying to argue is that Trump was doing his job by insuring that corruption in Ukraine was being investigated before giving them foreign aid. That's something that is standard practice for the United States to do before giving aid. So Trump did the right thing and that's not criminal.

One problem....THAT'S WHAT JOE BIDEN WAS DOING!!!!!!!

So in Summary... What Trump supporters are claiming Trump did is exactly what Joe Biden did. Conversely, what Trump supporters are trying to say Biden did is verbatim what Trump did.

The accusation their making towards Joe Biden is literally the exact thing Trump did. The defense their making of Trump is literally the exact same thing Joe Biden did. So by claiming Biden is guilty and Trump is innocent they have successfully proven that Trump is guilty and Biden is innocent.

Bravo Trump Supporters!!!! Absolutely Brilliant!

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They would have to both be guilty or both be innocent under the same fact pattern. Which is it? Is Biden guilty or is Trump innocent?

MrWonka said:

I'm sorry, but this is just too hilariously ironic to not talk more specifically about....

So now what Trump supporters are trying to argue is that Trump was doing his job by insuring that corruption in Ukraine was being investigated before giving them foreign aid. That's something that is standard practice for the United States to do before giving aid. So Trump did the right thing and that's not criminal.

One problem....THAT'S WHAT JOE BIDEN WAS DOING!!!!!!!

So in Summary... What Trump supporters are claiming Trump did is exactly what Joe Biden did. Conversely, what Trump supporters are trying to say Biden did is verbatim what Trump did.

The accusation their making towards Joe Biden is literally the exact thing Trump did. The defense their making of Trump is literally the exact same thing Joe Biden did. So by claiming Biden is guilty and Trump is innocent they have successfully proven that Trump is guilty and Biden is innocent.

Bravo Trump Supporters!!!! Absolutely Brilliant!

Click to expand...

That is twisting things quite a bit. It is either right or wrong (legal or illegal) for both Biden and Trump to demand a quid pro quo. The nature of the demorat's complaint (i.e. grounds for impeachment) is that Trump's was for personal (or political?) gain while Biden's was not.

One could also look at it as Biden was demanding that an investigation into Burisma who at the time employed his son be stopped (and got the desired result) and that Trump was demanding an investigation into Burisma and 2016 election "meddling" be started (and did not get the desired result).

This whole mess revolves around determining the specific motive for the quid pro quo - not whether a quid pro quo had, in fact, been demanded (requested?). It must be noted that Biden's demand was not to investigate corruption in Ukraine (specifically that allegedly involving Burisma, his son's employer) but to stop doing so.

Drawdown said:

They would have to both be guilty or both be innocent under the same fact pattern. Which is it? Is Biden guilty or is Trump innocent?

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Try and read this more slowly so you'll understand.

Trump is claiming to have done exactly what Biden actually did in reality. While Trump is accusing Biden of doing what Trump actually did in reality.

They did not do the same things. They did different things. Biden's actions were in the best interest of the United States and were therefore legal. However, Trump's actions were in his own best interest and therefore criminal. Trump is lying and saying it was the other way around, but the facts and all sworn testimony say otherwise.

ttwtt78640 said:

That is twisting things quite a bit. It is either right or wrong (legal or illegal) for both Biden and Trump to demand a quid pro quo.

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Biden didn't demand a quid pro quo. Biden demanded something be done for the good of the United States of America not something to be done for himself personally. That is the exact job of the Vice President. To work in the best interest of the United States.

ttwtt78640 said:

The nature of the democrat's complaint (i.e. grounds for impeachment) is that Trump's was for personal (or political?) gain while Biden's was not.

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Good! Now you're getting it.

ttwtt78640 said:

One could also look at it as Biden was demanding that an investigation into Burisma who at the time employed his son be stopped

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Wrong. Because the prosecutor who was fired had already stopped that investigation. Biden got him fired because they believed he had accepted a bribe from the CEO of Burisma. By firing the prosecutor he got the investigation going again. That is the exact opposite of what Biden would have done if he was trying to help his son.

In fact, you could argue that Hunter Biden under took this job at Burisma as a form of espionage helping out the United States. What is more likely is that Hunter found out the CEO of Burisma bribed this prosecutor and told his dad, and then his dad got the prosecutor fired. I don't think that's true, but it's more likely to be true.

ttwtt78640 said:

Trump was demanding an investigation into Burisma

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The investigation into Burisma was already on the table thanks to the new prosecutor being hired. Trump didn't need to ask for that.

ttwtt78640 said:

and 2016 election "meddling" be started

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Where the **** did you even pull this from? There has never been any evidence whatsoever that Ukraine meddled in our elections. This is just some nonsense Trump pulled from the sky.

ttwtt78640 said:

(and did not get the desired result).

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Actually, reports were that the Ukrainian President was about to do an interview with Fareed Zakaria announcing the bull**** investigations Trump wanted, but right before he could the Whistleblower came forward and Trump released the funds to avoid looking guilty.

ttwtt78640 said:

It must be noted that Biden's demand was not to investigate corruption in Ukraine (specifically that allegedly involving Burisma, his son's employer) but to stop doing so.

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Wrong. It is known that Biden was demanding to investigate corruption. Remember, the investigation into Burisma had already stopped before Biden stepped in. He believed the reason the investigation had stopped was because the prosecutor accepted a bribe from Burisma. By bringing in a new prosecutor he increased the likelihood that Burisma would be investigated.

Remember, Hunter Biden was never at any point himself under investigation. He himself committed no crime whatsoever. He was hired by Burisma AFTER the initial investigation started, but the investigation was shut down BEFORE Biden intervened.

ttwtt78640 said:

That is twisting things quite a bit. It is either right or wrong (legal or illegal) for both Biden and Trump to demand a quid pro quo. The nature of the demorat's complaint (i.e. grounds for impeachment) is that Trump's was for personal (or political?) gain while Biden's was not.

One could also look at it as Biden was demanding that an investigation into Burisma who at the time employed his son be stopped (and got the desired result) and that Trump was demanding an investigation into Burisma and 2016 election "meddling" be started (and did not get the desired result).

This whole mess revolves around determining the specific motive for the quid pro quo - not whether a quid pro quo had, in fact, been demanded (requested?). It must be noted that Biden's demand was not to investigate corruption in Ukraine (specifically that allegedly involving Burisma, his son's employer) but to stop doing so.

Click to expand...

Except Biden never even hinted at stopping an investigation into Burisma, nor getting the Prosecutor General fired to help his son in any way. In fact, the push for that action was international, and even supported by several Republican Senators.

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MrWonka said:

I'm sorry, but this is just too hilariously ironic to not talk more specifically about....

So now what Trump supporters are trying to argue is that Trump was doing his job by insuring that corruption in Ukraine was being investigated before giving them foreign aid. That's something that is standard practice for the United States to do before giving aid. So Trump did the right thing and that's not criminal.

One problem....THAT'S WHAT JOE BIDEN WAS DOING!!!!!!!

So in Summary... What Trump supporters are claiming Trump did is exactly what Joe Biden did. Conversely, what Trump supporters are trying to say Biden did is verbatim what Trump did.

The accusation their making towards Joe Biden is literally the exact thing Trump did. The defense their making of Trump is literally the exact same thing Joe Biden did. So by claiming Biden is guilty and Trump is innocent they have successfully proven that Trump is guilty and Biden is innocent.

Bravo Trump Supporters!!!! Absolutely Brilliant!

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Are you saying Biden broke the law?

roguenuke said:

Except Biden never even hinted at stopping an investigation into Burisma, nor getting the Prosecutor General fired to help his son in any way. In fact, the push for that action was international, and even supported by several Republican Senators.

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That only proves that Biden was smarter than Trump (or had a much weaker and more corrupt Ukrainian president) and got what he wanted in a single day. Biden sent a clear message that the Ukrainian president best abide by his wishes or he would get no US aid funds.

apdst said:

Are you saying Biden broke the law?

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No, I'm saying Trump broke the exact law that he accused Biden of breaking. But Biden never actually broke that law so now Trump is trying to claim he was doing the same thing that Biden was doing in reality.

MrWonka said:

No, I'm saying Trump broke the exact law that he accused Biden of breaking. But Biden never actually broke that law so now Trump is trying to claim he was doing the same thing that Biden was doing in reality.

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You can't have it both ways.

ttwtt78640 said:

That only proves that Biden was smarter than Trump

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Well I'm glad you can at least admit to that reality. I'm surprised given how stupid I'm sure you think Biden is.

apdst said:

You can't have it both ways.

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I'm not. Biden and Trump's actions were completely different. Everything Trump did in reality, is what he accused Biden of doing. But everything Biden did in reality is what Trump is lying and said he did. Trump committed the crimes. Biden did the right thing.

But since I already know you're not going to accept that. You claim that either they're both guilty or both innocent. Okay so what would you say if Democrats charged Biden? Would you let us impeach Trump too?

roguenuke said:

In fact, the push for that action was international, and even supported by several Republican Senators.

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Do you have a citation for this?

MrWonka said:

Well I'm glad you can at least admit to that reality. I'm surprised given how stupid I'm sure you think Biden is.

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Biden may have lost some of his past capabilities but he is far from stupid.

MrWonka said:

I'm not. Biden and Trump's actions were completely different. Everything Trump did in reality, is what he accused Biden of doing. But everything Biden did in reality is what Trump is lying and said he did. Trump committed the crimes. Biden did the right thing.

But since I already know you're not going to accept that. You claim that either they're both guilty or both innocent. Okay so what would you say if Democrats charged Biden? Would you let us impeach Trump too?

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You're applying a double standard. We all knew that, though.

It'll all get squared away when this gets to the Senate and the call the Bidens to testify.

MrWonka said:

I'm sorry, but this is just too hilariously ironic to not talk more specifically about....

So now what Trump supporters are trying to argue is that Trump was doing his job by insuring that corruption in Ukraine was being investigated before giving them foreign aid. That's something that is standard practice for the United States to do before giving aid. So Trump did the right thing and that's not criminal.

One problem....THAT'S WHAT JOE BIDEN WAS DOING!!!!!!!

So in Summary... What Trump supporters are claiming Trump did is exactly what Joe Biden did. Conversely, what Trump supporters are trying to say Biden did is verbatim what Trump did.

The accusation their making towards Joe Biden is literally the exact thing Trump did. The defense their making of Trump is literally the exact same thing Joe Biden did. So by claiming Biden is guilty and Trump is innocent they have successfully proven that Trump is guilty and Biden is innocent.

Bravo Trump Supporters!!!! Absolutely Brilliant!

Click to expand...

LOL.... except... never said Biden WAS guilty, said that the matter deserved investigation...
AND HE ADMITTED ON CAMERA TO DOING SO.

plus of course there are the possible financial ties with his son that needs investigating.

THE BEST you have on trump thus far is Sondland saying he, Sondland, pushed for quid pro quo to the ukrainians. he stated he never heard the president say he wanted that.

ttwtt78640 said:

That only proves that Biden was smarter than Trump (or had a much weaker and more corrupt Ukrainian president) and got what he wanted in a single day. Biden sent a clear message that the Ukrainian president best abide by his wishes or he would get no US aid funds.

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Because a stipulation of the aid, on an international level was that they actually show they were fighting corruption, and it was agreed upon internationally that Shokin was the highest, most obvious corrupt official. There is no evidence that Biden demanded he be fired for anything other than his corruption beyond the CT claims of people who proclaim outright they don't care for most Dems (some call them the enemy).

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MrWonka said:

Do you have a citation for this?

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Yes

Republican senators echoed Biden in urging Ukrainian president to reform prosecutor general's office - CNNPolitics

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MrWonka said:

Try and read this more slowly so you'll understand.

Trump is claiming to have done exactly what Biden actually did in reality. While Trump is accusing Biden of doing what Trump actually did in reality.

They did not do the same things. They did different things. Biden's actions were in the best interest of the United States and were therefore legal. However, Trump's actions were in his own best interest and therefore criminal. Trump is lying and saying it was the other way around, but the facts and all sworn testimony say otherwise.

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It's clear by the trumpsters responses in this thread you used words that are too big for them to understand. Do you have a popup picture book they could read?

azgreg said:

It's clear by the trumpsters responses in this thread you used words that are too big for them to understand. Do you have a popup picture book they could read?

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=

Bad post

MrWonka said:

I'm sorry, but this is just too hilariously ironic to not talk more specifically about....

So now what Trump supporters are trying to argue is that Trump was doing his job by insuring that corruption in Ukraine was being investigated before giving them foreign aid. That's something that is standard practice for the United States to do before giving aid. So Trump did the right thing and that's not criminal.

One problem....THAT'S WHAT JOE BIDEN WAS DOING!!!!!!!

So in Summary... What Trump supporters are claiming Trump did is exactly what Joe Biden did. Conversely, what Trump supporters are trying to say Biden did is verbatim what Trump did.

The accusation their making towards Joe Biden is literally the exact thing Trump did. The defense their making of Trump is literally the exact same thing Joe Biden did. So by claiming Biden is guilty and Trump is innocent they have successfully proven that Trump is guilty and Biden is innocent.

Bravo Trump Supporters!!!! Absolutely Brilliant!

Click to expand...

BIDEN went so far as to have someone FIRED in another countries legal system and ADMITTED IT ON VIDEO, are you kidding me?
you REALLY don;t see the difference between ASKING a country to investigate corruption and actually MEDDLING in their affairs?

because that ALWAYS works out GREAT for us doesn't it?

not to mention you don;t even question whether Biden was actually doing it for good reasons and not his own gains, because of his son just happening to work for one of the companies being investigated.

because imho, it isn't a crime to ask them to fire the guy if he is corrupt (although its shady as **** and like i say, that ALWAYS works out for us) , nor to withhold aid until they do, BUT WHETHER BIDEN DID THAT FOR PERSONAL GAIN NEEDS INVestigating because that WOULD BE a crime.

how about some honest freaking logic for once? try to see it from our side just this ONE time.