Ohio House passes bill allowing student answers to be scientifically wrong due to religion

I cannot believe the partisan idiocy that is coming from Columbus in the past week. The state legislature wants to allow public school students to be permited to cite their religious beliefs in classes and not be graded as wrong. If this passes any public school diploma will be worthless because they are allowing religious students to reject facts and instead write "God did it" as an answer and not be marked wrong. This is claimed to be an act of religious freedom but we can see that the GOP in Ohio is desperate to pander to religious conservatives to get them to vote Republican next year.

COLUMBUS, Ohio (WKRC) - Ohio lawmakers are weighing in on how public schools can teach things like evolution.

The Ohio House on Wednesday passed the "Student Religious Liberties Act." Under the law, students can't be penalized if their work is scientifically wrong as long as the reasoning is because of their religious beliefs.

Instead, students are graded on substance and relevance.

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I hated John Kasich but he is looking positively rational and pragmatic compared to this fundamentalist religious idiocy which includes the recent abortion bill would include the death penalty for doctors for performing abortions.

Ohio House passes bill allowing student answers to be scientifically wrong due to religion | WKRC

/facepalm

The idiots.

Lisa said:

I cannot believe the partisan idiocy that is coming from Columbus in the past week. The state legislature wants to allow public school students to be permited to cite their religious beliefs in classes and not be graded as wrong. If this passes any public school diploma will be worthless because they are allowing religious students to reject facts and instead write "God did it" as an answer and not be marked wrong. This is claimed to be an act of religious freedom but we can see that the GOP in Ohio is desperate to pander to religious conservatives to get them to vote Republican next year.


I hated John Kasich but he is looking positively rational and pragmatic compared to this fundamentalist religious idiocy which includes the recent abortion bill would include the death penalty for doctors for performing abortions.

Ohio House passes bill allowing student answers to be scientifically wrong due to religion | WKRC

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American students can now graduate from high school being told that they are correct to believe in a flat earth, and that stars are little lights that will one day fall to earth.

JustHanging said:

American students can now graduate from high school being told that they are correct to believe in a flat earth, and that stars are little lights that will one day fall to earth.

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This could make for some very amusing debates classroom when rational students call out of the Christian fundamentalists for their idiocy. I wonder when the Satanists will show up to make their voices known? I wonder how this will play out in history civics or literature classes?

Will this also allow Christian conservative teachers to teach their mythology in class instead of teaching facts?

Lisa said:

I cannot believe the partisan idiocy that is coming from Columbus in the past week. The state legislature wants to allow public school students to be permited to cite their religious beliefs in classes and not be graded as wrong. If this passes any public school diploma will be worthless because they are allowing religious students to reject facts and instead write "God did it" as an answer and not be marked wrong. This is claimed to be an act of religious freedom but we can see that the GOP in Ohio is desperate to pander to religious conservatives to get them to vote Republican next year.


I hated John Kasich but he is looking positively rational and pragmatic compared to this fundamentalist religious idiocy which includes the recent abortion bill would include the death penalty for doctors for performing abortions.

Ohio House passes bill allowing student answers to be scientifically wrong due to religion | WKRC

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Manufactured outrage the bill does not do what the article claims it does

Crovax said:

Manufactured outrage the bill does not do what the article claims it does

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Yes, it does.

Under the law, students can't be penalized if their work is scientifically wrong as long as the reasoning is because of their religious beliefs.

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Did the authors of this moronic idea consider that non-religious students will also make up a religious answer if they do not know the correct scientific answer just to prevent them from being marked wrong? There is nothing that says that a student must be logially consistant during the quiz, test or the semster.

I never believed a word of the Catholic relgion of my family but even I knew how to BS my way through an essay answer when the situation called for it just to save my grade.

Lisa said:

I cannot believe the partisan idiocy that is coming from Columbus in the past week. The state legislature wants to allow public school students to be permited to cite their religious beliefs in classes and not be graded as wrong. If this passes any public school diploma will be worthless because they are allowing religious students to reject facts and instead write "God did it" as an answer and not be marked wrong. This is claimed to be an act of religious freedom but we can see that the GOP in Ohio is desperate to pander to religious conservatives to get them to vote Republican next year.


I hated John Kasich but he is looking positively rational and pragmatic compared to this fundamentalist religious idiocy which includes the recent abortion bill would include the death penalty for doctors for performing abortions.

Ohio House passes bill allowing student answers to be scientifically wrong due to religion | WKRC

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Quote the language allowing students to "answer questions scientifically wrong?"

Up until about 40-50 years ago, it was scientific fact that dinosaurs vanished due to an ice age. Any student who answered they were killed due to a huge asteroid were "wrong," to scientifically correct.

Most progressive Democrats have no clue what the word "scientific" actually means. To them, it means whatever they believe therefore is scientific fact because someone told them to believe that it is.

CURIOUS - How is this any different to the abundance of laws out there which already completely disregard biology and other scientific facts in favor of protecting people's feelings?

Did you guys miss the laws that want doctors to be prosecuted for treating people based on their biological gender, instead mandating them to conform to the patient's identified gender?

What about the proposed laws which completely disregard the science behind genitalia and biology and forces us to allow men to shower in women's locker rooms because they feel like women?

What about the laws which declare that abortion is OK because you ain't killing a real human...even though science unanimously deduces that a heartbeat is present in the womb at just 3 weeks? Isn't that scientifically incorrect too?

What about the proposed hate speech laws to make it illegal to use statistical science when claiming that Islam is responsible for most terrorism deaths, or saying that black people commit a disproportionately higher number of crimes?

What about the outrage from Lefties saying that Mathematics is racist? Or that statistical evidence is EVIL!

I really don't see the difference. The left has been dismissing and burying science for decades now. If we wanted a world that is 100% in line with science, we wouldn't be legalizing gay marriage either...science and the natural order of the universe clearly didn't want two people of the same sex to procreate, so why do we legalize it again? Oh that's right, BECAUSE MUH FEELINGS!

Heaven forbid we think about the Christians' feelings though.

Lisa said:

I cannot believe the partisan idiocy that is coming from Columbus in the past week. The state legislature wants to allow public school students to be permited to cite their religious beliefs in classes and not be graded as wrong. If this passes any public school diploma will be worthless because they are allowing religious students to reject facts and instead write "God did it" as an answer and not be marked wrong. This is claimed to be an act of religious freedom but we can see that the GOP in Ohio is desperate to pander to religious conservatives to get them to vote Republican next year.


I hated John Kasich but he is looking positively rational and pragmatic compared to this fundamentalist religious idiocy which includes the recent abortion bill would include the death penalty for doctors for performing abortions.

Ohio House passes bill allowing student answers to be scientifically wrong due to religion | WKRC

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So you are claiming that in Ohio, the opinion of anyone with Local12WKRC is the law that is then told to the jury when deciding cases. :roll:

In this state, laws are created by the legislature, signed by the governor and subject to judicial review. You claim laws in Ohio are created by local news outlets opinions.

Lisa said:

Yes, it does.

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That’s what the article claims but that’s not what the actual bill says. It only says that students can’t be penalized for expressing religion in their school work and more importantly that all regular academic standards still apply

Lisa said:

I cannot believe the partisan idiocy that is coming from Columbus in the past week. The state legislature wants to allow public school students to be permited to cite their religious beliefs in classes and not be graded as wrong. If this passes any public school diploma will be worthless because they are allowing religious students to reject facts and instead write "God did it" as an answer and not be marked wrong. This is claimed to be an act of religious freedom but we can see that the GOP in Ohio is desperate to pander to religious conservatives to get them to vote Republican next year.


I hated John Kasich but he is looking positively rational and pragmatic compared to this fundamentalist religious idiocy which includes the recent abortion bill would include the death penalty for doctors for performing abortions.

Ohio House passes bill allowing student answers to be scientifically wrong due to religion | WKRC

Click to expand...

“There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.” - Isaac Asimov

The net effect of this is that Ohio high school graduates will be 'red lined' by colleges & universities when it comes to evaluating their applications for admission.

Crovax said:

Manufactured outrage the bill does not do what the article claims it does

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It's all about deliberately ambiguous wording designed to invite people to test its limits, then have a court decide exactly how far it goes. ie,


"No board of education of a school district shall adopt any policy or rule respecting or promoting an establishment of religion or prohibiting any pupil from the free, individual, and voluntary exercise or expression of the pupil's religious beliefs in any primary or secondary school."

House Bill 164 | Homework | Schools


2nd page. Well, what's a voluntary "exercise" or "expression"? Is an answer on a test an "expression" or an "exercise"? What's "voluntary"? After all, a student doesn't have to answer a question. If they do not, they get it wrong and points are deducted, but they still aren't made to write an answer.

The ambiguity doubles as cover for people who like you will defend the bill simply because someone "on the left" is criticizing it and as invitation for someone with means to test the boundaries by seeking a court ruling on just how far the definitions of the words can go. That second part is reflected in many things, like the red state bills that directly contradict Roe. The point is to keep throwing the issue to the courts as Trump and McConnell pack SCOTUS and the federal judciary with judges deemed conservative.

Lisa said:

If this passes any public school diploma will be worthless

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They've been worthless for decades.

Crovax said:

That’s what the article claims but that’s not what the actual bill says. It only says that students can’t be penalized for expressing religion in their school work and more importantly that all regular academic standards still apply

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If they can express a religious belief instead of the scientifically correct answer an not be marked wrong then how can regular academic standards still apply?

All religious beliefs apply a so this isn't just an excuse for Conservative Christian students to reject facts. The teachers will need to take a course in religious belief just so they can grade the papers.

Mr Person said:

It's all about deliberately ambiguous wording designed to invite people to test its limits, then have a court decide exactly how far it goes. ie,


"No board of education of a school district shall adopt any policy or rule respecting or promoting an establishment of religion or prohibiting any pupil from the free, individual, and voluntary exercise or expression of the pupil's religious beliefs in any primary or secondary school."

House Bill 164 | Homework | Schools


2nd page. Well, what's a voluntary "exercise" or "expression"? Is an answer on a test an "expression" or an "exercise"? What's "voluntary"? After all, a student doesn't have to answer a question. If they do not, they get it wrong and points are deducted, but they still aren't made to write an answer.

The ambiguity doubles as cover for people who like you will defend the bill simply because someone "on the left" is criticizing it and as invitation for someone with means to test the boundaries by seeking a court ruling on just how far the definitions of the words can go. That second part is reflected in many things, like the red state bills that directly contradict Roe. The point is to keep throwing the issue to the courts as Trump and McConnell pack SCOTUS and the federal judciary with judges deemed conservative.

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There is no ambiguity, maybe read beyond the first 2 pages

Assignment grades and scores shall be calculated using ordinary academic standards

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Scaremongering by religion hating bigots and perpetuated in this thread by people who can’t read a simple bill but somehow it’s the religious that are backwards and uneducated?

JacksinPA said:

The net effect of this is that Ohio high school graduates will be 'red lined' by colleges & universities when it comes to evaluating their applications for admission.

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Exactly.

Lisa said:

If they can express a religious belief instead of the scientifically correct answer an not be marked wrong then how can regular academic standards still apply?

All religious beliefs apply a so this isn't just an excuse for Conservative Christian students to reject facts. The teachers will need to take a course in religious belief just so they can grade the papers.

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I would suggest you take some courses since your trouble comprehending simple statements is apparent

Crovax said:

I would suggest you take some courses since your trouble comprehending simple statements is apparent

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There is no claimed additional religious freedom that this legislation supports if religious students cannot be marked wrong for giving a religious answer. Students can have a religious objection now but they are marked wrong for doing so because it is not the correct answer. The bill leaves it ambiguous how far it goes but it most certainly does open the door for that to happen. It also opens the door for all religious beliefs because the state cannot pick and choose which religious beliefs are permitted as objections to scientific or empirical facts.

This will be a religious and acedmeic sheep show of epic porportions if it manages to get signed by Dewine and not be thrown out by a rational judge.

Crovax said:

That’s what the article claims but that’s not what the actual bill says. It only says that students can’t be penalized for expressing religion in their school work and more importantly that all regular academic standards still apply

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They have religious a and free speech rights in school now to object in a classroom discussion. You either have the correct answer or you don't on a quiz or a test now. They have never be marked wrong for a religious objection if they also had the proper answer.

Schools should teach facts. Regardless of students' feelings, religion, etc.
They also shouldn't omit facts because of feelings, religion, etc.

Using the previous example, if it can be scientifically proven that the earth is round, then it should be taught as much.

Crovax said:

There is no ambiguity, maybe read beyond the first 2 pages

Assignment grades and scores shall be calculated using ordinary academic standards

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Psssst....you can't just pull what looks to be part of one sentence from its context. Not unless you wish to be dishonest.

The prohibition I quoted is part of its own section, 3313.601.

Yours is yanked from what? A subsection of a different section? The document's search function only turns up that phrase in a portion that appears to have been crossed out...you see this bill revises some sections of existing law.

Mr Person said:

Psssst....you can't just pull what looks to be part of one sentence from its context. Not unless you wish to be dishonest.

The prohibition I quoted is part of its own section, 3313.601.

Yours is yanked from what? A subsection of a different section?

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From section 3320.03 one of the only parts of the bill that changed. Your quote that you say is ambiguous and will lead to trouble is ALREADY part of the current law.

http://search-prod.lis.state.oh.us/solarapi/v1/general_assembly_133/bills/hb164/PH/02?format=pdf

The part in strikeout is being taken out of the current law and the underlined parts are being added

Would it be easier if it was written in crayon?

Mr Person said:

Psssst....you can't just pull what looks to be part of one sentence from its context. Not unless you wish to be dishonest.

The prohibition I quoted is part of its own section, 3313.601.

Yours is yanked from what? A subsection of a different section? The document's search function only turns up that phrase in a portion that appears to have been crossed out...you see this bill revises some sections of existing law.


View attachment 67268340

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Crovax said:

From section 3320.03 one of the only parts of the bill that changed. Your quote that you say is ambiguous and will lead to trouble is ALREADY part of the current law.

http://search-prod.lis.state.oh.us/solarapi/v1/general_assembly_133/bills/hb164/PH/02?format=pdf

The part in strikeout is being taken out of the current law and the underlined parts are being added

Would it be easier if it was written in crayon?

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Did you not bother to read what you were responding to? 3320.03 is crossed out. The bill we're talking about changes existing law. When those bills are displayed, the sections being removed are shown with lines through them, which would appear to be the case with your 3320.03.

Velvet Elvis said:

Schools should teach facts. Regardless of students' feelings, religion, etc.
They also shouldn't omit facts because of feelings, religion, etc.

Using the previous example, if it can be scientifically proven that the earth is round, then it should be taught as much.

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Here you go. I understand they still have openings: Modern flat Earth societies - Wikipedia