Ohio House passes bill allowing student answers to be scientifically wrong due to religion

Harshaw said:

All of that may be true, but the bill still doesn't say what the article says it does.

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If this legislation passes then teachers will also be forced to learn the beliefs of various sects so they can judge if the student's religious objection is in agreement with their beliefs. They are science teachers a not religion or theology instructers. These kids either need to learn the material or face the academic consequences because a high school diploma is not a participation trophy. They receive a diploma when they can prove a mastery of the material and not because you prayed about it. If your religious beliefs are more important than an education in facts and reality then go to a private religious school. I'm tired of being nice to these evangelical dipsticks who are doing their best to turn the social and intellectual clock back 1000 years because of their mythology.

Lisa said:

If this legislation passes then teachers will also be forced to learn the beliefs of various sects so they can judge if the student's religious objection is in agreement with their beliefs.

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Why? There's nothing in the bill which says anything of the kind.

They are science teachers a not religion or theology instructers.

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Why are you under the impression this bill pertains only to science classes?

These kids either need to learn the material or face the academic consequences

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And the bill specifically says they will be graded on the material by ordinary academic standards.

because a high school diploma is not a participation trophy.

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That is far less true than you apparently want to think.

They receive a diploma when they can prove a mastery of the material and not because you prayed about it.

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Nothing in the bill says otherwise. (Though lots of kids are passed without demonstrating any such "mastery.")

If your religious beliefs are more important than an education in facts and reality then go to a private religious school. I'm tired of being nice to these evangelical dipsticks who are doing their best to turn the social and intellectual clock back 1000 years because of their mythology.

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Sounds like you have quite the motivation to believe the worst about this, and stubbornly. But the bill doesn't do what the article says, and that's true whether you choose to believe it or not. :shrug:

Harshaw said:

Why? There's nothing in the bill which says anything of the kind.



Why are you under the impression this bill pertains only to science classes?



And the bill specifically says they will be graded on the material by ordinary academic standards.



That is far less true than you apparently want to think.



Nothing in the bill says otherwise. (Though lots of kids are passed without demonstrating any such "mastery.")



Sounds like you have quite the motivation to believe the worst about this, and stubbornly. But the bill doesn't do what the article says, and that's true whether you choose to believe it or not. :shrug:

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Try again, but don't forget the facts this time,

Gary Daniels, the chief lobbyist of ACLU of Ohio, acknowledged that the bill would remove some restrictions on students’ religious rights, but talked about the student who turns in biology homework saying that the Earth is just 10,000 years old. Would he or she be penalized?

“Under HB 164, the answer is ‘no,’ as this legislation clearly states the instructor ‘shall not penalize or reward a student based on the religious content of a student’s work,” Daniels said.

GOP Rep. Timothy Ginter, who sponsored the bill, said it’s not that simple. “We live in a day when our young people are experiencing stress and danger and challenges we never experienced growing up,” he said.



Ginter said widening religious self-expression would be positive for students. In response to the critique that “anti-science” would go unpunished, Ginter said that students must turn in work that accurately reflects what is taught during the course, cleveland.com reported.

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Lisa said:

Try again, but don't forget the facts this time,

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You've never once even read the bill, have you? Not even once. And the whole thing is linked to in your OP article.

You just go by what other people tell you about it IF they tell you what you want to hear.

"Assignment scores and grades shall be calculated using ordinary academic standards of substance and relevance, including any legitimate pedagogical concerns, and shall not penalize or reward a student based on the religious content of a student’s work."

This doesn't say someone can't be marked wrong for giving an incorrect answer because it's based on religion. It says ordinary academic standards will be maintained, but that a student can't be penalized or rewarded if they include religious content in their work, just because it's religious content. But if it's a wrong answer, it's still wrong answer.

And again, you seem to think that this is only about science. It isn't. It's about all kinds of subjects, some of which where religious content would be appropriate.

You really do cling tightly to what you want to believe whether it's true or not. It's almost . . . religious.

Lisa said:

Statistics,.......................you don't understand it.

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Right. That's how I got a degree in math. Sounds like you don't understand probability based on random past events. We can't predict global warming because we have no idea where we are in the cycle.

Lisa said:

I don't care about religion as long as it is kept out of any connection with the government or taxpayer dollars. The strict separation of church and state must be obeyed with no exceptions because I have equal religious rights, and my secular rights do not come with the approval of your god or any of the 2000+ other gods that someone has imagined. Public schools are for learning facts and not a breeding ground or a recruitment opportunity for any religion.

You can worship a rusty Edsel hubcap, and 3 broken Star wars Pez dispensers if you want to. All I demand is that just don't make me live by your myths, tell you its logical or pay for it and I could care less who or what you pray to.

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I always laugh hard when leftwingers blab about 'science'. Leftwingers are the LEAST interested in the scientific method when it comes to global warming. Science doesn't shut out all discussion and claim the debate over. Science constantly keeps an open mind, welcoming discussion and varied ideas.

Obscurity said:

I assume you're talking about trans identity? Irrelevant to the point, but I'll say this.

I do not agree with it being taught in school period.

That's not a "looney left" position and neither is trans identity in general, so please spare me your agitprop and get back on topic.

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By the same brush that religion is usually painted with - anything that cannot be objectively and systematically proven is just fairytale nonsense.

"Homosexuality is moral" - that's a belief. It cannot be proven therefore it should not be taught.

"Abortion is OK" - that's a belief. It cannot be proven therefore it should not be taught.

"Jesus is the son of God" - that's a belief. It cannot be proven therefore it should not be taught.

You don't get to pick and choose which beliefs our schools teach, and which ones they should "keep out. PERIOD". Almost everything taught in schools and college campuses is based on some form of unproven belief.

Crusader13 said:

By the same brush that religion is usually painted with - anything that cannot be objectively and systematically proven is just fairytale nonsense.

"Homosexuality is moral" - that's a belief. It cannot be proven therefore it should not be taught.

"Abortion is OK" - that's a belief. It cannot be proven therefore it should not be taught.

"Jesus is the son of God" - that's a belief. It cannot be proven therefore it should not be taught.

You don't get to pick and choose which beliefs our schools teach, and which ones they should "keep out. PERIOD". Almost everything taught in schools and college campuses is based on some form of unproven belief.

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No. No, no. You do not get to soil everything else with ignorance of religion. Religion is all based on belief. I've never been taught in public school abortion was acceptable because it's moral, and if anyone is, those are a minority outlier you're siezing on to prove your point, even though it's a minority.

Religion is for RELIGION studies and RELIGIOUS school.

Public school? No place for it.

Crusader13 said:

By the same brush that religion is usually painted with - anything that cannot be objectively and systematically proven is just fairytale nonsense.

"Homosexuality is moral" - that's a belief. It cannot be proven therefore it should not be taught.

"Abortion is OK" - that's a belief. It cannot be proven therefore it should not be taught.

"Jesus is the son of God" - that's a belief. It cannot be proven therefore it should not be taught.

You don't get to pick and choose which beliefs our schools teach, and which ones they should "keep out. PERIOD". Almost everything taught in schools and college campuses is based on some form of unproven belief.

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Schools teach morals every day. No hitting, kindness, respect.....etc

JustHanging said:

American students can now graduate from high school being told that they are correct to believe in a flat earth, and that stars are little lights that will one day fall to earth.

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And that the sun turns around the earth?