Impeachment a winner for Democrats? Don’t bet on it

Willie Brown was Speaker of the California State Assembly for 15 years. He was a towering figure in state politics and the Democratic party. He is also no fan of Donald Trump.

Impeachment a winner for Democrats? Don't bet on it

Willie Brown Nov. 2, 2019 Updated: Nov. 2, 2019 1:13 p.m.

If the goal was to damage President Trump by formalizing the impeachment inquiry, it's Mission Unaccomplished for House Democrats.

If anything, the vote solidified Trump's hold on power. There were zero GOP defections, meaning we have zero drama heading into the public phase of impeachment. Everyone is pretty much in the same lanes they've been in since the Russian-collusion investigation, the obstruction of justice investigation and every other investigation.

Unfortunately for the Democrats, that gives people little reason to be glued to their screens when House committees take public testimony. The basic story ” Trump pressured Ukraine to announce investigations into Democrats that would help Trump ” is out there already. People know how they feel about it, and if you believe the polls, they're pretty evenly split on whether the president deserves to be thrown out of office.

The only potential drama before last week's vote was whether there might be any movement, whether any Republicans would see it Democrats' way.

Looks like they don't.

And when it gets to the Senate, it will play out just the same way. Someone like Sen. Mitt Romney of Utah may break GOP ranks, but no one thinks 20 Republicans, the bare minimum who would have to defect to convict Trump, would actually do so.

So the Democrats will spend the next few precious months acting out a pretend cliffhanger to which everyone actually knows the script and the ending. No plot twists in sight. Remember health care, the issue that won so many elections for Democrats in 2018? You might, but they don't seem to.

Come next year, Trump will have an impeachment victory and quite possibly a solid economy. The Democrats will have...” what?

Impeachment a winner for Democrats? Don’t bet on it - SFChronicle.com

We already know that jury nullification will play out in the Senate.

Cardinal said:

We already know that acquittal will play out in the Senate.

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fify.

But if we all know how this ends, what reason do people have to stay glued to the TV or even pay attention to the proceedings?

You don't do an impeachment because it helps you politically, you do it to uphold the law.

That is, you should. Republicans DO impeach for politics.

eman623 said:

fify.

But if we all know how this ends, what reason do people have to stay glued to the TV or even pay attention to the proceedings?

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Because the more evidence Democrats can pile on the more damaging it will be to Senate Republicans who when they let such an obvious criminal get away with it.

I think there's a very real chance that this may finally break the back of the Republican party for decades to come.

I think the reasons why the dems are doing this is just symbolic. They know Trump will never be forced out of office, so they try to make him look bad for the election, which could easily backfire on them.

Cardinal said:

We already know that jury nullification will play out in the Senate.

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It might play out even worse at the ballot box.

MrWonka said:

Because the more evidence Democrats can pile on the more damaging it will be to Senate Republicans who when they let such an obvious criminal get away with it.

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This boils down to the American people holding politicians accountable - does the public support or undermine the rule of law?

I think there's a very real chance that this may finally break the back of the Republican party for decades to come.

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You're forgetting voters are goldfish. It might last months? It's a little like how Watergate was good for one election, then, hey, let's elect a guy who supports corruption, corporatocracy, plutocracy, brutal dictators, Iran-Contra and says the elected government of America is the problem!

eman623 said:

fify.

But if we all know how this ends, what reason do people have to stay glued to the TV or even pay attention to the proceedings?

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Because how senators vote won't effect my assessment of the evidence and subsequent voting decisions.

PoS said:

I think the reasons why the dems are doing this is just symbolic. They know Trump will never be forced out of office, so they try to make him look bad for the election, which could easily backfire on them.

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Hopefully, they're doing it because it's right and it's the law, regardless of the politics, something Republicans can't understand. If Democrats do the right thing, and it costs them politically, Republicans won't understand that - they'll say, "ha ha Democrats lost, we won" and think it proved them right.

less right said:

Because how senators vote won't effect my assessment of the evidence and subsequent voting decisions.

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It's not going to affect anyone's opinions or voting. That's Brown's point. The only thing it's going to accomplish is give Trump a political victory going into the election.

less right said:

Because how senators vote won't effect my assessment of the evidence and subsequent voting decisions.

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Making you wrong and unconcerned with the rule of law.

apdst said:

It might play out even worse at the ballot box.

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Signs thus far run contrary to that:

1)A majority of Americans support impeachment.
2)Trump’s approval average has dropped a point. True, one point isn’t a lot, but it contradicts the notion that impeachment will help him.
3)Republicans lost the governorship in Kentucky, and Virginia went blue.

Craig234 said:

You don't do an impeachment because it helps you politically, you do it to uphold the law.

That is, you should. Republicans DO impeach for politics.

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No. An impeachment is not a criminal matter. It's a political thing.

PoS said:

I think the reasons why the dems are doing this is just symbolic. They know Trump will never be forced out of office, so they try to make him look bad for the election, which could easily backfire on them.

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Trump would stop looking bad if he stopped committing impeachable offenses.

Cardinal said:

Signs thus far run contrary to that:

1)A majority of Americans support impeachment.
2)Trump’s approval average has dropped a point. True, one point isn’t a lot, but it contradicts the notion that impeachment will help him.
3)Republicans lost the governorship in Kentucky, and Virginia went blue.

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You still think those polls are gospel?

Craig234 said:

This boils down to the American people holding politicians accountable - does the public support or undermine the rule of law?



You're forgetting voters are goldfish. It might last months? It's a little like how Watergate was good for one election, then, hey, let's elect a guy who supports corruption, corporatocracy, plutocracy, brutal dictators, Iran-Contra and says the elected government of America is the problem!

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I think even American LIV voters will remember a failed impeachment.

PoS said:

I think the reasons why the dems are doing this is just symbolic. They know Trump will never be forced out of office, so they try to make him look bad for the election, which could easily backfire on them.

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Very easily. Few knew politics as well as Willie Brown and he thinks this is political suicide. Pelosi also dragged her feet on impeachment as long as she could. This will not end well for the Dems on just about any level.

eman623 said:

It's not going to affect anyone's opinions or voting. That's Brown's point. The only thing it's going to accomplish is give Trump a political victory going into the election.

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Why would you think it wouldn't effect anyone's opinion?

Craig234 said:

Making you wrong and unconcerned with the rule of law.

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What 'rule of law' determines my vote?

eman623 said:

Come next year, Trump will have an impeachment victory and quite possibly a solid economy. The Democrats will have...” what?

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The White House, the Senate, The House....lol

Who knows really, but we'll see how all of this plays out.

All I know is that if Trump gets away with all this, it won't be long before a Democrat uses the same dirty tricks. And then y'all will be upset.

lol

apdst said:

You still think those polls are gospel?

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The polls track extremely well with election results, so I see no reason not to take them seriously. The polls were particularly reliable in 2018, and were compatible with last night’s election results.

Cardinal said:

We already know that jury nullification will play out in the Senate.

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The entire affair is a farce. Democrats have been claiming they would impeach since the day after the election. Some unbiased use of power, huh? Republicans simply don't agree and that's their right. The Republicans will do their constitutional duty if the House votes to impeach. Republicans will run the trial just as openly and honestly and unbiased as the investigations of the democrats over the past 3 years. So you see you democrats have nothing to worry about. I think you will see the most important facts are not in existance.

Cardinal said:

The polls track extremely well with election results, so I see no reason not to take them seriously. The polls were particularly reliable in 2018, and were compatible with last night’s election results.

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The Democrats lost way more in 2010 and Obama still won.

apdst said:

The Democrats lost way more in 2010 and Obama still won.

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Which doesn’t change the fact that the polls have tracked reliably with election results.