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Dissecting the whistleblower transcript today

itstony said:
So trumpies, can you all remind what Nixon was guilty of? If I recall it was abusing the power of his office to harass his political opponents and GETTING CAUGHT TRYING TO COVER IT UP. Please explain why this is any different and how it worked our for Nixon?

I'm not sure how he ever says "drain the swamp" with a straight face again.
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You should actually take the time to learn something about a subject before commenting on it.
 
HumblePi said:
No, I'm speaking directly to the oath of office taken by any U.S. President as he places his left hand on a Bible and swears to protect the United States from all threats, both foreign and domestic. Trump has abused his presidential powers by trying to extort the president of Ukraine by threatening to withhold money approved by Congress for Ukraine's defense against Russian aggression. He threatened to withhold those monies unless the president of Ukraine did exactly as he asked.
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Learned legal opinions disagree on what Trump did during the Ukrainian phone call. I can't make this any cleared to you.:roll:
 
HumblePi said:
No, I'm speaking directly to the oath of office taken by any U.S. President as he places his left hand on a Bible and swears to protect the United States from all threats, both foreign and domestic. Trump has abused his presidential powers by trying to extort the president of Ukraine by threatening to withhold money approved by Congress for Ukraine's defense against Russian aggression. He threatened to withhold those monies unless the president of Ukraine did exactly as he asked.
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I have seen nothing that shows this yet.
please cite the reference for this thought.
 
Hypothetical said:
how do you think its going to play out then?
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He is going to be impeached in the House.
The Senate is not going to convict and remove.
He may get re-elected. But a tiger does not change its stripes.
He will do something more brazen and get caught again.

You first must come to the realization that, though you loathe it to be true, Donald J Trump is a corrupt man.
And absolute power corrupts, absolutely.
 
Pound4abrown said:
He is going to be impeached in the House.
The Senate is not going to convict and remove.
He may get re-elected. But a tiger does not change its stripes.
He will do something more brazen and get caught again.

You first must come to the realization that, though you loathe it to be true, Donald J Trump is a corrupt man.
And absolute power corrupts, absolutely.
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ok great. that very well might happen. he may even go to jail after his presidency if something actually is found. i do want to see actual proof firsthand though. I won;t accept rants and hyperbole of what might have happened because of how Trump acts, as evidence.


now, will Biden ever pay for his almost blatant admission of a crime? or even be investigated further?
 
cabse5 said:
And the American people are gonna be super pizzed 'cause nothing else will get done in congress. Even if something comes of this latest batch of quasi-impeachment proceedings, expect Americans to be super-pizzed because congress has done nothing else.
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Nothing gets done because Moscow Mitch does not even allow bills passed by the House to even be debated on the floor of the Senate. The House has passed oodles of legislation. Its all sitting dormant over in the Senate thanks to Moscow Mitch.
 
Hypothetical said:
ok great. that very well might happen. he may even go to jail after his presidency if something actually is found.


now, will Biden ever pay for his almost blatant admission of a crime? or even be investigated further?
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Biden was investigated
 
I can see many of the trumplicans got their Fox News talking points already.
 
jnug said:
They are welcome to run with that. Its a distraction, not more. Concentrating on who the Whistleblower is and the process by which he came to this material is of limited value when the material itself is so damning, when the WH and Administration officers are hemorrhaging leaks in an effort to now save their skins and jump off the Trump Party Bus, the President, his conceliiere Rudy are blathering contradictions to their own statements entirely wrapped around the axle and his underbosses, Barr And Pompeo are both deeply implicated. This is particularly true of Mr Barr who is again right smack in the middle and apparently engaged in misconduct.

Worth noting that the acting DNI just verified that he and the IG referred the whistleblower complaint to DOJ for prosecutorial consideration. Nice Bill Barr. Way to go. Way to not take Session's example to heart since YOU are called out by Trump in the phone call with Zalinsky.
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Joseph Mcguire just admitted that he went to the White House legal council FIRST to seek advice as to whether the matter in the complaint was determined to be 'executive privilege' or not. DUH! Of course, he went right to the source of the whistleblower complaint!
 
Hypothetical said:
ok great. that very well might happen. he may even go to jail after his presidency if something actually is found.


now, will Biden ever pay for his almost blatant admission of a crime? or even be investigated further?
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Biden will pay, for sure, by being eliminated from contention as presidential candidate for the dems in 2020, IMO...But yes, Biden and his son should, at least, be investigated for Ukraine.
 
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Airyaman said:
There will be no "transcript". What you got yesterday is all there is. According to others who were involved in previous admins, what was released yesterday was typically all that is ever created for such calls.
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I didn't realize they'd released it already.

[looks it up] ...

OK. So what do Democrats want here? Let's just say Pres. Trump is corrupt as all-get-out and pressured Pres. Zelensky.

Pres. Zelensky denies it. Pres. Trump obviously denies it. There's no evidence of it on the transcript (or "memorandum"). The only thing they have to work on is double-hearsay from an anonymous whistleblower.

Are they really going to use that as a basis for impeachment? I just... Does that seem reasonable to anybody here?

Are they trying to lose the 2020 election? What do they hope to accomplish? I don't understand.
 
Hypothetical said:
ok great. that very well might happen. he may even go to jail after his presidency if something actually is found. i do want to see actual proof firsthand though. I won;t accept rants and hyperbole of what might have happened because of how Trump acts, as evidence.


now, will Biden ever pay for his almost blatant admission of a crime? or even be investigated further?
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I doubt he ever sees jail time.
For me, and I am only speaking for me here. The Dems are doing the right thing on this WB scandal.
It may not have the outcome I personally desire, but if Trump's actions are not Impeachable, no one will ever be able to be impeached for improper behavior.
I am ok with them doing their jobs, even if it means short-term loses on the whole.

ETA: I didn't see your Biden thing.
I don't like Biden, never have he is an absolute Gaffe machine. I hope he is not the nominee.
And if he has done wrong, I don't care if he goes to jail. Like, at all.
 
HumblePi said:
Joseph Mcguire just admitted that he went to the White House legal council FIRST to seek advice as to whether the matter in the complaint was determined to be 'executive privilege' or not. DUH! Of course, he went right to the source of the whistleblower complaint!
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The whole phone call should be executive privilege.
 
cabse5 said:
The whole phone call should be executive privilege.
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Write DonDon a letter in protest. He released the thing to the public no less.
 
jnug said:
Biden was investigated
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and when he said , basically bragged he had the prosecutor fired, should he not be investigated again?


"I remember going over and convincing our team, others, to convince that we should be providing for loan guarantees. And I went over, I guess, the 12th, 13th time to Kiev. And I was supposed to announce that there was another billion-dollar loan guarantee. And I had gotten a commitment from Poroshenko and from Yatsenyuk that they would take action against the state prosecutor. And they didn’t.

So they said they had—they were walking out to a press conference. I said, nah, I’m not going to—or, we’re not going to give you the billion dollars. They said, you have no authority. You’re not the president. The president said—I said, call him. (Laughter.) I said, I’m telling you, you’re not getting the billion dollars. I said, you’re not getting the billion. I’m going to be leaving here in, I think it was about six hours. I looked at them and said: I’m leaving in six hours. If the prosecutor is not fired, you’re not getting the money. Well, son of a b-tch. (Laughter.) He got fired. And they put in place someone who was solid at the time."


you can find this video all over.
 
COTO said:
I didn't realize they'd released it already.

[looks it up] ...

OK. So what do Democrats want here? Let's just say Pres. Trump is corrupt as all-get-out and pressured Pres. Zelensky.

Pres. Zelensky denies it. Pres. Trump obviously denies it. There's no evidence of it on the transcript (or "memorandum"). The only thing they have to work on is double-hearsay from an anonymous whistleblower.

Are they really going to use that as a basis for impeachment? I just... Does that seem reasonable to anybody here?

Are they trying to lose the 2020 election? What do they hope to accomplish? I don't understand.
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Quid quo pro: a favor or advantage granted or expected in return for something.

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President Zelenskyy:...We are ready to continue to cooperate for the next steps specifically we are almost ready to buy more Javelins from the United States for defense purposes

The President: I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it.
 
Hypothetical said:
I have seen nothing that shows this yet.
please cite the reference for this thought.
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Everyone, and I'm sure you as well, have read and dissected the first disclosure yesterday of the phone conversation between President Zelensky of Ukraine and Donald Trump. And no, I don't have time to abide you pulling me into a dispute over what was said, what was promised or what was requested by Trump in that conversation.
 
jnug said:
Nothing gets done because Moscow Mitch does not even allow bills passed by the House to even be debated on the floor of the Senate. The House has passed oodles of legislation. Its all sitting dormant over in the Senate thanks to Moscow Mitch.
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That is wrong on McConnell's part. All an incumbent has to say is, 'I tried but the bills were tied up.'
 
Airyaman said:
Quid quo pro: a favor or advantage granted or expected in return for something.

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President Zelenskyy:...We are ready to continue to cooperate for the next steps specifically we are almost ready to buy more Javelins from the United States for defense purposes

The President: I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it.
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Like Joe putting a gun to the head of Ukraine demanding they fire the guy investigating his son, within 6 hours, or no Billion dollars?
 
Nunez looks and sounds defeated. That was low ****ing energy.
 
Hypothetical said:
that's fine, investigate, but if this is a nothingburger , the ones going ballistic are going to look pretty bad... again.

there is no proof until someone with KNOWN firsthand knowledge corroborates this imho.

also imho, it is perfectly fine to ask for an investigation into the issue when someone brags about a possible crime like Biden did.

the only damning thing for Trump would be IF INDEED he did use the money as leverage for an investigation.that would be wrong.
so prove it.
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Already proven, trump admitted it...
 
HumblePi said:
Joseph Mcguire just admitted that he went to the White House legal council FIRST to seek advice as to whether the matter in the complaint was determined to be 'executive privilege' or not. DUH! Of course, he went right to the source of the whistleblower complaint!
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No, he went there to find out whether executive privilege was going to be asserted by the WH which would have prevented him from forwarding any information to Congress. I can understand when Democrats are confused by people who actually follow the law.
 
ocean515 said:
Like Joe putting a gun to the head of Ukraine demanding they fire the guy investigating his son, within 6 hours, or no Billion dollars?
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If Biden were investigated and exonerated, how can Trump be liable even if he is guilty of bribery or coercion?
 
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