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The Christian Right is Helping Drive Liberals Away From Religion

Obscurity

Obscurity

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The Christian Right Is Helping Drive Liberals Away From Religion | FiveThirtyEight

Proof is in the pudding folks. I had mentioned something similar, that the religious right wing was destroying itself in truly iconoclast fashion.

This one is personal for me. Its part of the reason I am an atheist. The people composing the church are becoming more radical in their social views. They are ubdermining the separation of church and state, the very right that enables them to practice their faith.

The religious right takes any advance in social justice as an affront to their beliefs. Gay marriage for example. Gays being married outside the church does not undermine traditional marriage. Christians however take this as an affront to their belief. They can believe whatever they want but they have no right to make others adhere with that belief.

Thankfully the faith is dying by self inflicted wounds and worsening fanaticism.
 
Obscurity said:
The Christian Right Is Helping Drive Liberals Away From Religion | FiveThirtyEight

Proof is in the pudding folks. I had mentioned something similar, that the religious right wing was destroying itself in truly iconoclast fashion.

This one is personal for me. Its part of the reason I am an atheist. The people composing the church are becoming more radical in their social views. They are ubdermining the separation of church and state, the very right that enables them to practice their faith.

The religious right takes any advance in social justice as an affront to their beliefs. Gay marriage for example. Gays being married outside the church does not undermine traditional marriage. Christians however take this as an affront to their belief. They can believe whatever they want but they have no right to make others adhere with that belief.

Thankfully the faith is dying by self inflicted wounds and worsening fanaticism.
Click to expand...

Maybe there is a god. :)
 
calamity said:
Maybe there is a god. :)
Click to expand...

The funny part is the right will claim this is about a failure of society. They are wrong. Religion is supposed to be a refuge from the horrors of our cosmic existence. Instead it has become a cog in the machine of misery, grinding others to dust under the tenets it preaches.
 
Obscurity said:
The Christian Right Is Helping Drive Liberals Away From Religion | FiveThirtyEight

Proof is in the pudding folks. I had mentioned something similar, that the religious right wing was destroying itself in truly iconoclast fashion.

This one is personal for me. Its part of the reason I am an atheist. The people composing the church are becoming more radical in their social views. They are ubdermining the separation of church and state, the very right that enables them to practice their faith.

The religious right takes any advance in social justice as an affront to their beliefs. Gay marriage for example. Gays being married outside the church does not undermine traditional marriage. Christians however take this as an affront to their belief. They can believe whatever they want but they have no right to make others adhere with that belief.

Thankfully the faith is dying by self inflicted wounds and worsening fanaticism.
Click to expand...

As a mean becomes less and less general through the population it is inevitable that the remaining average level of intensity amongst those still with it will be higher.

In such a thing as nebulous as a religion it will generally cause those remaining to be surrounded by like minded, intensified, folk. This is also likely to intensify their perception of the meam its' self.
 
The sooner America loses it’s unhealthy fascination with religion the better.
 
Obscurity said:
The Christian Right Is Helping Drive Liberals Away From Religion | FiveThirtyEight

Proof is in the pudding folks. I had mentioned something similar, that the religious right wing was destroying itself in truly iconoclast fashion.

This one is personal for me. Its part of the reason I am an atheist. The people composing the church are becoming more radical in their social views. They are ubdermining the separation of church and state, the very right that enables them to practice their faith.

The religious right takes any advance in social justice as an affront to their beliefs. Gay marriage for example. Gays being married outside the church does not undermine traditional marriage. Christians however take this as an affront to their belief. They can believe whatever they want but they have no right to make others adhere with that belief.

Thankfully the faith is dying by self inflicted wounds and worsening fanaticism.
Click to expand...

I find the reasoning kind of backwards, Obscurity. How is it the responsibility of highly-orthodox/conservative religious groups to cater to the sensibilities of the liberal and ecumenical? Is it your argument (or those of FiveThirtyEight's) that if the teachings and interpretations were less strict, that these many liberal and progressive parishioners would stay? If that is the case, why aren't those who are leaving these supposedly "right wing" churches turning to more liberal and "open-minded" churches? Why aren't those Orthodox Jews simply going to Reform Synagogues, or Southern Baptists turning Presbyterian, or Sunni and Shia Muslims turning to the Baha'i Faith or Sufism?
 
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Jetboogieman said:
The sooner America loses it’s unhealthy fascination with religion the better.
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I agree. Then we Americans can begin putting the focus on what really matters: power. Power over our fellow citizens, their lives, their dreams and their wallets, stripped of any pretense of higher morality.
 
Felis Leo said:
I find the reasoning kind of backwards, Obscurity. How is it the responsibility of highly-orthodox/conservative religious groups to cater to the sensibilities of the liberal and ecumenical? Is it your argument (or those of FiveThirtyEight's) that if the teachings and interpretations were less strict, that these many liberal and progressive parishioners would stay? If that is the case, why aren't those who are leaving these supposedly "right wing" churches turning to more liberal and "open-minded" churches?
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My argument is that the religious have increasingly tied themselves to Republican politics and politicians who have increasingly levelled political blame at liberals of leftists in general.

The issue isnt the faith but the intersection of faith with hardline extremist rhetoric.

If you had read the article you would know that.

Go back and read it.
 
Felis Leo said:
I agree. Then we Americans can begin putting the focus on what really matters: power. Power over our fellow citizens, their lives, their dreams and their wallets, stripped of any pretense of higher morality.
Click to expand...

You clearly didnt read the article.

It is about power. Liberals are leaving religion. Why wouldnt they when preachers stand there and rail agaibst people who identify as liberal or left?
 
I am a card-carrying Democrat, and I have not walked away from my faith. I am not a fan of organized religion, but I have not, nor will I ever, deny Christ, or the impact He has in my life.

I’m just not crazy about some of His followers. :lol:
 
Obscurity said:
You clearly didnt read the article.

It is about power. Liberals are leaving religion. Why wouldnt they when preachers stand there and rail agaibst people who identify as liberal or left?
Click to expand...

If someone sincerely believes in a God and that this god somehow intervenes in human affairs and expects certain behaviors from humanity, why wouldn't they simply change congregations to one with a more liberal bent (or at least one that did not make a point of engaging in politics)? This seems more like a pretext for non-believers to break away from the pretensions of religious faith. I mean, did you stop believing in God because you thought his representatives on Earth were mean along with fellow members of your congregation?

Would you become religious again if the vast majority of believers became more left-wing politically and promoted policies that you favored using the Bible to justify it like many right-leaning Christians presently do, but reversed in a photo-negative fashion?
 
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If you think it is the people in the church that are becoming more radical, then you are a moron. The left has ripped society out of the church and put up a barrier of -ist and -phobe labels around it to make sure that anyone that is not firm in their faith will have second thoughts before going back. Do not worry leftists, I have a feeling that before our lifetimes are over, you will have converted our society into a majority of sociopaths. Well done.
 
Superfly said:
I am a card-carrying Democrat, and I have not walked away from my faith. I am not a fan of organized religion, but I have not, nor will I ever, deny Christ, or the impact He has in my life.

I’m just not crazy about some of His followers. :lol:
Click to expand...

The wingnuts are giving the rest of you Christians a bad name.
 
Crossfire said:
If you think it is the people in the church that are becoming more radical, then you are a moron. The left has ripped society out of the church and put up a barrier of -ist and -phobe labels around it to make sure that anyone that is not firm in their faith will have second thoughts before going back. Do not worry leftists, I have a feeling that before our lifetimes are over, you will have converted our society into a majority of sociopaths. Well done.
Click to expand...

^ This is why you are losing young people in droves. They're not going to put up with that stupid bull****.
 
Obscurity said:
Its part of the reason I am an atheist.
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Perhaps basing theological beliefs on the grievances you have with other people, is a practice that says more about you than it does about either God or those who follow Him?
 
Obscurity said:
My argument is that the religious have increasingly tied themselves to Republican politics and politicians who have increasingly levelled political blame at liberals of leftists in general.

The issue isnt the faith but the intersection of faith with hardline extremist rhetoric.

If you had read the article you would know that.

Go back and read it.
Click to expand...

Nice sentiment, but he's not much of a reader.

Felis Leo said:
If someone sincerely believes in a God and that this god somehow intervenes in human affairs and expects certain behaviors from humanity, why wouldn't they simply change congregations to one with a more liberal bent (or at least one that did not make a point of engaging in politics)? This seems more like a pretext for non-believers to break away from the pretensions of religious faith. I mean, did you stop believing in God because you thought his representatives on Earth were mean along with fellow members of your congregation?

Would you become religious again if the vast majority of believers became more left-wing politically and promoted policies that you favored using the Bible to justify it like many right-leaning Christians presently do, but reversed in a photo-negative fashion?
Click to expand...

The fact of the matter is religions have been bleeding members for decades in America and church attendance is every year at a record low. Evangelicals tying their religion to the Republican party isn't the cause for this, but it simply didn't help more non-Republicans stay in the church.

It makes me immensely happy to see more and more people shake the bonds of the cult and start thinking for themselves.
 
calamity said:
Maybe there is a god. :)
Click to expand...

Knowledge and rational thought are becoming more common due to the internets ability to help people learn and the fact that people can have real-time conversations on the issues of the day.
Theistic religion is quickly dying and life is looking better for it.
 
Crossfire said:
If you think it is the people in the church that are becoming more radical, then you are a moron. The left has ripped society out of the church and put up a barrier of -ist and -phobe labels around it to make sure that anyone that is not firm in their faith will have second thoughts before going back. Do not worry leftists, I have a feeling that before our lifetimes are over, you will have converted our society into a majority of sociopaths. Well done.
Click to expand...

How can anyone be ripped from the church, so drop the theatrics? You can think what you want to and worship what you want, but theistic religion in the US doesn't get to make the rules or decided what rights others get to enjoy by filtering the constitution or the Bill of Rights through their own interpretation of the Bible. If you need the bible to tell you to want is right and wrong because you are unable to think for yourself then you are just a rabid animal on an invisible leash. Our prisons are full of Christians so it doesn't see that their beliefs make for very moral members. How do you explain the number of pedophiles and sexual predators in the priesthood or youth minsters?

Who are the sociopaths that you are referring to?
 
RabidAlpaca said:
Nice sentiment, but he's not much of a reader.
Click to expand...

I did. It seems like so much excuse-making. It seems that Obscurity seems to have left his faith because he stopped believing in the foundational truth of the religious teachings, i.e., that a God exists. The same reason I did. Not that people in his Church were not nice enough.

RabidAlpaca said:
The fact of the matter is religions have been bleeding members for decades in America and church attendance is every year at a record low. Evangelicals tying their religion to the Republican party isn't the cause for this, but it simply didn't help more non-Republicans stay in the church.

It makes me immensely happy to see more and more people shake the bonds of the cult and start thinking for themselves.
Click to expand...

Let me ask you something, RabidAlpaca. What is there that Germans of all classes and backgrounds are able to come together regularly in a spirit of fellowship for? What in other words, has taken the place of religion in Germany? Soccer perhaps? Germanic racial supremacy in the case of the AfD?

What should take religion's place as a unifier? Or should there be nothing that unites disparate people?
 
Lisa said:
Knowledge and rational thought are becoming more common due to the internets ability to help people learn and the fact that people can have real-time conversations on the issues of the day.
Theistic religion is quickly dying and life is looking better for it.
Click to expand...

Is it, Lisa? Are people happier and kinder to each other in the United States right now? What is markedly "better" in people's lives overall unless you simply see belief as an objective bad?
 
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This is why I don’t care much for mainstream religion. I believe there could be a god, but I don’t know.
 
Obscurity said:
The Christian Right Is Helping Drive Liberals Away From Religion | FiveThirtyEight

Proof is in the pudding folks. I had mentioned something similar, that the religious right wing was destroying itself in truly iconoclast fashion.

This one is personal for me. Its part of the reason I am an atheist. The people composing the church are becoming more radical in their social views. They are ubdermining the separation of church and state, the very right that enables them to practice their faith.

The religious right takes any advance in social justice as an affront to their beliefs. Gay marriage for example. Gays being married outside the church does not undermine traditional marriage. Christians however take this as an affront to their belief. They can believe whatever they want but they have no right to make others adhere with that belief.

Thankfully the faith is dying by self inflicted wounds and worsening fanaticism.
Click to expand...

Have you considered being an agnostic instead of an atheist?
 
Felis Leo said:
Is it, Lisa? Are people happier and kinder to each other in the United States right now?
Click to expand...

I am much happier since I left the Catholic church. I didn't have some silk-robed hypocrite telling me that I was born bad and inherently evil unless I believe in a sky fairy and pray to what I can't prove exists. Do you believe that people are inherently bad and must apologize to a psychopathic god because your god made an imperfect being, but it is their fault for being imperfect? Religious belief takes gaslighting, the Stockholm syndrome and, delusions to an art form. Once you emotionally step outside of religious belief and see it from a 3rd party point of you you will never believe the ones that you have been indoctrinated in. If people were not brought up in a religion from their childhood they would laugh at people who tried to convince them what religious believers claim to be literally true.

Part of the problem in the US is that we have a very divisive government that is splitting the people part and it is driven by the media that says until you obey Trump, worship the GOP and fly the flag you are evil.
 
Obscurity said:
The Christian Right Is Helping Drive Liberals Away From Religion | FiveThirtyEight

Proof is in the pudding folks. I had mentioned something similar, that the religious right wing was destroying itself in truly iconoclast fashion.

This one is personal for me. Its part of the reason I am an atheist. The people composing the church are becoming more radical in their social views. They are ubdermining the separation of church and state, the very right that enables them to practice their faith.

The religious right takes any advance in social justice as an affront to their beliefs. Gay marriage for example. Gays being married outside the church does not undermine traditional marriage. Christians however take this as an affront to their belief. They can believe whatever they want but they have no right to make others adhere with that belief.

Thankfully the faith is dying by self inflicted wounds and worsening fanaticism.
Click to expand...

More BS lies from the left and the left media. Don't bother to get the facts, just make crazy claims that support a liberal socialist agenda full of perverse behavior.

New Harvard Research Says U.S. Christianity Is Growing Stronger
 
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