Questions concerning the on going investigations and Trump's reactions to them?

The first question concerns the Congressional subpoenas. If the courts rule in favor of the House committees should Trump continue to refuse to give up the information? Another question is how far Executive privilege extend? Trump is using it to cover everything including people who have never worked for the Administration. If Trump is impeached by the House with seemingly reasonable amount of evidence but not found guilty in the Senate, will it help or hurt Trump?

independentusa said:

The first question concerns the Congressional subpoenas. If the courts rule in favor of the House committees should Trump continue to refuse to give up the information? Another question is how far Executive privilege extend? Trump is using it to cover everything including people who have never worked for the Administration. If Trump is impeached by the House with seemingly reasonable amount of evidence but not found guilty in the Senate, will it help or hurt Trump?

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He has a right that constitutional procedures be followed. Nadler has a “make believe” impeachment inquiry. He has no choice. He doesn’t have the votes for a real one so a fake one will have to do. Dumb people don’t care about that. As long as the I word is in there they feel like in their heads, momentum is building! Woooo....

I don’t think America is as pissed off as the people under your rock think they are.

independentusa said:

The first question concerns the Congressional subpoenas. If the courts rule in favor of the House committees should Trump continue to refuse to give up the information? Another question is how far Executive privilege extend? Trump is using it to cover everything including people who have never worked for the Administration. If Trump is impeached by the House with seemingly reasonable amount of evidence but not found guilty in the Senate, will it help or hurt Trump?

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Article passed around yesterday on this.
1. The House can appeal to DOJ to compel them/hold in contempt, but Barr/Republicans/Trump control DOJ so you'll get nowhere doing that.
2. They can file a law suite and try to get a judge to rule for contempt too, but that goes to either:
--a. back to DOJ, see above
--b. relies on the House's own power to jail people, which would be politically outrageous for them to use.
(b. they can do with or without judge, but would be strongest with a judge ruling)

Democrats only have the House.
Republicans hold the the Senate (which largely cuts the power of the House out), the Presidency, and SCOTUS.

Not much Democrats can do in our current system, because it puts POTUS in charge of DOJ and he can apparently legally do anything he wants with it, according to right wing interpretation.
And if that gets contested, it goes to SCOTUS, which is partisan Republican, which will uphold that.

That's why Nancy is focused on beating Trump in an election. Anything else is a loser.

Our systems is designed to be nearly 100% corruptible. While Trump is a dumpster fire, that broken system is everyone's problem, not of his making.

independentusa said:

The first question concerns the Congressional subpoenas. If the courts rule in favor of the House committees should Trump continue to refuse to give up the information? Another question is how far Executive privilege extend? Trump is using it to cover everything including people who have never worked for the Administration. If Trump is impeached by the House with seemingly reasonable amount of evidence but not found guilty in the Senate, will it help or hurt Trump?

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First of all stop wondering 'if' the courts will rule in favor of Congress, they most certainly will because it would be unconstitutional for any court to rule against the powers of Congress as given to them in the US Constitution. The court will definitely rule in their favor. These rulings are said to be coming before Thanksgiving, so we have a while to wait yet. A federal court ruling will compel witnesses to testify and will compel the White House or Treasury Dept to supply documents as requested.

If witnesses are still directed by Trump not to appear or if documents are still being refused to be handed over, Trump will most certainly be impeached in the Senate. This is clearly violation of federal law and Trump would officially be a criminal and could actually be arrested and indicted for that alone. The U.S. shouldn't have a proven criminal running the U.S.

independentusa said:

The first question concerns the Congressional subpoenas. If the courts rule in favor of the House committees should Trump continue to refuse to give up the information? Another question is how far Executive privilege extend? Trump is using it to cover everything including people who have never worked for the Administration. If Trump is impeached by the House with seemingly reasonable amount of evidence but not found guilty in the Senate, will it help or hurt Trump?

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If the courts rule in favor of Trump will the House Dems stop using their Congressional power for political purposes?

Mycroft said:

If the courts rule in favor of Trump will the House Dems stop using their Congressional power for political purposes?

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No, and neither will the Senate Republicans.

independentusa said:

The first question concerns the Congressional subpoenas. If the courts rule in favor of the House committees should Trump continue to refuse to give up the information? Another question is how far Executive privilege extend? Trump is using it to cover everything including people who have never worked for the Administration. If Trump is impeached by the House with seemingly reasonable amount of evidence but not found guilty in the Senate, will it help or hurt Trump?

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"Executive privilege is the power of the president of the United States and other members of the executive branch of the United States Government to resist certain subpoenas and other interventions by the legislative and judicial branches of government in pursuit of information or personnel relating to confidential communications that would impair governmental functions. The power of Congress or the federal courts to obtain such information is not mentioned explicitly in the United States Constitution, nor is there any explicit mention in the Constitution of an executive privilege to resist such requests from Congress or courts.[1] The Supreme Court of the United States has ruled this privilege may qualify as an element of the separation of powers doctrine, derived from the supremacy of the executive branch in its own area of Constitutional activity."

Executive privilege - Wikipedia

So neither is executive privilege or the power of congress to obtain certain information is moot in the constitution. How far executive privilege extends probably depends on how the SCOTUS would rule. My take is congress can get information from the executive branch concerning how a policy decision was reached or information relating to governing. That personal correspondences not dealing with the operation of government isn't. But not being a constitutional lawyer and almost always getting how the SCOTUS would rule wrong, I'm far from the best to figure something like this out.

Help or hurt Trump. That would depend on how Americans see impeachment. If they see impeachment by the house as a political vendetta against Trump, that would help him. If they see impeachment as justified, that would hurt him. Impeachment seems to be a partisan affair at this time. 65% of Democrats favor impeachment, 82% of Republicans oppose it. Independents, the less to non-partisan's, non-affiliated with either party, 28% are for impeachment, 45% oppose or are against impeachment of Trump. 27% are not sure, undecided or just don't give a dang. Question 29

https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/hash0nbry8/econTabReport.pdf

How an individual see the evidence as reasonable or not probably depends on their political views, pro or anti Trump or just don't care. Right now I think impeachment would backfire on the democrats. As long as more independents oppose impeachment than are for the impeachment of Trump by the Democratic controlled house would probably look more as a partisan political ploy and most likely help Trump's reelection bid. At least among independents.

I'd take a look at Question 33. The generic presidential vote, independents are tied 29-29 between the generic Democratic presidential candidate and Trump. 16% say it depends. Which I take it the it depends independent vote depends on who the Democrats nominate.

https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/m1n9ik6irs/econTabReport.pdf

If impeachment is seen as unjustified, perceived as a partisan political tactic, I'd imagine most of those 16% would flock to Trump. If seen as justified and warranted, they'd go Democratic. My two cents.

chuckiechan said:

He has a right that constitutional procedures be followed. Nadler has a “make believe” impeachment inquiry. He has no choice. He doesn’t have the votes for a real one so a fake one will have to do. Dumb people don’t care about that. As long as the I word is in there they feel like in their heads, momentum is building! Woooo....

I don’t think America is as pissed off as the people under your rock think they are.

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And somehow during your rant you refused to answer a single question that was posed.

independentusa said:

The first question concerns the Congressional subpoenas. 1 If the courts rule in favor of the House committees should Trump continue to refuse to give up the information? 2 Another question is how far Executive privilege extend? Trump is using it to cover everything including people who have never worked for the Administration. 3 If Trump is impeached by the House with seemingly reasonable amount of evidence but not found guilty in the Senate, will it help or hurt Trump?

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1 He should not. What our loose cannon of a president will do is another question.
2. Way, way too far already. The balance of powers outlined in the Constitution has been upset and needs to be restored ASAP.
3. I'm afraid it might help him get reelected, which is why impeachment is not a good idea. His base at least will chant slogans about how the Democrats were out to get him, but failed.

Dittohead not! said:

3. I'm afraid it might help him get reelected, which is why impeachment is not a good idea. His base at least will chant slogans about how the Democrats were out to get him, but failed.

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Yep, a failed impeachment will lend credence to the "witch hunt" narrative in the minds of his supporters.

Dittohead not! said:

1 He should not. What our loose cannon of a president will do is another question.
2. Way, way too far already. The balance of powers outlined in the Constitution has been upset and needs to be restored ASAP.
3. I'm afraid it might help him get reelected, which is why impeachment is not a good idea. His base at least will chant slogans about how the Democrats were out to get him, but failed.

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1. Agreed.
2. The executive has too much authority thanks to abdication from the house and senate, who only want one thing; re-election. I believe it was Gingrich who figured out do-nothing congress is good for the minority party.
3. I disagree. Clinton was impeached, and Bush was elected. Not sure how this was a loss. After Clinton's term Bush was installed and rammed through all sorts of stuff. If that's a loss, I'll take it.

lwf said:

Yep, a failed impeachment will lend credence to the "witch hunt" narrative in the minds of his supporters.

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Actually the impeachment would not fail. It would be the Senate who fails to convict and toss the president out that would lead to the GOPers ranting about failure. I hate to say it but this Senate that is controlled by the GOP is so totally cowed by Trump and his followers that they will never convict, no matter what the evidence. I believe that if Clinton had had all of the evidence we have against Trump, he would have been convicted and tossed out on his ear. With today's GOP there will never be enough evidence to get them to move against Trump. Even Trump's outing classified info to our enemies has not moved the GOP. They have only supported his right to do so showing absolutely no problem with his doings so and thus have approved him doing so in the future.

Obscurity said:

1. Agreed.
2. The executive has too much authority thanks to abdication from the house and senate, who only want one thing; re-election. I believe it was Gingrich who figured out do-nothing congress is good for the minority party.
3. I disagree. Clinton was impeached, and Bush was elected. Not sure how this was a loss. After Clinton's term Bush was installed and rammed through all sorts of stuff. If that's a loss, I'll take it.

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Clinton could not run again due to term limits. Whether he could have won had there not been term limits is a good question. He was and still is pretty popular despite (because of?) having been impeached.

But, Clinton didn't have a core of supporters who gave him the unconditional love that Trump gets from his.

independentusa said:

The first question concerns the Congressional subpoenas. If the courts rule in favor of the House committees should Trump continue to refuse to give up the information? Another question is how far Executive privilege extend? Trump is using it to cover everything including people who have never worked for the Administration. If Trump is impeached by the House with seemingly reasonable amount of evidence but not found guilty in the Senate, will it help or hurt Trump?

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Holder defied Congress and Obama covered for him. That is how politics work in the DC swamp.