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Lets talk about the third debate on Thursday

Craig234 said:
Oh, brother, drop the 'berniebros' crap.

I hate to say it, but your post reeks of 'Bernie derangement syndrome'. It's so bad, you need an honesty test - how about telling the fuller story of the F-35 vote?
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And here we go. :lol:

Do you need a reminder of all the toxicity from the more aggressive Sanders supporters in 2016? Or do you believe that Saint Bernard deserves immunity from scrutiny?
 
Cardinal said:
Joe Biden just has to keep appearing genial. Warren will always do well on policy questions and is most likely to continue gaining ground. Bernie will do well on policy questions too, but I'm not sure he'll be able to shake the angry old guy image (which is super unfair when you consider that his age makes him no worse than Biden and Trump), Harris has shown herself to be poor on policy and I'm not sure what she can do to catch up on that front. Pete Buttigieg will once again be the smartest guy in the room and there's room for him to grow. I can't see Yang making progress. Booker is fine but can't seem to control the stage and I'm not sure he can. O'Rourke went AWOL after 2018 and ceded the national focus to others, probably forever. Castro is fine but doesn't seem to have "it." Gabbard can go play in traffic. Klobuchar is...fine.

And there you have it.
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What's needed is for voters not to just put some policy positions side by side, and say 'who got some good zingers in the debate', but to recognize the overwhelming trend in our country we've seen 40 years to plutocracy and recognize Bernie is the only leader who really seems to get what's needed.

Having said that, Warren and Yang are vying for my #2. But we need to defeat Biden, with his low-information Obama lover support.
 
Craig234 said:
What's needed is for voters not to just put some policy positions side by side, and say 'who got some good zingers in the debate', but to recognize the overwhelming trend in our country we've seen 40 years to plutocracy and recognize Bernie is the only leader who really seems to get what's needed.
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:2funny:

You think a Socialist Jewish man whose tone-deafness is second only to Individual-1's is going to get anywhere near the presidency? You ever taken a peek inside that man's skeleton closet?!

Having said that, Warren and Yang are vying for my #2. But we need to defeat Biden, with his low-information Obama lover support.
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Great idea, try to win over Democrats by going after Obama supporters! :lamo
 
Craig234 said:
Oh, brother, drop the 'berniebros' crap.

I hate to say it, but your post reeks of 'Bernie derangement syndrome'. It's so bad, you need an honesty test - how about telling the fuller story of the F-35 vote?
Click to expand...

Phys251 said:
And here we go. :lol:

Do you need a reminder of all the toxicity from the more aggressive Sanders supporters in 2016? Or do you believe that Saint Bernard deserves immunity from scrutiny?
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:popcorn2:
 
Whomever "wins" we all lose from the vocalizing of idiotic ideas born from dysfunction. The earth, solar system and entire galaxy loses from the oxygen used to spew garbage.
 
BrotherFease said:
This Thursday, on ABC, will be the third Democrat presidential debate. Ten candidates will square off in a three-hour debate.

Who do you think will win the debate?

Who do you think will lose the debate, as in, lose ground?

Who do you think might sneak up into the Biden vs. Warren vs. Sanders competition?

Here are the polling results for the month of August. Keep in mind I am only using the Democrat-approved national polls:

1. Joe Biden - 29%
2. Elizabeth Warren - 17%
3. Bernie Sanders - 14%
4. Kamala Harris - 7%
5. Pete Buttigieg - 5%
6. Andrew Yang - 3%
7. Cory Booker & Beto O'Rourke - 2%
9. Julian Casto, Tulsi Gabbard & Amy Klobuchar -1%
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They only winners from this debate will be the people who don't what and find something productive or enjoyable to do with the three hours.
 
Phys251 said:
You think a Socialist Jewish man whose tone-deafness is second only to Individual-1's is going to get anywhere near the presidency? You ever taken a peek inside that man's skeleton closet?!
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Yes. Emptiest one around. He's not a 'socialist', he's a Democratic Socialist, he's not 'tone deaf', on and on you are screaming your Bernie Derangement and lack of honesty.

Great idea, try to win over Democrats by going after Obama supporters! :lamo
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You also lack reading comprehension.
 
Phys251 said:
And here we go. :lol:

Do you need a reminder of all the toxicity from the more aggressive Sanders supporters in 2016? Or do you believe that Saint Bernard deserves immunity from scrutiny?
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I don't need a reminder of toxicity with your post in front of me.

Bernie deserves scrutiny - not ignorant smears from people with Bernie Derangement like you.
 
Craig234 said:
Yes. Emptiest one around. He's not a 'socialist', he's a Democratic Socialist, he's not 'tone deaf', on and on you are screaming your Bernie Derangement and lack of honesty.
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Sanders maybe running a social democratic campaign, but Bernie Sanders is a socialist.



You also lack reading comprehension.
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Craig234 said:
I don't need a reminder of toxicity with your post in front of me.
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There it is. The exact toxicity that I talked about. Right on cue. :)

Bernie deserves scrutiny - not ignorant smears from people with Bernie Derangement like you.
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You think you are ready to have Saint Bernard scrutinized at all? :D I could mention just a couple examples of serious problems with that man, but you wouldn't listen, because evidence against Saint Bernard is seen as a threat to your reality and treated accordingly. That kind of defensiveness is no different than that of Trump supporters. None.
 
Few things annoyed me more in the last few years than hearing Bernie Bros - the ones who actually stayed home rather than support Hillary against someone as bad as Trump - whine about Trump.

Nah, man. That's not how it works. If you stand on principle, own the fallout. Otherwise you want to have your cake and eat it too.
 
Phys251 said:
Sanders maybe running a social democratic campaign, but Bernie Sanders is a socialist.
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I see Bernie saying a lot of truth in that video from frickin 35 years ago, but he did not say 'he's a socialist', and if you had any honesty, you'd stop posting the lie that he says he's a socialist now.

You think you are ready to have Saint Bernard scrutinized at all? :D I could mention just a couple examples of serious problems with that man, but you wouldn't listen, because evidence against Saint Bernard is seen as a threat to your reality and treated accordingly. That kind of defensiveness is no different than that of Trump supporters. None.
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Great case you made. Phony claims you could make a case are better than more lies, at least.
 
Mr Person said:
Few things annoyed me more in the last few years than hearing Bernie Bros - the ones who actually stayed home rather than support Hillary against someone as bad as Trump - whine about Trump.

Nah, man. That's not how it works. If you stand on principle, own the fallout. Otherwise you want to have your cake and eat it too.
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More Bernie supporters voted for Hillary - as Bernie STRONGLY pushed them to - than Hillary supporters voted for Obama in 2008, as she did not make nearly the effort for Obama that Bernie did for her.

And that's in SPITE of the fact of how many Bernie supporters would never vote for Hillary, because Bernie has a lot broader appeal to independents - he got 2 for every 1 Hillary got - and even people who would vote for Bernie over trump, but not Hillary. That's a strength of Bernie attracting those voters, which would help the Democrats win the presidency. You can call the few 'Bernie bros' who didn't vote for Hillary wrong - but don't falsify their numbers.
 
Craig234 said:
I see Bernie saying a lot of truth in that video from frickin 35 years ago, but he did not say 'he's a socialist', and if you had any honesty, you'd stop posting the lie that he says he's a socialist now.
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Clearly you did not pay attention to what he was saying. He was clearly enabling the brutal tyrant Fidel Castro, who oppressed his people for decades. You think we had people fleeing from Florida to Cuba? No-sir, it was the other way around.

He also boldly supported the socialist Sandinista National Liberation Front. Whatever advances in gender equality and whatnot they may have had were completely overshadowed by their brutal human rights abuses, particularly against indigenous people. Your boy Sanders conveniently left that part out.

Great case you made. Phony claims you could make a case are better than more lies, at least.
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Dismissing allegations of defensiveness with your own defensiveness is not the winning argument you obviously feel that it is. Try hard to understand why. Try very hard. ;)

Craig234 said:
More Bernie supporters voted for Hillary - as Bernie STRONGLY pushed them to - than Hillary supporters voted for Obama in 2008, as she did not make nearly the effort for Obama that Bernie did for her.
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Sanders's support for Hillary following the convention was pathetically weak compared to his divisive attacks against her. The Democrats have never had to deal with a primary candidate that was this divisive since Ted Kennedy. Yet this time, the nominated candidate got nearly three million more votes than her competitor in the general election.

And that's in SPITE of the fact of how many Bernie supporters would never vote for Hillary, because Bernie has a lot broader appeal to independents - he got 2 for every 1 Hillary got - and even people who would vote for Bernie over trump, but not Hillary. That's a strength of Bernie attracting those voters, which would help the Democrats win the presidency. You can call the few 'Bernie bros' who didn't vote for Hillary wrong - but don't falsify their numbers.
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Sanders lost the primary fair and square. Get over it already. He was the only guy in the field who passed the progressive purity test that year, and if he had run a better campaign, he might have earned himself the nomination. But he didn't. In particular, you know what demographic absolutely crushed him? Nonwhite voters over the age of 30, who overwhelmingly supported Hillary. He simply found no way to connect with them.
 
Mr Person said:
Few things annoyed me more in the last few years than hearing Bernie Bros - the ones who actually stayed home rather than support Hillary against someone as bad as Trump - whine about Trump.

Nah, man. That's not how it works. If you stand on principle, own the fallout. Otherwise you want to have your cake and eat it too.
Click to expand...

Craig234 said:
More Bernie supporters voted for Hillary - as Bernie STRONGLY pushed them to - than Hillary supporters voted for Obama in 2008, as she did not make nearly the effort for Obama that Bernie did for her.

And that's in SPITE of the fact of how many Bernie supporters would never vote for Hillary, because Bernie has a lot broader appeal to independents - he got 2 for every 1 Hillary got - and even people who would vote for Bernie over trump, but not Hillary. That's a strength of Bernie attracting those voters, which would help the Democrats win the presidency. You can call the few 'Bernie bros' who didn't vote for Hillary wrong - but don't falsify their numbers.
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"don't falsify their numbers"?

Eh? I didn't mention any numbers. My general point was about what genuinely standing on principle is and what standing on principle is not. I reached for Bernie supporters because (A) you guys made that the present subject, and (B) I myself had arguments with Bernie supporting friends who stayed home but then complained that Trump won.

What did they expect to happen? Hillary would win and that way they get a Dem president thus generally policies they prefer over Trump policies thanks to the people who did still go out for Hillary, but then also get to tell themselves they stood on principle and are therefore better in some sense than those who backed Hillary because she was not Trump. Nothing to do with specific numbers. It's a general comment using a more recent example. I could name others. But in general, I am tired of people acting like they stand on principle when they complain about the result, or perhaps if they only stand on principle when it doesn't cost them anything. If something is a true principle one holds, one stands on it despite painful results.
 
Phys251 said:
Clearly you did not pay attention to what he was saying. He was clearly enabling the brutal tyrant Fidel Castro, who oppressed his people for decades. You think we had people fleeing from Florida to Cuba? No-sir, it was the other way around.
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No, he was correcting lies about Castro. You're the one who did not pay attention to what he said. He's condemned Castro.

Sanders acknowledged that Cuba is undemocratic and authoritarian and expressed hope that the country would change. But "it would be wrong not to state in Cuba they have made some good advances in health care," he said.

"They are sending doctors all over the world. They have made some progress in education. I think by restoring full diplomatic relations with Cuba, it will result in significant improvements to the lives of Cubans and it will help the United States," Sanders said.
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Sanders responds to 1985 praise of Fidel Castro, Sandinistas - POLITICO

He also boldly supported the socialist Sandinista National Liberation Front. Whatever advances in gender equality and whatnot they may have had were completely overshadowed by their brutal human rights abuses, particularly against indigenous people. Your boy Sanders conveniently left that part out.
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Enough of your uninformed dishonesty.

Why Bernie Was Right to Oppose US Intervention in Central America

Sanders's support for Hillary following the convention was pathetically weak compared to his divisive attacks against her. The Democrats have never had to deal with a primary candidate that was this divisive since Ted Kennedy.
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I see you don't think that was enough uninformed dishonesty. Bernie's campaign was widely described as the most gentle primary campaign in memory, and that he campaigned harder for Hillary than anyone else.

Sanders lost the primary fair and square.
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My objection is not that he didn't, it's your dishonest smears. But since you bring it up, no, he did not lose fairly. Hillary bought the DNC - and got favors like having the number of debates slashed and put on the least-viewed nights, because she knew her advantage was the voters not knowing Bernie, and how they preferred him once they did.

You failed the honesty test on the F-35 issue by not taking it.
 
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Mr Person said:
"don't falsify their numbers"?

Eh? I didn't mention any numbers. My general point was about what genuinely standing on principle is and what standing on principle is not. I reached for Bernie supporters because (A) you guys made that the present subject, and (B) I myself had arguments with Bernie supporting friends who stayed home but then complained that Trump won.

What did they expect to happen? Hillary would win and that way they get a Dem president thus generally policies they prefer over Trump policies thanks to the people who did still go out for Hillary, but then also get to tell themselves they stood on principle and are therefore better in some sense than those who backed Hillary because she was not Trump. Nothing to do with specific numbers. It's a general comment using a more recent example. I could name others. But in general, I am tired of people acting like they stand on principle when they complain about the result, or perhaps if they only stand on principle when it doesn't cost them anything. If something is a true principle one holds, one stands on it despite painful results.
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To be clear, when I said that, I wasn't saying you had said something wrong, I was saying don't, as people who hate Bernie so often do - to criticize those people as I do, but don't exaggerate their numbers. Not saying you're one of those from your post.

I strongly supported Bernie and was yelling at those Bernie supporters to vote for Hillary - and most did, the estimate I've seen is 90%. I'm with you on criticizing your friends.
 
Craig234 said:
No, he was correcting lies about Castro. You're the one who did not pay attention to what he said. He's condemned Castro.
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You're not listening, and you're starting the gaslighting. Keep it up, you're on a roll! :thumbs:

Sanders responds to 1985 praise of Fidel Castro, Sandinistas - POLITICO

He also boldly supported the socialist Sandinista National Liberation Front. Whatever advances in gender equality and whatnot they may have had were completely overshadowed by their brutal human rights abuses, particularly against indigenous people. Your boy Sanders conveniently left that part out.
Click to expand...

Enough of your uninformed dishonesty.

Why Bernie Was Right to Oppose US Intervention in Central America
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Obviously you did not listen to the video where he clearly, clearly praised the socialists, which was the whole point of this thread. Are you going to need a timestamp for when he starts this comment? :lol:

I see you don't think that was enough uninformed dishonesty. Bernie's campaign was widely described as the most gentle primary campaign in memory, and that he campaigned harder for Hillary than anyone else.
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That laugh that starts at 51s. I literally just did that. Literally fell onto the floor and started laughing just that hysterically.

God DAMN, dude, that is some straight-up Trumpian level dishonesty right there! Holy ****, not even the most diehard BernieBros would EVER call that man's primary "gentle!" What's your excuse, that a ****ing bird landed on his podium and he gave it a sweet sendoff? :lamo

My objection is not that he didn't, it's your dishonest smears. But since you bring it up, no, he did not lose fairly. Hillary bought the DNC - and got favors like having the number of debates slashed and put on the least-viewed nights, because she knew her advantage was the voters not knowing Bernie, and how they preferred him once they did.
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Again you do not listen. Why is it that Sanders supporters NEVER account for their enormous lack of support by nonwhite voters over 30? :)
 
Mr Person said:
Few things annoyed me more in the last few years than hearing Bernie Bros - the ones who actually stayed home rather than support Hillary against someone as bad as Trump - whine about Trump.

Nah, man. That's not how it works. If you stand on principle, own the fallout. Otherwise you want to have your cake and eat it too.
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works better this way..."You can't eat your cake and have it, too." for the future

You can't have your cake and eat it - Wikipedia
 
Craig234 said:
Phys, you have Bernie Derangement Syndrome. You have been very dishonest.
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That's all you've got? :lamo

Craig, I shredded your pathetic argument piece-by-piece. Your comment about Sanders's supposed gentleness in his campaign is something that not even the most diehard BernieBro would ever say. Not even the most diehard BernieBro would claim that his campaign was anything less than a bulldozer to the Democratic party. That is why that quote now occupies my wall of shame. I wasn't kidding with that Walter White clip. That is how hard I laughed as I literally fell on the floor.

Furthermore, you stood by his defense of a literal socialist and a tyrant, and when I called you out on it, you ran away with your tail tucked between your legs. Who are you to even suggest that Fidel Castro was anything but a monster? Check yourself, and educate yourself. You obviously know nothing about that dictator.

Your behavior is a classic example of how the most diehard Sanders supporters choose to show just as much dishonesty as most Trump supporters. You guys are all-give-and-no-take. Y'all will slash and burn anyone that does not follow the religious principles of white progressivism, but the second anyone calls you out on anything on it, y'all throw an infantile temper tantrum. After all, you are just copying after your Personal Lord and Savior, Saint Bernard, who did that all the damn time in the 2016 primary. And you people still can't figure out how he didn't attract enough votes to win? Grow up. Bernard Sanders will never be President of the United States.
 
Phys251 said:
So Warren fails the progressive purity test?
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There is a lot of trolling her with this tact on twitter. Saying she is the exact opposite of what she is politically. Clear divide and conquer tactic by twitter trolls. Not saying craig is doing this but what you said is actually happening. I think russia is weighing in already.
 
Phys251 said:
And here we go. :lol:

Do you need a reminder of all the toxicity from the more aggressive Sanders supporters in 2016? Or do you believe that Saint Bernard deserves immunity from scrutiny?
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How you can have like Warren and have disdain for Bernie is insane. And how Craig can have disdain for Warren while liking Bernie is similarly ridiculous. They have the same ****ing policies. Stop shooting messengers and go for the policies you want. They both deliver. Be happy they both are top tier candidates saying damn near the same thing that you like. When one of them drops out, the other should get damn near all the other's voters... IF IT'S ABOUT POLICY. But you two are wrapped up in stupid personality conflicts instead. You two need to stop being so easily divided for ****'s sake.
 
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