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Thread: A basic political point to think about

  1. #31
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    Re: A basic political point to think about: representing all the people

    Quote Originally Posted by Obscurity View Post
    Yes, we forgot, you alone are the arbiter of morality and you alone can smear and generalize all you like.
    Another comprehension fail, I didn’t imply any such thing.

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    Re: A basic political point to think about: representing all the people

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpletruther View Post
    Another comprehension fail, I didn’t imply any such thing.
    Yawwwwwn.
    #BDS

    "There are two different types of people in the world, those who want to know, and those who want to believe." - Friedrich Nietzsche

  3. #33
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    Re: A basic political point to think about: representing all the people

    Quote Originally Posted by Checkerboard Strangler View Post
    The more I hear folks on the alt-Right screeching about how "The United States is not a democracy because democracy is mob rule"...the more I see ACTUAL MOB RULE working its magic in the alt-Right.
    They're projecting. They don't even understand that they're choosing to create a system in which only one 'side' that wins then is oppressive to the other - they think that's just how it works, largely I think because they're lied to so much that they are so horribly abused by Democrats, by things like having to sell cakes to gay couples or to hire black people fairly, much less affirmative action (which they'd call reverse discrimination).

  4. #34
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    Re: A basic political point to think about: representing all the people

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpletruther View Post
    Only by reading the worst into everything trump says can one think that.

    Trump is rude and boorish. And he attacks people who attack him childishly. But most all of the progressive claims that’s he hates groups and insults them is just political rhetoric.

    And besides, going after him, and treating home unrespectfully I get, he asks for it sometimes. But the vile way trump suppprters are being treated only solidifies the trump base and justify the worst instincts in their minds. “See how evil the other side is”
    I'm not sure who you are using the word 'childishly' about, hopefully trump. No, it's not "just political rhetoric". It's classic scapegoating, and actually harmful, and definitely promotes hate of groups - with plenty of evidence he agrees with the hate - and insults them.

    His main targets appear to be Muslims and non-white immigrants (legal or not). Your point about 'political rhetoric' applies more to people such as the leader of Denmark this week, when he was idiotically saying he wanted to 'buy Greenland', and she said the idea was absurd - which everyone but trump cultists was thinking - and he then attacked her as a "nasty" woman for saying the word absurd, and cancelled his visit to Denmark.

    It's bad enough, the promotion of hatred and insults to get political power. The words came out of his mouth, of thousands of examples, of "ban all Muslims" and "rapists and murderers" and conflating refugees with MS-13. But he goes further, causing a lot of harm. He always supports authoritarians harming and killing and torturing it seems, with rare exceptions of Iran and Venezuela, though he no doubt just wants different authoritarians loyal t him ovr those countries. He supports ending sanctions for harm; ending them especially against Russia, for things like their seizing of Crimea the rest of the world condemned, while trump wants to re-admit Russia to the G8 the world kicked them out of, as well as things like not taking any action against Saudi Arabia's leader for murdering a US resident.

    He intentionally causes suffering to refugees, claiming it's justified by trying to deter them, including permanently separating families intentionally to try to scare people from applying for asylum. He cancelled all aid to Honduras, which could help prevent some of the refugees, increasing the suffering of people there. He's causing great suffering with sanctions on places such as Iran and Venezuela. You don't hear a peep of support from him for democracy protesters globally.

  5. #35
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    Re: A basic political point to think about: representing all the people

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpletruther View Post
    And this is why things will not get better^
    trump beginning "his campaign insulting his way to the top. It's not progressive claims. He literally insults groups" isn't the problem, the problem is Obscurity criticizing his doing so, that's your argument?

    We rational folks understand there are ugly people on both sides, and do not punish the whole group for the sins of theirs.
    We're not talking about a few 'ugly people' at trump rallies yelling something hateful - we're talking about the president, their chosen leader, saying the hate speech, and the whole rallies cheering him. Remember when McCain had a supporter attack Obama as untrustable as an "Arab", and McCain defended Obama (albeit not Arabs), instead of leading chants of "lock him up"? 90% support of trump's hate speech is why there is 'group blame'.

    The left has a pretty large mob of crazies. But I do not randomly punish dems because of their crazies.
    The 'crazy' is trump, and the 'crazies' are the 90% of Republicans who support him without criticizing his hate speech, just as you falsely are denying it in this thread, just whitewashing it as 'political rhetoric' as if it's nothing that all politicians don't do.

    You guys are doing that, and the media winks at it.
    We're actually condemning the hate and the support of trump's hate speech, and the media is very correctly reporting that and editorializing against trump's wrongs. You act like a cult member in complaining about the criticism of him and people who support his wrongs - even if you admit he deserves some criticism, which is better than most of his followers.

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    Re: A basic political point to think about: representing all the people

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpletruther View Post
    Nay, you have your history wrong. I suggest you do some googling.
    No, actually, his history is right, and yours is wrong. For example, the ACA was delayed as Obama worked with Republicans who stalled things demanding a lot of changes for their support. The act was weakened with a lot of changes Republicans demanded; and then not one Republican voted for it and it passes without one vote to spare, before Republicans voted over 50 times to repeal it.

    And how trump like was that post, lol. Running off and not knowing the facts.
    Oh boy.

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    Re: A basic political point to think about: representing all the people

    Quote Originally Posted by Obscurity View Post
    This is a war.

    No. Middle. Ground.
    But let's not ignore the topic of this thread, that when Democrats win that war, they won't act like Republicans and treat half the country like enemies, instead of citizens they represent, even if they disagree with them on things like equal gay rights.

    You won't see Democrats trying to provide disaster relief only to Democratic states, for example, like trump has done and threatened to do. trump has also pushed programs to punish Democratic states economically just for politics.

  8. #38
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    Re: A basic political point to think about: representing all the people

    Quote Originally Posted by Obscurity View Post
    Spare us your inane nonsense. This all began with Newt Gingrich, Grove Nordquist, and the nihilistic autocrats of the old Virginia Libertarian school of racist sentiment and austerity for the rich. Newt himself is the father of modern day republicanism; rant and rave, shout and hollar, point fingers, blame the other, name call, throw ****, etc.

    Maybe if some of you right wingers had some sense you'd go back and WATCH how Newt and Grover degraded political commentary in endless, venomous, hate filled rants left and right all aimed at democrats.
    This sounds like you're making excuses for those politicians who rather cynically call tens of millions of Americans, "deplorable", "iredeemable" and "the dregs of society", then plan to rule over them as second-class citizens.
    Do not blame Newt for the new crop of Leftist Democrats calling all Trump supporters, "racists".
    They did not come by their pure, unfiltered disdain for the American people by way of ANY Republican.

  9. #39
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    Re: A basic political point to think about: representing all the people

    Quote Originally Posted by Craig234 View Post
    No, actually, his history is right, and yours is wrong. For example, the ACA was delayed as Obama worked with Republicans who stalled things demanding a lot of changes for their support. The act was weakened with a lot of changes Republicans demanded; and then not one Republican voted for it and it passes without one vote to spare, before Republicans voted over 50 times to repeal it.



    Oh boy.
    I suggest you hit google up again. Not a single republican voted yes, not in the house,or senate.

    Not
    A
    single
    One.

    And public opinion was agaisnt it st the time .


    Yes, I was dead on with my statement. It was rammed down our throats.

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    Re: A basic political point to think about: representing all the people

    Quote Originally Posted by Craig234 View Post
    trump beginning "his campaign insulting his way to the top. It's not progressive claims. He literally insults groups" isn't the problem, the problem is Obscurity criticizing his doing so, that's your argument?



    We're not talking about a few 'ugly people' at trump rallies yelling something hateful - we're talking about the president, their chosen leader, saying the hate speech, and the whole rallies cheering him. Remember when McCain had a supporter attack Obama as untrustable as an "Arab", and McCain defended Obama (albeit not Arabs), instead of leading chants of "lock him up"? 90% support of trump's hate speech is why there is 'group blame'.



    The 'crazy' is trump, and the 'crazies' are the 90% of Republicans who support him without criticizing his hate speech, just as you falsely are denying it in this thread, just whitewashing it as 'political rhetoric' as if it's nothing that all politicians don't do.



    We're actually condemning the hate and the support of trump's hate speech, and the media is very correctly reporting that and editorializing against trump's wrongs. You act like a cult member in complaining about the criticism of him and people who support his wrongs - even if you admit he deserves some criticism, which is better than most of his followers.
    Give you a couple of examples of him actually insulting groups.

    Crazy left wing politically correct rules don't count. They have t be actual insults to the group.

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