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Liberals want a recession

Dittohead not! said:
1. Agreed. So, what does the term 'leftist" mean to you? I see it thrown around a lot, but there is no generally agreed upon definition.

2. Yes, Trump supporters to like to ascribe low unemployment to Trump. When the stock market goes up, that's Trump's doing too. When it goes down, that's just an adjustment, or else it's the Democrats' fault. The fact is, the economy has been improving steadily since about 2009.

3. Trump is Trump. I don't think there ever has been an American president who is like Trump. Whatever his political philosophy is, it is not that of the former Republican Party.

4. Democrats are more like politicians in Europe, nothing like Karl Marx or Mussolini. That latter is more like Trump than any Democrat.
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1) Like you see right wing thrown around. There are political science definitions which no one uses. Republicans are more in the JS Mill, John Locke liberal tradition than Democrats.. It is pretty confusing. Extremists are extreme and both side disavow those closest. Fortunately, they small in number and influence.

2) You say that the economy keeps going up like that was nothing much. I give Obama credit for avoiding a recession in 2014, when there were lots of warnings signs and down quarter. That is probably where you should begin the count, though. There are a lot of things conservatives like--economy, jobs, federal bench, energy independence, progress on illegal immigration and Mexico paying for it, getting tough with Iran, improving relations with Israel, regulatory reform, tax reform. It is entirely fair to say he has won over a lot of doubters.

3) Trump has his uniqueness, but he is governing as a conservative, see prior list.

4) Mussolini had a superficial brashness that might resemble Trump, but it is superficial. Politically, Italy's fascists were more like Democrats--regulate, single payer, elitist.
 
Mycroft said:
Back in 2008...and for decades before that...the economy WAS controlled by Wall Street. That's why businesses and workers took a bath. That is changing under Trump. People saving for retirement, nowadays, would be better off putting cash in a mattress than entrusting it to the whims of Wall Street gamblers who are twitchy as hell and only care about their own bottom line.
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No answer- just how has tRump changed/is changing the basics in our economy??? (you make 11 years ago sound like sooo long ago.)

I asked YOU how are YOU planning for your retirement??? Oh how old are you anyways???? You sound incredibly young and ill informed.... :peace
 
notquiteright said:
No answer- just how has tRump changed/is changing the basics in our economy??? (you make 11 years ago sound like sooo long ago.)

I asked YOU how are YOU planning for your retirement??? Oh how old are you anyways???? You sound incredibly young and ill informed.... :peace
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Sorry, but I'm very selective about the personal information I reveal. My retirement is "nunya".

Now...regarding how Trump is changing the basics of our economy, there are many things he's doing but the most important thing is executive branch actions that stimulate US investment as opposed to globalist investment.

Here's what the Germans say...

“What I would wish for is more investments by the private sector,” Scholz said, pointing to a much higher willingness of companies and investors in the United States to put fresh money into new projects or business ideas.

Germany's Scholz: Don't expect higher interest rates for years - Reuters
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To put a finer point on it...

In the big picture President Donald Trump has purposefully stalled the process of supply chain globalization and cheap labor evaluation. Trump is resetting global manufacturing supply chains, with U.S. incentives for relocation. This is bringing wealth and jobs back into the United States (and North America).

In essence Titan Trump is engaged in a process of: (a) repatriating wealth (trade policy); (b) blocking exfiltration of wealth (main street policy); (c) creating new and modern economic alliances based on reciprocity (bilateral deals); and (d) dismantling the post WWII Marshall plan of global trade and one-way tariffs (de-globalization).

Politics to Support Wall Street Multinationals – Democrats Plan to Block Trump Trade Reset… | The Last Refuge
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Mycroft said:
Sorry, but I'm very selective about the personal information I reveal. My retirement is "nunya". Now...regarding how Trump is changing the basics of our economy, there are many things he's doing but the most important thing is executive branch actions that stimulate US investment as opposed to globalist investment. Here's what the Germans say... To put a finer point on it...
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You are very young.... you have no retirement and are way too young to even think of such a thing.

Just how does one invest in US ideas and innovations??? You buy stock in that company.... ummm how do you think we invest in any company/corporation??? You walk into corporate HQ and write a check???? :confused:

While tRump rants a good game in front of his useful idiots, fact is he hasn't changed the equation a nit. (FYI our latest Republican't meltdown was a financial sector melt down the end stage was FORGIEN money pouring into bundled mortgages. The reverse of your 'great success' story, we attract overseas money into our financial markets while pouring out cash for cheap Chinese goods)

He announces 'major' domestic investments by corporations and sits REAL STILL as the same corporations lay-off people or push work overseas... :doh

Face it tRump has changed nothing but the level of hate.... :peace
 
notquiteright said:
You are very young.... you have no retirement and are way too young to even think of such a thing.
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I have two combat tours in Vietnam under my belt...just saying...

Just how does one invest in US ideas and innovations??? You buy stock in that company.... ummm how do you think we invest in any company/corporation??? You walk into corporate HQ and write a check???? :confused:
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Not all US businesses have stock that is traded on Wall Street.

~snipped the nonsense~
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Mycroft said:
I have two combat tours in Vietnam under my belt...just saying... Not all US businesses have stock that is traded on Wall Street.
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So you hold no stocks? Just VA and SS retirement? Never worked for a major company 'on Main Street'???? No 401 (K)???? Just a lumpy mattress with a few VA checks under it????

Love how you ignore the dismissal of the tRump lies and give some vague answer about a few companies not traded on Wall Street (how did you invest in them?)

Fact is tRump hasn't changed anything, we rely on the Stock Market as much today as we did a decade ago. Another FYI- many 'main street' businesses rely on the financial sector not only for business loans but the financial sector workers spending some of their money in their businesses.... trickle down seems to work harder/faster/deeper on the way down rather than lifting anyone up...

But do go on.... :peace
 
notquiteright said:
So you hold no stocks? Just VA and SS retirement? Never worked for a major company 'on Main Street'???? No 401 (K)???? Just a lumpy mattress with a few VA checks under it????
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What part of "nunya" do you not understand.

Give it a rest. You are wasting your time. (and mine)

Love how you ignore the dismissal of the tRump lies
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Likewise.

I gave you information about Trump's actions, as well as the reaction by others...and you ignored the information and repeat your blathering.

~snipped your repeated blather~
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Mycroft said:
What part of "nunya" do you not understand. Give it a rest. You are wasting your time. (and mine) Likewise. I gave you information about Trump's actions, as well as the reaction by others...and you ignored the information and repeat your blathering.
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Oh I think your retirement plan gives great insight to your opinion.... looks like you use VA and SS accounts- (you give no insight into how to 'safely' invest in domestic companies)

Actually you cited a vague propaganda speech (from a right wing site the Nut Tree) on the meaningless tRump 'actions'- while he rants, corporations are continuing to 'invest' overseas and cut jobs here.... :roll:

The German isn't quoting tRump but rather what 'Merica has been doing since Obama.... :doh
 
notquiteright said:
Oh I think your retirement plan gives great insight to your opinion.... looks like you use VA and SS accounts- (you give no insight into how to 'safely' invest in domestic companies)

Actually you cited a vague propaganda speech (from a right wing site the Nut Tree) on the meaningless tRump 'actions'- while he rants, corporations are continuing to 'invest' overseas and cut jobs here.... :roll:

The German isn't quoting tRump but rather what 'Merica has been doing since Obama.... :doh
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The German is talking about what's happening in America now. Obama has nothing to do with it.
 
Jay59 said:
1) Like you see right wing thrown around. There are political science definitions which no one uses. Republicans are more in the JS Mill, John Locke liberal tradition than Democrats.. It is pretty confusing. Extremists are extreme and both side disavow those closest. Fortunately, they small in number and influence.

2) You say that the economy keeps going up like that was nothing much. I give Obama credit for avoiding a recession in 2014, when there were lots of warnings signs and down quarter. That is probably where you should begin the count, though. There are a lot of things conservatives like--economy, jobs, federal bench, energy independence, progress on illegal immigration and Mexico paying for it, getting tough with Iran, improving relations with Israel, regulatory reform, tax reform. It is entirely fair to say he has won over a lot of doubters.

3) Trump has his uniqueness, but he is governing as a conservative, see prior list.

4) Mussolini had a superficial brashness that might resemble Trump, but it is superficial. Politically, Italy's fascists were more like Democrats--regulate, single payer, elitist.
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1 Agreed. In general, political terms have lost their meanings, and while there are few extremists, their voices seem to be louder than those of most of us.

2. No, it isn't "nothing much," it's quite important. Low unemployment is a great indication of progress, as is energy independence. The thing is, none of that happened suddenly when Trump was inaugurated. It started when the country began to heal from the recession.
Getting "tough" with Iran, pulling out of the nuclear deal, was a stupid mistake. We can only hope that it won't lead to another Iraq style undeclared war, but it well might. We came very close when Iran shot down the drone.
Trump has been attempting to do something about illegal immigration, I'll give you that, but the results of his attempts are far from positive.

3. "Conservative" is one of those political terms that has lost its meaning. The classic definition would be someone who wants to keep the status quo, as opposed to a progressive who wants to change things, supposedly for the better. Given that definition, Trump is certainly not a conservative.

4. Trump loves dictators and would like to have the same power that Putin and Kim jung Un enjoy, and that Mussolini once enjoyed. He would, without opposition from Democrats and that pesky Constitution, make the trains run on time.
 
Dittohead not! said:
1 Agreed. In general, political terms have lost their meanings, and while there are few extremists, their voices seem to be louder than those of most of us.

2. No, it isn't "nothing much," it's quite important. Low unemployment is a great indication of progress, as is energy independence. The thing is, none of that happened suddenly when Trump was inaugurated. It started when the country began to heal from the recession.
Getting "tough" with Iran, pulling out of the nuclear deal, was a stupid mistake. We can only hope that it won't lead to another Iraq style undeclared war, but it well might. We came very close when Iran shot down the drone.
Trump has been attempting to do something about illegal immigration, I'll give you that, but the results of his attempts are far from positive.

3. "Conservative" is one of those political terms that has lost its meaning. The classic definition would be someone who wants to keep the status quo, as opposed to a progressive who wants to change things, supposedly for the better. Given that definition, Trump is certainly not a conservative.

4. Trump loves dictators and would like to have the same power that Putin and Kim jung Un enjoy, and that Mussolini once enjoyed. He would, without opposition from Democrats and that pesky Constitution, make the trains run on time.
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I can agree with most of this except #4. Diplomacy means you have to make nice with everyone and Trump has proven a very adept diplomat. His domestic actions have been to curtail the reach of government.

If you mean conservative in the traditional understanding, you go back to Barry Goldwater. From his book

“The root difference between the Conservatives and the Liberals of today is that Conservatives take into account of the whole man, while Liberals tend to look only at the material side of man’s nature. The Conservative believes that man is in part, an economic, an animal creature; but he is also a spiritual creature with spiritual needs and spiritual desires. Conservatism therefore looks upon the enhancement of man’s spiritual nature as the primary concern of political philosophy.​

That shape is still recognizable, even with 50 years of change.
 
Jay59 said:
1 I can agree with most of this except #4. Diplomacy means you have to make nice with everyone and Trump has proven a very adept diplomat. His domestic actions have been to curtail the reach of government.

If you mean conservative in the traditional understanding, you go back to Barry Goldwater. From his book

2
“The root difference between the Conservatives and the Liberals of today is that Conservatives take into account of the whole man, while Liberals tend to look only at the material side of man’s nature. The Conservative believes that man is in part, an economic, an animal creature; but he is also a spiritual creature with spiritual needs and spiritual desires. Conservatism therefore looks upon the enhancement of man’s spiritual nature as the primary concern of political philosophy.​

That shape is still recognizable, even with 50 years of change.
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1 Trump is good at making nice with Kim Jung Un and Vladimir Putin, but not so much with the leaders of our actual allies, with the possible exception of Israel. He believes Putin over US intelligence on the issue of Russian interference in the election. He believes Kim that he will "do the right thing," even as Kim continues to test missiles. Yet, he doesn't trust Justin Trudeau.

2. That shape was still barely recognizable up to the election of Trump. There is nothing "spiritual" about the man at all.
 
Dittohead not! said:
1 Trump is good at making nice with Kim Jung Un and Vladimir Putin, but not so much with the leaders of our actual allies, with the possible exception of Israel. He believes Putin over US intelligence on the issue of Russian interference in the election. He believes Kim that he will "do the right thing," even as Kim continues to test missiles. Yet, he doesn't trust Justin Trudeau.

2. That shape was still barely recognizable up to the election of Trump. There is nothing "spiritual" about the man at all.
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1) You say that like it's a bad thing. It's not.

2)Sure there is. Hatred blinds people so they don't see it.
 
Jay59 said:
1) You say that like it's a bad thing. It's not.

2)Sure there is. Hatred blinds people so they don't see it.
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1. I can't buy that believing the dictator of a hostile nation over our own intelligence is a good thing.

2. Trump is a totally amoral man who will do or say anything for power. The only way anyone ascribes "spirituality" to him is that he opposes gay rights and a woman's right to choose. That's what has the evangelicals supporting him.
 
Dittohead not! said:
1. I can't buy that believing the dictator of a hostile nation over our own intelligence is a good thing.

2. Trump is a totally amoral man who will do or say anything for power. The only way anyone ascribes "spirituality" to him is that he opposes gay rights and a woman's right to choose. That's what has the evangelicals supporting him.
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When I said hatred, I was not talking of you specifically. But, since you insist...
 
Jay59 said:
When I said hatred, I was not talking of you specifically. But, since you insist...
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I'm not sure just what is meant by that. You have no reason to hate me, and I don't hate Donald Trump. That would be like hating a toddler who was playing with a loaded gun. I hate the fact that he has been given great power that he doesn't know how to handle, but I hold no rancor to Trump. That he is a totally amoral man who believes a foreign dictator over his own intelligence organizations is more of a reason to pity him than to hate him. I just wish he was still on reality TV where he can do little damage.
 
Dittohead not! said:
I'm not sure just what is meant by that. You have no reason to hate me, and I don't hate Donald Trump. That would be like hating a toddler who was playing with a loaded gun. I hate the fact that he has been given great power that he doesn't know how to handle, but I hold no rancor to Trump. That he is a totally amoral man who believes a foreign dictator over his own intelligence organizations is more of a reason to pity him than to hate him. I just wish he was still on reality TV where he can do little damage.
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I didn't say I hated you and I don't.

I said you volunteered as the example of hatred of Donald Trump, which has blinded you to what is really going on with the Trump administration.
 
Jay59 said:
I didn't say I hated you and I don't.

I said you volunteered as the example of hatred of Donald Trump, which has blinded you to what is really going on with the Trump administration.
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Understood.

And I explained how I really feel about Trump. I don't hate the guy. I really don't hate anyone.
 
Outlook said:
Are the liberals so scared that Trump is going to be re-elected, they want to see the US economy to collapse?
No media bias here, but NBC reporter Richard Engel and idiot Bill Maher want people to loss their jobs and have businesses close if it defeats Trump. They don’t care, they make millions a year.
These two idiots on Friday said they hoped an economic recession would happen in the US so Trump would not be re-elected.
Instead of wishing for a recession try going to the ballet box and vote him out of power if he is so horrible.
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Trump supporters want to see all American citizens who aren't white deported to their countries of origin. This statement is as ridiculous as yours.
 
lurchadams said:
Trump supporters want to see all American citizens who aren't white deported to their countries of origin. This statement is as ridiculous as yours.
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Republicans in Congress actively and proudly worked against Obama’s economy for 8 years. It took Trump to finish that.
 
Jay59 said:
I saw that. It was not very believable.
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Republicans did not want a recovery during Obama. That is settled history, through their actions in Congress and their words on right-wing media.
 
Linc said:
Republicans did not want a recovery during Obama. That is settled history, through their actions in Congress and their words on right-wing media.
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Obama did not do badly with the economy. He was handed a huge advantage by starting at the very bottom, but he did not squander it in eight years. That alone is impressive.There was reason to expect a recession in 2014-2015 but one never materialized.

That said, I count the recovery from the down quarter in 2014, rather than 2009 as most do. By that standard, the recovery is not that old in 2019. Obama's slow and steady approach avoided a recession, but Trump promptly doubled his per quarter growth rates. Which do you choose for the long term? I see arguments both ways.
 
Yes, some Dems want a recession if it will help defeat President Trump.


In fact, a FEW Dems want certain recent bad incidents to happen again in order to achieve the goal of overthrowing the President, their hatred for him being so irrational.
 
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Liberals want a recession
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Or Republicans ignore that one is coming?
 
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