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Does Trump lie from ignorance or on purpose for effect?

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independentusa

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I always thought it was both. Sometimes it seems he lies from ignorance. A good example is that he took credit for passing a Vet's bill that had been passed under and signed by Obama. The thing is he did sign a bill helping Vets, but not the one he was bragging about passing, so it could have been out of ignorance. Since Trump seems to have no desire to get into the minutia of the bills that he signs, he might just have gotten it wrong. An out and out lie with no basis in realty that Trump told was that California admitted there were over a million illegal votes in that state in 2016 or that his father was born in Germany. I mean you would know that your father was born in the US wouldn't you? They say they have counted over 12,000 lies told by Trump since he came into office. I wonder if anyone has tried to decide which are out of ignorance and which are on purpose. What do you think?
 
Trump lies on purpose, on accident, by omission and in every other conceivable method/manner. He is dishonest all the way to his fudge and hate filled core.
 
independentusa said:
I always thought it was both. Sometimes it seems he lies from ignorance. A good example is that he took credit for passing a Vet's bill that had been passed under and signed by Obama. The thing is he did sign a bill helping Vets, but not the one he was bragging about passing, so it could have been out of ignorance. Since Trump seems to have no desire to get into the minutia of the bills that he signs, he might just have gotten it wrong. An out and out lie with no basis in realty that Trump told was that California admitted there were over a million illegal votes in that state in 2016 or that his father was born in Germany. I mean you would know that your father was born in the US wouldn't you? They say they have counted over 12,000 lies told by Trump since he came into office. I wonder if anyone has tried to decide which are out of ignorance and which are on purpose. What do you think?
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I think it's mostly out of ignorance. Mostly it's sheer b.s.ing because he can't be bothered to think about anything.

When he thinks, it's usually about himself and the way people have wronged him. When he's talking about almost anything else, he's usually not thinking. He's just babbling.


But it's still "dishonesty" because there comes a point when someone has to take responsibility for not bothering to learn fact from fiction before running off at the mouth, and Trump is long past that point.
 
I wonder if trump has any idea of why he lies all the time?
 
independentusa said:
I always thought it was both. Sometimes it seems he lies from ignorance. A good example is that he took credit for passing a Vet's bill that had been passed under and signed by Obama. The thing is he did sign a bill helping Vets, but not the one he was bragging about passing, so it could have been out of ignorance. Since Trump seems to have no desire to get into the minutia of the bills that he signs, he might just have gotten it wrong. An out and out lie with no basis in realty that Trump told was that California admitted there were over a million illegal votes in that state in 2016 or that his father was born in Germany. I mean you would know that your father was born in the US wouldn't you? They say they have counted over 12,000 lies told by Trump since he came into office. I wonder if anyone has tried to decide which are out of ignorance and which are on purpose. What do you think?
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The VA Mission Act extended Veterans choice by a year so they could work out the kinks so it is really is a matter of how anal one wants to be about the details.

Trump is a horrible speaker who is perpetually loose with facts and reality, but I am not sure these sorts of things matter to anyone but the democratic base.
 
Both.
 
I'm going mostly with because telling lies makes him seem to be more involved or in charge. Much like when Joe Biden claimed to have talked with those Parkland HS kids while he was VP. It served no purpose to lie about that except to try to show how "in touch with the folks" he was when, once exposed as a lie, it should have done the opposite.
 
Trump is a pathological liar. He can't help it. It is more than just another lying politician, it is who he is. Combined with his inheritance it is the basis of his whole career. Had he not been born rich he'd be a two-bit conman and probably a convicted felon.

Defining characteristics of pathological lying include

- An internal motive for the behavior can be discerned clinically: e.g., long-lasting extortion or habitual spousal battery might cause a person to lie repeatedly, without the lying being a pathological symptom.[2]
- The stories told tend toward presenting the liar favorably. The liar "decorates their own person"[3] by telling stories that present them as the hero or the victim. For example, the person might be presented as being fantastically brave, as knowing or being related to many famous people, or as having great power, position, or wealth.
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Because I'm you know like a smart person
 
If you need a good laugh just read through threads like this one... What a hoot!

Over 12,000 lies..... Who is they? The MSM who attacks Trump everyday since he was elected.
They don't want him in office and they spin and jive stories about him 7/24!
CNN, MSNBC, NYT and the Washington post are totally and completely opposed to the president.
I wonder who is counting their lies about Trump?
 
Common Sense 1 said:
If you need a good laugh just read through threads like this one... What a hoot!

Over 12,000 lies..... Who is they? The MSM who attacks Trump everyday since he was elected.
They don't want him in office and they spin and jive stories about him 7/24!
CNN, MSNBC, NYT and the Washington post are totally and completely opposed to the president.
I wonder who is counting their lies about Trump?
Click to expand...

So go through and show us which ones are not lies according to you. Oh wait, your MO is just to outright dismiss anything because you are a Trump worshiper.
 
independentusa said:
I always thought it was both...
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No one cares. Let me tell you why.

Normal everyday decent Americans really care about a handful of things. 1) Feeding their family. 2) Clothing their family. 3) Keeping a roof over their family. 4) Put some $ back in savings. 5) Treating themselves to some kind of entertainment. Dining out, family getaway, a ball game, etc. 6) Health insurance.

Not necessarily in that order, but you get the idea.

Now, anything gov't does to facilitate those things, is a plus. For example...keeping taxes low, less regulations that keep cost low.

Normal everyday Americans also realize that gov't officials tell tall tales. And, most of those tales are misinterpreted by the MSM and then fed, of course, to everyday Americans to sway opinions. Again, no one cares.

DJT can claim he went to Mars. No one cares. Why? Because of 1-6 above.

It happens no matter who's in office. They all lie to agree. It's called life. People focus on those things that matter, their lives and the lives of their families.

When you all grow up and have a family of your own, you will realize how ridiculous you have acted.
 
DamnYankee said:
No one cares. Let me tell you why.

Normal everyday decent Americans really care about a handful of things. 1) Feeding their family. 2) Clothing their family. 3) Keeping a roof over their family. 4) Put some $ back in savings. 5) Treating themselves to some kind of entertainment. Dining out, family getaway, a ball game, etc. 6) Health insurance.

Not necessarily in that order, but you get the idea.

Now, anything gov't does to facilitate those things, is a plus. For example...keeping taxes low, less regulations that keep cost low.

Normal everyday Americans also realize that gov't officials tell tall tales. And, most of those tales are misinterpreted by the MSM and then fed, of course, to everyday Americans to sway opinions. Again, no one cares.

DJT can claim he went to Mars. No one cares. Why? Because of 1-6 above.

It happens no matter who's in office. They all lie to agree. It's called life. People focus on those things that matter, their lives and the lives of their families.

When you all grow up and have a family of your own, you will realize how ridiculous you have acted.
Click to expand...

How are “tall tales” “misinterpreted?”
 
Trump seems to lie out of ignorance, lack of control (compulsive liar), and out of being a manipulative conman. If a lie suits his agenda and excites his audience, he has no conscience against using it, and elaborating on it.
 
independentusa said:
I always thought it was both. Sometimes it seems he lies from ignorance. A good example is that he took credit for passing a Vet's bill that had been passed under and signed by Obama. The thing is he did sign a bill helping Vets, but not the one he was bragging about passing, so it could have been out of ignorance. Since Trump seems to have no desire to get into the minutia of the bills that he signs, he might just have gotten it wrong. An out and out lie with no basis in realty that Trump told was that California admitted there were over a million illegal votes in that state in 2016 or that his father was born in Germany. I mean you would know that your father was born in the US wouldn't you? They say they have counted over 12,000 lies told by Trump since he came into office. I wonder if anyone has tried to decide which are out of ignorance and which are on purpose. What do you think?
Click to expand...

As I've always said, the only time trump tells the truth is by accident.

At times he may be aware he is lying the sad thing is he does not care, it seems like he truly believes that if he says it it instantly becomes fact, at least in his head...
 
Old 'N Chill said:
Trump seems to lie out of ignorance, lack of control (compulsive liar), and out of being a manipulative conman. If a lie suits his agenda and excites his audience, he has no conscience against using it, and elaborating on it.
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Oh, you mean like every other politician, the Main Stream Media, special interest groups, salesmen, stock brokers, CEO's, actors, street hustlers, etc.?

The problem as I see it is trying to discern malicious, intentional lies and their purposes from those that are simple exaggeration, puffery, a misunderstanding, based on ignorance, an honest belief...even a desire to help or protect.

IMO Trump's statements are based on his history of salesmanship. He has learned to use puffery and exaggeration in all his business dealings. So I see the vast majority of those alleged lies in the ongoing count as just that...him making himself out to be larger, more effective, more successful in order to sell his programs. I also agree that he doesn't do much research, but is "prompted" by his advisors. Many CEO's tend to this, i.e. depending on "experts" they trust to tell them what is what. Sometimes the "experts" get it wrong.

I don't see them as malicious or intentionally misleading. That's the difference.
 
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Captain Adverse said:
Oh, you mean like every other politician, the Main Stream Media, special interest groups, salesmen, stock brokers, CEO's, actors, street hustlers, etc.?

The problem as I see it is trying to discern malicious, intentional lies and their purposes from those that are simple exaggeration, puffery, a misunderstanding, based on ignorance, an honest belief...even a desire to help or protect.

IMO Trump's statements are based on his history of salesmanship. He has learned to use puffery and exaggeration in all his business dealings. So I see the vast majority of those alleged lies in the ongoing count as just that...him making himself out to be larger, more effective, more successful in order to sell his programs. I also agree that he doesn't do much research, but is "prompted" by his advisors. Many CEO's tend to this, i.e. depending on "experts" they trust to tell them what is what. Sometimes the "experts" get it wrong.

I don't see them as malicious or intentionally misleading. That's the difference.
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Nice dance moves ya got there. At least you did not try claiming he does not lie, there may be hope for you after all.
 
He loves watching you guys' connitions, sputtering, tongue-twisted outrage and general lunacy.
 
Casper said:
Nice dance moves ya got there. At least you did not try claiming he does not lie, there may be hope for you after all.
Click to expand...

Why would I deny what is a characteristic of us ALL?

EVERYONE lies from time to time for the exact same reasons I posted, and more.

Or are you claiming some special characteristic of absolute honesty? If so I greet you as clearly the prophesized Second Coming; and I guess I should start counting down to Armageddon. :coffeepap:
 
Common Sense 1 said:
If you need a good laugh just read through threads like this one... What a hoot!

Over 12,000 lies..... Who is they? The MSM who attacks Trump everyday since he was elected.
They don't want him in office and they spin and jive stories about him 7/24!
CNN, MSNBC, NYT and the Washington post are totally and completely opposed to the president.
I wonder who is counting their lies about Trump?
Click to expand...

I know, huh?
The lying resistors who by all means necessary, and whatever it takes, calling out the president.
You can't make this stuff up. ;)
 
Captain Adverse said:
Oh, you mean like every other politician, the Main Stream Media, special interest groups, salesmen, stock brokers, CEO's, actors, street hustlers, etc.?

The problem as I see it is trying to discern malicious, intentional lies and their purposes from those that are simple exaggeration, puffery, a misunderstanding, based on ignorance, an honest belief...even a desire to help or protect.

IMO Trump's statements are based on his history of salesmanship. He has learned to use puffery and exaggeration in all his business dealings. So I see the vast majority of those alleged lies in the ongoing count as just that...him making himself out to be larger, more effective, more successful in order to sell his programs. I also agree that he doesn't do much research, but is "prompted" by his advisors. Many CEO's tend to this, i.e. depending on "experts" they trust to tell them what is what. Sometimes the "experts" get it wrong.

I don't see them as malicious or intentionally misleading. That's the difference.
Click to expand...

Very well said.
Plus, he has a huge ego which adds to the reason he is prone to boast and exaggerate. Some of his character flaws are the reason he has been so successful selling his brand. He loves the laughs he gets while using hyperbole at his rallies but what politician doesn't?
 
independentusa said:
I always thought it was both. Sometimes it seems he lies from ignorance. A good example is that he took credit for passing a Vet's bill that had been passed under and signed by Obama. The thing is he did sign a bill helping Vets, but not the one he was bragging about passing, so it could have been out of ignorance. Since Trump seems to have no desire to get into the minutia of the bills that he signs, he might just have gotten it wrong. An out and out lie with no basis in realty that Trump told was that California admitted there were over a million illegal votes in that state in 2016 or that his father was born in Germany. I mean you would know that your father was born in the US wouldn't you? They say they have counted over 12,000 lies told by Trump since he came into office. I wonder if anyone has tried to decide which are out of ignorance and which are on purpose. What do you think?
Click to expand...

He’s created a reality show presidency. It’s all for the show. He’s using the voters and using social media and Fox to do it. And Trump supporters are too stupid to see it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Bullseye said:
He loves watching you guys' connitions, sputtering, tongue-twisted outrage and general lunacy.
Click to expand...

There's that too! He sets his worst critics, especially the leftist media (who sold out for their politics long ago), up for the fall every time.
 
Captain Adverse said:
Why would I deny what is a characteristic of us ALL?

EVERYONE lies from time to time for the exact same reasons I posted, and more.

Or are you claiming some special characteristic of absolute honesty? If so I greet you as clearly the prophesized Second Coming; and I guess I should start counting down to Armageddon. :coffeepap:
Click to expand...

Some lie far more often than the average, we both know a pathological liar when we see them.
We best prepare for the coming storm, to do otherwise is not logical.
 
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