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No, we are not number one

Good4Nothin

Good4Nothin

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We keep hearing that the US is, by far, the world leader in mass shootings. And of course this is blamed on the NRA and the Republicans. And of course all we have to do to solve the problem is make it harder to buy guns.

However this is a fake fact. The US is not the world leader in mass shootings. Finland, France and Belgium are ahead of us, and we are not even in the top 10.

I am not a fanatic about guns, and I don't own any guns, and I think there should be restrictions on buying them. But I don't like the way progressives just swallow this kind of fake fact, without ever checking.

They want simple answers and they want a villain to blame. Too bad, there is no simple way to stop mass shootings. If guns were made completely illegal, mass killers would still find ways to make their weapons.

So we have the country angrily divided between gun-lovers and gun-haters. And in reality, it doesn't matter very much. The gun debate is distracting us from trying to figure out the real motivations of mass killers.
 
Source for us to evaluate?
 
Good4Nothin said:
We keep hearing that the US is, by far, the world leader in mass shootings. And of course this is blamed on the NRA and the Republicans. And of course all we have to do to solve the problem is make it harder to buy guns.

However this is a fake fact. The US is not the world leader in mass shootings. Finland, France and Belgium are ahead of us, and we are not even in the top 10.

I am not a fanatic about guns, and I don't own any guns, and I think there should be restrictions on buying them. But I don't like the way progressives just swallow this kind of fake fact, without ever checking.

They want simple answers and they want a villain to blame. Too bad, there is no simple way to stop mass shootings. If guns were made completely illegal, mass killers would still find ways to make their weapons.

So we have the country angrily divided between gun-lovers and gun-haters. And in reality, it doesn't matter very much. The gun debate is distracting us from trying to figure out the real motivations of mass killers.
Click to expand...

Yes, if you measure deaths from mass shootings per capita, from 2009-2015. But obviously comparing small countries where such events are statistically unlikely to large countries where such events happen frequently is a flawed comparison. Belgium had 10 people die in two mass shootings over that time period, which in a country of 11 million, gives a higher rate than the US.

If you compare from 2016-2019, Belgium had no deaths from mass shootings, the US had 444.
 
Good4Nothin said:
We keep hearing that the US is, by far, the world leader in mass shootings. And of course this is blamed on the NRA and the Republicans. And of course all we have to do to solve the problem is make it harder to buy guns.

However this is a fake fact. The US is not the world leader in mass shootings. Finland, France and Belgium are ahead of us, and we are not even in the top 10.

I am not a fanatic about guns, and I don't own any guns, and I think there should be restrictions on buying them. But I don't like the way progressives just swallow this kind of fake fact, without ever checking.

They want simple answers and they want a villain to blame. Too bad, there is no simple way to stop mass shootings. If guns were made completely illegal, mass killers would still find ways to make their weapons.

So we have the country angrily divided between gun-lovers and gun-haters. And in reality, it doesn't matter very much. The gun debate is distracting us from trying to figure out the real motivations of mass killers.
Click to expand...

Actually, I don't think Democrats hate guns. Many of them have guns or have body guards that have guns. What progressives are doing is using these unfortunate killings for political purposes because they know their socialist programs are dead on arrival and they won't even win their elections. So, they pander to the liberal crybabies hoping there is enough of them to win elections.

The motivations are different for each circumstance. Some are because they got fired and they were unable to deal with it and /or also were sociopaths. Some are over being rejected by a spouse or boyfriend/girlfriend. Some are just tired of being alive and commit suicide by killing as many as they can before they are killed but still sociopaths. Some are like the El Paso killer who hated Hispanics and was mad that mankind pollutes the earth. So, as a sociopath, he killed people to either show people it can be done or to start it off. Or, the Canton killer was simply a sociopath who wanted to die and kill anyone including his own sister. I'm pretty sure that the common thread is they are all sociopaths. See, 99% of sociopaths never commit crimes like this. But, there are those that are triggered by something and they decide to kill people. Mostly it's done with guns. But, the Oklahoma bomber, Timothy McVey, used a huge bomb to kill 187 people. And, that was when Clinton was President. So, was Clinton a racist too?
 
uptower said:
Times two. We need citation for that.
Click to expand...

And, this is the real problem. People who haven't a clue about what they talk about. And, they vote too not knowing a thing. Why? Because they listen to CNN and MSNBC, read the NY Slimes and Washington Compost. And, they are extremely lazy since they won't google it themselves.
 
OrphanSlug said:
Source for us to evaluate?
Click to expand...

And, this is the real problem. People who haven't a clue about what they talk about. And, they vote too not knowing a thing. Why? Because they listen to CNN and MSNBC, read the NY Slimes and Washington Compost. And, they are extremely lazy since they won't google it themselves.
 
Mass shootings, or bombings, are utterly pointless and therefore difficult or impossible to figure out. Easily attainable guns might be part of it, or might not. People like simple explanations and simple solutions for impossible problems.
 
spud_meister said:
Yes, if you measure deaths from mass shootings per capita, from 2009-2015. But obviously comparing small countries where such events are statistically unlikely to large countries where such events happen frequently is a flawed comparison. Belgium had 10 people die in two mass shootings over that time period, which in a country of 11 million, gives a higher rate than the US.

If you compare from 2016-2019, Belgium had no deaths from mass shootings, the US had 444.
Click to expand...

So, the challenge is that your 2016-2019 comparison simply isn't a long enough time period to get proper statistical data. But, the reality is, smaller countries simply won't have the same number depending upon the citizens and the governments. However, if you look at some really bad countries with lots of crime and genocide, their mass killings are probably a lot higher than is counted and in small populated countries. But, the fact is, per million people, the U.S. isn't the worst.

What is really pathetic is that Democrats never want to talk about the real mass shootings that go on every day in Democratic run cities like Chicago, Baltimore and other rat infested cities. The black on black murders in those cities are by far more than the mass shootings Democrats immediately run to gun control.
 
Good4Nothin said:
We keep hearing that the US is, by far, the world leader in mass shootings. And of course this is blamed on the NRA and the Republicans. And of course all we have to do to solve the problem is make it harder to buy guns.

However this is a fake fact. The US is not the world leader in mass shootings. Finland, France and Belgium are ahead of us, and we are not even in the top 10.

I am not a fanatic about guns, and I don't own any guns, and I think there should be restrictions on buying them. But I don't like the way progressives just swallow this kind of fake fact, without ever checking.

They want simple answers and they want a villain to blame. Too bad, there is no simple way to stop mass shootings. If guns were made completely illegal, mass killers would still find ways to make their weapons.

So we have the country angrily divided between gun-lovers and gun-haters. And in reality, it doesn't matter very much. The gun debate is distracting us from trying to figure out the real motivations of mass killers.
Click to expand...

Your definition of 'mass shooting' defines what numbers you're looking for. Certainly, without any doubt, there are parts of the world where mass shootings far exceed the number of 'mass shootings' in the United States. The numbers that are really something that the people in this country should be concerned about are the number of mass murders committed by home grown right-wing domestic terrorists. Violent extremism has been on a sharp rise in the US since 2016, that's just a fact. The United States has a right-wing terrorist problem unlike any other country in the world.
 
Cougarbear said:
And, this is the real problem. People who haven't a clue about what they talk about. And, they vote too not knowing a thing. And, they are extremely lazy since they won't google it themselves.
Click to expand...

Are we talking about the OP here? Post a statistic (and 'not number one implies a number) then expect to be asked for evidence. That is fair.
 
Good4Nothin said:
Mass shootings, or bombings, are utterly pointless and therefore difficult or impossible to figure out. Easily attainable guns might be part of it, or might not. People like simple explanations and simple solutions for impossible problems.
Click to expand...

I agree with that! And, Democrats know this. That's why they go to the gun control right away as the last person dying is falling to the ground. Sick and pathetic. Now, both sides are going to more easy or simple solutions by this "Red Flag" laws. So, I have a question. Say Timmy, son of Johnny, is found to be a sociopath and threatening others to do mass killings. So, they don't let Timmy buy a gun. If he has one, they go and take it away from him. What about Johnny's guns? With the Red Flag law, can they take Johnny's guns too? If they can't, then Timmy could steal his dad's guns and go do a mass shooting. So, there are always going to be loopholes.

350 million people. There are going to be murders and people hurt. The best we can do is try to build back up mental hospitals to house and help those who do threaten others. But, taking away guns won't stop killing. It didn't stop Timothy McVey. Personally, I'd rather take my chances with someone with a gun than a truck full of bomb materials or pressure cooker bombs.
 
Cougarbear said:
So, the challenge is that your 2016-2019 comparison simply isn't a long enough time period to get proper statistical data. But, the reality is, smaller countries simply won't have the same number depending upon the citizens and the governments. However, if you look at some really bad countries with lots of crime and genocide, their mass killings are probably a lot higher than is counted and in small populated countries. But, the fact is, per million people, the U.S. isn't the worst.
Click to expand...

Yet by assessing 2009-2015, statistical outliers are included in the data, which anyone with a basic knowledge of stats knows they should be excluded to avoid skewing the data. Prior to 2011, Belgium hadn't had a mass shooting since 1950.

What is really pathetic is that Democrats never want to talk about the real mass shootings that go on every day in Democratic run cities like Chicago, Baltimore and other rat infested cities. The black on black murders in those cities are by far more than the mass shootings Democrats immediately run to gun control.
Click to expand...

The patheticness on both sides is an unwillingness to address the socio-economic factors that drive most of the violent crime in the US.
 
Good4Nothin said:
We keep hearing that the US is, by far, the world leader in mass shootings. And of course this is blamed on the NRA and the Republicans. And of course all we have to do to solve the problem is make it harder to buy guns.

However this is a fake fact. The US is not the world leader in mass shootings. Finland, France and Belgium are ahead of us, and we are not even in the top 10.

I am not a fanatic about guns, and I don't own any guns, and I think there should be restrictions on buying them. But I don't like the way progressives just swallow this kind of fake fact, without ever checking.

They want simple answers and they want a villain to blame. Too bad, there is no simple way to stop mass shootings. If guns were made completely illegal, mass killers would still find ways to make their weapons.

So we have the country angrily divided between gun-lovers and gun-haters. And in reality, it doesn't matter very much. The gun debate is distracting us from trying to figure out the real motivations of mass killers.
Click to expand...



Source?
 
uptower said:
Are we talking about the OP here? Post a statistic (and 'not number one implies a number) then expect to be asked for evidence. That is fair.
Click to expand...

Have you ever seen a study on mass shootings before? I bet you have yet you go through this nonsense.
 
spud_meister said:
Yet by assessing 2009-2015, statistical outliers are included in the data, which anyone with a basic knowledge of stats knows they should be excluded to avoid skewing the data. Prior to 2011, Belgium hadn't had a mass shooting since 1950.



The patheticness on both sides is an unwillingness to address the socio-economic factors that drive most of the violent crime in the US.
Click to expand...

I agree with your last statement. Your first is just another excuse not to recognize the U.S. is apt to have more mass shootings because of our high population.
 
Cougarbear said:
Actually, I don't think Democrats hate guns. Many of them have guns or have body guards that have guns. What progressives are doing is using these unfortunate killings for political purposes because they know their socialist programs are dead on arrival and they won't even win their elections. So, they pander to the liberal crybabies hoping there is enough of them to win elections.

The motivations are different for each circumstance. Some are because they got fired and they were unable to deal with it and /or also were sociopaths. Some are over being rejected by a spouse or boyfriend/girlfriend. Some are just tired of being alive and commit suicide by killing as many as they can before they are killed but still sociopaths. Some are like the El Paso killer who hated Hispanics and was mad that mankind pollutes the earth. So, as a sociopath, he killed people to either show people it can be done or to start it off. Or, the Canton killer was simply a sociopath who wanted to die and kill anyone including his own sister. I'm pretty sure that the common thread is they are all sociopaths. See, 99% of sociopaths never commit crimes like this. But, there are those that are triggered by something and they decide to kill people. Mostly it's done with guns. But, the Oklahoma bomber, Timothy McVey, used a huge bomb to kill 187 people. And, that was when Clinton was President. So, was Clinton a racist too?
Click to expand...

What's amazing is how you can understand the idea of exploiting an issue to get votes for a bad economic agenda, but you are so blind that you think it's the Democrats who are doing that, and don't get that you just described the Republicans' basic political strategy, to get power to pass their plutocrat economic policies.
 
Good4Nothin said:
Mass shootings, or bombings, are utterly pointless and therefore difficult or impossible to figure out. Easily attainable guns might be part of it, or might not. People like simple explanations and simple solutions for impossible problems.
Click to expand...

This is true and explains Cters a lot. 1 evil group controlling everything is easier to comprehend than many groups/individuals with many different grievances/problems.
 
And, of course, even if guns were completely illegal criminals and terrorists would still find ways to get them.

I do agree with Democrats that there should be restrictions on buying guns. But it would not end violence.
 
Craig234 said:
What's amazing is how you can understand the idea of exploiting an issue to get votes for a bad economic agenda, but you are so blind that you think it's the Democrats who are doing that, and don't get that you just described the Republicans' basic political strategy, to get power to pass their plutocrat economic policies.
Click to expand...

The Republicans aren't running to the people yelling "GUN CONTROL!!!" It's the Democrats. It's only the Democrat liberals in the main screem media as well. Why would the Republicans do it since the Republican and Trump economy are doing great? No, it's the Democrats doing it. Booker, Harris, Beto, Sanders, Warren and most of the rest are actually raising money from these mass shootings. No, you aren't going to get to spin out of this one.
 
Good4Nothin said:
And, of course, even if guns were completely illegal criminals and terrorists would still find ways to get them.

I do agree with Democrats that there should be restrictions on buying guns. But it would not end violence.
Click to expand...

Can you imagine the money that will be made in the black market when the the semi-automatic guns are outlawed. The bumpstocks and other things to change a pistol into a machine gun won't be far behind. Criminals and Terrorists will have them and there is nothing we will be able to do.
 
Cougarbear said:
I agree with your last statement. Your first is just another excuse not to recognize the U.S. is apt to have more mass shootings because of our high population.
Click to expand...

Do you think the rate of shootings would change if it was assessed between 1951 and 2010? The events in Belgium aren't representative of trends. I'm not debating anything about the US, I'm pointing out it's not a valid comparison because of enormous population differences and cherry-picked dates.
 
Cougarbear said:
Can you imagine the money that will be made in the black market when the the semi-automatic guns are outlawed. The bumpstocks and other things to change a pistol into a machine gun won't be far behind. Criminals and Terrorists will have them and there is nothing we will be able to do.
Click to expand...

And what about 3D printed guns?
 
Cougarbear said:
The Republicans aren't running to the people yelling "GUN CONTROL!!!" It's the Democrats. It's only the Democrat liberals in the main screem media as well. Why would the Republicans do it since the Republican and Trump economy are doing great? No, it's the Democrats doing it. Booker, Harris, Beto, Sanders, Warren and most of the rest are actually raising money from these mass shootings. No, you aren't going to get to spin out of this one.
Click to expand...

No, the Republicans are running to the people yelling "Immigrants!" "Muslims!" "Caravans!" "Ebola!" "Terrorists!" "Commies (we mean the not Russia kind)!" "Open Borders!" "Free stuff for black people!" "Fantasy economics!" "Israel has a right to exist!" "Apology tour!" I could list hundreds more. But you're right, they're not saying "GUN CONTROL!"
 
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