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Implications of Medicare for All

Oh I don't doubt how to fix it, thats common sense. What I am saying is it will never happen under a government controlled program on a scale this elaborate. Not even possible. I love how Bernie fluffs this idea up with how other countries are so gifted to have incorporated these programs but when you dig just a bit deeper you find out the tax result of such a program.

I don't want my government telling me if I qualify for a certain surgery or medications I need. No thank you.

Let's say that is it only under a government program that it would happen. Otherwise, you got vultures as middlemen with a profit motive. I also want to see health care not dependent on employers. There were a couple of people I know that has a real good health insurance. They got sick, and couldn't work. After their medical leave time passed, they were laid off, and the Cobra ate into their savings and retirement. I am not sure about one, but the other left their spouse without their retirement fund, since it was spent on hospital bills and funeral costs. That means, people lose insurance when they need it the most, because they can't work. Unless you are independently wealthy, that can wipe out the savings and retirement of your spouse. That can happen to anyone.
 
Let's say that is it only under a government program that it would happen. Otherwise, you got vultures as middlemen with a profit motive. I also want to see health care not dependent on employers. There were a couple of people I know that has a real good health insurance. They got sick, and couldn't work. After their medical leave time passed, they were laid off, and the Cobra ate into their savings and retirement. I am not sure about one, but the other left their spouse without their retirement fund, since it was spent on hospital bills and funeral costs. That means, people lose insurance when they need it the most, because they can't work. Unless you are independently wealthy, that can wipe out the savings and retirement of your spouse. That can happen to anyone.

Don't think I am not sympathetic to the exact problem. I feel your pain as I have had to deal the similar problems myself. And the program you are sighting would be the best for everyone. Couldn't agree more. But Government run healthcare? Let me just say I would have to see it before I ever came close to believing it. That goes for Government run anything. You wind up with a bunch of nobodies who are the friend of a guy who used to be someones ex that got the job out of a favor making irrational emotional decisions.

Just take a day down at the DMV or DOT or your local inspectors office filled with people you can't fire to get an idea of what will be making your medical decisions. Way too scary for me.
 
Don't think I am not sympathetic to the exact problem. I feel your pain as I have had to deal the similar problems myself. And the program you are sighting would be the best for everyone. Couldn't agree more. But Government run healthcare? Let me just say I would have to see it before I ever came close to believing it. That goes for Government run anything. You wind up with a bunch of nobodies who are the friend of a guy who used to be someones ex that got the job out of a favor making irrational emotional decisions.

Just take a day down at the DMV or DOT or your local inspectors office filled with people you can't fire to get an idea of what will be making your medical decisions. Way too scary for me.

The local DMV and the local inspectors are really good where I am. I don't see any issue there. Could it be a regional difference, about work ethic and efficiency?
 
The local DMV and the local inspectors are really good where I am. I don't see any issue there. Could it be a regional difference, about work ethic and efficiency?

Most of what we have is understaffed and not very energetic. Takes an act of congress to remove one as most are there through family favors.
 
Our governments are so awesome at fixing the roads, why NOT put them in charge of our health?
 
When people discuss single-payer health care systems they hear about the massive increase in taxes, but those discussions never think through the real implications of single-payer. Implications include:


[*]Everyone has health insurance for life. No more changing plans because you changed jobs or your employer decides to change the plan.
maybe my next employer has a better plan than the crap medicare plan of which i still need additional insurance to cover the gaps.
[*]Employers are no longer concerned about providing health care at all. They are relieved of that cost and responsibility (unless the single payer plan requires them to pay into it).
of course employer will still have to pay into it. also right now all healthcare costs to a company are 100% tax deductible. they don't pay anything for healthcare.
[*]The cost of Medicare, Medicaid and the VA get rolled into paying for the single-payer system. States will no longer be required to spend on health care for the poor. All veterans will be covered instead of the percentage that are now covered. There is no transition for insurance at age 65.
STates only pay part of the cost anyway. so yea have you seen the VA? it sucks. why do you want crappy healthcare?

[*]There will be a massive increase in the market for health care. Millions of jobs will be created. Admittedly many jobs with insurance companies will be lost but in general those folks will benefit from the increase in the health care market.

no there won't. if any jobs are created it will be government jobs which is just more overhead. why do you think that none of these socialist medical system have any major
breakthroughs in medical technology or medical procedures? it is all done here in the US.

[*]Providers no longer have to make deals with dozens of insurance companies. They only need to deal with one payer vastly reducing overhead costs for them.

No providers are going to decrease because they are not going to be 40% less. neither are doctors. they can't afford it. they will either not take it or close.
your lacking a ton of facts.

[*]People will be relieved of the cost of health care insurance, co-pays, co-insurance, deductibles. Their cost will be shifted from insurance to some sort of tax system.
No they won't. medicare has a ton of co-pays, and premiums on the gap insurance. you seriously have done nothing of study or research on this topic have you?

[*]Hospitals will reliably get paid.

This is the biggestt lie of all. The worst payer in the medical industry isn't insurance companies. it is the government. a friend of mine is a doctor. he is required to see medicaid patients.
he quit taking medicare because he couldn't afford it. the cost to treat was more than he was getting paid. it can take him half a year or more to get paid from medicaid.
he has no issues with insurance companies.

[*]You can see any medical care provider you want. No more provider networks.
You can do that without messing up our normal healthcare and this in fact would bring costs way down.

[*]No more out of pocket costs for health care. (depending on the single-payer plan)
YOu don't know how the system works do you?

[*]Overall health care costs will go down with reductions in administrative costs.

not really. the cost savings of this is only about 5-10 trillion over 10 years.

[*]The country's general health will be better lowering the annual cost to the system.

No other countries UHC have had constantly increasing costs no lowered costs. the exact opposite of what you said.

Estimates place the annual cost of health care in the US at $3.2 trillion.

Estimates for the cost of single-payer are about $3-4 trillion annually. We already spend the money needed, we just have to figure out how we want to move the flow of dollars from insurance companies to the single-payer system.

no we don't that is NEW spending. the 10 year cost is 40 trillion or so.
with cost savings (that includes current money spent) we are still short about 24 trillion dollars.
so no this is NEW money not existing money.
 
Our governments are so awesome at fixing the roads, why NOT put them in charge of our health?

Yes there are

Take social security that will run dry in 2034 is it?

The buffoons will have to raise (again) the eligibility age

Take Trillions in unfunded liabilities in all the big Gov programs

Keep the faith(LOL)
 
Yes there are

Take social security that will run dry in 2034 is it?

The buffoons will have to raise (again) the eligibility age

Take Trillions in unfunded liabilities in all the big Gov programs

Keep the faith(LOL)

Social security will never run dry. It never has and never will
 
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When people discuss single-payer health care systems they hear about the massive increase in taxes, but those discussions never think through the real implications of single-payer. Implications include:

  • Everyone has health insurance for life. No more changing plans because you changed jobs or your employer decides to change the plan.
  • Employers are no longer concerned about providing health care at all. They are relieved of that cost and responsibility (unless the single payer plan requires them to pay into it).
  • The cost of Medicare, Medicaid and the VA get rolled into paying for the single-payer system. States will no longer be required to spend on health care for the poor. All veterans will be covered instead of the percentage that are now covered. There is no transition for insurance at age 65.
  • There will be a massive increase in the market for health care. Millions of jobs will be created. Admittedly many jobs with insurance companies will be lost but in general those folks will benefit from the increase in the health care market.
  • Providers no longer have to make deals with dozens of insurance companies. They only need to deal with one payer vastly reducing overhead costs for them.
  • People will be relieved of the cost of health care insurance, co-pays, co-insurance, deductibles. Their cost will be shifted from insurance to some sort of tax system.
  • Hospitals will reliably get paid.
  • A person's state of health will be irrelevant to the cost to them.
  • You can see any medical care provider you want. No more provider networks.
  • No more out of pocket costs for health care. (depending on the single-payer plan)
  • Overall health care costs will go down with reductions in administrative costs.
  • The country's general health will be better lowering the annual cost to the system.
Estimates place the annual cost of health care in the US at $3.2 trillion.

Estimates for the cost of single-payer are about $3-4 trillion annually. We already spend the money needed, we just have to figure out how we want to move the flow of dollars from insurance companies to the single-payer system.

Yep, works in every other civilized country with single payer healthcare so why not America? I'll tell you why; because tight-arse conservatives are terrified it might cost them a few extra cents tax, and most importantly, the 'why should I pay for someone else's healthcare?' epitome of conservative self-centred meanness.
 
It will never ever ever run dry. It never has and never will.

Relax chicken little

It will never ever ever run dry. It never has and never will.

Awesome "Water down" job... I commend you(wink)


when the trust fund reserves are projected to become exhausted.1



At the point where the reserves are used up, continuing taxes are expected to be enough to pay 76 percent of scheduled benefits. Thus, the Congress will need to make changes to the scheduled benefits and revenue sources for the program in the future.

Just trust

Keep the faith
 
Awesome "Water down" job... I commend you(wink)








Atta boy!

Keep the faith

The sky is falling!!!! Lol

Relax. They will fix it.


You guys make me laugh. Social security is the most successful government program in America
 
If it’s Medicare for all will ALL have to pay for it?

Yes, and that includes someone else paying for you. It works well here in Britain and you don't hear anyone whining about healthcare free at the point of delivery. If I need heart surgery I walk out of the hospital fixed, with my money intact, no insurance small-print to negotiate, no questions about pre-existing conditions and NO BILLS EVER either. Nor am I charged for MRI or other scans, physiotherapy, sight tests, doctor visits or hospital consultations-and when retirement age kicks in (65 in my case), my prescription meds are free if I need them. Why conservative Americans object to a system which is not only cheaper for everyone, but which also gets rid of the profiteering middle-man insurance company, baffles me frankly.
We ALL (except those who prefer the very expensive private option), pay a small percentage (13% of our wage), toward the NHS via general taxation, and EVERYONE benefits. What a terrible system, right?
 
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Yep, works in every other civilized country with single payer healthcare so why not America? I'll tell you why; because tight-arse conservatives are terrified it might cost them a few extra cents tax, and most importantly, the 'why should I pay for someone else's healthcare?' epitome of conservative self-centred meanness.
Yep, works in every other civilized country with single payer healthcare so why not America?

Well for one, we're stupid enough to be countries like you "Big Brother"
 
The sky is falling!!!! Lol

Relax. They will fix it.


You guys make me laugh. Social security is the most successful government program in America


Relax. They will fix it.

Oh sure they will

They will raise the eligibility age(Yet again)

Was that promised to you?

You like that?
 
Oh sure they will

They will raise the eligibility age(Yet again)

Was that promised to you?

You like that?

Or eliminate the cap on fica taxes or raise premiums or raise fica tax


Easy fixes.


Really.....try to relax
 
Or eliminate the cap on fica taxes or raise premiums or raise fica tax


Easy fixes.


Really.....try to relax

They will do both guy

You like that?

Was that promised to you?



Just trust
 
They will do both guy

You like that?

Was that promised to you?

Just trust

You think you were promised that social security would never change????

Wow....that is naive
 
I think '' breaking up the "Provider Networks" who engage in price fixing and price manipulation will be a plus for America, and then Breaking Up the Hospital Networks that are entrenched into "cost manipulations".

We can break up the system of Surgeon's charging $10's of thousands of dollars for procedures. And doing so moves Robotic Surgery to the forefront for procedures that can be performed by this unit. This sad issue of paying surgeons, $10's of thousands for a few hours of work regardless of the procedure type, is an absurdity, an absurdity that Insurance Companies never took even the slightest stance to fight against, because insurance companies were groomed to 'deny services", "delay services" and leave the individual with massive financial encumbrances.

Health Care NEVER should have been a "get rich quick game"... No doctor would be imporvished, based on lower cost. We have Doctors today, who make so much by exaggerated cost until many have become "Real Estate Holding Barrons". Hospital Networks scam cities of tax revenues with their Non-Profit Listing, and then they buy up any empty building, and rent out the space to their doctors in their network, again, skirting real estate revenue that should be collected by cities.

Then there's the "Pill Mill" type of programs, where they no longer seek to cure issue, only to medicate it with life long medications, rather than good medical monitoring and programming that can arrest various conditions.

I think when they get control of this madness, they will then come up with solid ways to deal with cancer, because it will not longer be a guaranteed 2 yrs Money Train, to ensure guaranteed profits increase during the 2 yr cycle.

Parents won't have to suffer nor their children waiting on some network to approve the care they need. We may even see a great increase in training people specifically for "Elderly Care", and building more facilities across the country where senior's can get managed care and lower the cost of Rehab and Assisted Living.

We may even see, facilities set up with dozens of MRI Machines, and take that away from the monologue that hospitals have engaged to dominate this, and then stretch people out months, claiming backlog. CT Scans can be routine, rather than office visit guess work, Ultra sound won't be costing $1000 plus for a 3.5 minute scan.

ACA set up a pathway to make all this possible. The game those played who fought ACA and supported the Medical Industry Lobby game, and allowing them to raise the prices will be vanquished.

There can be monthly payments for each citizen... that would not exceed $XXX per person for the coverage. Prescription medicine which often use much of "government grant funding in their research" will not be able to get "exclusive patents", if they use government funds, those patents will belong to the government, not the company that used the government funds.
 
I think '' breaking up the "Provider Networks" who engage in price fixing and price manipulation will be a plus for America, and then Breaking Up the Hospital Networks that are entrenched into "cost manipulations".

We can break up the system of Surgeon's charging $10's of thousands of dollars for procedures. And doing so moves Robotic Surgery to the forefront for procedures that can be performed by this unit. This sad issue of paying surgeons, $10's of thousands for a few hours of work regardless of the procedure type, is an absurdity, an absurdity that Insurance Companies never took even the slightest stance to fight against, because insurance companies were groomed to 'deny services", "delay services" and leave the individual with massive financial encumbrances.

Health Care NEVER should have been a "get rich quick game"... No doctor would be imporvished, based on lower cost. We have Doctors today, who make so much by exaggerated cost until many have become "Real Estate Holding Barrons". Hospital Networks scam cities of tax revenues with their Non-Profit Listing, and then they buy up any empty building, and rent out the space to their doctors in their network, again, skirting real estate revenue that should be collected by cities.

Then there's the "Pill Mill" type of programs, where they no longer seek to cure issue, only to medicate it with life long medications, rather than good medical monitoring and programming that can arrest various conditions.

I think when they get control of this madness, they will then come up with solid ways to deal with cancer, because it will not longer be a guaranteed 2 yrs Money Train, to ensure guaranteed profits increase during the 2 yr cycle.

Parents won't have to suffer nor their children waiting on some network to approve the care they need. We may even see a great increase in training people specifically for "Elderly Care", and building more facilities across the country where senior's can get managed care and lower the cost of Rehab and Assisted Living.

We may even see, facilities set up with dozens of MRI Machines, and take that away from the monologue that hospitals have engaged to dominate this, and then stretch people out months, claiming backlog. CT Scans can be routine, rather than office visit guess work, Ultra sound won't be costing $1000 plus for a 3.5 minute scan.

ACA set up a pathway to make all this possible. The game those played who fought ACA and supported the Medical Industry Lobby game, and allowing them to raise the prices will be vanquished.

There can be monthly payments for each citizen... that would not exceed $XXX per person for the coverage. Prescription medicine which often use much of "government grant funding in their research" will not be able to get "exclusive patents", if they use government funds, those patents will belong to the government, not the company that used the government funds.

Try convincing your average conservative that they would actually be better off with single payer when their sole objection is 'why should I pay for someone else?'
 
You think you were promised that social security would never change????

Wow....that is naive

Hey guy,

I had it taken out each pay check(No choice) and was told what I would receive

Are you naive?

I and everyone else should be Grandfathered in


They want to make changes for new recipients after an x date , go ahead

But that is NOT what happens is it?

You're a good little serf or what?
 
Hey guy,

I had it taken out each pay check(No choice) and was told what I would receive

Are you naive?

I and everyone else should be Grandfathered in


They want to make changes for new recipients after an x date , go ahead

But that is NOT what happens is it?

You're a good little serf or what?

Oh waaaaah. I thought social security would never change. Waaaah.


How childish. Lol
 
When people discuss single-payer health care systems they hear about the massive increase in taxes, but those discussions never think through the real implications of single-payer. Implications include:

  • Everyone has health insurance for life. No more changing plans because you changed jobs or your employer decides to change the plan.
  • Employers are no longer concerned about providing health care at all. They are relieved of that cost and responsibility (unless the single payer plan requires them to pay into it).
  • The cost of Medicare, Medicaid and the VA get rolled into paying for the single-payer system. States will no longer be required to spend on health care for the poor. All veterans will be covered instead of the percentage that are now covered. There is no transition for insurance at age 65.
  • There will be a massive increase in the market for health care. Millions of jobs will be created. Admittedly many jobs with insurance companies will be lost but in general those folks will benefit from the increase in the health care market.
  • Providers no longer have to make deals with dozens of insurance companies. They only need to deal with one payer vastly reducing overhead costs for them.
  • People will be relieved of the cost of health care insurance, co-pays, co-insurance, deductibles. Their cost will be shifted from insurance to some sort of tax system.
  • Hospitals will reliably get paid.
  • A person's state of health will be irrelevant to the cost to them.
  • You can see any medical care provider you want. No more provider networks.
  • No more out of pocket costs for health care. (depending on the single-payer plan)
  • Overall health care costs will go down with reductions in administrative costs.
  • The country's general health will be better lowering the annual cost to the system.
Estimates place the annual cost of health care in the US at $3.2 trillion.

Estimates for the cost of single-payer are about $3-4 trillion annually. We already spend the money needed, we just have to figure out how we want to move the flow of dollars from insurance companies to the single-payer system.




Estimates place the annual cost of health care in the US at $3.2 trillion.

And anyone with a Brain knows it always cost more than these "Estimates"

Just trust
 
Oh waaaaah. I thought social security would never change. Waaaah.


How childish. Lol

Obviously you don't have the Yankee American revolution spirit

Just trust
 
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