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Ok I see I need to take this really slow for you.

First your math was still wrong at 4.1570762053% the number is 4.31570762% at least try and do the math right. Here I'll make it easy for you 111/2572 - Google Search and 111/1505 - Google Search and you didn't "add" a zero you just put the percent sign behind your decimal point.

When congress is in session, they can override a bill, which means of the 2572 bills that were vetoed in total congress only had the chance to override 1505 of them, which means of the bill they could override, they did so at a 7.37% rate. If you include ALL vetoes, including those congress could not override pocket vetoes. And note pocket vetoes are indirect vetoes, as the the president didn't take action until it was too late for congress to take any action. Thus on bill congress could override they did so at the 7+%
Simpler then that there was 2572 vetos and 111 over rides that is in no way 7% , people can do the math here they know if my numbers are write then it's just over 4% and in actuality it is closer to 1% because many of the veto's the president knew they would be over ridden , they were simply trying to make a point . Which only supports my point that if the president writes a veto it is almost always the end of it. Which also brings us back to narcissistic personality disorder- look that up.
 
I'm glad you elected scum bag, where as your hate party was doomed because of demographics in two or three decades, after electing scum bag you chopped off one or two of those decades , so I appreciate you electing scum bag. I'll be writing your hate party's epitaph a lot sooner

If scum bag gets us into a war with Iran and its savage supporters you and I may not even live to see another decade.
 
Simpler then that there was 2572 vetos and 111 over rides that is in no way 7% , people can do the math here they know if my numbers are write then it's just over 4% and in actuality it is closer to 1% because many of the veto's the president knew they would be over ridden , they were simply trying to make a point . Which only supports my point that if the president writes a veto it is almost always the end of it. Which also brings us back to narcissistic personality disorder- look that up.

Notice I put BOTH calculations in my post, and pointed out there is a difference between vetoes that done while congress is in session and those when it is not. Thus giving us the 4.3+% of TOTAL vetoes overridden and 7.37+ of those vetoes where congress could vote to override them. Given that you state " because many of the veto's the president knew they would be over ridden" means it wasn't the end of it doesn't it? You just disproved your own point.

So in a nutshell, you've disproven your own point as you admit the the president KNEW his veto would be overridden, you can't do math (which is sad really), you fail to understand the difference between vetoes that could and could not be overridden.

BTW trying to imply someone has a mental disorder, you are really just saying I'm wrong and the only way I can feel better about myself is to demean the the person.
 
Notice I put BOTH calculations in my post, and pointed out there is a difference between vetoes that done while congress is in session and those when it is not. Thus giving us the 4.3+% of TOTAL vetoes overridden and 7.37+ of those vetoes where congress could vote to override them. Given that you state " because many of the veto's the president knew they would be over ridden" means it wasn't the end of it doesn't it? You just disproved your own point.

So in a nutshell, you've disproven your own point as you admit the the president KNEW his veto would be overridden, you can't do math (which is sad really), you fail to understand the difference between vetoes that could and could not be overridden.

BTW trying to imply someone has a mental disorder, you are really just saying I'm wrong and the only way I can feel better about myself is to demean the the person.
Didn't read it but I do want to help you, narcissistic personality disorder- look that up. Everyone, if there has been 2572 vetoes and 111 were over ridden.Whats the over ride rate by percentage, Tic toc tic toc
 
We will start with the fact that the Democrats had no mandatory lending policy and even if there was such a thing they have nothing to do with anything compared to how credit default swap caused the crash. That is a right wing Didi

The left authored a series of laws intended to make it easier for lower income people to buy houses, starting with Jimmy Carter and substantially enhanced by Bill Clinton. It's not mandatory lending, but it separated the loans from the credit risk. Banks had to make risky loans to stay accredited. That is what ultimately caused the crash--poor loan quality.

Far from causing the crash, default swaps were a symptom. Essentially they did not make matters worse, but they did hide some of the cracks in the dike. Banks tried desperately to stay solvent by various kinds of arcane bundles and mortgage backed securities which were no safer than the hazardous loans they already had on the books. I remember one small S&L that went under because they bought a Rental agreement from a trailer park company in California. There were lots of provisions about replacing a default rental with a good one, but no security if the whole company went bankrupt. No Trailer park = no rental income.
 
The left authored a series of laws intended to make it easier for lower income people to buy houses, starting with Jimmy Carter and substantially enhanced by Bill Clinton. It's not mandatory lending, but it separated the loans from the credit risk. Banks had to make risky loans to stay accredited. That is what ultimately caused the crash--poor loan quality.

Far from causing the crash, default swaps were a symptom. Essentially they did not make matters worse, but they did hide some of the cracks in the dike. Banks tried desperately to stay solvent by various kinds of arcane bundles and mortgage backed securities which were no safer than the hazardous loans they already had on the books. I remember one small S&L that went under because they bought a Rental agreement from a trailer park company in California. There were lots of provisions about replacing a default rental with a good one, but no security if the whole company went bankrupt. No Trailer park = no rental income.
Now wasn't it you that stomped around and said that the Democrats at fault because of a mandatory lending program lets look at that -OH goody here it is from the expert HIS QUOTE" It's hard to tell which party had a bigger role in the disaster--Democrat mandatory lending policies or Republican slack oversight" I told him it was bull**** and that he didn't know what he was talking about and has argued that point for half dozen comments but looky looky what he finally admitted HIS QUOTE"It's not mandatory lending, but it separated the loans from the credit risk. Banks had to make risky loans to stay accredited. That is what ultimately caused the crash--poor loan quality. " Now he is saying that Credit default swaps had little to do with the mortgage problem and again I will say he has no clue what he is talking about, Credit default swaps guarantee 47 trillions dollars worth of real estate ,Bundles mortgages . It was to insure creditors against default)They guaranteed those trillions with a minute percentage. When it was going they made massive amounts of money but when mortgage value decreased their small percentage that they paid was lost in less then a day and they guaranteed 47 trillion and were responsible to pay. They made massive amounts when it was hot and all but destroyed this country economy. The billions and billions that went to the massive money company's was for credit default swaps This guy that I'm responding can't be wrong ,hence the endless rattle from him ,problem is he doesn't know what he is talking about.
 
Now wasn't it you that stomped around and said that the Democrats at fault because of a mandatory lending program lets look at that -OH goody here it is from the expert HIS QUOTE" It's hard to tell which party had a bigger role in the disaster--Democrat mandatory lending policies or Republican slack oversight" I told him it was bull**** and that he didn't know what he was talking about and has argued that point for half dozen comments but looky looky what he finally admitted HIS QUOTE"It's not mandatory lending, but it separated the loans from the credit risk. Banks had to make risky loans to stay accredited. That is what ultimately caused the crash--poor loan quality. " Now he is saying that Credit default swaps had little to do with the mortgage problem and again I will say he has no clue what he is talking about, Credit default swaps guarantee 47 trillions dollars worth of real estate ,Bundles mortgages . It was to insure creditors against default)They guaranteed those trillions with a minute percentage. When it was going they made massive amounts of money but when mortgage value decreased their small percentage that they paid was lost in less then a day and they guaranteed 47 trillion and were responsible to pay. They made massive amounts when it was hot and all but destroyed this country economy. The billions and billions that went to the massive money company's was for credit default swaps This guy that I'm responding can't be wrong ,hence the endless rattle from him ,problem is he doesn't know what he is talking about.

Dense, hard to read, and incoherent. Was there a point in there?
 
Gramm–Leach–Bliley Act

Commodity Futures Modernization Act of 2000
 
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Dense, hard to read, and incoherent. Was there a point in there?
The point is That you have no clue what your talking about and that is the only point that I wanted to prove to this forum, and I did and your non response to my comment supports that.
 
narcissistic personality disorder- look that up.
Fine. I will make allowances.

What does your psych profile have to do with the question?
 
Didn't read it but I do want to help you, narcissistic personality disorder- look that up. Everyone, if there has been 2572 vetoes and 111 were over ridden.Whats the over ride rate by percentage, Tic toc tic toc

Had you read it, which you claim you didn't you would have seen what the percentage was 4.3+%. Of course given you can't do math, disproved your own point, given you stated many of the overridden vetoes happened because the president KNEW they would be overridden. Show you really don't know what you're talking about.

I am sorry that you so psychologically fragile that you can't admit you are wrong.
 
While it is true that Clinton had a brief period of balanced federal "budgets" the national debt continued to grow during his terms in office.

https://www.debtconsolidation.com/us-debt-presidents/

LOL. We talk near daily about the deficit and the debt, and every single time this is brought up, someone has to redefine the way we measure deficits and debt and point out if we use a definition never used in any other discussion, Clinton didn't really "balance" the budget.... :roll:
 
The left authored a series of laws intended to make it easier for lower income people to buy houses, starting with Jimmy Carter and substantially enhanced by Bill Clinton. It's not mandatory lending, but it separated the loans from the credit risk. Banks had to make risky loans to stay accredited. That is what ultimately caused the crash--poor loan quality.

Banks did not have to make risky loans to stay accredited. Do you really believe Wall Street got rolled by a bunch of community organizers with the CRA? That was the crumbs they allowed to fall off the table to get national banking, eating up the little guys. And every analysis of the defaults finds that big problems were concentrated in areas not covered by any loan requirements at all - the suburbs, in places like Las Vegas and Florida and involved $300k homes, $400k homes and up.

And anyone alive during that era knows the banks spent $billions begging people to borrow, NINJA loans, negative amortization, 110% LTV loans, and they did it because every loan made them money, piles of money, record profits, record stock prices, record bonuses.

Far from causing the crash, default swaps were a symptom. Essentially they did not make matters worse, but they did hide some of the cracks in the dike. Banks tried desperately to stay solvent by various kinds of arcane bundles and mortgage backed securities which were no safer than the hazardous loans they already had on the books. I remember one small S&L that went under because they bought a Rental agreement from a trailer park company in California. There were lots of provisions about replacing a default rental with a good one, but no security if the whole company went bankrupt. No Trailer park = no rental income.

That's wrong on every level. CDS was essentially default insurance, what the buyers of bundled mortgages believed would make them whole in what they believed was the VERY, VERY, VERY unlikely event of a major problem with underlying mortgages. It's what fueled the bubble, that and $trillions and $trillions of other bets on bets on bets on bets. It was a casino, and everyone thought they had insurance to pay off their bad bets. Turned out they were wrong, but that had nothing to do with government, except they let the casino run wild and virtually without regulation.

Read any book about that era and learn something. The thinking was, essentially, that X is the worst case scenario we've ever seen with a nationwide housing downturn, and priced things with that worst case in mind, and then the ACTUAL crisis was far worse than their worst case scenario. It wasn't 10-20% of the book that went bad, and was priced into the risk models as the worst case, but sometimes 80%. Worse, the 'insurers' - the other side of that bet - went belly up because they'd horribly mispriced the risks they were assuming, so when they went to collect on that 10-20% downside, even that wasn't there. It was the equivalent of a homeowners insurance company pricing in one Cat 4 hurrricane and then 10 Cat 5's hit all up and down the coastlines.

In fact a big part of the AIG bailout was because they were the 'insurer' and so the Feds assumed the losses AIG took on and paid out $billions to the banks as if the U.S. was the insurer. That bailout isn't mentioned a whole lot for some reason.
 
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Encouraging mortgage lending in redlined neighborhoods did not cause the real estate crash of 2008.

Mortgage lenders were relieved of the requirement to collect on their loans thereby making the risk of the loan non-existent. Mortgage backed securities put the risk on investors not the lender.

Credit Ratings companies, paid by the lenders, rated these securities AAA when they were full of bad loans, but since there were thousands of loans in a security no one bothered to look at the underlying loans only the rating.

Lenders were making a fortune on these securities and overextended themselves beyond the point of solvency if real estate prices dropped.

Real estate prices dropped.
 
Banks did not have to make risky loans to stay accredited. Do you really believe Wall Street got rolled by a bunch of community organizers with the CRA? That was the crumbs they allowed to fall off the table to get national banking, eating up the little guys. And every analysis of the defaults finds that big problems were concentrated in areas not covered by any loan requirements at all - the suburbs, in places like Las Vegas and Florida and involved $300k homes, $400k homes and up.

And anyone alive during that era knows the banks spent $billions begging people to borrow, NINJA loans, negative amortization, 110% LTV loans, and they did it because every loan made them money, piles of money, record profits, record stock prices, record bonuses.



That's wrong on every level. CDS was essentially default insurance, what the buyers of bundled mortgages believed would make them whole in what they believed was the VERY, VERY, VERY unlikely event of a major problem with underlying mortgages. It's what fueled the bubble, that and $trillions and $trillions of other bets on bets on bets on bets. It was a casino, and everyone thought they had insurance to pay off their bad bets. Turned out they were wrong, but that had nothing to do with government, except they let the casino run wild and virtually without regulation.

Read any book about that era and learn something. The thinking was, essentially, that X is the worst case scenario we've ever seen with a nationwide housing downturn, and priced things with that worst case in mind, and then the ACTUAL crisis was far worse than their worst case scenario. It wasn't 10-20% of the book that went bad, and was priced into the risk models as the worst case, but sometimes 80%. Worse, the 'insurers' - the other side of that bet - went belly up because they'd horribly mispriced the risks they were assuming, so when they went to collect on that 10-20% downside, even that wasn't there. It was the equivalent of a homeowners insurance company pricing in one Cat 4 hurrricane and then 10 Cat 5's hit all up and down the coastlines.

In fact a big part of the AIG bailout was because they were the 'insurer' and so the Feds assumed the losses AIG took on and paid out $billions to the banks as if the U.S. was the insurer. That bailout isn't mentioned a whole lot for some reason.
You seem to be running around a tree, never disagreeing with me, but jumping to the opposite conclusion. I will simply say that the causes were complex, spent many years, decades, building, and that both parties must bear some fault. More than anything it is an example of the rule of unintended consequences.
 
Strange as it seems, I used to be a Republican.

But I just can't hang with the likes of Trump, McConnell, Cotton, Hatch, Ryan, Sessions, Meadows, Jordan, etc. etc. etc.

Yet you have no problems with Schumer, Pelosi, Sanders, Harris, Warren, Clinton? Hmmmmm.
 
Banks did not have to make risky loans to stay accredited. Do you really believe Wall Street got rolled by a bunch of community organizers with the CRA? That was the crumbs they allowed to fall off the table to get national banking, eating up the little guys. And every analysis of the defaults finds that big problems were concentrated in areas not covered by any loan requirements at all - the suburbs, in places like Las Vegas and Florida and involved $300k homes, $400k homes and up.

And anyone alive during that era knows the banks spent $billions begging people to borrow, NINJA loans, negative amortization, 110% LTV loans, and they did it because every loan made them money, piles of money, record profits, record stock prices, record bonuses.



That's wrong on every level. CDS was essentially default insurance, what the buyers of bundled mortgages believed would make them whole in what they believed was the VERY, VERY, VERY unlikely event of a major problem with underlying mortgages. It's what fueled the bubble, that and $trillions and $trillions of other bets on bets on bets on bets. It was a casino, and everyone thought they had insurance to pay off their bad bets. Turned out they were wrong, but that had nothing to do with government, except they let the casino run wild and virtually without regulation.

Read any book about that era and learn something. The thinking was, essentially, that X is the worst case scenario we've ever seen with a nationwide housing downturn, and priced things with that worst case in mind, and then the ACTUAL crisis was far worse than their worst case scenario. It wasn't 10-20% of the book that went bad, and was priced into the risk models as the worst case, but sometimes 80%. Worse, the 'insurers' - the other side of that bet - went belly up because they'd horribly mispriced the risks they were assuming, so when they went to collect on that 10-20% downside, even that wasn't there. It was the equivalent of a homeowners insurance company pricing in one Cat 4 hurrricane and then 10 Cat 5's hit all up and down the coastlines.

In fact a big part of the AIG bailout was because they were the 'insurer' and so the Feds assumed the losses AIG took on and paid out $billions to the banks as if the U.S. was the insurer. That bailout isn't mentioned a whole lot for some reason.

Oh yeah! AIG

Couldn't call it insurance so they called it a credit default swap. Firms like Glodman were buying up all the subprime mortgages they could find and turning them into mortgage backed securities. Then turning the mortgage backed securities into collateralized debt obligation which is just pieces of different mortgage backed securities. Then they take them over to their buddy at the rating agency who slaps a AAA prime rating on them. Then they go to AIG and buy insurance on what they know is bad paper. They sell these fraudulent securities to unsuspecting investors all around the world.

If you notice when the house of cards collapsed Goldman was the first one at AIG's door.
 
You seem to be running around a tree, never disagreeing with me, but jumping to the opposite conclusion. I will simply say that the causes were complex, spent many years, decades, building, and that both parties must bear some fault. More than anything it is an example of the rule of unintended consequences.

I disagreed 100% with the idea that banks were "forced" to make a single loan, or that the cumulative impact of loans they weren't forced to make caused the bubble and inevitable burst. Raw greed is what caused it, and the bankers got the regulatory environment they paid $billions in lobbying and other outlays to get. They've owned Congress and the WH for decades, party isn't relevant.

Just look at pay and bonuses during the heyday. How can you see the skyrocketing profits, pay and bonuses and conclude, "The government made them do that - rake in money hand over fist!!! BAD GOVERNMENT!!!"

Bottom line is I get sick and tired of people blaming the crisis on the people who wield no power in this country, to make excuses for those that DO, and the most powerful people in this country are the Wall Street titans. And your analysis of derivatives was way off the mark - that's what made the bubble possible, and not just here but all across Europe. That was the common trait, not CRA or other loan requirements, not Fannie, not Freddie...
 
Encouraging mortgage lending in redlined neighborhoods did not cause the real estate crash of 2008.

Mortgage lenders were relieved of the requirement to collect on their loans thereby making the risk of the loan non-existent. Mortgage backed securities put the risk on investors not the lender.

Credit Ratings companies, paid by the lenders, rated these securities AAA when they were full of bad loans, but since there were thousands of loans in a security no one bothered to look at the underlying loans only the rating.

Lenders were making a fortune on these securities and overextended themselves beyond the point of solvency if real estate prices dropped.

Real estate prices dropped.
That would be true, you rarely run into anyone in these forums that know anything about what they are talking about These bundles of bonds of which there was 47 trillion were guaranteed at a few percentage points of profit all the big lenders were writing them. So they had to come up with all the lost percentage by the collapse of the mortgages. The market crash dropped almost 1/3 of the average value of real estate. You figure it out ,I don't have a calculator that even comes close to those numbers.what is 1/3 of the 47 trillion of the credit default swaps. That's what they owed as writers of the swaps
 
Oh yeah! AIG

Couldn't call it insurance so they called it a credit default swap. Firms like Glodman were buying up all the subprime mortgages they could find and turning them into mortgage backed securities. Then turning the mortgage backed securities into collateralized debt obligation which is just pieces of different mortgage backed securities. Then they take them over to their buddy at the rating agency who slaps a AAA prime rating on them. Then they go to AIG and buy insurance on what they know is bad paper. They sell these fraudulent securities to unsuspecting investors all around the world.

If you notice when the house of cards collapsed Goldman was the first one at AIG's door.

Right, and GS and JPM never acknowledge that every dime we paid out to AIG was a backdoor bailout of all their customers. Approaching $200 billion...
 
Oh yeah! AIG

Couldn't call it insurance so they called it a credit default swap. Firms like Glodman were buying up all the subprime mortgages they could find and turning them into mortgage backed securities. Then turning the mortgage backed securities into collateralized debt obligation which is just pieces of different mortgage backed securities. Then they take them over to their buddy at the rating agency who slaps a AAA prime rating on them. Then they go to AIG and buy insurance on what they know is bad paper. They sell these fraudulent securities to unsuspecting investors all around the world.

If you notice when the house of cards collapsed Goldman was the first one at AIG's door.
In the market crash, the drop in housing price dropped by just under 1/3 , and the swap writer at the time, owed then 1/3 of the value of the mortgages they wrote. The swaps had a value of 47 trillion dollars ,yup that's with a T, so what is 1/3 of 47 trillion dollars. The one I love about Goldman is they got 10 billion dollars of our money and gave 10 billion dollars in bonuses that year.
 
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