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ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

BlueTex said:
How about sending me the link so I can check it out... Since is was published 12 years ago, I would love to extrapolate their model to the latest numbers and compare...
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The question?

Yes/No?
 
Mycroft said:
Your number is an estimate.
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Most numbers are estimates.

22 million is an estimate of the number of non-citizen immigrants, not necessarily illegal immigrants. 11 million is an estimate from a few years ago of the number of illegal immigrants currently residing in the U.S.
 
Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

I just love the talking points about the citizenship question being racist.. Um.. Last time I checked, American citizens were and are all kinds of races.. LOL

I know logical and all, something dimwits lack in even greater numbers these days,

Tim-
 
Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

ocean515 said:
My purpose for including the study you want to erase was not the who conducted it, but to point out the fact there are many studies all showing different numbers.

So back to the question you ignored. Are the people who conducted the Yale Study racists?
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No I do not believe the Yale study to be racist, but it is an outliner and should be treated as such.
 
Idiometer said:
Do you think the Trump administration will be successful in obtaining an exact number? Seriously?
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Because they have the best people and have won at everything they have worked on so far...... :mrgreen:
 
Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

Hicup said:
I just love the talking points about the citizenship question being racist.. Um.. Last time I checked, American citizens were and are all kinds of races.. LOL

I know logical and all, something dimwits lack in even greater numbers these days,

Tim-
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What talking points? The ones Fox is feeding you to deflect the real reason Trump wanted the question put in there?
 
Mycroft said:
We already have the method. Every agency collects information on every person in the country...whether they are legal or illegal.

Very few people really live off the grid.
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Those methods also result in estimates. There is no such thing as an exact head count of illegal immigrants.
 
ocean515 said:
That number is not accurate, and is likely from the grossly partisan Pew Orgainization. Recent studies from Yale put the number at over 20 million, which logically is far closer to accurate.

As to who will fill those jobs, legal residents and citizens. And think about the impact on wages.
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I can't tell you how much I look forward to watching white men picking lettuce in Central California.

:popcorn2::popcorn2::popcorn2:
 
ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census
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He looked like a petulant child being taken to task by Barr and Ross. Trump knows no's politics … :2rofll:
 
Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

SCrider said:
What talking points? The ones Fox is feeding you to deflect the real reason Trump wanted the question put in there?
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Which was to count how many illegal people were here soaking up the resources that mostly the middle class pay in this nation. Trump understands this, perhaps better than any other politician in history. He know who the bread and butter voter is, and is openly protecting them, all the while, we have a dimwit field openly disregarding them.

Which strategy will work? I have an idea, do you?


Tim-
 
Luckyone said:
One more loss for Superman (Trump)

Scoreboard is now:

3 wins

1) Tax cut
2) Deregulation
3) Pick Conservative Judges

17 losses

1) Illegal Immigration
2) North Korea Denuclearization
3) China Tariff War
4) Iran Nuclear Deal
5) Debt lowering
6) Building of the Wall
7) Mexico will pay for it
8) Raise taxes on the rich
9) New Health care program
10) Infrastructure
11) Break America's largest Banks
12) Upholding clean air and water
13) Drain the swamp
14) Release his tax returns
15) Get the best of the best to run the country
16) Make America Great Again
17) Census question

He is now beating his record as a business man (6 bankruptcies and 7 failed businesses)
Click to expand...
This is good. A spinmonster at work.


1) Tax cut
2) Deregulation
3) Pick Conservative Judges
2 4) North Korea Denuclearization Major progress. Big Win
5) Voided 2016 Iran Deal
7 6) Mexico will pay for it
12 7) Upholding clean air and water EPA is doing it's job again
16 8) Make America Great Again Big Win. See Europe trip.
13 8) Drain the swamp Progress.
15 9) Get the best of the best to run the country Took long enough to find a good AG

1) Illegal Immigration In progress

3) China Tariff War Unclear expand please. In progress regardless.
4) Iran Nuclear Deal Looking good, but still in progress.
5) Debt lowering Who promised that?
6) Building of the Wall In progress

8) Raise taxes on the rich Democrat plan
9) New Health care program On hold
10) Infrastructure On hold
11) Break America's largest Banks Don't be silly


14) Release his tax returns Don't be silly


17) Census question In progress

Your list looks like a bad set of teeth.
 
Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

ocean515 said:
My thoughts? I think it's very difficult to calculate the number. It's quite clear to me the number is grossly under counted.

I believe there are political agenda's at play when such efforts are attempted.

What do you think of this research?

Illegal Aliens Estimated at 20 to 38 Million | Californians For Population Stabilization
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20 to 38 million? That's leaving a margin of 18 million, which is more than official estimates in the first place.

I would say that CAPS can't count any better than the government, and as an organization, they are motivated to scare us into thinking the illegals are an invasion force.

Utter nonsense, IMO.
 
Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

ocean515 said:
The question?

Yes/No?
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Come on, it takes 2-3 seconds to copy the link from your browser history.. Just post the link.... I'm starting to think you didn't read the study...

It's kind of odd that this study isn't listed in their recommended reading..
 
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Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

Hicup said:
Which was to count how many illegal people were here soaking up the resources that mostly the middle class pay in this nation. Trump understands this, perhaps better than any other politician in history. He know who the bread and butter voter is, and is openly protecting them, all the while, we have a dimwit field openly disregarding them.

Which strategy will work? I have an idea, do you?


Tim-
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It sounds like you don't understand the positive economic impact of illegal immigrants.

Economic impact of illegal immigrants in the United States - Wikipedia

Immigrants as Economic Contributors: Immigrant Tax Contributions and Spending Power - National Immigration Forum

Access Denied

There's more where those came from. Let me know if you are interested in actual FACTS.
 
Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

Idiometer said:
It sounds like you don't understand the positive economic impact of illegal immigrants.

Economic impact of illegal immigrants in the United States - Wikipedia

Immigrants as Economic Contributors: Immigrant Tax Contributions and Spending Power - National Immigration Forum

Access Denied

There's more where those came from. Let me know if you are interested in actual FACTS.
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Yeah, ok, sure, if you believe that, then I can't help.

The net drain on our economy is difficult to estimate, (Admittedly) in fact, it might just be impossible, conversely, so too is the net benefit.

It's one of those things that you can't really and truly define, but you know what it is when you see it. Fair?


Tim-
 
Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

SCrider said:
No I do not believe the Yale study to be racist, but it is an outliner and should be treated as such.
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Why? What about their study causes you to think the results are inaccurate?

I've spent quite a bit of time looking into the issue. I've read DHS annual reports on the subject. I've reviewed quarterly and annual reports from the CBP.

I know what is reported on what the CBP calls "gotaway" rates - meaning illegals sighted crossing, but not apprehended.

Over the last 5 years, and including Oct - June of this fiscal year, 4.1 million "migrants" have been apprehended at the Southwest Border.

Southwest Border Migration FY 2019 | U.S. Customs and Border Protection

The "gotaway" rate reported by the CBP over this same period adds another 2 million plus to this total. Meaning for every 2 that are apprehended, 1 get through untouched.


It's true that some of the 4.1 million captured over the 5 years are the same people getting caught again. So with some assumptions as to what that number might represent, 3 million or more have likely crossed the border, are in the US while being processed or have disappeared, etc..

Yet, Pew reports this: 5 facts about illegal immigration in the U.S. | Pew Research Center

Pew Illegal.jpg

The population has decreased?

Logically that makes no sense at all.
 
Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

BlueTex said:
Come on, it takes 2-3 seconds to copy the link from your browser history.. Just post the link.... I'm starting to think you didn't read the study...

It's kind of odd that this study isn't listed in their recommended reading..
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You caught him red-handed so now he is just going to keep answering with

The question?

Yes/No?

Laffrioting in the streets.
 
Jay59 said:
This is good. A spinmonster at work.


1) Tax cut
2) Deregulation
3) Pick Conservative Judges
2 4) North Korea Denuclearization Major progress. Big Win
5) Voided 2016 Iran Deal
7 6) Mexico will pay for it
12 7) Upholding clean air and water EPA is doing it's job again
16 8) Make America Great Again Big Win. See Europe trip.
13 8) Drain the swamp Progress.
15 9) Get the best of the best to run the country Took long enough to find a good AG

1) Illegal Immigration In progress

3) China Tariff War Unclear expand please. In progress regardless.
4) Iran Nuclear Deal Looking good, but still in progress.
5) Debt lowering Who promised that?
6) Building of the Wall In progress

8) Raise taxes on the rich Democrat plan
9) New Health care program On hold
10) Infrastructure On hold
11) Break America's largest Banks Don't be silly


14) Release his tax returns Don't be silly


17) Census question In progress

Your list looks like a bad set of teeth.
Click to expand...

Your list looks like an entry for the 2019 Clueless Awards. I'm going to limit myself by pointing out the first one where you have it so wrong, it isn't even close to reality, and that is NK. Not only is KJU not doing anything to reduce the number of missiles he has developed, he continues to enrich uranium to weapons grade and has developed a nuclear warhead small enough to fit on many of his missiles, including at least one that can reach the continental U.S. The only thing Trump has done is to give KJU exactly what he wants: photo ops with the leader of the free world, so he can further legitimize his brutal regime not only in the eyes of his own people, but perhaps in the eyes of the world. There is a very good reason why previous presidents did not go to NK.
 
Idiometer said:
I can't tell you how much I look forward to watching white men picking lettuce in Central California.

:popcorn2::popcorn2::popcorn2:
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You believe all illegal aliens are farm workers? On what basis do you make such a claim?
 
Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

Idiometer said:
20 to 38 million? That's leaving a margin of 18 million, which is more than official estimates in the first place.

I would say that CAPS can't count any better than the government, and as an organization, they are motivated to scare us into thinking the illegals are an invasion force.

Utter nonsense, IMO.
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I can see where an group that has problems with immigration could do that.

That principle works both ways, IMO.

Pew, for example, underestimates the number because they don't want the citizens to be shocked by how many illegals are actually living in the US.
 
Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

Hicup said:
Which was to count how many illegal people were here soaking up the resources that mostly the middle class pay in this nation. Trump understands this, perhaps better than any other politician in history. He know who the bread and butter voter is, and is openly protecting them, all the while, we have a dimwit field openly disregarding them.

Which strategy will work? I have an idea, do you?


Tim-
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“Which was to count how many illegal people were here soaking up the resources”

You provide no evidence to prove that “illegals” use any more resources, accounting for what they contribute, than do citizens or legal immigrants of the same income (or lack thereof).

“that mostly the middle class pay in this nation.”

You provide no evidence to prove this claim. Hint: It isn't the middle class.

Without evidence, both your claims are unfounded and need no further debate from your debate opponent, me, as an assertion made without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.
 
Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

BlueTex said:
Come on, it takes 2-3 seconds to copy the link from your browser history.. Just post the link.... I'm starting to think you didn't read the study...

It's kind of odd that this study isn't listed in their recommended reading..
Click to expand...

Let me try one last time:

Why don't you cut to the chase? You don't believe the number is greater than what Pew reports?

Yes/No?​
 
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