ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

ocean515 · Jul 12, 2019

Linc said:
The illegal immigrant number is 11 million as of 2018, with 8 million of those working.

Who are they working for and who will replace them?

That number is not accurate, and is likely from the grossly partisan Pew Orgainization. Recent studies from Yale put the number at over 20 million, which logically is far closer to accurate.

As to who will fill those jobs, legal residents and citizens. And think about the impact on wages.

BlueTex · Jul 12, 2019

Mycroft said:
We already have the method. Every agency collects information on every person in the country...whether they are legal or illegal.

Very few people really live off the grid.

Then why the big push to add a question to the census that would very likely skew the results?

BlueTex · Jul 12, 2019

ocean515 said:
That number is not accurate, and is likely from the grossly partisan Pew Orgainization. Recent studies from Yale put the number at over 20 million, which logically is far closer to accurate.

As to who will fill those jobs, legal residents and citizens. And think about the impact on wages.

Can you share a link to these studies? Would be interesting to read...

SCrider · Jul 12, 2019

BlueTex said:
Can you share a link to these studies? Would be interesting to read...

They say it's not accurate because it is not nearly scary enough for their political needs......

ocean515 · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

BlueTex said:
Can you share a link to these studies? Would be interesting to read...

Yale Study Finds Twice as Many Undocumented Immigrants as Previous Estimates | Yale Insights

Moving outside the Yale study, just logically consider the current number Pew has been reporting for many years. Roughly 11-12 million illegals.

Look at the number of people the CBP has reported to have apprehended on the Southwest Border over the last 5 years. It's many millions. Consider how many people successfully evade capture on the boarder. That number is calculated in the millions as well.

In order for the 11-12 million Pew reports to remain in place for so many years, 5-6 million illegal aliens would have to have left the country in the last 5 years.

There is zero evidence that has happened.

That's what makes it so easy to dismiss anything the grossly ideological Pew organization reports.

BlueTex · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

ocean515 said:
Yale Study Finds Twice as Many Undocumented Immigrants as Previous Estimates | Yale Insights

Moving outside the Yale study, just logically consider the current number Pew has been reporting for many years. Roughly 11-12 million illegals.

Look at the number of people the CBP has reported to have apprehended on the Southwest Border over the last 5 years. It's many millions. Consider how many people successfully evade capture on the boarder. That number is calculated in the millions as well.

In order for the 11-12 million Pew reports to remain in place for so many years, 5-6 million illegal aliens would have to have left the country in the last 5 years.

There is zero evidence that has happened.

That's what makes it so easy to dismiss anything the grossly ideological Pew organization reports.

Curious what your thoughts are on this response to the paper...

Commentary on “The number of undocumented immigrants in the United States: Estimates based on demographic modeling with data from 1990-2016”

BlueTex · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

ocean515 said:
Yale Study Finds Twice as Many Undocumented Immigrants as Previous Estimates | Yale Insights

Moving outside the Yale study, just logically consider the current number Pew has been reporting for many years. Roughly 11-12 million illegals.

Look at the number of people the CBP has reported to have apprehended on the Southwest Border over the last 5 years. It's many millions. Consider how many people successfully evade capture on the boarder. That number is calculated in the millions as well.

In order for the 11-12 million Pew reports to remain in place for so many years, 5-6 million illegal aliens would have to have left the country in the last 5 years.

There is zero evidence that has happened.

That's what makes it so easy to dismiss anything the grossly ideological Pew organization reports.

You know your study is in trouble when even the Center for Immigration Studies questions your results...

New Estimate of 22 Million Illegal Immigrants Is Not Plausible | Center for Immigration Studies

ocean515 · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

BlueTex said:
Curious what your thoughts are on this response to the paper...

Commentary on “The number of undocumented immigrants in the United States: Estimates based on demographic modeling with data from 1990-2016”

My thoughts? I think it's very difficult to calculate the number. It's quite clear to me the number is grossly under counted.

I believe there are political agenda's at play when such efforts are attempted.

What do you think of this research?

Illegal Aliens Estimated at 20 to 38 Million | Californians For Population Stabilization

ocean515 · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

BlueTex said:
You know your study is in trouble when even the Center for Immigration Studies questions your results...

New Estimate of 22 Million Illegal Immigrants Is Not Plausible | Center for Immigration Studies

It's not my study. The CIS questioned the PLOS One study.

Do you disagree with the Yale Study?

BlueTex · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

ocean515 said:
My thoughts? I think it's very difficult to calculate the number. It's quite clear to me the number is grossly under counted.

I believe there are political agenda's at play when such efforts are attempted.

What do you think of this research?

Illegal Aliens Estimated at 20 to 38 Million | Californians For Population Stabilization

It's an interesting press release but not the research... Did you click on the link to the research in the press release and read the research?

BlueTex · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

ocean515 said:
It's not my study. The CIS questioned the PLOS One study.

Do you disagree with the Yale Study?

PLOS One is not a study, it's a place for research to be shared... That's where the Yale study was published... CIS is disagreeing with the Yale study...

ocean515 · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

BlueTex said:
It's an interesting press release but not the research... Did you click on the link to the research in the press release and read the research?

Yes I did.

Why don't you cut to the chase? You don't believe the number is greater than what Pew reports?

Yes/No?

SCrider · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

ocean515 said:
My thoughts? I think it's very difficult to calculate the number. It's quite clear to me the number is grossly under counted.

I believe there are political agenda's at play when such efforts are attempted.

What do you think of this research?

Illegal Aliens Estimated at 20 to 38 Million | Californians For Population Stabilization

From a group with racist ties? No thanks.

ocean515 · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

SCrider said:
From a group with racist ties? No thanks.

LOL

It's always about racism with liberals. Dang, what happens when they have to come up with a legitimate argument?

SCrider · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

ocean515 said:
LOL

It's always about racism with liberals. Dang, what happens when they have to come up with a legitimate argument?

So an anti immigration group that hires known racists should be trusted to conduct a study on immigration without a bias?

ocean515 · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

SCrider said:
So an anti immigration group that hires known racists should be trusted to conduct a study on immigration without a bias?

How about the Yale Study that pegs the illegal alien population at over 20 million? Are they racists too?

BlueTex · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

ocean515 said:
Yes I did.

Why don't you cut to the chase? You don't believe the number is greater than what Pew reports?

Yes/No?

That's very odd... when I click on the link to the study in the press release, I get the following:

SCrider · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

ocean515 said:
How about the Yale Study that pegs the illegal alien population at over 20 million? Are they racists too?

So you are conceding the fact then? Good that's a start.

Idiometer · Jul 12, 2019

Mycroft said:
The census question is the easiest way to get the citizenship information, but it's not the only way. Don't forget about Obama's database.

Getting citizenship information was never the goal. The goal of having this question on the census form was intimidation, making the undocumented afraid to fill out the form, which results in undercounting the local populace in their area, which results in fewer representatives and electoral votes mostly in Democratic districts, which has been the GOP goal all along.

What Obama database do you mean?

ocean515 · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

BlueTex said:
That's very odd... when I click on the link to the study in the press release, I get the following:

View attachment 67259738

Hmmm. Worked for me, or I wouldn't have clicked on it. Just a hit from google.

Back to my question.

Yes/No?

Idiometer · Jul 12, 2019

Mycroft said:
LOL!!

22 million

Don't worry, Trump will have a more accurate number and I guarantee you it's a lot more than 22 million.

Can we quote you on that? I'm keeping a copy of that post for future references.

What makes you think Trump is even interested in getting "a more accurate number"?

SCrider · Jul 12, 2019

Idiometer said:
Getting citizenship information was never the goal. The goal of having this question on the census form was intimidation, making the undocumented afraid to fill out the form, which results in undercounting the local populace in their area, which results in fewer representatives and electoral votes mostly in Democratic districts, which has been the GOP goal all along.

What Obama database do you mean?

They want access to the secret deep state info Obama collected on all of us......

Idiometer · Jul 12, 2019

SCrider said:
They want access to the secret deep state info Obama collected on all of us......

What "deep state info"? Got a link? Got any proof at all?

ocean515 · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

SCrider said:
So you are conceding the fact then? Good that's a start.

My purpose for including the study you want to erase was not the who conducted it, but to point out the fact there are many studies all showing different numbers.

So back to the question you ignored. Are the people who conducted the Yale Study racists?

BlueTex · Jul 12, 2019

Re: ACLU Rubs it in: Trump Folds “with a whimper” on Census

ocean515 said:
Hmmm. Worked for me, or I wouldn't have clicked on it. Just a hit from google.

Back to my question.

Yes/No?

How about sending me the link so I can check it out... Since is was published 12 years ago, I would love to extrapolate their model to the latest numbers and compare...