Military and intelligence protecting US in spite of Trump

It seems the US has made some unprecedented recent cyberattacks against Russia, and implanted malware deep within the Russian electric grid which could be set off in case of rising escalations in tensions. These projects have been underway since 2012, but have been ratcheted up since last year amid rising tensions.

What is interesting is that it seems officials in the Pentagon and intelligence agencies have not reported it to the Whitehouse, partly in fear of the president’s reactions to such important safety measures, and partly because they don’t trust him to keep it secret. Apparently there were some measures passed in congress which allowed the agencies to do such things without having to report it all to the whitehouse.

Pentagon and intelligence officials describe to the Times "broad hesitation" to tell Trump about the details of the operations against Russia. They tell the Times there was concern over how Trump would react, and the possibility that Trump might reverse the operations or discuss it with foreign officials.

In 2017, Trump shared highly classified information with the Russian foreign minister and Russian ambassador to the US in a White House meeting, The Washington Post first reported and CNN later confirmed...

Trump issued new authorities last summer to the United States Cyber Command, which is part of the Pentagon and runs the US military's defensive and offensive online operations, the Times reports. The classified document gives the commander of Cyber Command, Gen. Paul Nakasone, the power to conduct offensive online operations without needing presidential approval.

...Officials at the National Security Council declined to comment to the Times, but said they had no national security concerns about the details of the Times' reporting.

www-m.cnn.com/2019/06/15/politics/us-ramping-up-cyberattacks-russia/index.html?r=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnn.com%2F

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More evidence of this “deep state” Trump supporters keep talking about? Maybe. But it’s good to know there are still people not too busy watching Fox and Friends to actually watch out for the country’s security. The country seems to be able to at least perform some basic security and governance measures, even in spite of the whitehouse circus. Thank God. Gives you some hope.

ataraxia said:

It seems the US has made some unprecedented recent cyberattacks against Russia, and implanted malware deep within the Russian electric grid which could be set off in case of rising escalations in tensions. These projects have been underway since 2012, but have been ratcheted up since last year amid rising tensions.

What is interesting is that it seems officials in the Pentagon and intelligence agencies have not reported it to the Whitehouse, partly in fear of the president’s reactions to such important safety measures, and partly because they don’t trust him to keep it secret. Apparently there were some measures passed in congress which allowed the agencies to do such things without having to report it all to the whitehouse.



More evidence of this “deep state” Trump supporters keep talking about? Maybe. But it’s good to know there are still people not too busy watching Fox and Friends to actually watch out for the country’s security. The country seems to be able to at least perform some basic security and governance measures, even in spite of the whitehouse circus. Thank God. Gives you some hope.

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I'm having a hard time deciding which is worse:

1. People who believe in rumors.

2. People who revel in rumors because they make Trump look bad.

3. News organizations who spread rumors.

4. Government employees who spread rumors.

5. Government employees who disclose the actions of US intelligence agencies.

6. News organizations who disclose the actions of US intelligence agencies.

How about you, ataraxia? Do you find any of this disturbing? Does it bother you that, now that the Russians know of this action by the US, agents might lose their lives?

Or is that okay if another rumor gets spread around by the multimedia echo chamber that will make Trump look bad? Are you calloused enough not to care as long as Trump looks bad?

ataraxia said:

It seems the US has made some unprecedented recent cyberattacks against Russia, and implanted malware deep within the Russian electric grid which could be set off in case of rising escalations in tensions. These projects have been underway since 2012, but have been ratcheted up since last year amid rising tensions.

What is interesting is that it seems officials in the Pentagon and intelligence agencies have not reported it to the Whitehouse, partly in fear of the president’s reactions to such important safety measures, and partly because they don’t trust him to keep it secret. Apparently there were some measures passed in congress which allowed the agencies to do such things without having to report it all to the whitehouse.



More evidence of this “deep state” Trump supporters keep talking about? Maybe. But it’s good to know there are still people not too busy watching Fox and Friends to actually watch out for the country’s security. The country seems to be able to at least perform some basic security and governance measures, even in spite of the whitehouse circus. Thank God. Gives you some hope.

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Good job DOD!

Mycroft said:

I'm having a hard time deciding which is worse:

1. People who believe in rumors.

2. People who revel in rumors because they make Trump look bad.

3. News organizations who spread rumors.

4. Government employees who spread rumors.

5. Government employees who disclose the actions of US intelligence agencies.

6. News organizations who disclose the actions of US intelligence agencies.

How about you, ataraxia? Do you find any of this disturbing? Does it bother you that, now that the Russians know of this action by the US, agents might lose their lives?

Or is that okay if another rumor gets spread around by the multimedia echo chamber that will make Trump look bad? Are you calloused enough not to care as long as Trump looks bad?

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DOD said they had no national security problems with the NY Times reporting.

It's about time we pushed back. Let's empower the radicals, expose the regime's leadership, incite riots and civil disturbance, conduct false flags and otherwise bring total chaos to Russia. Burn it down.

TrueScotsman said:

DOD said they had no national security problems with the NY Times reporting.

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shrug...if you say so. That unlinked blurb from the OP didn't say that.

Mycroft said:

I'm having a hard time deciding which is worse:

1. People who believe in rumors.

2. People who revel in rumors because they make Trump look bad.

3. News organizations who spread rumors.

4. Government employees who spread rumors.

5. Government employees who disclose the actions of US intelligence agencies.

6. News organizations who disclose the actions of US intelligence agencies.

How about you, ataraxia? Do you find any of this disturbing? Does it bother you that, now that the Russians know of this action by the US, agents might lose their lives?

Or is that okay if another rumor gets spread around by the multimedia echo chamber that will make Trump look bad? Are you calloused enough not to care as long as Trump looks bad?

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1) why do you assume these are rumors? Unlike Fox News, everything reported by the Times so far has turned out to be actually true. But we are still waiting to see Obama’s secret Kenyan birth certificate. The NYT has proven to be a breathtakingly accurate, prescient, and reliable news source. There is no equivalence to the trash on the right.

2) Trump needs no help looking bad. Just watching videos of him talking at his rallies is embarrassing enough.

ecofarm said:

It's about time we pushed back. I hope we create chaos that burns Putin's regime down.

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Now that Putin knows, it's doubtful anything will be burned...except the operation that got burned.

Mycroft said:

shrug...if you say so. That unlinked blurb from the OP didn't say that.

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It did at the end. Now that the deed is done, they may be OK with the Russians knowing the country is not the fool it’s president makes it seem like it is. There are still people actually watching out for it.

I think its possible the DOD purposefully leaked this information to the NY Times to inform Russia its in place. What's the purpose of an anti-escalation measure if your opponent doesn't know you have it. It's like that scene in Dr. Strange Love where they wonder why they couldn't have warned the US about the Doomsday Machine, as it defeated the whole purpose for it. The pride of the leader it turns out, had caused a delay because he wanted to give a fancy speech. Thankfully reality is not like the movies though.

Mycroft said:

Now that Putin knows, it's doubtful anything will be burned...except the operation that got burned.

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Putin can't stop a concerted effort. We can burn it down.




Wake, sleeping giant. Russia must burn.

Mycroft said:

shrug...if you say so. That unlinked blurb from the OP didn't say that.

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Let me help.

Officials at the National Security Council declined to comment to the Times, but said they had no national security concerns about the details of the Times' reporting.

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Link: New York Times: US ramping up cyber attacks on Russia - CNNPolitics

The sources were two Pentagon/intelligence officials, who provided the additional information about Trump not being briefed.

What’s funny is that despite these very serious foreign security threats, Trump and his supporters think that the real threat is some desperate families fleeing violence seeking asylum at our border. And the way to really address the country’s security is by ripping 5-year-olds away from their moms. It’d be more funny if it wasn’t so sad, and so obviously racist. Their racism has blinded them to the real threats facing them.

ataraxia said:

1) why do you assume these are rumors? Unlike Fox News, everything reported by the Times so far has turned out to be actually true. But we are still waiting to see Obama’s secret Kenyan birth certificate. The NYT has proven to be a breathtakingly accurate, prescient, and reliable news source. There is no equivalence to the trash on the right.

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They are rumors because this is the usual case of "someone told a reporter that they think something happened for some reason". There are no established facts. None. No named sources, no proof that what they say happened and no proof that it happened for the reasons they "believe" it happened.

That's called "a rumor".

But...you are either pretending not to know things, are actually ignorant of things or know things but are lying about them. I'll let you decide which is the case.

The NYT has a history of very shoddy reporting that has been well documented.

The New York Times controversies - Wikipedia

The New York Times history of false reporting exposed by TimesWatch - NaturalNews.com

CNN.com - New York Times: Reporter routinely faked articles - May. 11, 2003

FAKE NEWS: New York Times Caught MAKING-UP False Quote From Trump's CPAC Speech

2) Trump needs no help looking bad. Just watching videos of him talking at his rallies is embarrassing enough.

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If that were true, then the NYT and the echo chamber wouldn't need to make up rumors.

ataraxia said:

What’s funny is that despite these very serious foreign security threats, Trump and his supporters think that the real threat is some desperate families fleeing violence seeking asylum at our border. And the way to really address the country’s security is by ripping 5-year-olds away from their moms. It’d be more funny if it wasn’t so sad, and so obviously racist. Their racism has blinded them to the real threats facing them.

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AWESOME!!

You are now deflecting from your own thread topic.

You lose!

If true:

1. The level of hypocrisy of screaming RUSSIAN COLLUSION!!! - while we were doing that back to 2012 is an astonishing degree of hypocrisy. With us engaging in that level of attack against Russia, if Russia ONLY tried to influence our election shows we, not they, are the worst attackers by far.

2. Any general who decided that he doesn't trust the President so proactively kept it secret FROM HIS COMMANDER should be busted down to a private and thrown out of the military.

3. That some general has the ability to personally start WW3 with Russia - without even informing the President or Congress or higher ups in the military - is truly stunning, totally outrageous, exactly grotesquely unconstitutional, and of totally intolerable danger - indicating that at least some secret conspiracy within the military has essentially already executed a coup against our civil government - or they believe they have.

ANYONE involved in that program should be fired from government if civilian government, and minimally busted to a private for calculating retirement and busted out of the military - plus a court martial on their military records. Allowing them ANY retirement and instead a dishonorable discharge is extremely generous on my part.

However, I think the whole story is a lie. Not tell President Trump in 2017 about a program in existence since 2012, but issued a press release about it to the NYT? in 2019?? NOTHING is believable about that.

ataraxia said:

It seems the US has made some unprecedented recent cyberattacks against Russia, and implanted malware deep within the Russian electric grid which could be set off in case of rising escalations in tensions. These projects have been underway since 2012, but have been ratcheted up since last year amid rising tensions.

What is interesting is that it seems officials in the Pentagon and intelligence agencies have not reported it to the Whitehouse, partly in fear of the president’s reactions to such important safety measures, and partly because they don’t trust him to keep it secret. Apparently there were some measures passed in congress which allowed the agencies to do such things without having to report it all to the whitehouse.



More evidence of this “deep state” Trump supporters keep talking about? Maybe. But it’s good to know there are still people not too busy watching Fox and Friends to actually watch out for the country’s security. The country seems to be able to at least perform some basic security and governance measures, even in spite of the whitehouse circus. Thank God. Gives you some hope.

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There was a time, three years ago or so, that liberals believed decisions about attacking other countries should be made by elected officials. Now they celebrate unaccountable bureaucrats acting unilaterally because Orange Man Bad.

TrueScotsman said:

Let me help.


Link: New York Times: US ramping up cyber attacks on Russia - CNNPolitics

The sources were two Pentagon/intelligence officials, who provided the additional information about Trump not being briefed.

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Intelligence officers who refused to brief the President because they did not trust him with super classified info deciding instead to brief the NYT on it should be charged with espionage and criminally divulging national security secrets - to be locked up in solitary in a super max so they don't divulge any more top national security secrets.

joko104 said:

Intelligence officers who refused to brief the President because they did not trust him with super classified info deciding instead to brief the NYT on it should be charged with espionage and criminally divulging national security secrets - to be locked up in solitary in a super max so they don't divulge any more top national security secrets.

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Yeah you would think. But the article says that Trump and congress passed measures that allowed the cyber team at the Pentagon to legally do it with having to report to him. Maybe Trump realized he doesn’t want to be bothered while watching reruns of this his Fox and Friends show. It’s common knowledge that he watches more TV than any other president. He also plays more golf. He is more interested in what Hannity, Coulter, and Limbaugh say than what any nerdy wonk at the Pentagon or the CIA say. They are losers. He knows more than the generals, believe me. What can they tell him that’s worth hearing, a bunch of boring eggheads? He has had fewer briefings by them than any other president. He made it clear from day one he is not interested. It’s boring. Hannity is so much more fun to listen to! He says good things about him, and that’s what it’s all about, right?

So maybe the reasoning behind passing those measures to allow the Pentagon to do this without having to report to him was to let those nerdy wonks at the Pentagon just do whatever things it is that they do without bothering his favorite TV programming and golf games. It gives him time to listen to his adoring crowds at his rallies tell him was he is making America Great Again by finally stepping up to protect America- he’ll show those criminal 5-year-olds fleeing violence with their families at the border what’s what here in America. Don’t mess with us!

But somebody’s gotta do the work. He probably sees this as the kind of work the maids and butlers do- the unimportant dirty day-to-day work. But he can’t be bothered with the details.

So don’t assume he is interested in hearing this stuff in the first place. Very unlikely. This way, everyone wins- he gets to watch more TV and play golf, his fans are happy he is making America Great Again, and the country still gets run. Win- win!

AmNat said:

There was a time, three years ago or so, that liberals believed decisions about attacking other countries should be made by elected officials. Now they celebrate unaccountable bureaucrats acting unilaterally because Orange Man Bad.

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This may surprise the simple minded right wing but most people understand that different situations require different responses

Mycroft said:

I'm having a hard time deciding which is worse:

1. People who believe in rumors.

2. People who revel in rumors because they make Trump look bad.

3. News organizations who spread rumors.

4. Government employees who spread rumors.

5. Government employees who disclose the actions of US intelligence agencies.

6. News organizations who disclose the actions of US intelligence agencies.

How about you, ataraxia? Do you find any of this disturbing? Does it bother you that, now that the Russians know of this action by the US, agents might lose their lives?

Or is that okay if another rumor gets spread around by the multimedia echo chamber that will make Trump look bad? Are you calloused enough not to care as long as Trump looks bad?

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'Agents' know what their job entails and the risks involved. If they get killed while spying, who cares, send another one. Chances are you'd never get to hear about it anyway. Agencies involved in covert activities don't usually advertise what they've been doing.

ecofarm said:

It's about time we pushed back. Let's empower the radicals, expose the regime's leadership, incite riots and civil disturbance, conduct false flags and otherwise bring total chaos to Russia. Burn it down.

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Good luck with that and hoping Russia will do nothing but cower.

snakestretcher said:

'Agents' know what their job entails and the risks involved. If they get killed while spying, who cares, send another one. Chances are you'd never get to hear about it anyway. Agencies involved in covert activities don't usually advertise what they've been doing.

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Except in this case where we have alleged government employees telling the world about covert activities.

Seriously...did my point really sail right over your head?

You are dismissed.

Mycroft said:

Except in this case where we have alleged government employees telling the world about covert activities.

Seriously...did my point really sail right over your head?

You are dismissed.

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'Alleged' (a rumour). Dismiss yourself; who are you, my school teacher?

Mycroft said:

I'm having a hard time deciding which is worse:

1. People who believe in rumors.

2. People who revel in rumors because they make Trump look bad.

3. News organizations who spread rumors.

4. Government employees who spread rumors.

5. Government employees who disclose the actions of US intelligence agencies.

6. News organizations who disclose the actions of US intelligence agencies.

How about you, ataraxia? Do you find any of this disturbing? Does it bother you that, now that the Russians know of this action by the US, agents might lose their lives?

Or is that okay if another rumor gets spread around by the multimedia echo chamber that will make Trump look bad? Are you calloused enough not to care as long as Trump looks bad?

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Think of the combination of the NYT and CNN.

With the hundreds of times both have been busted for spreading what can only be defined as propaganda, why would anyone buy into their spin or bark at their dog whistles?