• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Time for War with Iran

S

Slavister

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 8, 2018
Messages
11,128
Reaction score
8,158
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
I will go ahead and go all the way DOWN to the level of the President and predict that current sitting President will try to attack Iran to get reelected.

Trump tweets said:
29 Nov 2011: In order to get elected, @BarackObama will start a war with Iran.
17 Jan 2012: @BarackObama will attack Iran in order to get re-elected.
9 Oct 2012: Now that Obama's poll numbers are in tailspin watch for him to launch a strike in Libya or Iran. He is desperate.
16 Sep 2013: I predict that President Obama will at some point attack Iran in order to save face!
25 Sep 2013: Remember what I previously said–Obama will someday attack Iran in order to show how tough he is
Click to expand...

Truth is there might be enough advisors around him that will refuse his orders or get the war averted but what we know so far...

He clearly views this as a strategy worth pursuing and that helps with reelection.
He clearly does not mind doing very questionable things to get reelected.
He hired war hawks like Bolton and Pompeo to lead him to war.
He had asked already about USA invading other countries (e.g. Venezuela in 2017):
Trump administration is starting to lay down the groundwork for pretext: today they accused Iran of various acts, including:
- recent attacks on oil tankers... no real evidence was provided
- 'on May 19th, a rocket landed near the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad' USA never claimed Iran was the cause
- 'on May 31st, a car bomb in Afghanistan wounded four U.S. service members, killed four Afghan civilians, and wounded bystanders' Actually Taliban took responsibility for that one, but who cares, right?

Pompeo said:
these unprovoked attacks present a clear threat to international peace and security, a blatant assault on the freedom of navigation, and an unacceptable campaign of escalating tension by Iran....Today, I have instructed our UN Ambassador Jonathan Cohen to raise Iran’s attacks in the UN Security Council meeting later this afternoon
Click to expand...

With 17 months left to election, Trump is starting to lay the groundwork for attacking Iran for his reelection. Seems a bit too soon to me but maybe they figure it will take 6 months to a year to prepare and to rally up the country.
 
Last edited:
He's the one who ripped up the Iran deal. If it leads to war then it's on him. The American people are tired of wasting money on Middle East wars.
 
I don't think Americans have the appetitite to send more American sons and daughters to fight another fracas in the Middle East.

Let Trump send one of his sons to fight.
 
Slavister said:
I will go ahead and go all the way DOWN to the level of the President and predict that current sitting President will try to attack Iran to get reelected.



Truth is there might be enough advisors around him that will refuse his orders or get the war averted but what we know so far...

He clearly views this as a strategy worth pursuing and that helps with reelection.
He clearly does not mind doing very questionable things to get reelected.
He hired war hawks like Bolton and Pompeo to lead him to war.
He had asked already about USA invading other countries (e.g. Venezuela in 2017):
Trump administration is starting to lay down the groundwork for pretext: today they accused Iran of various acts, including:
- recent attacks on oil tankers... no real evidence was provided
- 'on May 19th, a rocket landed near the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad' USA never claimed Iran was the cause
- 'on May 31st, a car bomb in Afghanistan wounded four U.S. service members, killed four Afghan civilians, and wounded bystanders' Actually Taliban took responsibility for that one, but who cares, right?



With 17 months left to election, Trump is starting to lay the groundwork for attacking Iran for his reelection. Seems a bit too soon to me but maybe they figure it will take 6 months to a year to prepare and to rally up the country.
Click to expand...

Trump seems to follow a pattern of putting it on really hard, and then pulling back and then looking ridiculous while telling his supporters what a great success he's had.


There's North Korea, where he "an aircraft carrier" (okay, it went to Singapore, but the North Koreans didn't know this) and talked about war. Then he thought Kim was giving in, so he relaxed and then Kim started up again and Trump acted like Kim was amazing.

There's Venezuela, big talk about war then nothing.

Now Iran, talk about war again.
 
The Iranian hardliners already believe our two nations are in an economic war, and daily threaten to attack the US with a hot war. Should they be stupid enough to set off a terrorist bomb on US territory, no matter who is in the presidential seat, all hell will be delivered in return. The US has not forgotten the hostage taking at the Iranian US embassy, an invasion of US soil. Our military establishment has been waiting patiently for an excuse to retaliate, not only for this action but other proxy actions taken by Iran against US interests, from the bombing of the Marine barracks in Lebanon and much more.

Pray I am wrong, but don't be foolish and think this is all on Trump's rhetorical head. He did not pull out of that well violated agreement without good cause. Be afraid. Be very afraid.

Should Liz Warren win the election, expect the Iranians to act. They perceive her to be a weakness, a woman in charge. An opportunity to strike and make a point. She will have to prove she has balls. Amerika will be screaming "Death to the Iranians, death to Satan!" Appeasement did not work with Hitler, it will not work with the Iranians.
 
OldFatGuy said:
He did not pull out of that well violated agreement without good cause.
Click to expand...
Yes he did. Your comment here is unequivocally false. There was ZERO reason to pull out of the deal, which is why the other countries stayed in it. Trump just pulled out of it because it was Obama who had negotiated it. Iran was complying.

Why would you post a lie like this?

Be afraid. Be very afraid.
Click to expand...
You're saying we should be afraid that Trump is actively trying to start an unnecessary war with Iran? Isn't that the point of the thread?

Should Liz Warren win the election, expect the Iranians to act. They perceive her to be a weakness, a woman in charge. An opportunity to strike and make a point. She will have to prove she has balls. Amerika will be screaming "Death to the Iranians, death to Satan!" Appeasement did not work with Hitler, it will not work with the Iranians.
Click to expand...
What are you talking about? Do you even know?
 
Slavister said:
I will go ahead and go all the way DOWN to the level of the President and predict that current sitting President will try to attack Iran to get reelected.



Truth is there might be enough advisors around him that will refuse his orders or get the war averted but what we know so far...

He clearly views this as a strategy worth pursuing and that helps with reelection.
He clearly does not mind doing very questionable things to get reelected.
He hired war hawks like Bolton and Pompeo to lead him to war.
He had asked already about USA invading other countries (e.g. Venezuela in 2017):
Trump administration is starting to lay down the groundwork for pretext: today they accused Iran of various acts, including:
- recent attacks on oil tankers... no real evidence was provided
- 'on May 19th, a rocket landed near the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad' USA never claimed Iran was the cause
- 'on May 31st, a car bomb in Afghanistan wounded four U.S. service members, killed four Afghan civilians, and wounded bystanders' Actually Taliban took responsibility for that one, but who cares, right?



With 17 months left to election, Trump is starting to lay the groundwork for attacking Iran for his reelection. Seems a bit too soon to me but maybe they figure it will take 6 months to a year to prepare and to rally up the country.
Click to expand...



I think it's about the Saudi and Israel's money. Trump's enriched himself at every turn. He runs his admin like he knows it's only going to one term.

I think the Saudi's staged the attack on the two tankers. I think it's a backroom deal to start a war with Iran. I think the US is staging the evidence.

I think Trump is getting paid. And possibly setting up an escape route to avoid prosecution after the election.


I can't prove any of it. But it makes the most sense to me.

Iran gains nothing, no benefit, from sanctions and war. What good is raised oil prices if no one is buying from you and you got drones bombing your kids schools flown by teenagers chugging mountain dew in a mini mall in TX.

What does make sense, is Trump thinking if they timed the attacks right when he sends Japan to put in a good word, a scene will happen.

I for one, have no interest in a war with Iran. I don't trust Trump. And for once I agree with the Ayatollah when he said there wasn't anything to say to Trump.

If he drags us into another war in the middle east for his own selfish reasons, I will be in the protests . And there will be protests.
 
You would have to be truly stupid to believe we will go to war with Iran.
 
OldFatGuy said:
The Iranian hardliners already believe our two nations are in an economic war, and daily threaten to attack the US with a hot war. Should they be stupid enough to set off a terrorist bomb on US territory, no matter who is in the presidential seat, all hell will be delivered in return. The US has not forgotten the hostage taking at the Iranian US embassy, an invasion of US soil. Our military establishment has been waiting patiently for an excuse to retaliate, not only for this action but other proxy actions taken by Iran against US interests, from the bombing of the Marine barracks in Lebanon and much more.

Pray I am wrong, but don't be foolish and think this is all on Trump's rhetorical head. He did not pull out of that well violated agreement without good cause. Be afraid. Be very afraid.

Should Liz Warren win the election, expect the Iranians to act. They perceive her to be a weakness, a woman in charge. An opportunity to strike and make a point. She will have to prove she has balls. Amerika will be screaming "Death to the Iranians, death to Satan!" Appeasement did not work with Hitler, it will not work with the Iranians.
Click to expand...

Death to Satan? Really, dude? Any American who screams that is as bat **** crazy as the Muslim extremists. If you can't see the oil tanker "attacks" are a false flag operation, you're blind.

If you really think Iran is stupid enough to attack us because Elizabeth Warren is president, you're mad too. Who is the president does not change ANYTHING about the American military's operational readiness. If you don't think cowboy Trump's failed missions and intellectual deficit don't make HIM look weak, you're not paying attention. The Iranians know, however, that the weakness in the whitehouse stops there. There are enough competent people in the organization to compensate for Trump's stupidity and bravado.
 
Slyfox696 said:
Yes he did. Your comment here is unequivocally false. There was ZERO reason to pull out of the deal, which is why the other countries stayed in it. Trump just pulled out of it because it was Obama who had negotiated it. Iran was complying.

Why would you post a lie like this?

You're saying we should be afraid that Trump is actively trying to start an unnecessary war with Iran? Isn't that the point of the thread?

What are you talking about? Do you even know?
Click to expand...

I'm glad you know more than anyone else about Iran's uranium enrichment program. Iran itself has admitted it enrichment program has expanded during the period following the agreement. Yet you know otherwise.

Don't tell me what I am saying. I have been very clear, Iran's behavior, whether direct or by proxy has been one of war, and not merely since Trump has been in office. Today two more tankers suffered explosions in the Strait of Hormuz. Iran radio declared Iran is responsible for security in the Strait. Mines laid by the Iranian National Guard were responsible for those attacks on unarmed tankers. Your apologetic appeasement pontificating and laying blame at Trump's feet is not a solution.

Whine all you want, tell me I don't have a clue as you whine. Meanwhile Iranian aggression continues and grows more heated. Iranian leadership is tenuous as the sanctions take their tolls, and desperation for maintenance of power domestically is growing exponentially as the Iranian people suffer from decades of belligerence, but you know better. Iranian leadership believes if there is a hot war, Iranian nationalism will rise to create a cohesive force to fight all comers. A replay of the Iraqi Iranian war. But they have made themselves into a pariah among other nations, including former allies like Pakistan and North Korea, both facing their own problems and adversaries. Maybe they think China will come to the rescue, wanting their oil and other resources, but China's two largest markets are the US and Europe, it cannot afford to offend either as the trade war already threatens their plans for growing their middle-class. Iran is a pissant nothing to them, just another pawn in the game of thrones.

But you know more.

Having fought in combat, the last thing I want is war. I know first hand its misery and destruction of the soul. You, and those like you who have never experienced real war, see it in the abstract and have no idea of the horrors that await for both losers and those who conquer and vanquish. War is likely coming, and blame will accomplish nothing for partisans seeking false moral superiority. Especially with little or no understanding of the forces in play. This isn't about you or what you want, it is about the realities of those who enjoy inflicting death and destruction, with all causes mere subterfuges for the evil within. I pray I am wrong, and the gods, if they are real, are listening and willing to act to prevent what I envision.

But you know more.
 
D_NATURED said:
Death to Satan? Really, dude? Any American who screams that is as bat **** crazy as the Muslim extremists. If you can't see the oil tanker "attacks" are a false flag operation, you're blind.

If you really think Iran is stupid enough to attack us because Elizabeth Warren is president, you're mad too. Who is the president does not change ANYTHING about the American military's operational readiness. If you don't think cowboy Trump's failed missions and intellectual deficit don't make HIM look weak, you're not paying attention. The Iranians know, however, that the weakness in the whitehouse stops there. There are enough competent people in the organization to compensate for Trump's stupidity and bravado.
Click to expand...

Uh huh. Must be a conspiracy. :spin::rofl:eek:
 
How about we not go to war, and just tell the media we bombed the everloving crap out of Iran...fake news can be a good thing, right?

win win for everyone and we can all drink beer and listen to Lee Greenwood on the surround sound.
 
OldFatGuy said:
I'm glad you know more than anyone else about Iran's uranium enrichment program.
Click to expand...
I don't, I'm just going by what IAEA is saying.

How come you seem to think you know more than the agency specifically intended to investigate it? You are saying things which directly contradict their findings. So I don't know more than anyone else, I'm just going by what the agency who investigates it is saying.

You, on the other hand, are just making up things that have no basis in reality.

Iran itself has admitted it enrichment program has expanded during the period following the agreement. Yet you know otherwise.
Click to expand...
Gosh, if only we knew how the US Government felt about it. Oh wait, we do:

Secretary of State Rex Tillerson recertified Iran's compliance with the 2015 nuclear deal late Monday...Under U.S. law, the State Department is required to recertify to Congress Iran's compliance with the nuclear deal every 90 days.
Click to expand...

State Department Certifies Iran's Compliance With Nuclear Deal : The Two-Way : NPR


So, let's see. The agency tasked with regulating the deal is saying Iran is complying with the deal and the US Government said Iran was complying with the deal. But OldFatGuy says he knows better.

You're making things up. Whether you are simply ignorant or dishonest, I could not care less. But you're wrong. Trump had no good faith basis to pull out of the agreement, he only did it because Obama negotiated it.

Don't tell me what I am saying.
Click to expand...
Then say something truthful and stop making statements which are false.

But you know more.
Click to expand...
No, I just know what every agency responsible for monitoring the deal is saying. You, on the other hand, are making things up.

Having fought in combat, the last thing I want is war. I know first hand its misery and destruction of the soul. You, and those like you who have never experienced real war, see it in the abstract and have no idea of the horrors that await for both losers and those who conquer and vanquish. War is likely coming, and blame will accomplish nothing for partisans seeking false moral superiority. Especially with little or no understanding of the forces in play. This isn't about you or what you want, it is about the realities of those who enjoy inflicting death and destruction, with all causes mere subterfuges for the evil within. I pray I am wrong, and the gods, if they are real, are listening and willing to act to prevent what I envision.

But you know more.
Click to expand...
What the hell are you talking about? Do you even know?

There is literally ZERO reason for a war, except for the Trump Administration actively seeking it. How about you stop ranting about things which are not only not true but also not relevant and just acknowledge Iran is/was complying with the nuclear deal and that the only people who want war with Iran is the President and the foreign governments who helped get him elected?

In short, stop posting lies.
 
Last edited:
Slavister said:
I will go ahead and go all the way DOWN to the level of the President and predict that current sitting President will try to attack Iran to get reelected.



Truth is there might be enough advisors around him that will refuse his orders or get the war averted but what we know so far...

He clearly views this as a strategy worth pursuing and that helps with reelection.
He clearly does not mind doing very questionable things to get reelected.
He hired war hawks like Bolton and Pompeo to lead him to war.
He had asked already about USA invading other countries (e.g. Venezuela in 2017):
Trump administration is starting to lay down the groundwork for pretext: today they accused Iran of various acts, including:
- recent attacks on oil tankers... no real evidence was provided
- 'on May 19th, a rocket landed near the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad' USA never claimed Iran was the cause
- 'on May 31st, a car bomb in Afghanistan wounded four U.S. service members, killed four Afghan civilians, and wounded bystanders' Actually Taliban took responsibility for that one, but who cares, right?



With 17 months left to election, Trump is starting to lay the groundwork for attacking Iran for his reelection. Seems a bit too soon to me but maybe they figure it will take 6 months to a year to prepare and to rally up the country.
Click to expand...

I'm not much given to conspiracy theories, but which small Middle Eastern nation has been itching to start a war with Iran for decades? My suspicion is that the Hormuz mines were an Israeli false flag. It wouldn't be the first time either. Lavon Affair?
 
Last edited:
OldFatGuy said:
The Iranian hardliners already believe our two nations are in an economic war, and daily threaten to attack the US with a hot war. Should they be stupid enough to set off a terrorist bomb on US territory, no matter who is in the presidential seat, all hell will be delivered in return. The US has not forgotten the hostage taking at the Iranian US embassy, an invasion of US soil. Our military establishment has been waiting patiently for an excuse to r
etaliate, not only for this action but other proxy actions taken by Iran against US interests, from the bombing of the Marine barracks in Lebanon and much more.

Pray I am wrong, but don't be foolish and think this is all on Trump's rhetorical head. He did not pull out of that well violated agreement without good cause. Be afraid. Be very afraid.

Should Liz Warren win the election, expect the Iranians to act. They perceive her to be a weakness, a woman in charge. An opportunity to strike and make a point. She will have to prove she has balls. Amerika will be screaming "Death to the Iranians, death to Satan!" Appeasement did not work with Hitler, it will not work with the Iranians.
Click to expand...

Iran, according to the IAEA (and they should know), was in full compliance with the deal. Trump reneged.
Iran still holding up its end of nuclear deal, IAEA report shows - Reuters
You really should try to keep up with events, and not rely on what your liar-in-chief feeds you as 'truth'.
 
Wouldn't count out a Bolton conspiracy and false flag, honestly. Until we have more info, I will wait to condemn anyone in specific.
 
snakestretcher said:
Iran, according to the IAEA (and they should know), was in full compliance with the deal. Trump reneged.
Click to expand...
Not just the IAEA, but also the US State Department said Iran was in full compliance.

OldFatGuy is literally making up things which are not true.
 
OldFatGuy said:
I'm glad you know more than anyone else about Iran's uranium enrichment program. Iran itself has admitted it enrichment program has expanded during the period following the agreement. Yet you know otherwise.

Don't tell me what I am saying. I have been very clear, Iran's behavior, whether direct or by proxy has been one of war, and not merely since Trump has been in office. Today two more tankers suffered explosions in the Strait of Hormuz. Iran radio declared Iran is responsible for security in the Strait. Mines laid by the Iranian National Guard were responsible for those attacks on unarmed tankers. Your apologetic appeasement pontificating and laying blame at Trump's feet is not a solution.

Whine all you want, tell me I don't have a clue as you whine. Meanwhile Iranian aggression continues and grows more heated. Iranian leadership is tenuous as the sanctions take their tolls, and desperation for maintenance of power domestically is growing exponentially as the Iranian people suffer from decades of belligerence, but you know better. Iranian leadership believes if there is a hot war, Iranian nationalism will rise to create a cohesive force to fight all comers. A replay of the Iraqi Iranian war. But they have made themselves into a pariah among other nations, including former allies like Pakistan and North Korea, both facing their own problems and adversaries. Maybe they think China will come to the rescue, wanting their oil and other resources, but China's two largest markets are the US and Europe, it cannot afford to offend either as the trade war already threatens their plans for growing their middle-class. Iran is a pissant nothing to them, just another pawn in the game of thrones.

But you know more.

Having fought in combat, the last thing I want is war. I know first hand its misery and destruction of the soul. You, and those like you who have never experienced real war, see it in the abstract and have no idea of the horrors that await for both losers and those who conquer and vanquish. War is likely coming, and blame will accomplish nothing for partisans seeking false moral superiority. Especially with little or no understanding of the forces in play. This isn't about you or what you want, it is about the realities of those who enjoy inflicting death and destruction, with all causes mere subterfuges for the evil within. I pray I am wrong, and the gods, if they are real, are listening and willing to act to prevent what I envision.

But you know more.
Click to expand...

What evidence do you have other than 'Pompeo says so'? None; and Pompeo hasn't presented any either. No, this is just more lies and bluster, just Iraq's mysteriously vanishing WMD, mobile chemical weapons plants and Al Qaeda underground command centres were total fabrications.
 
Last edited:
ajn678 said:
You would have to be truly stupid to believe we will go to war with Iran.
Click to expand...

Trump believed it. Check the OP. Thanks for confirming you think he is stupid.

OldFatGuy said:
Iran itself has admitted it enrichment program has expanded during the period following the agreement.
Click to expand...

Really? Do you have any proof that it did so after Obama agreement and before Trump tore it down? And when you DO provide your proof, make sure it states to what level they enriched it. 2015 agreement is fine with them enriching it to 3.67% limit (usable for a power plant but far below what’s needed for an atomic weapon).

OldFatGuy said:
Iran radio declared Iran is responsible for security in the Strait.
Click to expand...

Did Iran say they blew up the tankers?

OldFatGuy said:
Mines laid by the Iranian National Guard were responsible for those attacks on unarmed tankers.
Click to expand...

Proof?

OldFatGuy said:
Having fought in combat, the last thing I want is war.
Click to expand...

Yet you are very eager to get into one without having any provable reasons. During Cold War there have been many more proven Soviet indirect attacks and provocations. Were you just as eager to go to war then?

OldFatGuy said:
War is likely coming
Click to expand...

Great, Trump's propaganda is working on his base...

OldFatGuy said:
I pray I am wrong, and the gods, if they are real, are listening and willing to act to prevent what I envision.
Click to expand...

Yeah, because prayer to Gods has a good track record of preventing wars, right?
 
Last edited:
Bum said:
Bad idea.
Click to expand...
Really bad idea.

SonOfDaedalus said:
He's the one who ripped up the Iran deal. If it leads to war then it's on him. The American people are tired of wasting money on Middle East wars.
Click to expand...
Exactly! The public should be reminded of this continually throughout whatever actions the Trump administration takes.
 
Slyfox696 said:
In short, stop posting lies.
Click to expand...

OK, Iran did not admit increasing it uranium enrichment program during the period after it signed the agreement, did not claim responsibility for securing the straits, and the Revolutionary Guard did not lay mines in the Straits. Iran has not backed proxies of terror throughout the world and the US is the great satan.

How's that for a pack of lies? And btw, the League of Nations inspectors said "Germany is not rearming," even as German dive bombers were crushing Guernica.

The blind man picked up the hammer and saw.
 
snakestretcher said:
What evidence do you have other than 'Pompeo says so'? None; and Pompeo hasn't presented any either. No, this is just more lies and bluster, just Iraq's mysteriously vanishing WMD, mobile chemical weapons plants and Al Qaeda underground command centres were total fabrications.
Click to expand...

Pompeo is a joke. Your cries for appeasement are nothing new, and remember where they got you last time. Stiff upper lip and all that.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom