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Why We Need a Wealth Tax

Mason66 said:
You think a man who makes his own money is taking something from society?
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Absolutely. Name me one who hasn't. The view that they don't is part of the right-wing cult dogma. The literal answer is, 'yes, he's a counterfeiter' though if he "makes his own money".
 
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OscarLevant said:
Sen. Warren has the right policy proposal

Republicans today are against a wealth tax which is another reason to vote for a Democrat in 20/20



I've been for this idea long before Senator Warren even brought it to the national attention. It's the only way to thwart the Dynasty-ism that is growing
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Robert Reich is a democrat party hack with stupid ideas designed to empower democrats in politics for the purpose of getting their hands on federal money for themselves and their friends. Moveon.org is backed by one of the richest dirtiest communists in the US and their goal is to rob the rich to give to themselves and their friends.
 
Craig234 said:
And yet you support, presumably, EVERY wealth redistribution from everyone to the most rich, trillions of dollars - cut their taxes, add to the public debt; let them pollute for free, pay the cleanup costs from tax dollars, etc.
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Do not prevaricate about what I support with presumption and assumption. You project with a broad brush as you paint social villains from your nightmares having nothing to do with reality.

Make up your mind, do you abhor Trump's tax cuts, or his raising taxes via tariffs? Which is it? The Federal government has enjoyed its greatest amount of the revenue collection during 2018, increased by 1.7 trillion dollars.
 
RedAkston said:
Where did I say that I didn't pay my taxes? Oh that's right, I didn't. I suppose you could make a viable argument at some point, but it has yet to be done.
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Well I assumed you were aware that theft was illegal in this country. Surely someone who was so strong in his convictions that taxation was theft would file suit to recoup the damages he/she suffered as the victim of theft. I mean, it’s not that we don’t know the identity of the alleged perpetrator of the theft. So I wish you luck in your upcoming suit against the US Government.
 
RedAkston said:
Taxes are theft because one could face imprisonment or confiscation of additional personal property for failure to pay. It doesn't matter if you or I agree or disagree as to whether some taxes are theft or not because they absolutely are, sorry to be the bearer of bad news.
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OK talk about terrible arguments.

Under this logic, if a thief breaks in and steals my TV (theft), you saying the reason it is theft is because I could face imprisonment for failure to give him my DVD player as well. THAT is truly a terrible and dumb argument.
 
RedAkston said:
I don't have a problem with property taxes or sales tax. In fact, as I stated previously in this thread, I'm all for a flat tax on when one spends their money. I have a serious problem with a so-called "wealth tax" as it's a money redistribution grab on money that has already been taxed.
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Point of correction. “Wealth” as defined above (especially for the top x%) most likely has NOT previously been taxed. Wealth by definition includes unrealized appreciation on property/asset values.
 
Mr Person said:
Once. Estate tax is applied once. You are talking about a yearly set of assessments. An incredibly burdensome thing where the targets of this tax have to constantly update the value of just about everything they own, and an army of assessors if it has any hope of being enforced in a remotely equitable manner. How on Earth is there any reasonable hope of this working let alone working in a fair manner when we can't even properly police income tax payments?
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Exactly. And this is probably the major reason I’m against the proposal in the OP.

If we’re going down this path of taxing wealth to raise revenue, I’d much rather see it be done via lowering estate tax exemptions and/or raising the estate tax rate.
 
Craig234 said:
I didn't say they can't have a billion dollar yacht, I said they can't use it as an excuse not to pay a wealth tax.
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How many times should somebody pay taxes on the same money?
 
OldFatGuy said:
You don't know what justice is. Wealth redistribution is not justice. It is theft. Simple and plain.
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You are entitled to your opinions, but you are not entitled to your own facts.

Taxes are what is legislated by the elected. If you want to call a particular tax theft, that's an emotional statement, but not a statement of fact.

Apparently you are unable to grasp the difference. All taxes are a form of "wealth distribution".

So, are you against taxation? It's a yes or no answer. If you are arguing " I don't like that tax, but I iike that one", that is a yes answer, that you do not believe taxes are theft, and the debate is not 'theft' but the debate is tax policy.

Why? Because all taxes are a form of wealth distribution. Either you are for taxation, or you are against it.

There is no qualification. It's a yes or no answer. So, which is it?

The socialist/communist vision of wealth distribution has failed. It is archaic. It is useless, except for crooked politicians to line their own pockets as did Lenin, Stalin, Castro and all the rest while the everyman starves and suffers. George Orwell spoke the truth, "some are more equal than others" when he warned us of socialism and communism. Erewhon, not just a natural food brand.
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This is the strawman trope offered by many on the right. I don't follow all posts, there are too many, and who has the time.
Based on your writings about "socialism", it wasnt unreasonable for me to conclude you are a republican. If you are a moderate, fine, but your position on a socialism" is a strawman and typical on the far right. The "socialism" as practiced by USSR, etc., is, in fact, totalitarianism.

I am not a socialist and I am not for totalitarianism so I do not know why you are even arguing that point, for you did not get that from me.


Moreover,

You're nitpicking on 'ethical' is really telling, as if that is some kind of argument. People use words, and that is a word which is perfectly acceptable to used in politics, about laws, acts, etc. I find it beyond the pale that you are even harping on it. In my 20 years on various forums arguing about politics, I've never seen anyone complain about it.

Quit lying
 
OldFatGuy said:
Do not prevaricate about what I support with presumption and assumption. You project with a broad brush as you paint social villains from your nightmares having nothing to do with reality.

Make up your mind, do you abhor Trump's tax cuts, or his raising taxes via tariffs? Which is it? The Federal government has enjoyed its greatest amount of the revenue collection during 2018, increased by 1.7 trillion dollars.
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The same people who say tax cuts were ruinous are the same ones saying tariffs are ruinous. Tariffs paid go into the treasury. I.E. democrats be hating on a tax increase, and a tax cut. WTF, LOL.

Bitch, moan, rinse, repeat....
 
RedAkston said:
I don't have a problem with property taxes or sales tax. In fact, as I stated previously in this thread, I'm all for a flat tax on when one spends their money. I have a serious problem with a so-called "wealth tax" as it's a money redistribution grab on money that has already been taxed.
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I don't see what the problem is. Once you're back below 50 million in wealth...they can't touch your money.
 
OldFatGuy said:
Wrong. A wealth tax would be a theft, not income, gains, sales or property taxes.

No it is not subjective, not what I feel. It is double dipping, taxing the same money twice.

No one in this life is truly equal, yet our system of government and economics provide the most equal of opportunities for those who try, with no guarantee for outcome.
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Wait, now it's not redistribution that's the problem, it's "double taxation?"

Mason66 said:
How many times should somebody pay taxes on the same money?
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Customer buys the widget, pays sales tax. That money goes to the business, that pays tax on the profits. Some of that money goes to the employee who sold the widget, and both pay taxes on doing that. But yeah. NOW it's double taxation.
 
OldFatGuy said:
It is double dipping, taxing the same money twice.
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Mason66 said:
How many times should somebody pay taxes on the same money?
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I am against the wealth tax, but this line of argument does not work. There is no limit. Even with today's system, we pay plenty of taxes on same "earned" money:
- first people pay payroll taxes
- then they pay federal income taxes (some pay extra AMT tax on top of that too)
- then they pay state taxes
- then they pay local taxes
- then they pay sales and excise and property taxes
- then they pay estate taxes
 
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OldFatGuy said:
No one in this life is truly equal, yet our system of government and economics provide the most equal of opportunities for those who try, with no guarantee for outcome.
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Yeah, an African-American from the 'hood has equal opportunities as the white son of a rich law firm attorney from upstate New York. FFS, do people actually believe that crap?
 
marke said:
Robert Reich is a democrat party hack with stupid ideas designed to empower democrats in politics for the purpose of getting their hands on federal money for themselves and their friends. Moveon.org is backed by one of the richest dirtiest communists in the US and their goal is to rob the rich to give to themselves and their friends.
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I've been waiting for the day you will provide this forum with a competent counter argument.

Your only offerings are "trivialize" "shame" those who disagree with you, that's it. In fact, in your bizarre world view, anyone on the left disagreeing with you is so described by you.

That is not a counter argument. That is an incompetent argument.

You are a one-note charlie.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Hmm... adding the proposed 2% wealth tax on (personal/household?) holdings of more than $50M is said to be able to generate an additional $275B of (federal?) revenue annually (expressed in the video as about $2.75T in the next decade). That represents only about 1/3 of the current annual federal deficit assuming that such a windfall would not trigger our congress critters to increase federal spending (fat chance of that).

In other words, even with the proposed wealth tax the federal government will continue to borrow and spend (endlessly?). Of course, as noted in the video, this private wealth is now being invested (wisely?) and being given to charities - would giving it to the federal government instead not hurt the economy as well as charities? It's not as if giving more money to the federal government (to spend as it now does) is going to enrich anyone but it will punish the uber rich a tad, yet still likely leave them uber rich.
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It doesn't take a genius to understand why a socialist push is not well received by many. Historically socialism has never been a success and the wealth is not evenly distributed. There is always going to be a small elite group at the top who do better, who run the system and who abuse this power. The countries that are touted as socialist successes such at Sweden and others are not true socialist countries. Sweden and others certainly have strong socialist leanings but their economic prosperity is based on good old capitalism.
Capitalism works with a "free market" attitude and the ability to conduct and run your own business without the government over regulating or owning and controlling.
Even the most capitalist countries have some "socialist" policies such as social security and medicare. Look at how messed up and abused these are because the government is not very good at a business.
 
Integrityrespec said:
It doesn't take a genius to understand why a socialist push is not well received by many. Historically socialism has never been a success and the wealth is not evenly distributed. There is always going to be a small elite group at the top who do better, who run the system and who abuse this power. The countries that are touted as socialist successes such at Sweden and others are not true socialist countries. Sweden and others certainly have strong socialist leanings but their economic prosperity is based on good old capitalism.
Capitalism works with a "free market" attitude and the ability to conduct and run your own business without the government over regulating or owning and controlling.
Even the most capitalist countries have some "socialist" policies such as social security and medicare. Look at how messed up and abused these are because the government is not very good at a business.
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Social Security and Medicare are aimed at (reserved for?) those no longer in the workforce. Why socialism fails is that it separates one's reward (pay) from society from the value of their contribution (work) to society.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Social Security and Medicare are aimed at (reserved for?) those no longer in the workforce. Why socialism fails is that it separates one's reward (pay) from society from the value of their contribution (work) to society.
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Keep in mind that many of these countries have the highest taxes in the world and many have capitalist economies. The "free" stuff, education, health care, doesn't actually come free. It's free at the point of service but the tax payer pays dearly with his deductions from his pay check.

Sorry Bernie Bros But Nordic Countries Are Not Socialist
 
OscarLevant said:
Sen. Warren has the right policy proposal

Republicans today are against a wealth tax which is another reason to vote for a Democrat in 20/20



I've been for this idea long before Senator Warren even brought it to the national attention. It's the only way to thwart the Dynasty-ism that is growing
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Stop.... making... sense... facts... numb-ers... logic... must resist!
 
Juggernaut74 said:
OK talk about terrible arguments.

Under this logic, if a thief breaks in and steals my TV (theft), you saying the reason it is theft is because I could face imprisonment for failure to give him my DVD player as well. THAT is truly a terrible and dumb argument.
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How on Earth you came up with that illogical leap is beyond comprehension.
 
Juggernaut74 said:
Point of correction. “Wealth” as defined above (especially for the top x%) most likely has NOT previously been taxed. Wealth by definition includes unrealized appreciation on property/asset values.
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Goalposts officially moved.

:roll:
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Social Security and Medicare are aimed at (reserved for?) those no longer in the workforce. Why socialism fails is that it separates one's reward (pay) from society from the value of their contribution (work) to society.
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Some of us have this bizarre idea that human life has a value other than dollars.
 
Deuce said:
Some of us have this bizarre idea that human life has a value other than dollars.
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Yet demand dollars be taken from those deemed to have too many in order to subsidize those deemed to have too few.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Yet demand dollars be taken from those deemed to have too many in order to subsidize those deemed to have too few.
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Um yes, exactly.
 
OscarLevant said:
You are entitled to your opinions, but you are not entitled to your own facts.
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You repeat the same lies, the same obfuscation, the same desperate lies, and you do not deserve any reasonable responses.
 
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