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The U.S.A., this is so normal

ttwtt78640 said:
The federal "budget" deficit is simply the political path of least resistance - used by both parties on a regular basis. Raising taxes to even cover current federal spending is unpopular (costs votes?) while increased government spending (without raising taxes) is popular (borrows votes?).
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Understood.

But if taxes go up to cover healthcare costs, that is going to save everybody a lot of money, as you cut out the middleman, ie the Healthcare Insurance providers. Surely this can be explained to the American people so they understand?
 
Mycroft said:
LOL!!

A Bernie crowd? Okay.
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Huh? I'm not sure what you're referring to. I thought everyone had seen that FOX hosted town hall or whatever it was where the crowd went wild for Bernie's healthcare plan.

Here it is. It's FOX hosted.

Well, I guess you won't have any problem getting that disaster pass in Congress and signed by a President, then.
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What? Me? Get legislation passed? Signed by the president? WTF are you babbling about?
 
JustHanging said:
Understood.

But if taxes go up to cover healthcare costs, that is going to save everybody a lot of money, as you cut out the middleman, ie the Healthcare Insurance providers. Surely this can be explained to the American people so they understand?
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That (bolded above) is simply not true since not "everybody" either pays taxes or has medical care insurance which they must pay for. UHC may lower total care costs (especially plans which mandate that care providers become non-profit) but mainly it shifts the costs to those deemed to be "most able to pay" by elite politicians.

PPACA is an example of that - demanding that "large" employers provide their employees medical care insurance as a fringe benefit while allowing "small" employers to have lower direct labor costs. That is much the same as saying that a "large" employer must pay someone more than a "small" employer for having the same work (job?) done.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
That (bolded above) is simply not true since not "everybody" either pays taxes or has medical care insurance which they must pay for.
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OK. Good point. Technically not everyone will save money, because those who pay zero can't pay less. So let the people who paid zero, still pay zero. Granted they will save nothing. But they will get better access to healthcare, and that is very good, because early diagnosis usually means saving money.

So while technically true that the poorest Americans won't save money, they will get better access to healthcare, and save the people paying the taxes a bunch of money. Win win!

UHC may lower total care costs (especially plans which mandate that care providers become non-profit) but mainly it shifts the costs to those deemed to be "most able to pay" by elite politicians.
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AFAIK, every single universal healthcare system in the world pays far less than the USA on a per capita basis. I think the Swiss are the closest at like 80% or something. It drops dramatically after them, to in the 40%-66% per capita range.

So everyone who does pay into the healthcare system, from top to bottom, can save money.
 
Helix said:
we'll have to vote out a lot of right wingers to get to a sane health care system. i'm not even sure that would be enough. i think that it will probably take another Republican economic collapse and a new deal type situation. that's a stupid way to fix the problem, but it might be the only way.
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and a lot of center / center-right Dems, and not elect someone like Biden....
 
nekrodev said:
and a lot of center / center-right Dems, and not elect someone like Biden....
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I'm in the anyone but Tweety camp. Win first.
 
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Helix said:
I'm I'm the anyone but Tweety camp. Win first.
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I'm just speaking in terms of healthcare. none of the Dems in the center, or to the right, support universal healthcare. Kamala Harris, Corey Booker, Beto, and Mayor Pete all SAY they support it, but don't, or waffle around about "access".

If you want change in healthcare, you need people in government who want that, too, not people who get paid by big pharma and insurance companies to only make tiny, incremental changes.
 
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