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New report implicates Trump in same crime that’s sending Michael Cohen to jail

Rogue Valley

Rogue Valley

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New report implicates Trump in same crime that’s sending Michael Cohen to jail

Both allegedly lied to banks about their net worth to receive a loan.

90


3/19/19
President Donald Trump repeatedly committed one of the same crimes that is about to land his former lawyer Michael Cohen in jail, The New York Times reported Monday. The Times report on Trump’s long, troubled history with Deutsche Bank includes allegations that he repeatedly overstated his wealth to obtain favorable loans from the bank. The reporting confirms some of Cohen’s sworn testimony that Trump misrepresented his assets when it suited him. The Times reports that Trump overstated his personal wealth by $2.2 billion when applying for a loan to build the Trump International Hotel and Tower in Chicago around 2005. Five years later in another incident, a Deutsche Bank team tasked with investigating his financial records reportedly discovered that Trump was inflating the value of some of his real estate assets by up to 70 percent. Trump was seeking financing for his Doral Golf Resort and Spa in Miami.

Trump reportedly lied to Deutsche Bank again in 2014 as part of his bid to buy the Buffalo Bills football team, according to The Times and to congressional testimony Cohen gave last month. “It was my experience that Mr. Trump inflated his total assets when it served his purposes, such as trying to be listed among the wealthiest people in Forbes, and deflated his assets to reduce his real estate taxes,” Cohen said. Cohen himself pleaded guilty last year to a host of charges that included lying on loan applications to obtain a home equity line of credit. He will begin a 36-month prison term in May. “What we have learned today is that the president committed bank fraud by submitting a false loan application to Deutsche Bank,” Rep. William Lacy Clay (D-MO) told the St. Louis Post-Dispatch after Cohen’s testimony. This is not the first time Trump has been implicated in potential crimes as the sprawling special counsel investigation into Russian election interference has grown to include the president’s business and campaign finance dealings. Trump has also emerged, under the legal moniker “Individual 1,” as a central character in a series of indictments and criminal investigations related to his business dealings in Russia and whether his former campaign aide Roger Stone may have coordinated Russia’s election interference efforts.
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Cohen is going to prison for bank fraud. Trump will probably follow him there sometime after 2020.

Related: https://www.debatepolitics.com/gene...ion/350978-trump-s-history-deutsche-bank.html
 
New report implicates Trump in same crime that’s sending Michael Cohen to jail
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What is the relevance of this new report? The SDNY's already indicated Trump as an unnamed co-conspirator with Cohen. Are you saying this a new count?

...You know what, even if it is a new count, GOP-ers have decided they just don't care that their political leader is a felon who's simply not been charged because of a DoJ policy that ostensibly proscribes such an action.
 
Xelor said:
What is the relevance of this new report? The SDNY's already indicated Trump as an unnamed co-conspirator with Cohen. Are you saying this a new count?

...You know what, even if it is a new count, GOP-ers have decided they just don't care that their political leader is a felon who's simply not been charged because of a DoJ policy that ostensibly proscribes such an action.
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Yes, this is a new and much more serious criminal offense, that appears investigators will have Trump dead to rights on.
 
MovingPictures said:
Yes, this is a new and much more serious criminal offense, that appears investigators will have Trump dead to rights on.
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Have you read the charging and sentencing documents for Cohen, Flynn, Manafort, etc? All of the "Russia/Trump-related" cases have been heavily documentary, including the ones against Cohen.

They got Trump "dead to rights" on the FEC violation for which Cohen's going to jail. Trump's merely an unindicted co-conspirator. In other words, it's the same evidence about the same actus reus that was, by all parties involved, undertaken with the same mens rea; Trump's just another party, a co-conspirator, to the actus reus. He's just as "dead to rights" got/guilty as Cohen, and Pecker, for that matter, but Pecker has an immunity deal, which is why Pecker's not going to be charged unless he breaches his deal.


Red:
Okay. TY for the clarification.
 
Xelor said:
Have you read the charging and sentencing documents for Cohen, Flynn, Manafort, etc? All of the "Russia/Trump-related" cases have been heavily documentary, including the ones against Cohen.

They got Trump "dead to rights" on the FEC violation for which Cohen's going to jail. Trump's merely an unindicted co-conspirator. In other words, it's the same evidence about the same actus reus that was, by all parties involved, undertaken with the same mens rea; Trump's just another party, a co-conspirator, to the actus reus. He's just as "dead to rights" got/guilty as Cohen, and Pecker, for that matter, but Pecker has an immunity deal, which is why Pecker's not going to be charged unless he breaches his deal.


Red:
Okay. TY for the clarification.
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The campaign finance stuff is illegal, but it's not something he's going to be pushed out of office for.

It's the fraud related to his insurance, banking, taxes, and charities that's got him shaking in his boots.
 
Rogue Valley said:
New report implicates Trump in same crime that’s sending Michael Cohen to jail

Both allegedly lied to banks about their net worth to receive a loan.

90




Cohen is going to prison for bank fraud. Trump will probably follow him there sometime after 2020.

Related: Trump’s History With Deutsche Bank
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I watched Maddow rubbing one out to this news last night. Accusing the guy and proving fraud are two VASTLY different things. Cohen is going to jail because he took a plea, not because he was proved guilty.
 
Lutherf said:
I watched Maddow rubbing one out to this news last night. Accusing the guy and proving fraud are two VASTLY different things. Cohen is going to jail because he took a plea, not because he was proved guilty.
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So, Cohen was innocent and chose to go to prison? That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard.
 
MovingPictures said:
The campaign finance stuff is illegal, but it's not something he's going to be pushed out of office for.

It's the fraud related to his insurance, banking, taxes, and charities that's got him shaking in his boots.
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I hear you.

For me, federal felonies, any of them, are sufficient to send any elected or appointed public office holder packing, if not to the hoosegow, out of office.

Alas, that's my bar, and sure as God made little green apples, I've observed ruefully that many of my countrymen have notably lower standards...Ruefully because truly I didn't think mine were inordinately high. Indeed, until 2016, I doubt anyone would have thought them so, for among my associates colleagues, children and relatives, I am affectionately (usually) thought of as the "man who gives seven second chances."
 
Lutherf said:
I watched Maddow rubbing one out to this news last night. Accusing the guy and proving fraud are two VASTLY different things. Cohen is going to jail because he took a plea, not because he was proved guilty.
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1. Maddow can't rub one out, she's a chick.

2. No attorney has a client plead guilty to a noncrime.

WTF?
 
D_NATURED said:
So, Cohen was innocent and chose to go to prison? That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard.
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FWIW, if you keep listening to/reading the commentary of editorialists who say "the dumbest thing you've ever heard," and, in turn dignifying their dumb remarks by responding to them, you will find they consistently aim to outdo themselves, and mostly they succeed.
 
I would imagine Trump did his banking with the Deutsche Bank branch in New York City. So it seems to me the state would prosecute. No presidential pardon.

I know the feds already have a ton of documents from Deutsche Bank, and quite a collection of Cohen documents.

For all practical purposes, most of Trumps significant legal problems will hit him after he's out of the White House.
 
D_NATURED said:
So, Cohen was innocent and chose to go to prison? That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard.
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Not at all. My guess is that Cohen knew he was guilty as sin for enough stuff that the plea came out to be a good deal. I'd have to go back and check but I think his bank fraud issue was different than Trump's. In Cohen's case, if I'm not mistaken, he was hiding income and asset values to get a debt forgiven, not inflating numbers to get a loan.
 
MovingPictures said:
1. Maddow can't rub one out, she's a chick.

2. No attorney has a client plead guilty to a noncrime.

WTF?
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I realize this isn't biology class, but women absolutely can rub one out, in fact it's a better description. I won't get more specific as it's off topic and I'm not sure what the rules are on that topic.
 
MovingPictures said:
1. Maddow can't rub one out, she's a chick.

2. No attorney has a client plead guilty to a noncrime.

WTF?
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It isn't so much a non-crime as it is a matter of mitigating the risk of a jury finding guilt or, frankly, the cost of litigation versus the penalty.

For example, if I participated in a liquor store robbery and my buddy, while making our escape, shot a cop and crashed into a church after a high speed chase I'd be willing to take a plea on all the other charges even if I didn't actively participate as long as I got a deal for 10 years. That beats the hell out of the possibility of a jury handing me LWOP.
 
D_NATURED said:
So, Cohen was innocent and chose to go to prison? That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard.
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Cohen plead guilty to something that - under normal circumstances - wouldn't raise anybody's eyebrows ... had it not been for the threat to his wife.

Lynne Patton: "... What many of you may not be aware of is the fact that I can personally confirm that the ONLY reason Michael Cohen “turned on” the President of the United States is because Mueller threatened to throw his wife in jail for up to 30 years. Period. She is the co-guarantor of a $20M personal loan that Mueller discovered Michael secured back in 2015 by falsely inflating the value of his taxi medallions – effectively making her part & parcel to the federal charge of “Making False Statements to a Financial Institution,” to which Cohen ultimately plead guilty. ..."

Lynne Patton - Dear Haters:

Since so many of you are... | Facebook
 
Bu-bu-but the "FINANCIAL GENUISES of the NEW YORK SLIMES" said....bu-bu-but...WAAAAAAH!!! :lamo



Donald Trump has had no trouble getting big loans at competitive rates


The idea that banks won’t lend to Trump because of his bankruptcy history is the equivalent of fake news: MarketWatch analysis



Contrary to countless reports portraying President Donald Trump’s relationship with banks as toxic, a new MarketWatch analysis shows Trump has virtually no trouble getting loans on good terms these days. Big banks like Barclays BCS, +0.80%also welcome Trump’s money in brokerage accounts and one of the biggest, J.P. Morgan Chase JPM, -0.36% , oversees his family trusts, according to a recent presidential disclosure.

Trump signed his first financial-disclosure form as president on Flag Day, June 14 — also Trump’s birthday. The 98-page document shows assets of at least $1.4 billion and income of almost $600 million for the 2016 calendar year and into the early stages of 2017. Trump reported that he owes at least $310 million to banks and financial-services firms, including at least $130 million to Deutsche Bank.



Donald Trump has had no trouble getting big loans at competitive rates - MarketWatch



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More SILLIASS LEFT BULL**** SHOT DOWN IN FLAMES.....by simply RESEARCHING THE ACTUAL FACTS....


down in flames.jpg
 
Xelor said:
Have you read the charging and sentencing documents for Cohen, Flynn, Manafort, etc? All of the "Russia/Trump-related" cases have been heavily documentary, including the ones against Cohen.

They got Trump "dead to rights" on the FEC violation for which Cohen's going to jail. Trump's merely an unindicted co-conspirator. In other words, it's the same evidence about the same actus reus that was, by all parties involved, undertaken with the same mens rea; Trump's just another party, a co-conspirator, to the actus reus. He's just as "dead to rights" got/guilty as Cohen, and Pecker, for that matter, but Pecker has an immunity deal, which is why Pecker's not going to be charged unless he breaches his deal.


Red:
Okay. TY for the clarification.
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They have Trump's loan applications and loan documents now and apparently they are an SNL riot. Certainly what I have seen of them...they are in fact an SNL riot. For example Trump claimed that the 2008 financial crash was an "act of God" so he should not have to pay back the particular loan he was ...well...not paying. But the real story is the loan applications. They are a pack of false statement . Trump is very likely on the hook for Making False Statements to a Bank and if they can also prove that he knew he was getting loans under lending standards that nobody ever heard of before and knew the genesis of the bank's decisions was russian money laundering he could easily be on the hook for bank fraud as well.

In other words one of the reasons banks lend money under crazy lending terms is because they are trying to move laundered money out of their reserves before regulators figure out that they are sitting on too much liquidity and not moving it into the marketplace fast enough to accommodate the incoming. Where, they ask is this excess liquidity coming from. Since the bank is likely already taking a cut off their money laundering activities (they don't do it for free) they don't need to stick to lending standards. They just need to move the money out before regulators see that their reserves are building for no legit reasons they can see.

In some cases Trump was borrowing from one DBank division to pay off another DBank division. In other cases he was borrowing for projects. But his loan apps are a pack of lies and in other cases his rational for not paying them back make one suspect that as long as DBank moved the money out, they were not as concerned as a legit bank would have been about what was coming back from Trump nor how often he was defaulting. He borrowed over $2B over a period in excess of 10 years.

Usually the fees for turning dirty money into clean money are very heavy. So DBank should have been taking a hefty cut of whatever the incoming dirty rubles were. Apparently at least $10B worth of dirty rubles.
 
Lol. I think Trumpees will be one surprised group when Der Leader is indicted in early 2021.
 
jnug said:
They have Trump's loan applications and loan documents now and apparently they are an SNL riot. Certainly what I have seen of them...they are in fact an SNL riot. For example Trump claimed that the 2008 financial crash was an "act of God" so he should not have to pay back the particular loan he was ...well...not paying. But the real story is the loan applications. They are a pack of false statement . Trump is very likely on the hook for Making False Statements to a Bank and if they can also prove that he knew he was getting loans under lending standards that nobody ever heard of before and knew the genesis of the bank's decisions was russian money laundering he could easily be on the hook for bank fraud as well.

In other words one of the reasons banks lend money under crazy lending terms is because they are trying to move laundered money out of their reserves before regulators figure out that they are sitting on too much liquidity and not moving it into the marketplace fast enough to accommodate the incoming. Where, they ask is this excess liquidity coming from. Since the bank is likely already taking a cut off their money laundering activities (they don't do it for free) they don't need to stick to lending standards. They just need to move the money out before regulators see that their reserves are building for no legit reasons they can see.

In some cases Trump was borrowing from one DBank division to pay off another DBank division. In other cases he was borrowing for projects. But his loan apps are a pack of lies and in other cases his rational for not paying them back make one suspect that as long as DBank moved the money out, they were not as concerned as a legit bank would have been about what was coming back from Trump nor how often he was defaulting. He borrowed over $2B over a period in excess of 10 years.

Usually the fees for turning dirty money into clean money are very heavy. So DBank should have been taking a hefty cut of whatever the incoming dirty rubles were. Apparently at least $10B worth of dirty rubles.
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Red:
18 U.S. Code § 1014. Loan and credit applications generally; renewals and discounts; crop insurance:

18 U.S. Code § 1341. Frauds and swindles and 18 U.S. Code § 1344. Bank fraud

Money Laundering Control Act

Based on your descriptions, it seems as though you've conflated/confused money laundering with bank fraud. That said, each of the above offenses can be quite closely related or even concurrently occurring.
 
Xelor said:
Red:
18 U.S. Code § 1014. Loan and credit applications generally; renewals and discounts; crop insurance:

18 U.S. Code § 1341. Frauds and swindles and 18 U.S. Code § 1344. Bank fraud

Money Laundering Control Act

Based on your descriptions, it seems as though you've conflated/confused money laundering with bank fraud. That said, each of the above offenses can be quite closely related or even concurrently occurring.
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And NONE apply to Pres.Trump...never have .


Post #20.
 
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