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Most economists think $ 15 an hourfed. minimum wage is a bad idea

tres borrachos said:
So once again, do you believe economists or not? Do you believe polls or not?
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Sometimes they do and sometimes they don't. According to Trump, most can't figure it out on their own, and have to wait for him to tell them what to think (See post #52 for citation)
 
KLATTU said:
New Survey Finds 72 Percent of U.S. Economists Oppose a $15 Federal Minimum Wage – Employment Policies Institute

Washington D.C. – Today, the Employment Policies Institute (EPI) released a new survey conducted by the University of New Hampshire Survey Center asking economists about their reaction to a $15 minimum wage. It finds that 72 percent of U.S.-based economists oppose a $15 federal minimum wage.

Hey but it makes virtue signaling liberal Dems *sound *like they care, so that'a the important thing, right?
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I think we should perhaps implement some sort of UBI or Negative Income Tax. Leveraged consumption from the masses will not sustain aggregate demand for goods and services. Austerity exacerbated recessionary forces, and Capital that has fled much of the rural areas could return to stimulate local economic growth.
 
Grokmaster said:
Competitive wages must be growth/profit produced to be sustainable.

It ain't Rocket Science, but so FEW leftists , in office or otherwise, have ever even ran a LEMONADE STAND, that they can't seem to grasp the concept.
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Growth/profit and wages were decoupled decades ago.

Now its the fewest you can employ for the very least you can pay them for not a second more than you need them.

The class war is over. Most of us are in the class of disposable commodities to be used and discarded by the other class.

I'm still amazed that everybody goes along with a made up economic system that officially declares the vast majority no better than a 2x4 or bag of concrete.
 
MrWonka said:
Because it's true, and your own article supports what I said...
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MrWonka said:
Because it's true, and your own article supports what I said...
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Maybe you should read the whole thing...
When we look more closely at the results for experienced workers, however, we find that about a quarter of their increase in pay came from taking additional work outside Seattle to make up for lost hours. And, quite plainly, the findings for inexperienced workers show that when the price of their labor went up, the quantity of it demanded fell, exactly as economic theory predicts. Instead of more money, which is supposed to be the whole point of the “Fight for $15,” they got more free time.

The study finds a notable decline of about 5 percent in the number of people entering Seattle’s low-wage workforce in each quarte
 
Skeptic Bob said:
Anots. I don't think a $15 minimum wage in places like NYC or San Francisco would do much harm. s.
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Not totally wrong, but mostly
Survival of the Fittest: The Impact of the Minimum Wage on Firm Exit by Dara Lee Luca, Michael Luca :: SSRN
We study the impact of the minimum wage on firm exit in the restaurant
industry, exploiting recent changes in the minimum wage at the city level.
The evidence suggests that higher minimum wages increase overall exit
rates for restaurants. However, lower quality restaurants, which are already
closer to the margin of exit, are disproportionately impacted by increases to
the minimum wage. Our point estimates suggest that a one dollar increase in
the minimum wage leads to a 14 percent increase in the likelihood of exit
for a 3.5-star restaurant (which is the median rating), but has no discernible
impact for a 5-star restaurant (on a 1 to 5 star scale).

We find suggestive evidence that a higher minimum wage leads to overall
increases in restaurant exit rates – depending on the specification, we find that a $1 increase in
the minimum wage leads to approximately a 4 to 10 percent increase in the likelihood of exit,
although the estimate is only statistically significant in certain specifications.



A New York City Hospitality Alliance survey found that 47% of full-service restaurants expect to cut jobs this year to cope with the latest wage hike. Last year, 36% said they'd eliminated jobs. The picture is worse at limited-service restaurants. The survey found half reported cutting jobs last year. And 53% say they'll do so this year.
https://thenycalliance.org/assets/documents/informationitems/021Ib.pdf
 
Mycroft said:
It apparently leaves out a BIGGER chunk of the left, since they are the ones who don't seem to realize how bad a minimum wage is for everyone.
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LOL, I don't think so. That's your leader calling his base a bunch of morons, and they cheered when he said it. :lamo
 
What if...? said:
Gr
Now its the fewest you can employ for the very least you can pay them for not a second more than you need them.

ncrete.
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Now?It's always been that way.
The facts of life are conservative.

By the way, using that paradigm, the Phillies just signed Bryce Harper for the least amount they thought they could pay,and for the least amount of time, and still sign him .
It tunred out o be lucrative.

That is how it works in pretty much every employment scenario. They offer the lowest amount they think they can get away with.

the facts of life are conservative.

That' s why we need good people like BErnie, Kamala , Warrenet al. To 'fix all that. After all THEY know better!
 
MrWonka said:
No, but that's the point. To prevent states from stealing jobs from one another by standardizing the laws. As it stands right now small towns with lower wages do have an advantage over a city like Seattle or San Fran. I find with them having a small advantage because they're struggling so much, but too much and it hurts the cities unfairly.
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I would think that cities that increase their minimum wages decided to hurt themselves, so why would we consider this unfairly and need the big government to step in and save them. They are capable of adjusting their laws to meet their needs.
 
KLATTU said:
New Survey Finds 72 Percent of U.S. Economists Oppose a $15 Federal Minimum Wage – Employment Policies Institute

Washington D.C. – Today, the Employment Policies Institute (EPI) released a new survey conducted by the University of New Hampshire Survey Center asking economists about their reaction to a $15 minimum wage. It finds that 72 percent of U.S.-based economists oppose a $15 federal minimum wage.

Hey but it makes virtue signaling liberal Dems *sound *like they care, so that'a the important thing, right?
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Most economist have not tried to or even could support a family on less than $15.00 an hour. The fact of the matter is the minimum wage needs to vary to fit cost of living in different parts of the country. I a lot of the rural parts of America where cost of living is minimal it would be a great starting wage. In a lot of major cities $15.00 would not be enough. The fact is if industry does not pay people enough to live they will die or get the money needed to live some other way. That is through our taxes or crime. But rest assured we pay either way.
 
Mycroft said:
Increasing to $15/hr is not a small increase.

It's not manufacturing jobs that are at risk.

Maybe you need another "study".
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Well, any wage that forces a person to get foodstamps is too low. The reason is that if tax payers are taking up the slack, it is then at a greater cost to society than if the employer paid enough so that food stamps are not necessary. Foodstamps, in essence, are an indirect corporate welfare.


I think a commission should be empowered to study what that liveable wage would be in every city over a certain size, and below a certain size, a region.
 
KLATTU said:
New Survey Finds 72 Percent of U.S. Economists Oppose a $15 Federal Minimum Wage – Employment Policies Institute

Washington D.C. – Today, the Employment Policies Institute (EPI) released a new survey conducted by the University of New Hampshire Survey Center asking economists about their reaction to a $15 minimum wage. It finds that 72 percent of U.S.-based economists oppose a $15 federal minimum wage.

Hey but it makes virtue signaling liberal Dems *sound *like they care, so that'a the important thing, right?
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Most economists support a minimum wage, though they might not agree that it should be $15 an hour.

Most republicans want to eliminate the minimum wage altogether.


That is the real right vs left argument.

$15 an hour is a dem socialist thing, it's not dem thing across the board. Many dems, especially the moderates, feel it should be in the $12 an hour arena, which it was it would be if the minimum wage were indexed against inflation, and it is not (actually...).

in 1974 the minimum wage was ( for non farm workers ) $2 an hour, which, adjusting for inflation, would be $10.85 an hour.


So, about $11 an hour is where it should be today if it were indexed.


However, in some cities that is too low, like NYC or L.A or it might be too high in some cities. So, I believe a commission should be empowered to formulate what it should be in each city, states could do this in coordination with the federal government.

Myi view is that if a wage is so low it causes employees to accept food stamps, then the wage should be raised to a level where foodstamps are not necessary. Foodstamps, for those who are employed, is a form of indirect corporate welfare ( because taxes are taking up the slack where employers should be paying, and this results in a greater cost to society than if the employer paid enough to prevent food stamps ).
 
KLATTU said:
Now?It's always been that way.
The facts of life are conservative.

By the way, using that paradigm, the Phillies just signed Bryce Harper for the least amount they thought they could pay,and for the least amount of time, and still sign him .
It tunred out o be lucrative.

That is how it works in pretty much every employment scenario. They offer the lowest amount they think they can get away with.

the facts of life are conservative.

That' s why we need good people like BErnie, Kamala , Warrenet al. To 'fix all that. After all THEY know better!
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yes, exploitation is a fact of life, but that doesn't mean it is just. That is why regulation is needed.

That is why we need people like Bernie, Kamala, and Harris.
 
i support tying minimum wage to inflation, but it could be argued that fifteen might be a bit high to put the floor. i'd much rather see universal debt free access to college. that would potentially do a lot of good. i'd also like to see restaurants forced to pay the full minimum wage like everyone else. my tip is intended to be something extra for good service, not a donation to the owner to help with base wages.
 
Mycroft said:
It apparently leaves out a BIGGER chunk of the left, since they are the ones who don't seem to realize how bad a minimum wage is for everyone.
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What about the people who would otherwise make less money, is it bad for them?
 
As an aside One of the studies that left wingers mistakenly rely on when claiming min wage increases don't lead to unemployment is the massively flawed Card Krueger study.
Kruger just passed away this weekend. He was only 58.

RIP
 
OscarLevant said:
yes, exploitation is a fact of life, but that doesn't mean it is just. That is why regulation is needed.

That is why we need people like Bernie, Kamala, and Harris.
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NAHHHHH.
That's a really perverted world view where employment is considered exploitation.
 
KLATTU said:
NAHHHHH.
That's a really perverted world view where employment is considered exploitation.
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Many workers are exploited. Pretend all you want.
 
KLATTU said:
New Survey Finds 72 Percent of U.S. Economists Oppose a $15 Federal Minimum Wage – Employment Policies Institute

Washington D.C. – Today, the Employment Policies Institute (EPI) released a new survey conducted by the University of New Hampshire Survey Center asking economists about their reaction to a $15 minimum wage. It finds that 72 percent of U.S.-based economists oppose a $15 federal minimum wage.

Hey but it makes virtue signaling liberal Dems *sound *like they care, so that'a the important thing, right?
Click to expand...
All you need to know about this survey is the sponsor to know it is false, skewed and deliberately inaccurate.
 
KLATTU said:
Now?It's always been that way.
The facts of life are conservative.

By the way, using that paradigm, the Phillies just signed Bryce Harper for the least amount they thought they could pay,and for the least amount of time, and still sign him .
It tunred out o be lucrative.

That is how it works in pretty much every employment scenario. They offer the lowest amount they think they can get away with.

the facts of life are conservative.

That' s why we need good people like BErnie, Kamala , Warrenet al. To 'fix all that. After all THEY know better!
Click to expand...

Of course it isn't a coincidence that union busting preceded the Great Divergence. You remember, back when everybody got richer every year at about the same RATE.

Now the commodity class's wages barely keep up with inflation while profits and executive salaries go up with "productivity".

And the parts you edited out are very telling.
 
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