Immigration

[Good4Nothin]

The immigration debate is always stupid and confusing, because each side pretends there is only one reason for illegal immigration. And one side pretends that legal and illegal immigration are the same.

There are various reasons for being an illegal immigrant. One reason is to escape desperate conditions of poverty, war, etc. Another is to make money and send it back home where it's worth a lot more. Another is to sell drugs. Etc.

Republicans pretend that most illegal immigrants are dangerous criminals. Most are not, but some are. The problem is we don't know, because they entered illegally.

Democrats think all immigration is good, whether legal or not. And they think it's racist to prevent illegal immigration. Maybe most illegal immigration is from the southern border, where people are less white. But immigration of any races should be legal.

Democrats think illegal immigrants are not talking American's jobs, because they are doing the jobs that Americans don't want. That is not true. Lots of American women used to work as cleaners, and lots of American men used to work as landscapers. They just didn't work as cheaply as the illegal immigrants.

The low skill jobs that illegal immigrants are doing were valuable as temporary sources of income for divorced women, laid off workers, students, people who for whatever reason were in between careers.

It used to be the Republicans who liked illegal immigration, because it was good for business owners. But now a lot of Republican voters are people who would need those jobs.

In summary, there are two sides to this debate and it makes no sense to see only one side of anything.

 

[WCH]

The immigration debate is always stupid and confusing, because each side pretends there is only one reason for illegal immigration. And one side pretends that legal and illegal immigration are the same.

There are various reasons for being an illegal immigrant. One reason is to escape desperate conditions of poverty, war, etc. Another is to make money and send it back home where it's worth a lot more. Another is to sell drugs. Etc.

Republicans pretend that most illegal immigrants are dangerous criminals. Most are not, but some are. The problem is we don't know, because they entered illegally.

Democrats think all immigration is good, whether legal or not. And they think it's racist to prevent illegal immigration. Maybe most illegal immigration is from the southern border, where people are less white. But immigration of any races should be legal.

Democrats think illegal immigrants are not talking American's jobs, because they are doing the jobs that Americans don't want. That is not true. Lots of American women used to work as cleaners, and lots of American men used to work as landscapers. They just didn't work as cheaply as the illegal immigrants.

The low skill jobs that illegal immigrants are doing were valuable as temporary sources of income for divorced women, laid off workers, students, people who for whatever reason were in between careers.

It used to be the Republicans who liked illegal immigration, because it was good for business owners. But now a lot of Republican voters are people who would need those jobs.

In summary, there are two sides to this debate and it makes no sense to see only one side of anything.

When they crossed the border illegally, they were criminals.

Here's another good reason to enter illegally.

Terrorist Infiltration Threat at the Southwest Border | Center for Immigration Studies

 

[noonereal]

Democrats think all immigration is good, whether legal or not. And they think it's racist to prevent illegal immigration.
.

Dude, this is the ridiculous wing nut propaganda.

 

[noonereal]

When they crossed the border illegally, they were criminals.

Here's another good reason to enter illegally.

Terrorist Infiltration Threat at the Southwest Border | Center for Immigration Studies

Why is it Rambo is the guy always most fearful?

 

[Rogue Valley]

Democrats think all immigration is good, whether legal or not. And they think it's racist to prevent illegal immigration.

You pulled this straight out of your partisan arse.

 

[Good4Nothin]

Dude, this is the ridiculous wing nut propaganda.

No, that is what I have been hearing Democrats say. They don't say "Well immigration should be controlled and it should be legal, but we have to make sure illegal immigrants are treated humanely."

No they do NOT say that. They just say the Republicans are being racist because they want to control immigration.

 

[Atheist 2020]

When they crossed the border illegally, they were criminals.

Here's another good reason to enter illegally.

Terrorist Infiltration Threat at the Southwest Border | Center for Immigration Studies

With Native Americans, they figured out that the settlement of the Roanoke Colony entered the United States illegally. The sentence was death. Native Americans, the first ICE agents.

 

[Indlib]

The immigration debate is always stupid and confusing, because each side pretends there is only one reason for illegal immigration. And one side pretends that legal and illegal immigration are the same.

There are various reasons for being an illegal immigrant. One reason is to escape desperate conditions of poverty, war, etc. Another is to make money and send it back home where it's worth a lot more. Another is to sell drugs. Etc.

Republicans pretend that most illegal immigrants are dangerous criminals. Most are not, but some are. The problem is we don't know, because they entered illegally.

Democrats think all immigration is good, whether legal or not. And they think it's racist to prevent illegal immigration. Maybe most illegal immigration is from the southern border, where people are less white. But immigration of any races should be legal.

Democrats think illegal immigrants are not talking American's jobs, because they are doing the jobs that Americans don't want. That is not true. Lots of American women used to work as cleaners, and lots of American men used to work as landscapers. They just didn't work as cheaply as the illegal immigrants.

The low skill jobs that illegal immigrants are doing were valuable as temporary sources of income for divorced women, laid off workers, students, people who for whatever reason were in between careers.

It used to be the Republicans who liked illegal immigration, because it was good for business owners. But now a lot of Republican voters are people who would need those jobs.

In summary, there are two sides to this debate and it makes no sense to see only one side of anything.

Most of your post is rational but a little inaccurate maybe? I see some traces of Trump media false narratives but as an independent maybe I am not the best judge.

1. Democrats don't think it is racist (in my experience anyhow) to try to stop illigals from immigrating, they think it is racists to pretend the reason to stop illigals is because they are rapists and murderers. (Racist stereotype). As you yourself stated, they dont know. So why make the claim?

2. Republicans still like illigals for cheap labor. If they didn't then why would Trump accept hundreds of thousands from construction and farm lobbys? (Public record). Why would Trump keep ICE in Cali instead of sweeping across America arresting illigals at farm fields and construction sites? The reason was stated by Ann Coultier on Bill Mahr a couple weeks ago. Because the billionaires like illigal labor...on both sides...including Trump.

Here is an example. I live in an agriculture area and loosely work with new construction areas. One thing I have seen over and over is the crop circles all have "Vote Trump" signs on the interstate side but on the back side these same farmers are building housing specifically for illigals doing seasonal work.

3. Lastly, most democrats do not support illigal immigration but they do support illigals following the law and legally applying for amnesty and other avenues that give them a chance at citizenship.

 

[WCH]

With Native Americans, they figured out that the settlement of the Roanoke Colony entered the United States illegally. The sentence was death. Native Americans, the first ICE agents.

Think you're looking for my Reconquesta thread.

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez: 'Reconquistador!'

BTW: no one really knows what happened to those people.

 

[WCH]

Most of your post is rational but a little inaccurate maybe? I see some traces of Trump media false narratives but as an independent maybe I am not the best judge.

1. Democrats don't think it is racist (in my experience anyhow) to try to stop illigals from immigrating, they think it is racists to pretend the reason to stop illigals is because they are rapists and murderers. (Racist stereotype). As you yourself stated, they dont know. So why make the claim?

2. Republicans still like illigals for cheap labor. If they didn't then why would Trump accept hundreds of thousands from construction and farm lobbys? (Public record). Why would Trump keep ICE in Cali instead of sweeping across America arresting illigals at farm fields and construction sites? The reason was stated by Ann Coultier on Bill Mahr a couple weeks ago. Because the billionaires like illigal labor...on both sides...including Trump.

Here is an example. I live in an agriculture area and loosely work with new construction areas. One thing I have seen over and over is the crop circles all have "Vote Trump" signs on the interstate side but on the back side these same farmers are building housing specifically for illigals doing seasonal work.

3. Lastly, most democrats do not support illigal immigration but they do support illigals following the law and legally applying for amnesty and other avenues that give them a chance at citizenship.

You sure those seasonal worker's homes are for illegals or are you just guessing? You know we have programs for that.

H-2A Temporary Agricultural Workers | USCIS

 

[Indlib]

You sure those seasonal worker's homes are for illegals or are you just guessing? You know we have programs for that.

H-2A Temporary Agricultural Workers | USCIS

Good question. The answer is neither. It is just what I have been told so I guess I could be wrong on that point. Regardless of whether the housing is for illigals or not you have to be naive to think illigals are not working the farms. As such, send ICE in. Get them out and SEVERELY fine the employers. When word gets out that America only hires Americans then we won't even need a wall. I mean really, if your eating dirt for lunch in Mexico while your friend is getting money transfers from thier illigal immigrant kids that work at mar I lago (I butchered that spelling, I know) he will make the journey for one of those jobs. I would.

 

[WCH]

Good question. The answer is neither. It is just what I have been told so I guess I could be wrong on that point. Regardless of whether the housing is for illigals or not you have to be naive to think illigals are not working the farms. As such, send ICE in. Get them out and SEVERELY fine the employers. When word gets out that America only hires Americans then we won't even need a wall. I mean really, if your eating dirt for lunch in Mexico while your friend is getting money transfers from thier illigal immigrant kids that work at mar I lago (I butchered that spelling, I know) he will make the journey for one of those jobs. I would.

Speaking of money orders...there are billions transferred/wired out of this country from legal and illegals alike. TAX the **** out of that money.

 

[Indlib]

Speaking of money orders...there are billions transferred/wired out of this country from legal and illegals alike. TAX the **** out of that money.

So the party of low taxes will implement a program that taxes money sent out of Mexico that has already been taxed? Tax them twice? That will piss off a lot of people, especially Americans sending money.

 

[WCH]

So the party of low taxes will implement a program that taxes money sent out of Mexico that has already been taxed? Tax them twice? That will piss off a lot of people, especially Americans sending money.

Who says it's already been taxed? WE're specifically talking about monies made here in the US by migrants, legal or illegal, not citizens.

 

[Barnacle]

Speaking of money orders...there are billions transferred/wired out of this country from legal and illegals alike. TAX the **** out of that money.

We don't have to tax that money, we can just add a "fee" to it. Governments and businesses do it all the time ...

 

[Hypothetical]

The immigration debate is always stupid and confusing, because each side pretends there is only one reason for illegal immigration. And one side pretends that legal and illegal immigration are the same.

There are various reasons for being an illegal immigrant. One reason is to escape desperate conditions of poverty, war, etc. Another is to make money and send it back home where it's worth a lot more. Another is to sell drugs. Etc.

Republicans pretend that most illegal immigrants are dangerous criminals. Most are not, but some are. The problem is we don't know, because they entered illegally.

Democrats think all immigration is good, whether legal or not. And they think it's racist to prevent illegal immigration. Maybe most illegal immigration is from the southern border, where people are less white. But immigration of any races should be legal.

Democrats think illegal immigrants are not talking American's jobs, because they are doing the jobs that Americans don't want. That is not true. Lots of American women used to work as cleaners, and lots of American men used to work as landscapers. They just didn't work as cheaply as the illegal immigrants.

The low skill jobs that illegal immigrants are doing were valuable as temporary sources of income for divorced women, laid off workers, students, people who for whatever reason were in between careers.

It used to be the Republicans who liked illegal immigration, because it was good for business owners. But now a lot of Republican voters are people who would need those jobs.

In summary, there are two sides to this debate and it makes no sense to see only one side of anything.

dangerous criminals yes we want to keep out, but thats not the entire argument at all... even those who are not dangerous criminals should enter and respect our country in accordance with our laws.

 

[Indlib]

Who says it's already been taxed? WE're specifically talking about monies made here in the US by migrants, legal or illegal, not citizens.

Hmm. I have never wired before. How do they distinguish bt money sent by Americans and money sent by illigals? Is that part of the process?

Of course that doesn't matter much since if illigals are getting charged to wire money then they will get it thier a plethora of other ways rendering the tax rather pointless. It would end up being another pointless tax law made up by bureaucrats.

 

[Indlib]

dangerous criminals yes we want to keep out, but thats not the entire argument at all... even those who are not dangerous criminals should enter and respect our country in accordance with our laws.

Agreed, which is why it shouldn't be so easy for them to find work.

 

[noonereal]

No, that is what I have been hearing Democrats say. They don't say "Well immigration should be controlled and it should be legal, but we have to make sure illegal immigrants are treated humanely."

No they do NOT say that. They just say the Republicans are being racist because they want to control immigration.

You hear it from your wingnut, liar talking heads.

You have no quotes.

Do you understand the difference between wing nut (or left wing) editorializing and fact?

You are repeating editorial exaggeration as fact. It's also refereed to as a lie.

 

[Good4Nothin]

Most of your post is rational but a little inaccurate maybe? I see some traces of Trump media false narratives but as an independent maybe I am not the best judge.

1. Democrats don't think it is racist (in my experience anyhow) to try to stop illigals from immigrating, they think it is racists to pretend the reason to stop illigals is because they are rapists and murderers. (Racist stereotype). As you yourself stated, they dont know. So why make the claim?

2. Republicans still like illigals for cheap labor. If they didn't then why would Trump accept hundreds of thousands from construction and farm lobbys? (Public record). Why would Trump keep ICE in Cali instead of sweeping across America arresting illigals at farm fields and construction sites? The reason was stated by Ann Coultier on Bill Mahr a couple weeks ago. Because the billionaires like illigal labor...on both sides...including Trump.

Here is an example. I live in an agriculture area and loosely work with new construction areas. One thing I have seen over and over is the crop circles all have "Vote Trump" signs on the interstate side but on the back side these same farmers are building housing specifically for illigals doing seasonal work.

3. Lastly, most democrats do not support illigal immigration but they do support illigals following the law and legally applying for amnesty and other avenues that give them a chance at citizenship.

I agree that Trump should not make general statements about illegal immigrants being criminals, since probably only a small minority of them are. I don't see why his statements are assumed to be racist though. Wouldn't he say the same thing about Eastern Europeans or other whites entering the US illegally?

I agree that the way to stop illegal immigration is to stop businesses from hiring them. That would make more sense than a wall.

 

[Good4Nothin]

Good question. The answer is neither. It is just what I have been told so I guess I could be wrong on that point. Regardless of whether the housing is for illigals or not you have to be naive to think illigals are not working the farms. As such, send ICE in. Get them out and SEVERELY fine the employers. When word gets out that America only hires Americans then we won't even need a wall. I mean really, if your eating dirt for lunch in Mexico while your friend is getting money transfers from thier illigal immigrant kids that work at mar I lago (I butchered that spelling, I know) he will make the journey for one of those jobs. I would.

I agree. Why is this solution not mentioned in political debates or by mainstream news?

 

[Hypothetical]

Agreed, which is why it shouldn't be so easy for them to find work.

which is great... you press the dems or repubs establishment politicians to get right on that and actually MAKE PROGRESS when they have a chance again... which they haven't been able to do for years....until then I am going with the guy who is actually trying to solve the problem.

 

[RaleBulgarian]

When they crossed the border illegally, they were criminals.

Yeah, a misdemeanor. Big whoop.

With Native Americans, they figured out that the settlement of the Roanoke Colony entered the United States illegally. The sentence was death. Native Americans, the first ICE agents.

There was no United States in 1857, or native Americans, and what happened to the settlers has never been determined.

Who says it's already been taxed? WE're specifically talking about monies made here in the US by migrants, legal or illegal, not citizens.

Illegal immigrants pay billions of dollars each year in taxes.

 

[Atheist 2020]

There was no United States in 1857, or native Americans, and what happened to the settlers has never been determined.

There was a United States in 1857.

 

[RaleBulgarian]

There was a United States in 1857.

Typo, 1587.