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Maximum Rent?

Lursa said:
"Giving" people things doesnt help them become more responsible. People often waste what they dont earn for themselves.

First you disrespect all low income people by acting like they are victims and now you make it worse by making them sound like beggars.

I respect the American worker alot more than you do apparently, and I know they can achieve more than you give them credit for.
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You respect them so much that you don't care if they pay 50% of their income and get no equity for it.
 
Lursa said:
And this surprises you why?

Power & $ go together. Calling 'leaders' 'the elite' is just silly tho, since everyone in this country has the opportunity to make $ and also to join committees and city boards.

Low income people are not excluded from those organizations...why are there so few involved?

But now do you realize that the system wouldnt work? That tenants would much too easily abuse it for months and months of free rent? Or are you going to justify that cheating and abuse again?
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Weird how the list of the richest in our country have names like Rockefeller and Walton, eh?
 
phattonez said:
You respect them so much that you don't care if they pay 50% of their income and get no equity for it.
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I'd respect them more if they moved to where they could find a better job and develop the skills to afford what they desire. If they want equity, they can work for it like everyone else
 
phattonez said:
Weird how the list of the richest in our country have names like Rockefeller and Walton, eh?
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How is that relevant? If there are just 2 people you want me to rent to at 25% of their income, sure. THen it's relevant. Otherwise, it's just you floundering to prove your proposal would work.

I notice you have gotten increasingly defensive and started personal attacks (with ridiculous hyperbole and lies) instead of directly responding to this huge hole in your proposal: the abuse of tenants who would quit their jobs or intentionally get fired as soon as they sign a lease. Getting out of 10-11 months of rent.

How would this be prevented? How would landlords be protected? Please show me how well-thought out your proposal is. Please show your work.
 
phattonez said:
And what happens when we get like Hong Kong? What then is your solution? You only offer stop-gaps.

Sent from my phone. Instaurare omnia in Christo.
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When we get to those levels then we can have a discussion about it, until then acting as if it is a problem of lack of area is rather ridiculous considering the US ranks 179th in density. We have a long ways to go until we reach anywhere close to that point.
 
Lursa said:
How is that relevant? If there are just 2 people you want me to rent to at 25% of their income, sure. THen it's relevant. Otherwise, it's just you floundering to prove your proposal would work.

I notice you have gotten increasingly defensive and started personal attacks (with ridiculous hyperbole and lies) instead of directly responding to this huge hole in your proposal: the abuse of tenants who would quit their jobs or intentionally get fired as soon as they sign a lease. Getting out of 10-11 months of rent.

How would this be prevented? How would landlords be protected? Please show me how well-thought out your proposal is. Please show your work.
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How about Soros, Buffett and many others who amass great sums of wealth without bring a product to market?
 
Individual said:
How about Soros, Buffett and many others who amass great sums of wealth without bring a product to market?
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Retail store owners dont bring a product to market. THey offer a service: access to the products

Truck company owners dont bring a product to market, they transport the products. They offer a service.

Nurses dont bring a product to market, they market a service: care.

Landlord dont bring a product to market, they offer a service: shelter

Etc etc etc.


Can you please clarify your question? Are any of these people "wrong" for accumulating their income without creating a product?
 
Lursa said:
I'd respect them more if they moved to where they could find a better job and develop the skills to afford what they desire. If they want equity, they can work for it like everyone else
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But their parents' generation didn't have to? Disingenuous!
 
Lursa said:
How is that relevant? If there are just 2 people you want me to rent to at 25% of their income, sure. THen it's relevant. Otherwise, it's just you floundering to prove your proposal would work.

I notice you have gotten increasingly defensive and started personal attacks (with ridiculous hyperbole and lies) instead of directly responding to this huge hole in your proposal: the abuse of tenants who would quit their jobs or intentionally get fired as soon as they sign a lease. Getting out of 10-11 months of rent.

How would this be prevented? How would landlords be protected? Please show me how well-thought out your proposal is. Please show your work.
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The same way credit card companies prevent people from racking up huge debt and then just defaulting.
 
Nap said:
When we get to those levels then we can have a discussion about it, until then acting as if it is a problem of lack of area is rather ridiculous considering the US ranks 179th in density. We have a long ways to go until we reach anywhere close to that point.
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But why should we build to that density if we have evidence that we're still going to have the problem even at that density?
 
phattonez said:
But their parents' generation didn't have to? Disingenuous!
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Of course they did.

Are you saying their parents didnt work hard to get ahead in life?

Man, you just continue to create victims and disrespect people, eh?
 
phattonez said:
The same way credit card companies prevent people from racking up huge debt and then just defaulting.
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Please explain that process, I'm not familiar with it.

Doesnt defaulting mean the credit card company loses out on all that $ owed them? Do you find that ethically acceptable for landlords to have to lose?

And again, your proposal has nothing in place to prevent illegal actions on the part of the tenants. Right here ^^ you are 'turning a blind eye' to it, or downright justifying it.

Please justify people cheating the landlords out of months of rent...legally and ethically.

And then you'll still need to tell me how your proposal will *solve* this abuse for landlords (perhaps your explanation of the cc example will, but if not, let's see it)
 
Lursa said:
Of course they did.

Are you saying their parents didnt work hard to get ahead in life?

Man, you just continue to create victims and disrespect people, eh?
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Are you saying that this generation that is more qualified, has more credentials, and works longer hours, is lazy?
 
phattonez said:
Are you saying that this generation that is more qualified, has more credentials, and works longer hours, is lazy?
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I asked you first. You are avoiding all the hard questions.

So...you go first.
 
Lursa said:
Please explain that process, I'm not familiar with it.

Doesnt defaulting mean the credit card company loses out on all that $ owed them? Do you find that ethically acceptable for landlords to have to lose?
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Credit card companies have small credit limits and charge high rates of interest to new borrowers. Landlords similarly would rent their smaller, not as nice units to new tenants, and probably from month to month.

And yes, if it's acceptable for credit card companies to lose, then why should landlords be any different?

And again, your proposal has nothing in place to prevent illegal actions on the part of the tenants. Right here ^^ you are 'turning a blind eye' to it, or downright justifying it.
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They will suffer the consequences of not being able to lease if they try to pull that stunt.

Please justify people cheating the landlords out of months of rent...legally and ethically.

And then you'll still need to tell me how your proposal will *solve* this abuse for landlords (perhaps your explanation of the cc example will, but if not, let's see it)
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What's the bigger issue facing society? Tenants skipping out on rent, or landlords charging exorbitant rents?
 
Lursa said:
I asked you first. You are avoiding all the hard questions.

So...you go first.
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What did I avoid? Of course the older generations worked. Why are younger generations facing a tougher time despite working harder?
 
phattonez said:
But why should we build to that density if we have evidence that we're still going to have the problem even at that density?
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Because if you increase supply above demand then prices will fall. If we reach the point that no more housing can be built then some will need to make a choice about what is more important to them.
 
phattonez said:
Credit card companies have small credit limits and charge high rates of interest to new borrowers. Landlords similarly would rent their smaller, not as nice units to new tenants, and probably from month to month.
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It's very expensive to fix up rentals and find tenants. Month to month is bull****.

Interesting that you just figure the poor are more deserving of crappy rentals....why arent they deserving of 'nice' units? Please answer.

ANd you still havent addressed the issue of flagrant cheating by tenants....the tenants you want landlords to bend over backwards and lose $$ over. These people will deliberately lie and cheat the landlord and you feel the landlords should just 'adapt' to that behavior. How do you justify that cheating?

And yes, if it's acceptable for credit card companies to lose, then why should landlords be any different?
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I never said it was acceptable. Why do you believe it's acceptable? It's about people cheating. How do you justify these 'poor poor low income people' cheating landlords?

They will suffer the consequences of not being able to lease if they try to pull that stunt.
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Really? How? What mechanisms would prevent it?

What's the bigger issue facing society? Tenants skipping out on rent, or landlords charging exorbitant rents?
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False equivalency. However in your scenario, 'skipping out on rent' would become endemic and by far more a bigger, more serious issue.
 
phattonez said:
What did I avoid? Of course the older generations worked. Why are younger generations facing a tougher time despite working harder?
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Try again:

Lursa said:
I'd respect them more if they moved to where they could find a better job and develop the skills to afford what they desire. If they want equity, they can work for it like everyone else
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phattonez said:
But their parents' generation didn't have to? Disingenuous!
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Feel free to tell me why this generation cannot do the same?
 
Nap said:
Because if you increase supply above demand then prices will fall. If we reach the point that no more housing can be built then some will need to make a choice about what is more important to them.
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Something is wrong with your theory when the facts (Hong Kong) don't agree with your expected conclusions.
 
Lursa said:
It's very expensive to fix up rentals and find tenants. Month to month is bull****.

Interesting that you just figure the poor are more deserving of crappy rentals....why arent they deserving of 'nice' units? Please answer.

ANd you still havent addressed the issue of flagrant cheating by tenants....the tenants you want landlords to bend over backwards and lose $$ over. These people will deliberately lie and cheat the landlord and you feel the landlords should just 'adapt' to that behavior. How do you justify that cheating?
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I didn't say crappy. I wouldn't expect them to get luxury, though. And that's the risk you take when you're a landlord.

I never said it was acceptable. Why do you believe it's acceptable? It's about people cheating. How do you justify these 'poor poor low income people' cheating landlords?
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I don't. They'll suffer the consequences.
Really? How? What mechanisms would prevent it?
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Would you rent out to someone who had done that?

False equivalency. However in your scenario, 'skipping out on rent' would become endemic and by far more a bigger, more serious issue.
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Is defaulting on credit card debt endemic?
 
Lursa said:
Try again:

Feel free to tell me why this generation cannot do the same?
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They have worked for it. They have more training, more degrees, yet lower pay. You keep dodging that issue.
 
phattonez said:
They have worked for it. They have more training, more degrees, yet lower pay. You keep dodging that issue.
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You didnt answer the question yet either.

I was really clear in my post.
 
Lursa said:
You didnt answer the question yet either.

I was really clear in my post.
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Your question assumes that this generation isn't working as hard and is responsible for their plight. You haven't proved that.
 
phattonez said:
I didn't say crappy. I wouldn't expect them to get luxury, though. And that's the risk you take when you're a landlord.
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"Not as nice" = crappy, lesser, etc. A landlord cant get as high rent for such places anyway, so you're not describing anything useful at all. And no, it's not a risk landlords have to take. Again...you have zero credibility here because in the end, no matter what anyone else demonstrates re: your failed proposal, you dont care how it affects landlords.

No such legislation will ever be considered...heh, once again you failed to think it thru. You are blinded by resentment.

I don't. They'll suffer the consequences.
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Yup, thanks for reiterating:

Again...you have zero credibility here because in the end, no matter what anyone else demonstrates re: your failed proposal, you dont care how it affects landlords.

No such legislation will ever be considered...heh, once again you failed to think it thru. You are blinded by resentment.

Would you rent out to someone who had done that?
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How would they know? The entire first year of this 'proposal' would crush landlords...much to your glee I'm sure. And thus anyone with any critical thinking skills would not legislate it. Not everyone harbors your resentment of landlords.

And I wrote and you dont care...finding new tenants all the time and fixing up units for rent is very $$$. That is why landlords choose carefully NOW.

Is defaulting on credit card debt endemic?
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If endemic = widespread, then yes (I know you have trouble with vocabulary)
 
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