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Why is illegal border crossing at an 'all time low'?

Barnacle said:
How do we know how many illegals made it into the country without being apprehended at the border?
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We don't.

Do you have an opinion on the question?
 
Casca XV said:
Is it at an all time low? Or is it being counted and reported different for propaganda purposes? Like when Obama was claiming all time highs in deportations, by counting the catch and releases as deportation.
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All the numbers I've seen do show it decreasing overall. There were ups and downs.
 
jnug said:
Can't believe nobody has mentioned this one yet. I take that back. I can believe it.

One major reason is that Mexico has clawed back enough of an economy over the years to keep them home. We now have negative unauthorized immigration flow from Mexico, meaning more go back than come in.

Gee you think there is a message there for the US with virtually its entire ex-border problem originating in three tiny countries in Central America that we have frigged around with and helped screw up for a century? Those folks start their trek from about 1,200 to 1,500 miles away...some of them more! Do you think we might be able to figure out a way to keep them at home too!!!!
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Got any ideas? And if Mexico figured it out, so can other countries. Why is the US responsible to figure it out for them.
 
maxparrish said:
Why do you think that the number of illegal crossings are at an all time low?



In 1960 it was nearly zero. It was still negligible up to 1969. Then till about 1975 it climbed to about a half million a year. Then it was higher (varying between 600,000 and 1.7 million a year) till 2009. And in 2010, and all years since (but one) were LOWER than 2018.

So obviously 521,000 apprehended (for every illegal caught one is not) is much lower than in many years, but it is not anywhere near an all time low.

The question you ought to be asking is what has changed since the 1960s that triggered this flood of illegals, such that half million a year are still crossing the SW border illegally (and another 600,000 enter by visa to become illegals)?
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Personally, I don't consider the number 396,579 that was apprehended in 2018 (not including of course those not caught) a low by any means. But it is a lower number than previous years. Add that to the 12 million illegals currently living in the US and the numbers are staggering.

Add any amount to that number is too high.
 
Stealers Wheel said:
You reminded me of a beautiful song by Roger Whittaker and later covered by Reba:

Just Across the Rio Grande

The lights of Laredo dance on the water
And shine in a young man's eyes
He stands on the border and dreams of Paradise
He's heard crazy stories of how people live
Over in the Promised Land
He heard they eat three meals a day
Just across the Rio Grande

He's got a wife named Maria and a baby named Rose
And one more to feed on the way
Two willing hands that couldn't find work today
He stares at the river and curses the future that he can't understand
He knows his child would have a chance
Just across the Rio Grande

It's only a river that's not that deep or wide
A boy can throw a stone across and reach the other side
It's just some muddy water cuttin' through the land
But a man can make a dream come true
Just across the Rio Grande

The lights of Laredo dance on the water
And shine in a young man's eyes
He stands on the border and stares up at the skies
The same old stars shine so bright over the Promised Land

Sometimes it seems like God must live
Just across the Rio Grande

It's only a river that's not that deep or wide
A boy can throw a stone across and reach the other side
It's just some muddy water cuttin' through the land
But a man can make his dream come true
Just across the Rio Grande

Sometimes it seems like God must live
Just across the Rio Grande
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Great sad song. Thanks for posting.

Brought back memories of sad visits to Laredo detention centers to see asylum seekers caught while crossing. Outside of town, you could see people on the other side, waiting for nightfall to swim across.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Or having a police department if there was little crime in that town. The argument that law enforcement and/or security systems are not useful unless some specific level of crime (currently?) exists is quite lame. What, exactly, is an acceptable level of illegal border crossing? What should be done if (when?) that level is reached?
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I would say that spending billions and billions on a wall to stop this hypothetical 1% would be akin to a small town with little crime building a police force the size of the NYPD. It would certainly reduce the crime even more, but it would not be considered a wise allocation of resources.
 
If crossings are at an all-time low, where is the crisis Trump keeps blathering on about?
 
Nickyjo said:
Great sad song. Thanks for posting.

Brought back memories of sad visits to Laredo detention centers to see asylum seekers caught while crossing. Outside of town, you could see people on the other side, waiting for nightfall to swim across.
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That song contains no claim of asylum whatsoever. Asylum seekers do not "get caught" - they voluntarily seek CPB personnel to make their asylum claim.
 
LowDown said:
How many Americans killed by illegal aliens in the US is too many, in your estimation? I ask because you seem to imply that we should just tolerate the current level of crime perpetrated by illegals and that to want something done about the problem, like simply enforcing current laws on immigration, is unreasonable.
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"Simply enforcing current laws on immigration"

I mean goddamn that's some 1984-level propaganda right there.
 
Skeptic Bob said:
I would say that spending billions and billions on a wall to stop this hypothetical 1% would be akin to a small town with little crime building a police force the size of the NYPD. It would certainly reduce the crime even more, but it would not be considered a wise allocation of resources.
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The assertion that a physical border barrier is no longer a good idea fails to explain why funds have been appropriated to build and maintain them. I suggest a simple experiment be tried - remove one mile of the physical border barriers between Tijuana and San Diego and carefully observe the result.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
The assertion that a physical border barrier is no longer a good idea fails to explain why funds have been appropriated to build and maintain them. I suggest a simple experiment be tried - remove one mile of the physical border barriers between Tijuana and San Diego and carefully observe the result.
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I suggest an experiment that can be tried immediately but it requires media cooperation.
When anyone says Walls don't work they have to be asked "Why not?"
If they say because experts say so you know they're lying.
Actually if they come up with anything they'd be lying.
 
bubbabgone said:
I suggest an experiment that can be tried immediately but it requires media cooperation.
When anyone says Walls don't work they have to be asked "Why not?"
If they say because experts say so you know they're lying.
Actually if they come up with anything they'd be lying.
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Physical barriers alone do not work but folks, especially criminals, are basically lazy and do not wish to expend the time and effort to defeat them. Making the effort to breach a physical barrier also establishes criminal intent - the "I just went after my stray child/puppy defense" is doomed.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
That song contains no claim of asylum whatsoever. Asylum seekers do not "get caught" - they voluntarily seek CPB personnel to make their asylum claim.
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Sorry you misunderstood me. I had traveled to Laredo to visit a former Guatemalan military guy who refused to become a death squad member and was seeking asylum after being nabbed by the INS. While there, I saw would be migrants on the opposite river bank. And many asylum seekers did get caught, expressed a fear to their captors, and used an asylum claim as a defense against forcible return to their countries of origin.

Been out of the loop for a while and some things have changed. What is CPB?
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Physical barriers alone do not work but folks, especially criminals, are basically lazy and do not wish to expend the time and effort to defeat them. Making the effort to breach a physical barrier also establishes criminal intent - the "I just went after my stray child/puppy defense" is doomed.
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Of course walls act as some sort of deterrent. That’s why it’s strange that Trump and the GOP didn’t build any in the past two years.
 
Nickyjo said:
Sorry you misunderstood me. I had traveled to Laredo to visit a former Guatemalan military guy who refused to become a death squad member and was seeking asylum after being nabbed by the INS. While there, I saw would be migrants on the opposite river bank. And many asylum seekers did get caught, expressed a fear to their captors, and used an asylum claim as a defense against forcible return to their countries of origin.

Been out of the loop for a while and some things have changed. What is CPB?
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Customs and Border Protection.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Physical barriers alone do not work but folks, especially criminals, are basically lazy and do not wish to expend the time and effort to defeat them. Making the effort to breach a physical barrier also establishes criminal intent - the "I just went after my stray child/puppy defense" is doomed.
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There's a whole menu of what needs to be done. The Wall is just one of the choices.
The problem with most of the meals on the menu is that the people responsible for cooking those meals don't want to cook 'em because the people who'd have to eat them don't want to.
And when there's a new chef they could always create a new menu that eliminates all those old favorites.
A cooked Wall would be a perennial menu favorite for kids and adults alike even if not on the new menu.

Ya think I've beaten the menu metaphor to death?
 
Nickyjo said:
Of course walls act as some sort of deterrent. That’s why it’s strange that Trump and the GOP didn’t build any in the past two years.
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That is a good point, for sure, since that was before they became "immoral" - yet also before Trump stated that he demanded that they be funded by deficit spending instead of "being paid for by Mexico".
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Customs and Border Protection.
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Thanks. But migrants are not required to present their claims in order to obtain protection. Given Trump’s attempt to re-write asylum laws, they might be better off laying low til the courts overturn his rulings, which I think is likely.
 
bubbabgone said:
I suggest an experiment that can be tried immediately but it requires media cooperation.
When anyone says Walls don't work they have to be asked "Why not?"
If they say because experts say so you know they're lying.
Actually if they come up with anything they'd be lying.
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Actually you are lying. Anyone who says a full-length border wall is cost effective is lying
 
Deuce said:
Actually you are lying. Anyone who says a full-length border wall is cost effective is lying
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"Cost effective"?
It would be but I just said "effective".
 
holbritter said:
Personally, I don't consider the number 396,579 that was apprehended in 2018 (not including of course those not caught) a low by any means. But it is a lower number than previous years. Add that to the 12 million illegals currently living in the US and the numbers are staggering.

Add any amount to that number is too high.
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For the sake of clarity, I use the official statistics and graphs that are normally combined: apprehensions and others seeking entry at the border. Neither of these figures represent those who are successful in their border entry (e.g. typically those caught then apply for asylum and have gained entry anyway, being either detained in the US or caught and released). However this figure has served as a prior benchmark in that it is thought 1/2 of those attempting do make it across; which would be 500,000 a year.

The only reason the numbers are not as bad as in many prior years is two-fold: first, the great recession sent many home and second, Mexico has emptied a lot of poorest class to the US already. Now Central American immigration has become the dominate regional source of southwest border illegals and their numbers are growing (especially family units using asylum loopholes).
 
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