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Thread: [W:168]Cortez releases her communist agenda

  1. #221
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    Re: [W:168]Cortez releases her communist agenda

    From the article:

    "Ocasio-Cortez’s plan further claims it will (virtually) eliminate poverty: “The Plan for a Green New Deal (and the draft legislation) shall recognize that a national, industrial, economic mobilization of this scope and scale is a historic opportunity to virtually eliminate poverty in the United States and to make prosperity, wealth and economic security available to everyone participating in the transformation.”

    Didn't she get the memo that LBJ's Great Society already proposed this? Maybe we just need another 40+ years to see if it's going to work.

  2. #222
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    Re: [W:168]Cortez releases her communist agenda

    Quote Originally Posted by Nickyjo View Post
    Are you saying that every piece of legislation has to be in the form of a constitutional amendment? I don’t understand. I don’t think your theory on the limits of the federal government to do something like Medicare or Social Security has any support. Can you refer me to an argument, say in some law journal, that supports it?

    But if Medicare, for example, is unconstitutional, how else other than repeal by congress or challenge in court can we get rid of it?
    I'm saying exactly what the constitution says. The powers of govt are listed in the constitution. All other powers are reserved to the people. There is no power to pay for healthcare or create a retirement insurance program.

    The argument you're making is that govt can do anything it wants, so long as its not specifically forbidden, or the govts courts decides it cant. Which is exactly the opposite of the fundamental design of the federal govt and the constitution. Exactly the opposite of everything the people who wrote it said.

    How we get rid of it is irrelevant. Just because you dont get caught speeding, doesnt mean you werent breaking the law. We dont require govts agreement that theyre doing something illegal. They just stop doing it.

  3. #223
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    Re: [W:168]Cortez releases her communist agenda

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    I'm saying exactly what the constitution says. The powers of govt are listed in the constitution. All other powers are reserved to the people. There is no power to pay for healthcare or create a retirement insurance program.

    The argument you're making is that govt can do anything it wants, so long as its not specifically forbidden, or the govts courts decides it cant. Which is exactly the opposite of the fundamental design of the federal govt and the constitution. Exactly the opposite of everything the people who wrote it said.

    How we get rid of it is irrelevant. Just because you dont get caught speeding, doesnt mean you werent breaking the law. We dont require govts agreement that theyre doing something illegal. They just stop doing it.
    As I said, we the people don't agree with you. Can you find anyone who supports your strange theory. Someone with your view of the constitution would have sued and changed things. The government generally does acknowledge it is doing something illegal if the courts tell it so. The National Recovery Act of FDR was declared unconstitutional and it ended.

    Btw, why do you want to end Medicare and Social Security anyway. They do good things. If they were indeed unconstitutional,we would have amended the constitution anyway. But doing so for every function of government is ridiculous. Would you also get rid of interstate highways, the FDA? Do you want to test your own drugs?

    "Promote the general welfare" is one of the objectives of the constitution.

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    Re: [W:168]Cortez releases her communist agenda

    Quote Originally Posted by Nickyjo View Post
    As I said, we the people don't agree with you. Can you find anyone who supports your strange theory. Someone with your view of the constitution would have sued and changed things. The government generally does acknowledge it is doing something illegal if the courts tell it so. The National Recovery Act of FDR was declared unconstitutional and it ended.

    Btw, why do you want to end Medicare and Social Security anyway. They do good things. If they were indeed unconstitutional,we would have amended the constitution anyway. But doing so for every function of government is ridiculous. Would you also get rid of interstate highways, the FDA? Do you want to test your own drugs?

    "Promote the general welfare" is one of the objectives of the constitution.
    How do I know the people dont agree with me? When did we vote on it? According to the rules, you need 3/4 of states to agree, not 'we the people'. And you know who supports my theory? The people who wrote it.

    It has been urged and echoed, that the power "to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts, and excises, to pay the debts, and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States,'' amounts to an unlimited commission to exercise every power which may be alleged to be necessary for the common defense or general welfare. No stronger proof could be given of the distress under which these writers labor for objections, than their stooping to such a misconstruction. Had no other enumeration or definition of the powers of the Congress been found in the Constitution, than the general expressions just cited, the authors of the objection might have had some color for it; though it would have been difficult to find a reason for so awkward a form of describing an authority to legislate in all possible cases. A power to destroy the freedom of the press, the trial by jury, or even to regulate the course of descents, or the forms of conveyances, must be very singularly expressed by the terms "to raise money for the general welfare.
    The Avalon Project : Federalist No 41

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