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When people have a hole in their life, they often fill it with angry politics.

TheParser said:
The thread title seems to make sense.

People with meaningful relationships are simply too busy and happy to waste time indulging in angry political tirades.

Maybe those celebrities who are always opening their big mouths do not have anyone who really loves them, so they are making up for it by getting "love" from ordinary people who thank them for their political tirades.

And this may apply to ordinary people who spend hours mouthing off on the Internet. (Oops!)
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Good one, Parser

:argue

Are you a prophet from God?
 
cpwill said:
Yeah. The government pushed agencies helping the poor and children out of the space of helping people... because it didn't like what the Catholic church believed, and the Catholic Church isn't going to change it's beliefs because a government told it to.

So, your claim that the government does not do this sort of thing.... is incorrect.

Just as your claim that the Catholic agencies have the ability to deny anyone the ability to adopt - there are plenty (though their numbers will be shrinking, the more government refuses to have anyone who isn't it in the space) of non-Catholic Adoption Agency options, just as Jews have plenty of non-Muslim Adoption Agency options, and Catholics have plenty of non-Jewish Adoption Agency options.



Sure. And laws can violate the Constitution. And laws can stop non-governmental entities attempting to help orphans from doing so.



Interesting. I know quite a few Trumpkins who feel very similarly about Muslims, and quite a few southern baptist who feel very similarly about Gays. After all, if homosexuality is against the law (and, with the anti-sodmoy laws, it was), then they just shouldn't be gay where anyone can notice, or out in public. To banishment, with them.
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There are laws, which the government chooses to enforce, which the Catholics would like to break. Hello!!! The Catholics don't have to change their beliefs, nor do they have a "right" to enforce their beliefs on the rest of society. If you have documentation that Jews or Muslims are also breaking the law in providing adoption services, please provide them. Those agencies should also be stopped.

Whether or not laws violate the Constitution is a discussion quite outside the topic here, as is this entire discussion about Catholic adoption agencies. We were originally discussing isolation of individuals and angry politics. So I suggest you start a new thread if you really are interested in defending adoption agencies that follow religious mandates.
 
JMR said:
There are laws, which the government chooses to enforce, which the Catholics would like to break. Hello!!! The Catholics don't have to change their beliefs, nor do they have a "right" to enforce their beliefs on the rest of society. If you have documentation that Jews or Muslims are also breaking the law in providing adoption services, please provide them. Those agencies should also be stopped.
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I'm sorry, but that's balderdash. Catholics do not "enforce their beliefs on the rest of society" by helping orphans find families any more than Jewish Adoption Agencies or Muslim Adoption Agencies do. Nothing is enforced on me whatsoever by a Muslim helping a child. I hope they do.

The purpose of adoption agencies isn't to force everyone to adopt secular progressive belief systems, or any universal belief system. I don't agree with the homosexual lifestyle, but if an agency wants to stand up to help gay couples adopt children? Good. Because the purpose of adoption services isn't to make sure that I approve of all parents. It's to help children who desperately need loving families.

But, at least we know the value judgment being applied. "Forcing everyone to publicly adhere to progressive sexual beliefs > Caring for orphans"



However, this is all an attempt to shift from your original argument. You originally claimed:

JMR said:
The government does not push out anyone providing services to families.
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It now sounds like you've switched to a position that "The Government Passes Laws To Push Out People Providing Services To Families".

And I agree :)
 
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cpwill said:
I'm sorry, but that's balderdash. Catholics do not "enforce their beliefs on the rest of society" by helping orphans find families any more than Jewish Adoption Agencies or Muslim Adoption Agencies do. Nothing is enforced on me whatsoever by a Muslim helping a child. I hope they do.

The purpose of adoption agencies isn't to force everyone to adopt secular progressive belief systems, or any universal belief system. I don't agree with the homosexual lifestyle, but if an agency wants to stand up to help gay couples adopt children? Good. Because the purpose of adoption services isn't to make sure that I approve of all parents. It's to help children who desperately need loving families.

But, at least we know the value judgment being applied. "Forcing everyone to publicly adhere to progressive sexual beliefs > Caring for orphans"



However, this is all an attempt to shift from your original argument. You originally claimed:



It now sounds like you've switched to a position that "The Government Passes Laws To Push Out People Providing Services To Families".

And I agree :)
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No, my position is the Government does not push out agencies that are acting lawfully. And you can provide no evidence that they do.
 
JMR said:
No, my position is the Government does not push out agencies that are acting lawfully. And you can provide no evidence that they do.
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No. You stated the government does not push out anyone. Now you are shifting to "the government uses laws to push people out". And I have provided you multiple examples of that happening.
 
cpwill said:
No. You stated the government does not push out anyone. Now you are shifting to "the government uses laws to push people out". And I have provided you multiple examples of that happening.
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The government did not push them out, they refused to comply with the law. Therefore they cannot operate in the public sector. It's very easy.
 
JMR said:
The government did not push them out, they refused to comply with the law. Therefore they cannot operate in the public sector. It's very easy.
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Sure. Just like if we merely pass a law forbidding Muslims to breathe air while inside the territorial confines of the United States after Jan 31, 2019. We're not pushing them out, they're merely refusing to comply with the new law if they stay while breathing.



That.

Or.

We are using law to push them out. Which is what is happening in both instances.
 
cpwill said:
Sure. Just like if we merely pass a law forbidding Muslims to breathe air while inside the territorial confines of the United States after Jan 31, 2019. We're not pushing them out, they're merely refusing to comply with the new law if they stay while breathing.



That.

Or.

We are using law to push them out. Which is what is happening in both instances.
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Geez you like to beat dead horses. :roll: I don't think it is possible that we will ever pass a law forbidding Muslims to breathe. There IS a law that agencies cannot legally discriminate against protected classes. The Catholic agency decided to ignore that law. If that were not the case, (the lawbreaking) they would still be operating.
 
Skeptic Bob said:
You know, I find this plausible. I think people who obsess over things like politics may not be getting enough stimulation or excitement out of their “real life”. And I would guess that I and many members here fall into that category from time to time at least.
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There are a few posters here that answer a simple question with half a page of text.

I wonder what they do for a living, if it is not this, to spread propaganda.
 
JMR said:
Geez you like to beat dead horses. :roll: I don't think it is possible that we will ever pass a law forbidding Muslims to breathe.
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:shrug: which is immaterial. The point remains that it is possible to push people out via legislation, and that simply saying "oh, well if they weren't [what they were] then they'd be legal, so we're not pushing them out" doesn't change that.

:shrug: you've decided that you value enforcing your social-value preferences over helping orphans find families, and are willing to use government coercion to achieve it. Okay. Just own it, instead of pretending you aren't.
 
ElChupacabra said:
Interesting to see this given that on the way back home today I saw this billboard:

Screen-Shot-2018-11-14-at-15.12.06.jpg
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ipsofacto said:
Many right wingers (I won't call them conservatives) think we all have to believe the same thing or our nation will collapse.
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May be we should omit the cheap shots and focus on more than Fox News. After all, here we are, sitting behind the screen like it amounts to real life. What's more, we think that an opinion expressed on a discussion forum will change the world because what we think is so important.

What makes us lonely? Technology? Society? Lack of faith? I don't think there is one right answer, and this isn't necessarily a new phenomenon. May be we just measure it differently, are more aware? Just questions, no implications.
 
Skeptic Bob said:
You know, I find this plausible. I think people who obsess over things like politics may not be getting enough stimulation or excitement out of their “real life”. And I would guess that I and many members here fall into that category from time to time at least.
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I don’t know. I usually post to get away from people, excitement, drama, whatever. Posting provides a different sort of rush, endorphin buzz, whatever.

Best way I can describe it is control. Posting feels like taking control of a moment. You write your thoughts, you click send, you walk away. Real life is more like, “WTF is wrong now?”
 
ipsofacto said:
How Loneliness Is Tearing America Apart

America is suffering an epidemic of loneliness.

According to a recent large-scale survey from the health care provider Cigna, most Americans suffer from strong feelings of loneliness and a lack of significance in their relationships. Nearly half say they sometimes or always feel alone or “left out.” Thirteen percent of Americans say that zero people know them well. The survey, which charts social isolation using a common measure known as the U.C.L.A. Loneliness Scale, shows that loneliness is worse in each successive generation.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/23/opinion/loneliness-political-polarization.html


Wanted to see what others thought of this editorial by the president of the American Enterprise Institute. Chutzpah on his part, I believe.
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accurate for me but giving me something else to do wont change my opinions
 
Lovebug said:
May be we should omit the cheap shots and focus on more than Fox News. After all, here we are, sitting behind the screen like it amounts to real life. What's more, we think that an opinion expressed on a discussion forum will change the world because what we think is so important.

What makes us lonely? Technology? Society? Lack of faith? I don't think there is one right answer, and this isn't necessarily a new phenomenon. May be we just measure it differently, are more aware? Just questions, no implications.
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My post wasn't intended as a shot against Fox, just noting the coincidence between seeing that billboard and reading the OP later that day.
 
Captain Adverse said:
IMO isolation has become part of society oddly enough as a direct result of communication technology.

How many people have seen kids sitting together at a table in the mall, or at a park texting or calling each other instead of actually talking face to face? Talked to friends and family over skype but haven't visited them in a while?

We have more and more people walling themselves off behind their handheld and desktop communication systems and failing to maintain actual personal interactions.

IMO so many people are talking through twitter, Facebook, email, video, etc., all the while seeking "likes" from a million of their "closest friends" (that they've never met) to reassure themselves that they are worthwhile...that they've seriously weakened their ability to interact without these technical filters.

(EDIT: I'd like to add the fear factor which developed from "stranger-danger" over the last few decades leading to helicopter parenting which keeps kids in the home or at school and doesn't allow them to explore and interact as they grow up unless it is in a highly controlled environment.)
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not sure those kids feel isolated
 
Skeptic Bob said:
You know, I find this plausible. I think people who obsess over things like politics may not be getting enough stimulation or excitement out of their “real life”. And I would guess that I and many members here fall into that category from time to time at least.
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A lot of these people have no life, all they have is politics, that's why they are so miserable.
 
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