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Bernie shows his ignorance with the BEZOS Act.

Renae

Renae

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I'm no fan of Bernie or his idiocy. However, this latest attempt to show his ignorance takes the cake:
Bernie Sanders (S-VT) has introduced legislation to tax companies for the federal benefits their employees receive, unsubtly called the Stop Bad Employers by Zeroing Out Subsidies, or BEZOS Act. Leave aside for now the ominous nature of naming a piece of federal legislation after an individual, solely due to legislative animus at that individual’s financial success. Let’s look at how this would operate in practice:
The bill would establish a 100% tax on companies equal to the benefits their employees are receiving. Covered public assistance program include Medicaid, Section 8 housing, the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program and the National School Lunch and School Breakfast programs, for companies with more than 500 employees.
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https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/the-bernie-sanders-big-brother-act-of-2018/
AH HA you might think, if you were unwise, what a great plan, stick it to those companies!

As the article, which I implore you to read so you can respond to this thread without looking silly, goes on to point out is that this would:

Force companies to ask VERY invasive and PRIVATE questions of employees, encourage employers to not hire people who would be subject to this tax and if all else fails makes a very strong financial case for businesses to further automate/move operations to off-shore contractors.

Oh and then of course, there is the raise the price of goods and services because in the end, corporations don't pay taxes, their end clients and consumers do.

Ergo, massive taxation, regulation and enforcement that will only harm workers.

BRILLIANT BERNIE strikes again. Why do people listen to him? He's a ****ing moron.
 
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Just based on this very biased article, I don't like the idea of the legislation very much. Not sure if they are describing it 100% accurately, but some of the issues like asking invasive questions etc I could see as a problem when trying to enforce something like this. But the general idea that if a company makes a fortune while not paying their employees enough so that the american tax payer needs to help them afford to keep food on the table is also a problem. This might not be the best way to help. I'll look more into it.

One very interesting thing that popped into my head, what seems like an obvious solution, why don't we just get another country to pay for it? Like Mexico or something. Bernie should just put in the legislation that Mexico will pay for it. I know a lot of people that would be gullible enough to believe it.
 
Or they can just pay their employees enough.

There is a point Bernie is making, and that is that the Taxpayers are subsidizing poor labor compensations. I doubt this law will go anywhere, and I think it would be pretty hard to enforce overall. But we are subsidizing big corps who refuse to pay proper wages to employees.
 
roughdraft274 said:
Just based on this very biased article, I don't like the idea of the legislation very much. Not sure if they are describing it 100% accurately, but some of the issues like asking invasive questions etc I could see as a problem when trying to enforce something like this. But the general idea that if a company makes a fortune while not paying their employees enough so that the american tax payer needs to help them afford to keep food on the table is also a problem. This might not be the best way to help. I'll look more into it.

One very interesting thing that popped into my head, what seems like an obvious solution, why don't we just get another country to pay for it? Like Mexico or something. Bernie should just put in the legislation that Mexico will pay for it. I know a lot of people that would be gullible enough to believe it.
Click to expand...

Mexico is going to pay our Corporate Subsidies!
 
Renae said:
I'm no fan of Bernie or his idiocy. However, this latest attempt to show his ignorance takes the cake:
https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/the-bernie-sanders-big-brother-act-of-2018/
AH HA you might think, if you were unwise, what a great plan, stick it to those companies!

As the article, which I implore you to read so you can respond to this thread without looking silly, goes on to point out is that this would:

Force companies to ask VERY invasive and PRIVATE questions of employees, encourage employers to not hire people who would be subject to this tax and if all else fails make a very strong financial case for businesses to further automate/move operations to off-shore contractors.

Oh and then of course, there is the raise the price of goods and services because in the end, corporations don't pay taxes, their end clients and consumers do.

Ergo, massive taxation, regulation and enforcement that will only harm workers.

BRILLIANT BERNIE strikes again. Why do people listen to him? He's a ****ing moron.
Click to expand...

He could just put tariffs on them I guess.

It's no worse than Trump's Twitter tantrums about Harley Davidson.
 
Ikari said:
Or they can just pay their employees enough.

There is a point Bernie is making, and that is that the Taxpayers are subsidizing poor labor compensations. I doubt this law will go anywhere, and I think it would be pretty hard to enforce overall. But we are subsidizing big corps who refuse to pay proper wages to employees.
Click to expand...

That not true though, the welfare state supports a system where people think that being a grocery bagger is a long term career that can support a family of 4
 
Well, call me confused on your position Renae.

Some employers regularly pay portions of their workforce so little, that the employees qualify for and are substantially subsidized by the federal taxpayer. Therefore Sanders is introducing a bill that would (A) re-coup our taxpayer money from the employer and (B) incentive the employer to not push compensation onto our welfare system.

But that's a terrible idea? (Go welfare state?)
 
Ikari said:
Or they can just pay their employees enough.

There is a point Bernie is making, and that is that the Taxpayers are subsidizing poor labor compensations. I doubt this law will go anywhere, and I think it would be pretty hard to enforce overall. But we are subsidizing big corps who refuse to pay proper wages to employees.
Click to expand...

"Pay proper wages"?
The market sets the wages, whose forcing people to work for Amazon? Is there a law forcing people to take the jobs?
 
Renae said:
"Pay proper wages"?
The market sets the wages, whose forcing people to work for Amazon? Is there a law forcing people to take the jobs?
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Who cares - Why are we taxpayers footing the bill?
 
Renae said:
"Pay proper wages"?
The market sets the wages, whose forcing people to work for Amazon? Is there a law forcing people to take the jobs?
Click to expand...

Corporations set the wages. People take jobs where they can get them, and certain places under pay. As a result, Corporations end up making bank while their employees are on food stamps. There's a reason why wealth is aggregating in the top 1%. I don't believe there's an Amazon Labor Union, so there's no real mechanism there to force proper pay scales.
 
Renae said:
"Pay proper wages"?
The market sets the wages, whose forcing people to work for Amazon? Is there a law forcing people to take the jobs?
Click to expand...

That is how it works in a perfect market, but it is never and far from a perfect market, this is one thing Conservatives seem to constantly forget.
 
Literally Amazon has roughly $250 billion in cash or near cash equivalents on their balance sheet.

... while the federal government, which is heavily in-debt, is forking over billions in welfare payments to Amazon employees.

**** all of that noise.
 
brothern said:
Well, call me confused on your position Renae.

Some employers regularly pay portions of their workforce so little, that the employees qualify for and are substantially subsidized by the federal taxpayer. Therefore Sanders is introducing a bill that would (A) re-coup our taxpayer money from the employer and (B) incentive the employer to not push compensation onto our welfare system.

But that's a terrible idea? (Go welfare state?)
Click to expand...

I'm sorry but again, whose forcing these people to take these jobs that are "paying so poorly they can't live"? No one. I know I refused jobs because I felt the compensation wasn't worth my time. Call me crass and old fashioned, but what's the point of taking a job that doesn't pay the bills?

I've also had jobs that weren't high pay and made sacrifices to survive, the one short period I did get gov't assistance, I was ashamed and worked two jobs to get off the dole asap. And that "dole" was a few unemployment checks from the state of Texas that if memory serves was less than 2k in total payout.
 
Carjosse said:
That is how it works in a perfect market, but it is never and far from a perfect market, this is one thing Conservatives seem to constantly forget.
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I forget nothing, I understand the purpose of a business is to provide a ROI to those with a vested financial stake in said endeavor.
 
Renae said:
I'm sorry but again, whose forcing these people to take these jobs that are "paying so poorly they can't live"? No one. I know I refused jobs because I felt the compensation wasn't worth my time. Call me crass and old fashioned, but what's the point of taking a job that doesn't pay the bills?

I've also had jobs that weren't high pay and made sacrifices to survive, the one short period I did get gov't assistance, I was ashamed and worked two jobs to get off the dole asap. And that "dole" was a few unemployment checks from the state of Texas that if memory serves was less than 2k in total payout.
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And I can empathize where you're coming from, but why do you believe it's the responsibility of the Federal government to support these lowly paid individuals with welfare rather than pressuring the employer to pony up?

IMO - more people on the Federal dole is a way less desirable outcome than cracking heads together.
 
Renae said:
I'm sorry but again, whose forcing these people to take these jobs that are "paying so poorly they can't live"? No one. I know I refused jobs because I felt the compensation wasn't worth my time. Call me crass and old fashioned, but what's the point of taking a job that doesn't pay the bills?

I've also had jobs that weren't high pay and made sacrifices to survive, the one short period I did get gov't assistance, I was ashamed and worked two jobs to get off the dole asap. And that "dole" was a few unemployment checks from the state of Texas that if memory serves was less than 2k in total payout.
Click to expand...

Because having to be on some form of public support is still better than being completely destitute. If you're in some class of working where most places are going to pay poor wages, then there's no "going somewhere else". People need a job, and a poor paying job is still going to be better than no job.

So in the end, then, the Taxpayer subsidizes the poor wages. Taxpayer ends up subsidizing quite a bit for Corporate America.
 
Edit: Btw, I would call it a full-on "market failure" if the price of labor is deemed to be so pitifully low by market forces that the Federal government is required to step into the labor market and provide interference with substantial welfare support.
 
brothern said:
Edit: Btw, I would call it a full-on "market failure" if the price of labor is deemed to be so pitifully low by market forces that the Federal government is required to step into the labor market and provide interference with substantial welfare support.
Click to expand...

If you are married, have kids and taking low paying jobs... whose fault is that?
 
Renae said:
AH HA you might think, if you were unwise, what a great plan, stick it to those companies!
Click to expand...

I don't know anyone who thinks "stick it to those companies!" although I'm sure they do exist.

But the deficit is growing, and with Trump's huge tax cuts for him and his buddies

Trump will personally save up to $15m under tax bill, analysis finds

That it is only increasing in speed.

Who is going to pay for it? Or do you agree with Trump that the richest Americans should be granted huge tax cuts that the middle class will be forced to pay for generations?
 
brothern said:
And I can empathize where you're coming from, but why do you believe it's the responsibility of the Federal government to support these lowly paid individuals with welfare rather than pressuring the employer to pony up?

IMO - more people on the Federal dole is a way less desirable outcome than cracking heads together.
Click to expand...

If a worker has dependents and can't afford to survive without government assistance, is that the business's fault or the persons fault? Does the market have an obligation to pay more for the work done because someone made bad life choices?
 
JustHanging said:
I don't know anyone who thinks "stick it to those companies!" although I'm sure they do exist.

But the deficit is growing, and with Trump's huge tax cuts for him and his buddies

Trump will personally save up to $15m under tax bill, analysis finds

That it is only increasing in speed.

Who is going to pay for it? Or do you agree with Trump that the richest Americans should be granted huge tax cuts that the middle class will be forced to pay for generations?
Click to expand...

If you understood how taxes worked, you wouldn't make such statements.
 
Renae said:
If you are married, have kids and taking low paying jobs... whose fault is that?
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You can hardly blame someone because they were born in a lousy country that caters to the rich while screwing over the middle class and poor.
 
JustHanging said:
You can hardly blame someone because they were born in a lousy country that caters to the rich while screwing over the middle class and poor.
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America is a lousy country now is it?
 
Renae said:
If you understood how taxes worked, you wouldn't make such statements.
Click to expand...

I'm Canadian, and I know how our taxes work. And I think I understand how American taxes work.

But the possibility that I'm wrong always exists, so please explain the error of my ways.
 
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